x factor o.g.

[ultramario17]

Is this not a thing anymore? are they only selling advanced? out eeverywhere? Heard advance wasn't as efficient?

do you all have better success with ara than PA? and don't want to stack them..

damnit, when is magnitropin coming back?

[Mumra]

Came expecting:

[kbayne]

Is this not a thing anymore? are they only selling advanced? out eeverywhere? Heard advance wasn't as efficient?

do you all have better success with ara than PA? and don't want to stack them..

damnit, when is magnitropin coming back?

Stick with ArA. PA, might not be what we thought with recent study.

And patience is key with Magnitropin. Soon, it'll be back.

[kissdadookie]

Is this not a thing anymore? are they only selling advanced? out eeverywhere? Heard advance wasn't as efficient?

do you all have better success with ara than PA? and don't want to stack them..

damnit, when is magnitropin coming back?

Between the 2, I would lean towards ArA having more benefit. X-Factor Advanced IMHO is also superior to the regular X-Factor. I've used many many many many many bottles of both.

[AfroPope]

Is this not a thing anymore?

it is.

are they only selling advanced?

At this point yes.

out eeverywhere?

it's an in-demand product made by a small company, retailers run out frequently.

Heard advance wasn't as efficient?

The doses of the active ingredients are identical. "Efficiency" is a worthless metric by which to measure a supplement.

do you all have better success with ara than PA?

Yes, ArA is far better in my experience.

and don't want to stack them..

only a fool and a coward wouldn't want to stack them.

damnit, when is magnitropin coming back?

Magnitropin was just an underdosed epicatechin supplement, if you want to waste your money on something like it there's tons of others.

[ultramario17]

Between the 2, I would lean towards ArA having more benefit. X-Factor Advanced IMHO is also superior to the regular X-Factor. I've used many many many many many bottles of both.

Last time I took this, has already been over a year, year and a half. People were swallowing nasty controlled labs product to absorb Ara, is that still normal/necessary. If I just take them all with a pre workout, would that suffice?

[AfroPope]

Last time I took this, has already been over a year, year and a half. People were swallowing nasty controlled labs product to absorb Ara, is that still normal/necessary. If I just take them all with a pre workout, would that suffice?

You're referring to the "neuron" dosing, which requires glycerol monostearate, most commonly available as GlycerGrow by CL. GlycerGrow 2 is way less nasty. I notice better gains when following the neuron dosing, KDD does not.

[kissdadookie]

You're referring to the "neuron" dosing, which requires glycerol monostearate, most commonly available as GlycerGrow by CL. GlycerGrow 2 is way less nasty. I notice better gains when following the neuron dosing, KDD does not.

^ That.

[AMeyer9]

And patience is key with Magnitropin. Soon, it'll be back.

verysoon.jpg

[ultramario17]

it is.

At this point yes.

it's an in-demand product made by a small company, retailers run out frequently.

The doses of the active ingredients are identical. "Efficiency" is a worthless metric by which to measure a supplement.

Yes, ArA is far better in my experience.

only a fool and a coward wouldn't want to stack them.

Magnitropin was just an underdosed epicatechin supplement, if you want to waste your money on something like it there's tons of others.

no offense, just something about you and your responses I just don't like. I feel like it's constructed with heavy focus medication

[AfroPope]

no offense, just something about you and your responses I just don't like. I feel like it's constructed with heavy focus medication

you've never liked me on any forum you've posted on and some day you will learn to relax and accept that whether or not you like me has no bearing on whether or not I am giving out good information. Also, meditation rules and is extremely chill.

[82ndAirborne]

Stick with ArA. PA, might not be what we thought with recent study.

And patience is key with Magnitropin. Soon, it'll be back.

not disputing anything you said here, in fact, this question is out of curiosity, but can you point me in the direction of the PA study/efficacy data? I've never used it but was under the impression some recent study proved it was actually effective so now I am confused lol. Thanks bro

[kissdadookie]

not disputing anything you said here, in fact, this question is out of curiosity, but can you point me in the direction of the PA study/efficacy data? I've never used it but was under the impression some recent study proved it was actually effective so now I am confused lol. Thanks bro

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17210675

http://www.jbc.org/content/286/34/29568.abstract

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2742264/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23035701

Since Jacob Wilson is again a point of contention, I've done you the favor and have excluded that one in the group of links above

[kissdadookie]

Also this study on PA, which I didn't even realize existed until just now (since this was actually from last year):

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27274715

This one was most certainly industry funded so take that into consideration.

[Cheftepesh]

Also this study on PA, which I didn't even realize existed until just now (since this was actually from last year):

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27274715

.


When in Doubt as kissadookie

[kissdadookie]

Also just noticed that the Escalante study used MaxTor which has a confounding variable of having HMB in it as well, so, probably not a great study to look at if you are trying to look at PA specifically.

[kbayne]

not disputing anything you said here, in fact, this question is out of curiosity, but can you point me in the direction of the PA study/efficacy data? I've never used it but was under the impression some recent study proved it was actually effective so now I am confused lol. Thanks bro

http://www.nrcresearchpress.com/doi/...4#.WNWCPRiZORs

[SwolenONE]

We'll be producing more X-Factor original very soon, thank you very much for your patience during the backorder.

In the meantime you can grab a cycle of X-Factor Advanced, which many customers prefer to the original, and has a 9/10 score here at BB.

https://www.bodybuilding.com/store/m...hTerm=x-factor

Thanks for all of the ArA love in this thread guys!

[kissdadookie]

http://www.nrcresearchpress.com/doi/...4#.WNWCPRiZORs

What was the training like? The full text didn't really give all that much insight into the training.

[82ndAirborne]

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17210675

http://www.jbc.org/content/286/34/29568.abstract

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2742264/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23035701

Since Jacob Wilson is again a point of contention, I've done you the favor and have excluded that one in the group of links above

Also this study on PA, which I didn't even realize existed until just now (since this was actually from last year):

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27274715

This one was most certainly industry funded so take that into consideration.

Thanks bro, tracking, and I was also aware of these...

https://nutritionandmetabolism.biome...986-017-0166-6

http://jissn.biomedcentral.com/artic...970-016-0135-x

http://www.nrcresearchpress.com/doi/...4#.WNWMKzvytaT

https://jissn.biomedcentral.com/arti...1550-2783-9-47

so my question is with what is the recent data that says "PA may not be what we thought it was"? Because all of this tells me that there is at least the propensity for it to be effective.

[AMeyer9]

Magnitropin was just an underdosed epicatechin supplement, if you want to waste your money on something like it there's tons of others.

I'd think most would consider 184mg of actual Epicatechin to be a pretty good dose, but to each their own I suppose.

[ultramario17]

I'd think most would consider 184mg of actual Epicatechin to be a pretty good dose, but to each their own I suppose.

don't waste your time, he is the kind to flock to Oregon, Austin, any kind of hippie town/city. Prob. grow a groomed beard and be a sophisticated know it all.

[AfroPope]

I'd think most would consider 184mg of actual Epicatechin to be a pretty good dose, but to each their own I suppose.

My understanding is that Epicatechin, like Laxogenin, is promising in animal studies but has virtually no human studies on its efficacy as a muscle-building supplement, certainly not in the same fashion as ArA, am I mistaken?

don't waste your time, he is the kind to flock to Oregon, Austin, any kind of hippie town/city. Prob. grow a groomed beard and be a sophisticated know it all.

Do you want me to dig up the threads you used to make about not being able to satisfy your girlfriend or do you want to hop off my nuts, buddy?

[VO2Maxima]

Last time I took this, has already been over a year, year and a half. People were swallowing nasty controlled labs product to absorb Ara, is that still normal/necessary. If I just take them all with a pre workout, would that suffice?

Necessary, no. Does having an emulsifier help? Possibly, doesn't hurt anyway.

You're referring to the "neuron" dosing, which requires glycerol monostearate, most commonly available as GlycerGrow by CL. GlycerGrow 2 is way less nasty. I notice better gains when following the neuron dosing, KDD does not.

Yeah but GlycerGrow 2 doesn't work as an emulsifier, as it is HydroMax, not GMS. If you don't want to use GMS, you could use soy lecithin (although OP sounds like he doesn't want to use phosphatidic acid for some reason, which he would get with soy lecithin), but HydroMax won't do the same thing.

[kbayne]

What was the training like? The full text didn't really give all that much insight into the training.

Only thing I find is:

3 sessions per week consisting of 1 for chest (8 sets) and 2 for legs (16 sets).

Compared to ones you linked, a little lower in volume. PA source was a product using Mediator PA.

Thanks bro, tracking, and I was also aware of these...

https://nutritionandmetabolism.biome...986-017-0166-6

http://jissn.biomedcentral.com/artic...970-016-0135-x

http://www.nrcresearchpress.com/doi/...4#.WNWMKzvytaT

https://jissn.biomedcentral.com/arti...1550-2783-9-47

so my question is with what is the recent data that says "PA may not be what we thought it was"? Because all of this tells me that there is at least the propensity for it to be effective.

Almost every study showing PA has any merit, was either funded or sponsored by Chemi Nutra, or any other company in affiliation with PA.

Most recent study I linked above, has no affiliation with any PA companies.

[AfroPope]

Necessary, no. Does having an emulsifier help? Possibly, doesn't hurt anyway.


Yeah but GlycerGrow 2 doesn't work as an emulsifier, as it is HydroMax, not GMS. If you don't want to use GMS, you could use soy lecithin (although OP sounds like he doesn't want to use phosphatidic acid for some reason, which he would get with soy lecithin), but HydroMax won't do the same thing.

Interesting, I hadn't realized the products were so functionally different, which perhaps they aren't except in this case.