smj5351, this is for you bud

[Quadrummer]

These are Verses from the bible that smj5351 copies and pasts in many forums here in the Religion and Politics section and instead of posting a whole bunch of stuff taking up other threads that have nothing to do wit this topic; I decided to start a new one. I hope you read all of this smj. You have wanted someone to do this so here it is. You have no more excuses anymore. Someone has grown a pair and fought you on this now?

1.

Originally Posted by smj5351

You're very right, one passage cannot be used to refute another...I never refute the Bible with other verses (people try to do that to me). I use the Bible to PROVE my beliefs.

It's funny how you say you have no problem with the Bible, but you reject the Bible's verses.

And yes, sometimes I do feel like I am arguing with myself, because no one bothers to debate me, probably because they know they can't win.

Quote:
"That at the name of Jesus EVERY knee should bow, of those in heaven, and those in earth, and those under the earth; And that EVERY tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father" (Phil. 2:10-11?See also Isa. 26:9b).

This verse means that everyone will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord...so that means that because they believe, they are saved. It's very simple.

As I had told you before in The New Christian Thread: You are right, everyone will know of God's existence, but at this point it?s too late. Your dead or it is the final time when God comes to take his people to be with him. It is too late to try and repent now. He wants us to have faith before we die. Also it says no where in this verse about everyone being saved. Just that people will finally know of his existence.

2.

Originally Posted by smj5351

That's not the only verse that says people are saved:

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as all die in Adam, so all will be made alive in Christ.

This passage is referring to the church in Corinth that had a hard time in believing that Christ rose from the dead. You have to know that Paul was writing to people who are already Christians and "all" is explaining that all Christians will be made alive through his resurrection since "if Christ has not been raised, our preaching is useless and so is our faith". 1 Cor. 15:14

3.

Originally Posted by smj5351

1 Timothy 4:9-11:
This is a faithful saying worthy of all acceptance. For to this end we both labor and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Savior of all men, especially of those who believe.

Jesus loves the whole world yes. Jesus wants all to be saved but some will not be because they will reject him. He is the savior of all men but it is those who believe will be saved. It says nothing about them being saved; just that he is their savior when that time comes.

4.

Originally Posted by smj5351

Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. I Tim. 2:4

this verse completly wrong. Let me give you five different translations of this verse that show you miss-wrote it.

"Who WANTS all men to be saved..." -NIV
"Who DESIRES all men to be saved..." -NKJV
"He WANTS not only us but everyone to be saved..." - The Message
"for he wants everyone to be saved..." -NLT
"who desires all people to be saved..." -ESV
"who desires all men to be saved..." -NASB

Oops, that was 6, sorry. Got a little carried away.

5.

Originally Posted by smj5351

We have seen, and do testify, that
the Father sent the Son to be the Savior of the world. 1 John 4:14.

This verse also says nothing about all being saved but that he is their savior. Like a fireman would save your life but not all have been saved by a firefighter.

6.

Originally Posted by smj5351

And he is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world. I John 2:2.

Later in verse 4 John says ?The man who says, ?I know Him,? but does not do what he commands is a liar, AND THE TRUTH IS NOT IN HIM.

7.

Originally Posted by smj5351

And the Lord hath laid on him the iniquity
us all. Isa. 53:6.

You have to realize that this book was written to Jews and does not show at all that it means ?us all? in a sense of all man kind. I don?t know where you get ?all man kind? from ?us all?.

8.

Originally Posted by smj5351

Behold the Lamb of God which taketh away the sin of the world. John 1:29.

Another verse that does not show that everyone will be saved. See my explanation for 1 John 4:14

9.

Originally Posted by smj5351

And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. John 12:32.

How come if you look 7 verses back, Jesus says: ?The man who loves his life will lose it, while the man who hates his life in this world will keep it for eternal life. WHOEVER SERVES ME MUST FOLLOW ME; and where I am, my servant will also be. My father will honor the one who serves me?. John 12:25

10.

Originally Posted by smj5351

Therefore, God hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name that at (in) the name of Jesus every knee shall bow of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father. Phil. 2:9-11.

See #1 because it is the exact same context but Paul is defining how we should be Christ like in this section.

12.

Originally Posted by smj5351

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 3:16

This goes against what your saying and is the #1 classic evangelistic verse used. I don?t even know why you would put this verse because it contradicts what you are trying to prove since it says ??that whosoever believeth in him should not perish?? meaning you must believe and have faith in order to have everlasting life.

13.

Originally Posted by smj5351

Behold I show you a mystery; we shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump; for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. I Cor. 15: 51, 52

Who do you think Paul refers to when saying WE. All of his letters were addressed to churches that were already established in the Christian faith. He is talking to his fellow brethren as he says many times through his letters.

14.

Originally Posted by smj5351

And when all things shall be subdued unto him,
then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be ALL IN ALL. I Cor. 15:28

This whole section of scripture is justifying that Christ had to be resurrected or there is no point in faith. This goes along with number 2 since it is in the same context of what Paul is preaching. Why would it make a point in verse 23 to say ?But each his own turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then when he comes, those that belong to him. If all humanity was included in this don?t you think that would be mentioned and/or said instead?

15.

Originally Posted by smj5351

For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. I John 3:8.

Says nothing about ALL being saved.

[Quadrummer]

16.

Originally Posted by smj5351

all will be drawn up again into heaven. Acts 10:10-16.

I don?t know where you got this verse because it is nowhere in Acts 10. Please do not be making verses up. I looked it up in bible software and also could not even find where it is suppose to go if it is actually a verse in the bible.

17.

Originally Posted by smj5351

But now commandeth all men everywhere to repent. Acts 17:30

Again, where does it say all men are saved?

18.

Originally Posted by smj5351

He that believeth not God, hath made him a liar, because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son. And this is the record, that God has given us eternal life; and this life is in his Son. I John 5:10, 11

Also no reference to ALL being saved

19.

Originally Posted by smj5351

And they shall not teach every man his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying know the Lord: for all shall know me from the least to the greatest. Heb. 8:11

This still doesn?t show that ALL will be saved. In chapter 8 of Hebrews, Paul is talking about the new covenant established. The reason why this is true is shown in John 14:15-17. ?If you love me, you will obey what I command. And I will ask the Father, and He will give you another counselor to be with you forever- the Spirit of Truth. The wold cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you.?

20.

Originally Posted by smj5351

For he that is dead is freed from sin. Rom. 6:7

I you had placed the next verse along with this, it would prove you wrong. Paul is talking about that when you die, you won?t sin anymore. That doesn?t mean your saved, you just don?t sin anymore because you are dammed for eternity or ?Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him.? Romans 6:8

21

Originally Posted by smj5351

All kings shall fall down before him: all nations shall serve him, and men shall be blessed in him: all nations shall call him blessed. Ps. 72:11,17

See #1 (Sorry, I?m getting a little lazy. This is kinda hard but necessary work)

22.

Originally Posted by smj5351

Though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool. Isa. 1:18.

This verse also says nothing about ALL being saved.

23.

Originally Posted by smj5351

The Lord God will wipe away tears from off all faces. Isa. 25:8.

The book of Isaiah was written to the chosen people (Jews) and this passage is addressing the Jews as ?all the faces?. It is addressing a single people group, not ALL people of the whole world.

24.

Originally Posted by smj5351

God will swallow up death in victory. Isa. 25:8.

Yet another verse that says nothing about ALL being saved.

25.

Originally Posted by smj5351

The Lord WILL NOT CAST OFF FOREVER. But though he cause grief, yet will he have compassion according to the multitude of his tender mercies, for he doth not afflict willingly, nor grieve the children of men. Lam. 3:31-33.

The book of Lamentations is one of crying out to the Lord for all the grief that Israel went through. This passage as nothing to do with eternal salvation but is more a passage of hope that you wont have to suffer forever on earth and is saying more that God will eventually help you out even though it seems like he might not be there.

26.

Originally Posted by smj5351

For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, teaching us, that denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in the present world. Titus 2:11, 12.

Where does it say again that ALL will be saved and go to heaven?

I am tired of doing this for right now and I have to go to bed because I have class at 9am tomorrow (or really today) but I will try and finish them up later.


In Doing all this, I too have some verses to share with you that completely go against what you believe in.

?Here is a worthy saying:
If we died with him, we will also live with him;
If we endure, we will also reign with him.
If we disown him, HE WILL ALSO DISOWN US;
If we are faith less, he will remain faithful, for he cannot disown himself.?
-2 Tim. 2:11-13

?If anyone?s name was not found in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.?
-Rev. 20:15

"Lord, will only a few be saved?" He replied, "The door to heaven is narrow. Work hard to get in, because many will try to enter, but when the head of the house has locked the door, it will be too late. Then you will stand outside knocking and pleading, `Lord, open the door for us!' But he will reply, `I do not know you.' You will say, `But we ate and drank with you, and you taught in our streets.' And he will reply, `I tell you, I don't know you. Go away, all you who do evil.' And there will be great weeping and gnashing of teeth, for you will see Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and all the prophets within the Kingdom of God, but you will be thrown out. Then people will come from all over the world to take their places in the Kingdom of God. And note this: Some who are despised now will be greatly honored then; and some who are greatly honored now will be despised then."
-Luke 13:24-30

"But the gateway to life is small, and the road is narrow, and only a few ever find it."
-Mat 7:14

"Not all people who sound religious are really godly. They may refer to me as `Lord,' but they still won't enter the Kingdom of Heaven. The decisive issue is whether they obey my Father in heaven. On judgment day many will tell me, `Lord, Lord, we prophesied in your name and cast out demons in your name and performed many miracles in your name.' But I will reply, `I never knew you. Go away; the things you did were unauthorized."
-Mat 7:21-23

"Then the King will turn to those on the left and say, `Away with you, you cursed ones, into the eternal fire prepared for the Devil and his demons! For I was hungry, and you didn't feed me. I was thirsty, and you didn't give me anything to drink. I was a stranger, and you didn't invite me into your home. I was naked, and you gave me no clothing. I was sick and in prison, and you didn't visit me.' "Then they will reply, `Lord, when did we ever see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and not help you?' And he will answer, `I assure you, when you refused to help the least of these my brothers and sisters, you were refusing to help me.' And they will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous will go into eternal life."
-Mat 25:40-46

Have a good night. My mind is fried right now. I know there are only 10 more but I can?t take it any more. I need rest and a protein shake right now? lol

[resurrected]

( pulls up a chair, makes some popcorn and waits for it to start)

As they say on South Park, "Oh its on"

[Calhexas]

Point. Set. Match.

Someone just got burned.

[Quadrummer]

I noticed that in my message some of my periods and quotation marks got turned into question marks and other forms of puncuation. Why is that? It didnt look like that in the preview...

[Quadrummer]

Oh and if you want smj, I can try and get 30+ professors with multiple PhD's in theology, who have written books (In fact one of my professors wrote a book on Hell), and are pastors of churches and teach at seminaries to do the same thing I just did. I am pretty sure they will agree with me. That?s of course if you want more credible sources other than myself who will have a bachelor?s degree in psychology in May from a Christian University and have taken over 12 theology courses and have read numerous books on theology and wrote numerous papers that have required tons of research on theology.

[Calhexas]

Originally Posted by Quadrummer

I noticed that in my message some of my periods and quotation marks got turned into question marks and other forms of puncuation. Why is that? It didnt look like that in the preview...

Be careful. Now instead of trying to debate you he will focus on the computer's error to post the correct punctuation, and will make the claim that since you can't post proper grammatical punctuation, it is below him to debate you.

It's his form of stalling, and avoiding the conversation. A petty personal attack if you will.

Just a fair warning.

[IceDragon]

Originally Posted by Calhexas

Be careful. Now instead of trying to debate you he will focus on the computer's error to post the correct punctuation, and will make the claim that since you can't post proper grammatical punctuation, it is below him to debate you.

It's his form of stalling, and avoiding the conversation. A petty personal attack if you will.

Just a fair warning.

LOL He'll do anything to escape actually having to think about stuff. He'll probably also label him a troll.

[Quadrummer]

I never really understood the label "trol". What exactly is a trol...

[IceDragon]

Originally Posted by Quadrummer

I never really understood the label "trol". What exactly is a trol...

Someone who posts meaningless rambling bull**** just to aggravate people, or makes false usernames just to spew ****e that way too.

[AlbinoGerbil]

Originally Posted by IceDragon

Someone who posts meaningless rambling bull**** just to aggravate people, or makes false usernames just to spew ****e that way too.

^^^Exactly

They will start **** then run when confronted about it(or post slurs and insults) and basically just detract from the objective of the thread they've invaded.

[Quadrummer]

Here are a few more that I have found that completely refute what smj has been preaching...

"Blessed is the man who listens to me, watching daily at my doors, waiting at my doorway. For whoever finds me minds life and receives favor from the Lord. But whoever failed to find me harms himself; all who hate me love death."
-Proverbs 8:34-36

"Anyone who loves his father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me; and anyone who does not take up his cross and follow me is not worthy of me. Whoever finds his life will loose it, and whoever loses his life for my sake will find it. He who receives you receives me, and he who receives me receives the one who sent me."
-Matt. 10:37-40

"...those who have done good will rise to live, and those who have done evil will rise to be CONDEMNED."
-John 5:29

"You diligently study the scriptures because you think that by them you possess eternal life, these are the Scriptures that testify about me, yet you refuse to come to me to have eternal life."
-John 5:39-40

"...for the Lord searches every heart and understands every motive behind the thoughts. If you seek him, he will be found by you; but if you forsake him, he will reject you forever."
-1 Chron. 28:9

"Who is it that overcomes the world? Only he who believes that Jesus is the son of God."
-1 John 5:5

"He who has the son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life."
-1 john 5:12

[RelentlessChaos]

drummer, i have been in a long battle with him. I have tried my hardest here on bb.com to talk with him. I have many talks in the PM with him.

VERY VERY good posts. Repped many times.

its the King James that says "will have all men saved" but im not sure, whats going on here" imma talk to my pastor. Because you cant look at 1 verse. The rest of the bible will prove this wrong.

Look at any other version, and youll see that he desires.

you cant look at scripture, and just see "wants" "will" or anything else. Everything you read, you need to read the context. Read in context. Whatever it is, you wanna call it. Understand whats going on here, the timeline, and whos speaking, and to whom.

Thats why you cant just read a verse, and think it means for the whole world. Things changed from the OT to the NT.

btw. good post, and i got your back man. i got some good verses to.

[adilrockstar]

Repped

[Quadrummer]

Originally Posted by RelentlessChaos

drummer, i have been in a long battle with him. I have tried my hardest here on bb.com to talk with him. I have many talks in the PM with him.

VERY VERY good posts. Repped many times.

its the King James that says "will have all men saved" but im not sure, whats going on here" imma talk to my pastor. Because you cant look at 1 verse. The rest of the bible will prove this wrong.

Look at any other version, and youll see that he desires.

you cant look at scripture, and just see "wants" "will" or anything else. Everything you read, you need to read the context. Read in context. Whatever it is, you wanna call it. Understand whats going on here, the timeline, and whos speaking, and to whom.

Thats why you cant just read a verse, and think it means for the whole world. Things changed from the OT to the NT.

btw. good post, and i got your back man. i got some good verses to.

In every verse he posted and every verse I posted I read the whole chapter. I also read overviews of the entire book in which the passages are in and the context as to which each passage is referring. I have had alot of training on how to read the bible and i have used those skilles in this thread. Thanks for the insight and it would be great to get those other verses from you if i could. Thanks,

Corey

[Germanic]

Originally Posted by Quadrummer

These are Verses from the bible that smj5351 copies and pasts in many forums here in the Religion and Politics section and instead of posting a whole bunch of stuff taking up other threads that have nothing to do wit this topic; I decided to start a new one. I hope you read all of this smj. You have wanted someone to do this so here it is. You have no more excuses anymore. Someone has grown a pair and fought you on this now?
.

1. Wrong...nowhere does it say that we only get one chance. That's your opinion, I'd like you to at least back it up with scripture.

2. Wrong again...it says that ALL die in Adam (doesn't every human being die?) and then it goes right on to say that ALL will be made alive in Christ. It doesn't say "all Christians" or "all who believe"... It's very simple...everyone dies, and everyone will be made alive.

3. Wrong, wrong wrong. It SPECIFICALLY makes a distinction between THOSE WHO BELIEVE, and those who DON'T believe. It says that ALL men are saved, ESPECIALLY those who believe. You are REALLY stretching it on this one. So far it's really weak. Let's see how the others are.

4. Duhhh...it means that it's God will that all men be saved. Not our will, but God's will be done. Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven. GOD'S WILL TRUMPS THE WILL OF MAN. No man can stop God from getting what He wants. Weak again...

5. Says he's the savior of the world. That means he's the SAVIOR OF THE WORLD. Nice try, though.

6. Again, sins of THE WHOLE WORLD...not just Christians, not just good people, not just believers.

7. Even though "us all" means every human, I guess you could say that "us all" might only be referring to a specific group of people.

8. Again...He takes away THE SINS OF THE WORLD...not just 1/10 of the world, or PART of the world.

9. Jesus was lifted up from the Earth...and that means He will draw all men unto him. It's there in plain English, buddy...just like ALL of these (well, I guess "ALL" only means some, so I guess only SOME of these are in plain English ).

10. Every knee will bow, and every tongue will confess. See John 3:16.

13. You can't say that he is ONLY referring to a specific group of people. He says ALL, he means ALL.

14. God being ALL in ALL. Hmmm...I guess that only means SOME in SOME. Just like how the Lamb of God only takes away the sins of SOME of the world.

15. Destroying the works of the devil...that means evil is destroyed. Sin is destroyed. Lies are destroyed. All bad things are destroyed. Eternal hellfire damnation is the most evil possible thing ever imagined...I'm pretty sure that human-imagined fairy-tale will be destroyed as well.

16. I didn't make the verse up, but if you read the verses like it says (10-16) you will see that it says that all things will be drawn up into heaven. Learn to read, and comprehend words.

17. This one is simple...if God commands you to repent...don't you think that means He will let you repent? If God commands EVERYONE to repent, and God never changes (He never does) God will command people to repent as long as people CAN repent. And people WILL repent.

18. You're right, I don't know why I included this one.

19. Nothing to say about this.

20. It's VERY simple...He that is dead, is freed from sin. You CAN'T tell me it means something that it doesn't.

Most of these verses, you are just plainly stating the exact opposite of what they say. Very very weak.

21. LOL at you thinking this is hard work. I must put more work into my posts than you have in your entire life.

22. Right, but it's a nice verse, telling what everyone's sins will be.

23. This is also mentioned in Revelation...the former World has passed away? Yea...God will wipe away ALL tears from ALL faces. I'm pretty sure that means there won't be any people screaming in hellfire.

24. Right, but I figured I would include it.

25. It says that the Lord will not cast off forever. That means He won't cast off forever...

26. Weak...it says that salvation has appeared to ALL men (this hasn't happened yet).



Honestly, I am embarrassed for you. You only "refuted" the ones that didn't have anything to do with salvation.

Good job! The rest...you basically stated the exact opposite of what they meant.

You can attach little comments to every single one of these verses...that doesn't mean you have accomplished ANYTHING. And, sorry to tell you, but you haven't accomplished anything. I at least thought I would get a challenge from you, but apparently this "fried your brain". How long did it take you...10 minutes? lmao

And it's funny that you think just because you wrote a little sentence after each verse, that you "refuted" what I am "teaching". You people can trick yourselves into believing whatever the hell you want...I'm so sick of the constant bull**** from you morons. I could probably post all the evidence in the Bible proving me right, and you would just ignore it and complain. I can understand why atheists get so frustrated trying to debate with you people...you refuse to consider evidence that you don't like. Most of you can't even read for 5 minutes without "frying your brain" or "getting confused" or like adilrockstar, deeming it "junk" and "garbage" and "mumbo-jumbo". Maybe I will make another thread in a few weeks...but I'm really tired of the little games I've been playing with you guys. It's becoming a real waste of my time. At least I reached a few people, and that makes it all worth it.

[adilrockstar]

Originally Posted by smj5351

1. Wrong...nowhere does it say that we only get one chance. That's your opinion, I'd like you to at least back it up with scripture.

2. Wrong again...it says that ALL die in Adam (doesn't every human being die?) and then it goes right on to say that ALL will be made alive in Christ. It doesn't say "all Christians" or "all who believe"... It's very simple...everyone dies, and everyone will be made alive.

3. Wrong, wrong wrong. It SPECIFICALLY makes a distinction between THOSE WHO BELIEVE, and those who DON'T believe. It says that ALL men are saved, ESPECIALLY those who believe. You are REALLY stretching it on this one. So far it's really weak. Let's see how the others are.

4. Duhhh...it means that it's God will that all men be saved. Not our will, but God's will be done. Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven. GOD'S WILL TRUMPS THE WILL OF MAN. No man can stop God from getting what He wants. Weak again...

5. Says he's the savior of the world. That means he's the SAVIOR OF THE WORLD. Nice try, though.

6. Again, sins of THE WHOLE WORLD...not just Christians, not just good people, not just believers.

7. Even though "us all" means every human, I guess you could say that "us all" might only be referring to a specific group of people.

8. Again...He takes away THE SINS OF THE WORLD...not just 1/10 of the world, or PART of the world.

9. Jesus was lifted up from the Earth...and that means He will draw all men unto him. It's there in plain English, buddy...just like ALL of these (well, I guess "ALL" only means some, so I guess only SOME of these are in plain English ).

10. Every knee will bow, and every tongue will confess. See John 3:16.

13. You can't say that he is ONLY referring to a specific group of people. He says ALL, he means ALL.

14. God being ALL in ALL. Hmmm...I guess that only means SOME in SOME. Just like how the Lamb of God only takes away the sins of SOME of the world.

15. Destroying the works of the devil...that means evil is destroyed. Sin is destroyed. Lies are destroyed. All bad things are destroyed. Eternal hellfire damnation is the most evil possible thing ever imagined...I'm pretty sure that human-imagined fairy-tale will be destroyed as well.

16. I didn't make the verse up, but if you read the verses like it says (10-16) you will see that it says that all things will be drawn up into heaven. Learn to read, and comprehend words.

17. This one is simple...if God commands you to repent...don't you think that means He will let you repent? If God commands EVERYONE to repent, and God never changes (He never does) God will command people to repent as long as people CAN repent. And people WILL repent.

18. You're right, I don't know why I included this one.

19. Nothing to say about this.

20. It's VERY simple...He that is dead, is freed from sin. You CAN'T tell me it means something that it doesn't.

Most of these verses, you are just plainly stating the exact opposite of what they say. Very very weak.

21. LOL at you thinking this is hard work. I must put more work into my posts than you have in your entire life.

22. Right, but it's a nice verse, telling what everyone's sins will be.

23. This is also mentioned in Revelation...the former World has passed away? Yea...God will wipe away ALL tears from ALL faces. I'm pretty sure that means there won't be any people screaming in hellfire.

24. Right, but I figured I would include it.

25. It says that the Lord will not cast off forever. That means He won't cast off forever...

26. Weak...it says that salvation has appeared to ALL men (this hasn't happened yet).



Honestly, I am embarrassed for you. You only "refuted" the ones that didn't have anything to do with salvation.

Good job! The rest...you basically stated the exact opposite of what they meant.

You can attach little comments to every single one of these verses...that doesn't mean you have accomplished ANYTHING. And, sorry to tell you, but you haven't accomplished anything. I at least thought I would get a challenge from you, but apparently this "fried your brain". How long did it take you...10 minutes? lmao

He turned your own gun against you and blew your face off, get over it. We still have room for you on the Big Bus.

[Beatitude]

Very well done Quad.

[Quadrummer]

Originally Posted by smj5351

1. Wrong...nowhere does it say that we only get one chance. That's your opinion, I'd like you to at least back it up with scripture.

2. Wrong again...it says that ALL die in Adam (doesn't every human being die?) and then it goes right on to say that ALL will be made alive in Christ. It doesn't say "all Christians" or "all who believe"... It's very simple...everyone dies, and everyone will be made alive.

3. Wrong, wrong wrong. It SPECIFICALLY makes a distinction between THOSE WHO BELIEVE, and those who DON'T believe. It says that ALL men are saved, ESPECIALLY those who believe. You are REALLY stretching it on this one. So far it's really weak. Let's see how the others are.

4. Duhhh...it means that it's God will that all men be saved. Not our will, but God's will be done. Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven. GOD'S WILL TRUMPS THE WILL OF MAN. No man can stop God from getting what He wants. Weak again...

5. Says he's the savior of the world. That means he's the SAVIOR OF THE WORLD. Nice try, though.

6. Again, sins of THE WHOLE WORLD...not just Christians, not just good people, not just believers.

7. Even though "us all" means every human, I guess you could say that "us all" might only be referring to a specific group of people.

8. Again...He takes away THE SINS OF THE WORLD...not just 1/10 of the world, or PART of the world.

9. Jesus was lifted up from the Earth...and that means He will draw all men unto him. It's there in plain English, buddy...just like ALL of these (well, I guess "ALL" only means some, so I guess only SOME of these are in plain English ).

10. Every knee will bow, and every tongue will confess. See John 3:16.

13. You can't say that he is ONLY referring to a specific group of people. He says ALL, he means ALL.

14. God being ALL in ALL. Hmmm...I guess that only means SOME in SOME. Just like how the Lamb of God only takes away the sins of SOME of the world.

15. Destroying the works of the devil...that means evil is destroyed. Sin is destroyed. Lies are destroyed. All bad things are destroyed. Eternal hellfire damnation is the most evil possible thing ever imagined...I'm pretty sure that human-imagined fairy-tale will be destroyed as well.

16. I didn't make the verse up, but if you read the verses like it says (10-16) you will see that it says that all things will be drawn up into heaven. Learn to read, and comprehend words.

17. This one is simple...if God commands you to repent...don't you think that means He will let you repent? If God commands EVERYONE to repent, and God never changes (He never does) God will command people to repent as long as people CAN repent. And people WILL repent.

18. You're right, I don't know why I included this one.

19. Nothing to say about this.

20. It's VERY simple...He that is dead, is freed from sin. You CAN'T tell me it means something that it doesn't.

Most of these verses, you are just plainly stating the exact opposite of what they say. Very very weak.

21. LOL at you thinking this is hard work. I must put more work into my posts than you have in your entire life.

22. Right, but it's a nice verse, telling what everyone's sins will be.

23. This is also mentioned in Revelation...the former World has passed away? Yea...God will wipe away ALL tears from ALL faces. I'm pretty sure that means there won't be any people screaming in hellfire.

24. Right, but I figured I would include it.

25. It says that the Lord will not cast off forever. That means He won't cast off forever...

26. Weak...it says that salvation has appeared to ALL men (this hasn't happened yet).



Honestly, I am embarrassed for you. You only "refuted" the ones that didn't have anything to do with salvation.

Good job! The rest...you basically stated the exact opposite of what they meant.

You can attach little comments to every single one of these verses...that doesn't mean you have accomplished ANYTHING. And, sorry to tell you, but you haven't accomplished anything. I at least thought I would get a challenge from you, but apparently this "fried your brain". How long did it take you...10 minutes? lmao

And it's funny that you think just because you wrote a little sentence after each verse, that you "refuted" what I am "teaching". You people can trick yourselves into believing whatever the hell you want...I'm so sick of the constant bull**** from you morons. I could probably post all the evidence in the Bible proving me right, and you would just ignore it and complain. I can understand why atheists get so frustrated trying to debate with you people...you refuse to consider evidence that you don't like. Most of you can't even read for 5 minutes without "frying your brain" or "getting confused" or like adilrockstar, deeming it "junk" and "garbage" and "mumbo-jumbo". Maybe I will make another thread in a few weeks...but I'm really tired of the little games I've been playing with you guys. It's becoming a real waste of my time. At least I reached a few people, and that makes it all worth it.

Again I say nothing you have said is "evidence". There are 100 times more people that would agree with what i have said against your "verses that show proof". There is no proof in your verses and I just demonstrated that and people now see the load of BS that you are trying to preach. Also, instead of just copying and pasting those verses over and over again, you may want to narrow it down to the verses that might have more weight for what you are trying to "proove" instead of posting verses that have nothing to do with the fact.

I would also like to see what you have to say about the other vrses that i have placed before you that also show your BS...

[Quadrummer]

Originally Posted by Beatitude

Very well done Quad.

Thanks man, I enjoy doin all this. It helps me sharpen my sword. I have learned alot through all this.

[Violator009]

Originally Posted by smj5351

15. Destroying the works of the devil...that means evil is destroyed. Sin is destroyed. Lies are destroyed. All bad things are destroyed. Eternal hellfire damnation is the most evil possible thing ever imagined...I'm pretty sure that human-imagined fairy-tale will be destroyed as well.

Answer me this, are you sayin the devil will be saved aswell?

[RelentlessChaos]

Originally Posted by Quadrummer

In every verse he posted and every verse I posted I read the whole chapter. I also read overviews of the entire book in which the passages are in and the context as to which each passage is referring. I have had alot of training on how to read the bible and i have used those skilles in this thread. Thanks for the insight and it would be great to get those other verses from you if i could. Thanks,

Corey

haha same. i read commentaries, and bible dictionaries. Maybe smj should look up fire, and refiners fire.

[Absolute0]

**popcorn**

[RelentlessChaos]

[QUOTE=smj5351;25338061]1. Wrong...nowhere does it say that we only get one chance. That's your opinion, I'd like you to at least back it up with scripture.

Originally Posted by smj5351

2. Wrong again...it says that ALL die in Adam (doesn't every human being die?) and then it goes right on to say that ALL will be made alive in Christ. It doesn't say "all Christians" or "all who believe"... It's very simple...everyone dies, and everyone will be made alive.

This goes for number 2 and 3. All men were destined for hell. Because of mans sin, and choice to disobey God, we put ourselves in a BAD position. A position we had no control over. Still dont, but somewhat of a decision, and God PROMISES eternal salvation. "All were dead" yes, but because of Christ, we were made alive. We now dont have to die. Its a choice of choosing this day who you will follow, and worship. Doesnt it also say, those who believe in him will not perish? so im thinking that all are to perish, and all were going to, but christ freed us. Man already rejected him, so why would he then make all men go to heaven, if they dont want to? thats why he made it a choice.

Originally Posted by smj5351

3. Wrong, wrong wrong. It SPECIFICALLY makes a distinction between THOSE WHO BELIEVE, and those who DON'T believe. It says that ALL men are saved, ESPECIALLY those who believe. You are REALLY stretching it on this one. So far it's really weak. Let's see how the others are.

So if all are going to be saved, why in that verse does it say "especially those who believe in him? huh, huh? i think all men were saved from eternal punishment, but not inheriting heaven. Its a choice you must make to inherit heaven. Yes it is given to us, but only those who seek after God. The option os given, but the gift is not. Its something you must take, and a choice you must make.

Originally Posted by smj5351

26. Weak...it says that salvation has appeared to ALL men (this hasn't happened yet).

yeah all salvation appeared to all men when christ died. There was no slavation. There was no savior. Why do we call it salvation, or him our savior. What did he save us from smj? i thought there is no hell. Or was hell gone, and disappeared? We obviously showed God we didnt care when we sinned, so why would he make us go to heaven, when we chose to sin, and show him sometimes in our time, hes not top priority, Yes people forget, but others who dont know him, dont care. So why would he make them go to heaven. Is he gonna make them worship him in heaven? yeah every kneee will bow when Christ returns, but will everyone worship him in heaven? i dont know why hed do that, when they dont want to here on earth. Hey, thats another sign of free will.

EDIT: smj what does john 3:16 mean then? why does it say "those who believe in him, will not perish" and in that other verse, it says all men " "will" be saved" ESPECIALLY THOSE WHO *BELIEVE*"

see smj, you cant look at a verse and say, "its not talking about hell, that says nothing of hell" "this says fire, all will be baptized in fire"

dude, you gotta look at the contect, and read on certain words, and figure whos speaking and who the person talking to. you cant just look at a verse and make an assumption on it. Thats what those who dont have the Holy Spirit do. They dont understand anything about the bible then, and it wont make sense to them.

[RelentlessChaos]

heres another question smj. honestly in all respect

Why do you think YOUR "right", and everyone else here on bb.com who claims to be a christian is wrong.

along with the people who wrote the bible dictionaries, and the bible commentaries, who are probably bible scholars, who invest im sure WAY more time into the bible, and studying and learning it, than we do.

[RelentlessChaos]

sorry for the many posts in a row, more likely you wont want to read one long post

commentary:

John 3:16 (really good. please read)

This is one of the best known verses in all the bible, doubtless because it states the gospel so clearly and simply. It summarizes what the Lord Jesus had been teaching Nicodemus concerning the manner by which the new birth is recieved. GOD, we read, SO LOVED THE WORLD. THE WORLD here includes all mankind. God does not love men's sin or the wicked world system, but He loves people and is not willing that any should perish.
The extent of His love is shown by the fact THAT HE GAVE HIS ONLY BEGOTTEN SON. God has no other son like the Lord Jesus. It as an expression of His infinate love that he would be willing to give HIS unique SON for a race of rebel sinners. This does Not mean that everyone is saved. A person must recieve what Christ has done for him before God willgive him eternal life. Therefore the words are added, :THAT WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM SHALL NOT PERISH." There is no need for anyone to perish. A way has been provided by which all might be saved, but a person must acknowledge the Lord Jesus Christ as personal Savior. When he does this, he has eternal LIFE as a present possession.

[Quadrummer]

Originally Posted by Absolute0

**popcorn**

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.

Can I have some, im bored now. I dont know what to do with myself... Lol. i feel as if there is nothing left to be said.

[HardcoreFitness]

as with many fellow Christians on this site I have had many arguments with smj, and as we all know he will always go back to believing his cult views but your the first guy I have seen take the time to address every single one of his false claims. Even if we can't save him atleast others that have been lead astray by him on here can finally see that he is not a servent of God, and actually a wolf in sheeps clothing. Keep fighting the good fight brother.... you have my respect

[Quadrummer]

Originally Posted by HardcoreFitness

as with many fellow Christians on this site I have had many arguments with smj, and as we all know he will always go back to believing his cult views but your the first guy I have seen take the time to address every single one of his false claims. Even if we can't save him atleast others that have been lead astray by him on here can finally see that he is not a servent of God, and actually a wolf in sheeps clothing. Keep fighting the good fight brother.... you have my respect

That is the main reason I wanted to do this. I know he will never change his beliefs and I am not expecting him to. I just wanted to outline the faulty claims he has made so others can decide for themselvs what is real truth. In fact, dont even listen to what i have to say people. Go look up these verses for yourself and come up with some of your beliefs. Never just take what someone has to tell you as truth. Look it up for yourself. And if I made any mistakes on my theology, please let me know (not you smj, I know what you think)...

[974g63awd]

Originally Posted by Quadrummer

That is the main reason I wanted to do this. I know he will never change his beliefs and I am not expecting him to. I just wanted to outline the faulty claims he has made so others can decide for themselvs what is real truth. In fact, dont even listen to what i have to say people. Go look up these verses for yourself and come up with some of your beliefs. Never just take what someone has to tell you as truth. Look it up for yourself. And if I made any mistakes on my theology, please let me know (not you smj, I know what you think)...

Negged for being from the 909/951




















j/k