Meat-eaters...

[Aggressive]

****ing christ this is why Mr T is still going strong because of liberal feel good chit like this. Only in 1st world nations can some bullchit like veganism exist. If you did some man vs wild chit you'd find out real quick that meat aka protein aka vitamin b 12 is a necessary component to the human body.

Only in a first world, over-privileged oppressive, consumerist race would we find real fukin life death camps for other sentient living beings. Some of whom possess the same intelligence as 3-year old fukin CHILDREN. What will it take for you to make the connection? They're just different from us. That doesn't make it alright.

[Cha0tic]

I dunno where you're based but the choices are crazy good around the US and Canada. Over here in the UK its a bit more difficult to find alternatives. But we have a few. As I said earlier in the thread Linda McCartney pulled "pork" burger tasted insanely good. Got some spicy burger options too I foget the name of now, but srs so much better than meat imo. Plus you can avoid the nasty health issues that come along with meat too. Give them a try brah.

Us, but my family comes from Puerto Rico and Colombia, my dad and his family is meat based. Almost everyday it's steak or some form of meat.

I love pork I'm not sure if you're talking about actual pork or vegan alternative but , I love poultry and fish as well.
I recently just had pulled pork, very very good.

My gf when I first met her just had plates of veggies.

[Thekittenking]

(first ever vegan thread actually made by a vegan, and not a meat-eater attacking vegans)


Why has it got to turn into an argument of technicalities every single time?

Why can't a person see that something is wrong, see that the harm is not only to the animals who've done nothing to harm you, but to the goddam planet your own children are supposed to inhabit after you've destroyed it.

It's wrong to hurt things for pleasure or convenience. Most people would agree with that (without legit mental problems). But tell them to please stop eating animals, and everyone loses their minds.
It's not hard. I ate meat most of my life. I ate a steak a day for a while, but I have never felt the need to attack people who didn't. I knew even then it wasn't right. I didn't have to put up this hard-ass wall to pretend I didn't feel. The transition was easy compared to the lives who would've ended up on my plate. Statistically around 200 animals a year saved by me, alone, just by not eating them. It's not much, but it's a difference I can make.

There are a lot of opinionated speakers on the subject, and I can totally understand why someone wouldn't like the person. But you can't use that as an excuse to avoid it. The core reason behind is always there: To not harm sentient beings for pleasure. to live in a way that causes as little suffering, and as little damage to the only home the animals, we, and our children have.

Who can really argue this?

200 less animals will be bred, or other people will eat more meat due to cheaper prices as 200 more animals are in supply with less demand.

[LMAOatYou]

I understand the argument against factory farming and asking that we decrease the amount of meat consumption but to completely eliminate is too much. Plus with things like hunting we actually help control populations. And what do you think about invasive animals such as boar?

I personally don't have any moral issue with killing and eating animals so will continue to do so

[Aggressive]

Us, but my family comes from Puerto Rico and Colombia, my dad and his family is meat based. Almost everyday it's steak or some form of meat.

I love pork I'm not sure if you're talking about actual pork or vegan alternative but , I love poultry and fish as well.
I recently just had pulled pork, very very good.

My gf when I first met her just had plates of veggies.

I was in the same position. Whole family had meat my entire life, ever meal. No meal felt like a meal without meat when I actually switched for a while. You get used to it. I just realise that Its nurture. I was just brought up to feel like that.

She's (both of you) seem to be missing out on the sheer choice you've got over there. I'm heading abroad to check out a few EU countries' choices the next couple of months. Yeah its an alternative to pork, but (imo) tastes even better. Plenty of poultry and fish alternatives too. Just had some "fish" last night. No difference in taste. Except its healthier and doesn't mean something has to die for it.

[WrathOfPecan]

Around 70% of grains are used for animal feed for livestock. You could feed the entire planet twice over with the grain WE use for our meat addiction. So for your concerns, you can quit meat and make a far smaller impact on this earth. Sounds good?

This one always blows my mind. Its as if they don't think that the animals need to eat something while they're held up in Auschwitz.

Perhaps you missed the obvious part where I said I don't eat grain fed meat, only free range grass fed.

If I quit eating free range grass fed, then I need to fill that part of my diet with grain, which is more destructive. I can't do anything about what other people are eating, only myself.

Congrats on being like most other vegans, OP, who take their talking points from pseudo-environmentalist propaganda that is based on commonly-believed fallacies. Its no different from the people who think they're doing the environment good by driving a flashy hybrid car -- in reality the lifetime carbon footprint of a hybrid (creation, use, and disposal) is considerably larger than a regular petrol car because batteries are terribly environmentally costly to produce and recycle. The best move, environmentally-speaking, is to buy a mechanically simple car and maintain it as long as possible. But nobody wants to be told the reality that in order to really save the environment they need to drive around in 20 year old corsas and golfs.

[Aggressive]

200 less animals will be bred, or other people will eat more meat due to cheaper prices as 200 more animals are in supply with less demand.

400 animals were able to avoid a life of literal hell because of the lower demand for meat. There's no debate here. I doubt you would choose life of hell and torment vs eternity.


Again, technicalities. None of you have come out and said that you believe it's right to torture things for your own personal pleasure.

Perhaps you missed the obvious part where I said I don't eat grain fed meat, only free range grass fed.

If I quit eating free range grass fed, then I need to fill that part of my diet with grain, which is more destructive. I can't do anything about what other people are eating, only myself.

Congrats on being like most other vegans, OP, who take their talking points from pseudo-environmentalist propaganda that is based on commonly-believed fallacies. Its no different from the people who think they're doing the environment good by driving a flashy hybrid car -- in reality the lifetime carbon footprint of a hybrid (creation, use, and disposal) is considerably larger than a regular petrol car because batteries are terribly environmentally costly to produce and recycle. The best move, environmentally-speaking, is to buy a mechanically simple car and maintain it as long as possible. But nobody wants to be told the reality that in order to really save the environment they need to drive around in 20 year old corsas and golfs.

Your grass-fed meat still had to be half-beheaded in it's journey to your plate. You ever see a person have their throat cut? So apathy is your answer? Neat.

[FailedPotential]

What if it was discovered that plants were just as sentient as animals? It's a what if question, but what if, and what would you then do?

[Triathletes]

People will always argue 2+2 doesn't = 4 lol. Its so easy to believe it doesn't affect their personal lives and even easier to not give a sht until its too late.

[Cha0tic]

I was in the same position. Whole family had meat my entire life, ever meal. No meal felt like a meal without meat when I actually switched for a while. You get used to it. I just realise that Its nurture. I was just brought up to feel like that.

She's (both of you) seem to be missing out on the sheer choice you've got over there. I'm heading abroad to check out a few EU countries' choices the next couple of months. Yeah its an alternative to pork, but (imo) tastes even better. Plenty of poultry and fish alternatives too. Just had some "fish" last night. No difference in taste. Except its healthier and doesn't mean something has to die for it.

Wanna know what brother I'll talk it over with my gf tomorrow I know she'd be down. I'll look at my choices and alternatives in the vegan life style. If you can shoot me a pm with some info or links, I'll check it out tomorrow and keep you updated.

[Aggressive]

What if it was discovered that plants were just as sentient as animals? It's a what if question, but what if, and what would you then do?

1. They're not. They don't posses a central nervous system. Any reaction to stimuli is an automatic reaction, a bit like your hairs standing on end when you get cold. They don't feel pain. An animal knows when it's being hurt. It feels pain and fear. The same way you would feel if you were captured, hung up and had a blade slide through your neck. A story of a 3-year old child being abducted and tortured strikes horror in you, but a pig has the same intelligence and that's different somehow? Why?
2. EVEN if they were sentient. Vegans consume less plants than meat eaters because most of the planets grains and plant-life is destroyed/eaten in the production of meat.

[Thekittenking]

Would you rather live in torment, pain and fear.. A literal hell your entire live? Or would you rather just not have existed in the first place? Do you think the pig that can't even turn over in the cage she's in would thank you for letting her live a little while?

So if an animal was bred to be eaten and lived a happy life it would be okay to eat it right?

[zhengterry]

lmao @ trying to guilt trip non-vegans

lmao @ saving animals produced for consumption

lmao @ being such a big pussy

[Aggressive]

So if an animal was bred to be eaten and lived a happy life it would be okay to eat it right?

none of them experience a happy life. They're either locked in a farm or locked in a cage. Seriously, would YOU be content with living in a cage half your life, then having someone string you up and cut your throat so that something can eat you?

And no, ofcourse I don't think its right. You might as well ask me if I think its ok to string toddlers up and murder them. Would you feel ok with that?

[420Layers]

none of them experience a happy life. They're either locked in a farm or locked in a cage. Seriously, would YOU be content with living in a cage half your life, then having someone string you up and cut your throat so that something can eat you?

I only eat free range (srs)

[B055M0D3]

C'mon man. You're using a fictional story to justify the torture and torment of billions of pure innocent beings every single year. These animals have done nothing to deserve the wrath we have put on them. What would your god think of the pain you inflict on beings that have done nothing to you? For pleasure? For convenience?

I used to work in an animal processing facility for one of the largest meat companies in the world. They do a good job at slaughtering the animals humanely. The animals are stunned, slit and bleed out feeling nothing. The way they are raised isn't too bad either. They have standards on how much space is required. Most cows were 'free range.' Chicken had ample space because it helped them grow quicker. Our company has penalized and revoked contracts of growers who didn't follow their standards. The government is heavily involved in animal welfare too.

It is much harder to supplement nutrients without meat. With inflation rising it is difficult to eat healthy. Most people can't afford it and fast foods are both convenient and cheap. People already live pay check to pay check as is. I spend roughly $250/week to eat healthier with whole grains, berries, lean cuts of meat. Most people don't have that kind of luxury.

It is also more difficult to feed the population too. Vegetables take vasts amounts of land and spoil much quicker. Can you imagine if people stopped eating meat tomorrow? Hundreds of thousands of jobs would be lost, if not millions due to the domino effect.

I understand your feelings towards the animal cruelty, but USA does a fine job at minimizing the suffering. Have you ever seen the way animals treat other animals in the wild? They don't even kill them instantly and eat them alive. Do you think about all the suffering animals deliver to one another? It is part of the cycle of life. A lot of animals are omni/carnivores too. A hungry lion/bear/dog/etc wouldn't think twice to eat you, no matter how much suffering it would cause to you physically and the mental suffering of your families.

[WrathOfPecan]

Your grass-fed meat still had to be half-beheaded in it's journey to your plate. You ever see a person have their throat cut? So apathy is your answer? Neat.

I've gone hunting before, gutted and field-dressed my own elk, and go fishing regularly, OP. Its the circle of life and I only wish that I could live a life as a full-time hunter-gatherer. Unfortunately grain eaters such as yourself have encroached on so much land that there is very little natural land left for wildlife to flourish.

[Aggressive]

I used to work in an animal processing facility for one of the largest meat companies in the world. They do a good job at slaughtering the animals humanely. The animals are stunned, slit and bleed out feeling nothing. The way they are raised isn't too bad either. They have standards on how much space is required. Most cows were 'free range.' Chicken had ample space because it helped them grow quicker. Our company has penalized and revoked contracts of growers who didn't follow our standards. The government is heavily involved in animal welfare too.

It is much harder to supplement nutrients without meat. With inflation rising it is difficult to eat healthy. Most people can't afford it and fast foods are both convenient and cheap. People already live pay check to pay check as is. I spend roughly $250/week to eat healthier with whole grains, berries, lean cuts of meat. Most people don't have that kind of luxury.

It is also more difficult to feed the population too. Vegetables take vasts amounts of land and spoil much quicker. Can you imagine if people stopped eating meat tomorrow? Hundreds of thousands of jobs would be lost, if not millions due to the domino effect.

I understand your feelings towards the animal cruelty, but USA does a fine job at minimizing the suffering. Have you ever seen the way animals treat other animals in the wild? They don't even kill them instantly and eat them alive. Do you think about all the suffering animals deliver to one another? It is part of the cycle of life. A lot of animals are omni/carnivores too.

- No slaughter is humane. Ending a life is hard, and painful, and takes time and makes a mess, and its awful. This is why it's hidden from us. Nobody would buy a KFC if they saw what went into their meal.
- It takes more land to raise livestock comparitively to growing crops. There are charities that provide purely vegan food to starving populations - Not because of ethics. But because it's cheaper. It is cheaper, unless you go for the processed meat alternatives. They can be higher in price. But they're non-essential lets be real.
- No doubt nature is brutal. But we're a species that believes itself above others in morality, intelligence, progress. Why are we comparing ourselves to them only when it comes to how we kill them? We dont NEED to do this. We don't NEED to support this. Its the biggest business on the planet.

I've gone hunting before, gutted and field-dressed my own elk, and go fishing regularly, OP. Its the circle of life and I only wish that I could live a life as a full-time hunter-gatherer. Unfortunately grain eaters such as yourself have encroached on so much land that there is very little natural land left for wildlife to flourish.

Like I said. Hunting > factory farmed animals (the norm now). It's far less cruel, far less painful. The animal was able to live, stretch it's legs, and breathe free air. I don't agree with it at all. I don't think we need to do it anymore with our advancements, but it's not my argument here honestly. If it meant the animals in the death camps could live free and everyone hunted for their own food. I would choose that over what we have now.

[Aggressive]

I only eat free range (srs)

Thats a common loophole.

free range: http://www.veganoutreach.org/freeran...eChickens2.jpg

[FailedPotential]

none of them experience a happy life. They're either locked in a farm or locked in a cage. Seriously, would YOU be content with living in a cage half your life, then having someone string you up and cut your throat so that something can eat you?

So you value the lives of animals locked in those cages as much as you value human life?

If you feel that way, then why don't you drive to the nearest farm you know of and free those animals.

If you knew a bunch of humans were actually locked in a cage, and you could easily just sneak in in the middle of the night and free them, of course you would, anyone would!

The point i'm making here is, if you truly value the life of "x" animal as much as you valued a humans life, then you would surely be making it your mission to sneak into farms in the middle of the night and free them.

That's why when people who say "I value animals MORE or the same as I view human life" i'm very suspicious if they actually felt that way. As said above, if you or anyone actually felt that way, you'd be saving them animals all day everyday.

If I valued the life of an animal as much as I value a human life, i'd be out there freeing those animals in the middle of the night, driving all over the country doing so.

[joshewwah]

I won't stop eating meat until they release artificial meat that can be grown using plants.

Til that day, ill still eat meat. Vegans should be investing money in such companies to speed up the process. Simply going vegan won't do much in the long run

[LMAOatYou]

none of them experience a happy life. They're either locked in a farm or locked in a cage. Seriously, would YOU be content with living in a cage half your life, then having someone string you up and cut your throat so that something can eat you?

And no, ofcourse I don't think its right. You might as well ask me if I think its ok to string toddlers up and murder them. Would you feel ok with that?

how many cows have you talked to about their quality of life? If you go to an actual farm and purchase whole half or quarter of a steer is it okay in your eyes? How much space do you think a steer needs to be happy?

[420Layers]

Thats a common loophole.

free range: http://www.veganoutreach.org/freeran...eChickens2.jpg

So based off one photo, with 0 supporting evidence I am supposed to make massive assumptions and throw away my beliefs?

[Aggressive]

So you value the lives of animals locked in those cages as much as you value human life?

If you feel that way, then why don't you drive to the nearest farm you know of and free those animals.

If you knew a bunch of humans were actually locked in a cage, and you could easily just sneak in in the middle of the night and free them, of course you would, anyone would!

The point i'm making here is, if you truly value the life of "x" animal as much as you valued a humans life, then you would surely be making it your mission to sneak into farms in the middle of the night and free them.

That's why when people who say "I value animals MORE or the same as I view human life" i'm very suspicious if they actually felt that way. As said above, if you or anyone actually felt that way, you'd be saving them animals all day everyday.

If I valued the life of an animal as much as I value a human life, i'd be out there freeing those animals in the middle of the night, driving all over the country doing so.

So why aren't you in africa right now liberating child soldiers, or in some chinese factory helping out with the over-worked slaves there?

I am vegan. I don't eat them, or support the industry that murders them. I've changed my life, changed the way I shop for food, the way I cook, the places I go. For them. What are you doing, for anyone?

Or do you just not care about anything at all? Because this thread wasn't really directed at the mentally ill.

So based off one photo, with 0 supporting evidence I am supposed to make massive assumptions and throw away my beliefs?

Christ. Get a grip mate, am I supposed to post every single picture in existence? Go visit a "free range" slaughterhouse.

[FD1997]

Ranting on the misc is going to make 0 difference to someone who consumes meat, they're going to do it anyway. Do you think reading this post will make me not eat that chicken tonight?

[8PointBuck]

didn't read.

you're a beta cuck if you're a vegan, end of story.

[bigmane123]

op takes steroids but crys about meat am i missing something here ? surely you must be trolling op

[Aggressive]

Ranting on the misc is going to make 0 difference to someone who consumes meat, they're going to do it anyway. Do you think reading this post will make me not eat that chicken tonight?

Not true. It was a Gary Yourofsky video that sparked my interest, and lead me to research more into it.. posted ON the misc. Im not innocent, Im not above any of you. I ate meat most of my life without a thought. Until I made that connection. Everyone has good in them, they just don't want to feel it.

This is the original video that started it for me anyway if anyone's interested. Watched this, then watched the one below it. Then Earthlings.. and it was set from there.





Just watch it in it's entirety and let me know your thoughts is all I ask.

[B055M0D3]

- No slaughter is humane. Ending a life is hard, and painful, and takes time and makes a mess, and its awful. This is why it's hidden from us. Nobody would buy a KFC if they saw what went into their meal.
- It takes more land to raise livestock comparitively to growing crops. There are charities that provide purely vegan food to starving populations - Not because of ethics. But because it's cheaper. It is cheaper, unless you go for the processed meat alternatives. They can be higher in price. But they're non-essential lets be real.
- No doubt nature is brutal. But we're a species that believes itself above others in morality, intelligence, progress. Why are we comparing ourselves to them only when it comes to how we kill them? We dont NEED to do this. We don't NEED to support this. Its the biggest business on the planet.

-People do know how it happens but they ignore it because they can go to the supermarket and have the meat handed to them without feeling bad. It's like how people know some products are treated with ammonia and reflavored, but people still eat it. How people smoke cigarettes even though it gives you cancer.
-You say these animals are crammed into small spaces and have no room to move, but a vegetable would use less land? How many chicken can I fit into a square mile v.s. vegetables? Then weigh your resources, can you really make people more full on veggies with the same space? Yeah, we can factor in that they eat some corn, but a majority of the nutrients come from cannibalism. The chicken fat/feet/heads/bones are cooked to a crisp, filtered into protein and put into the feed. Also, if weather wasn't nice one day and wiped out all your plants, what would you eat? Irish potato famine. Unlike the veggies, the chicken are housed with heat and cooling.
-Morality was invented by the weak so they could survive. Imagine where society would be today if we only bred the smartest, strongest, etc? We would be evolved superhumans, but instead we have people on welfare popping out 6 children or those who work on minimum wage for the rest of their lives. What if those superhumans would be smart enough to realize that animal meats kill you? Problem solved! We already abort babies everyday already now, right? Do you realize how much pollution that you, yourself create by existing? The electricity, internet, housing, cars, annihilating the Earth. If you want the animals to stop suffering, eliminate humans completely.

[ghst23]

Yes eating too much meat is bad. Meat is a low vibrational food which will lead to more problems down the road.