Question about Volume and Frequency

[kevingoupil]

Hi everyone, first of all sorry for my english, but I'll try my best ^^.

So I heard a lot that frequency is key for natural bodybuilder because of protein synthesis. It make sense but if for example I start to follow a PPl workout I surely won't be able to do as much volume and as much exercice per workout (ex: for chest). So I follow a 4 days split type of workout then 1 day off and repeat so I hit every muscle every 5 days pretty hard, with a PPL I would hit every muscle every 4 days (with a days off after leg) but not gonna be able to do as much volume. For me I would feel like I haven't hit my chest hard enough, same with shoulder or triceps. My question is wich one is the most optimal for building muscle when natural ? And why please. And if you guys have any like scientific fact that you could link me, that would be great ! Thanks a lot !

[SuffolkPunch]

What matters is total workload over time. How you distribute it is not as important. There are two factors to take into account:
1. directed adaptation / SRA cycle length / the need to overload
2. Protein synthesis time length

A balance of these two tend to produce the frequency required in a program. Generally speaking an early intermediate can work each body part once in 4 days so a PPL is fine for that. SRA cycle lengths and protein synthesis window tends to get shorter as you get more advanced - however you also need more total volume per bodypart to progress.

There is also the issue that at least some of your training sessions should cause overload. For a more advanced lifter, I would say that you need a heavy overloading session once a week or so with maybe 2 or 3 more non overloading sessions between. Note that overlap between bodyparts is a valid form on non overloading volume. For example the use of traps in deadlift, overhead press and barbell row.

If you want more detail, see the JTS principles of strength training.

[Grizvok]

You have to give us your experience level and what you currently bench, squat, and deadlift as well as your current height/weight/bodyfat.

[kevingoupil]

What matters is total workload over time. How you distribute it is not as important. There are two factors to take into account:
1. directed adaptation / SRA cycle length / the need to overload
2. Protein synthesis time length

A balance of these two tend to produce the frequency required in a program. Generally speaking an early intermediate can work each body part once in 4 days so a PPL is fine for that. SRA cycle lengths and protein synthesis window tends to get shorter as you get more advanced - however you also need more total volume per bodypart to progress.

There is also the issue that at least some of your training sessions should cause overload. For a more advanced lifter, I would say that you need a heavy overloading session once a week or so with maybe 2 or 3 more non overloading sessions between. Note that overlap between bodyparts is a valid form on non overloading volume. For example the use of traps in deadlift, overhead press and barbell row.

If you want more detail, see the JTS principles of strength training.

Ok so you think that even if I hit my muscle more frequently but with less volume, it's not necessarly optimal ? I've been training for almost 3 years now. What you are saying is that with time the protein synthesis window get shorter and we need more volume, but you can't combine both obviously. That's where I don't know what to do between PPL with less volume and a "more volume" workout where I hit every muscle every 5 days.

[SuffolkPunch]

I was referring to more volume in total - not necessarily more volume per session

[kevingoupil]

Oh ok but to sum it up do you think hitting every muscle every 4 days with lower volume > hitting every muscle every 5 days with higher volume ? As you said with time you usually need more volume in total but also you would need more frequency since protein synthesis window get shorter. I know there are different parameter to take in consideration as you said above, but at the end of the day ?

[NZninja101]

Oh ok but to sum it up do you think hitting every muscle every 4 days with lower volume > hitting every muscle every 5 days with higher volume ? As you said with time you usually need more volume in total but also you would need more frequency since protein synthesis window get shorter. I know there are different parameter to take in consideration as you said above, but at the end of the day ?

At the end of the day, with volume over time being the same, you will likely do slightly better to train each muscle once every 4 days, rather than once every 5 days.

[kevingoupil]

At the end of the day, with volume over time being the same, you will likely do slightly better to train each muscle once every 4 days, rather than once every 5 days.

How is volume the same since my workout is :
Chest/Bi
Leg/Calves
Should/Tri
Back

If I decide to do a PPL I'll have to cut down on the volume there is no way I could do Chest/Should/Tri on a High Volume type of workout, My workout would last 3h