Benching 405 at 157 lbs!!! How?

[rimam1]

How is this guy able to bench so much at such a low bodyweight. I'm working on benching 225 with proper form.

Guys like Jim Wendler and Mark Rippetoe say you gotta eat... a LOT if you want to get stronger. And it makes perfect sense. But I can't figure out how this guy did it.

Is it just a matter of experience? Slowly adding 40 pounds to your bench year after year until you're finally lifting that much weight?



How can I get that strong?

[randomalias]

I thought that guy didn't work legs which keeps his body weight lower.

[JimRat6969]

Its that asian master race

[adpowah]

He posts here sometimes but I forget his username. Anyways, he's a dedicated bench specialist, if he continues he will probably hold a world record.

[rimam1]

It's absolutely incredible.

Judging from how small his arms are (relative to his bench), I wouldn't be surprised if he can squat a ridiculous amount too.

[breathinglife]

Hulecki benched 440@148, so yeah, it's a crazy bench, but there are a lot of crazy benches around in a sport like PL where crazy lifts are the point!

Wendler's general advice about lifting doesn't really apply to the top 1%.

[ecchastang]

Keep in mind that there are 3 people now who have benched 500+ in the 163/165 category. This guy, UFpwrlifter or something like that, would be much stronger if he did gain weight, as he is 5'10". He could probably be solidly 500 or more in 181's.

[rimam1]

How are these guys able to do it?

Genetics?

Or just keep lifting year after year, progressing little by little?

[smokinHawk]

The mind is the strongest muscle of them all. If you limit your belief on what you can do, you wont even come close. If you have the mindset that you will find out and do whatever it takes to achieve your goal, you will get there.
There are a lot of people who believe what the top % do is impossible, they are limiting themselves.
when some one first breaks a milestone it sets up on what people believe the human race can accomplish, so more and more people can do what that first person did. But it takes an initial visionary to break that milestone.
Like some of the world powerlifting records. When Jack Barnes set the 181 raw world record total at 1745, it stood for 41 years, until Brantley Thornton came and crushed it with 1800, since then two more people have done over 1800, and 3 more have done more then 1745. Now who believes 1950 raw at 181 is possible?

[breathinglife]

Yeah, that guy would probably be crazy if he moved to 165. Look at what happened when Roman Eremashvili moved up a weightclass--or when Maliek Derstine moved up a weightclass.

The mind is the strongest muscle of them all. If you limit your belief on what you can do, you wont even come close. If you have the mindset that you will find out and do whatever it takes to achieve your goal, you will get there.
There are a lot of people who believe what the top % do is impossible, they are limiting themselves.
when some one first breaks a milestone it sets up on what people believe the human race can accomplish, so more and more people can do what that first person did. But it takes an initial visionary to break that milestone.
Like some of the world powerlifting records. When Jack Barnes set the 181 raw world record total at 1745, it stood for 41 years, until Brantley Thornton came and crushed it with 1800, since then two more people have done over 1800, and 3 more have done more then 1945. Now who believes 1950 raw at 181 is possible?

I agree that it can be bad to limit yourself mentally, but I certainly don't do that. I'm pretty self aware: the reason I don't lift more is that I do place other limitations on myself, e.g., I put quite a few things ahead of powerlifting--family, career, etc. I'm certainly not willing to "do whatever it takes" to achieve a goal, especially in the realm of *cough* supplements. At the end of the day, powerlifting is a hobby for me, although I do enjoy watching those who can make a career of it!

EDIT: Maybe that wasn't so much directed at me. But yeah, to the OP--just train your hardest and use amazing lifters like this as inspiration!

I do, however, have some buddies who have some serious mental blockages, so it is definitely a problem for some. I was more just advising the OP to not be surprised if elite lifters don't seem to follow generally powerlifting advice of people like Rippetoe or Wendler. They are writing toward the general PLer, and even more to the beginner.

[kmc06005]

OP, he posts here some, maybe he'll chime in. IIRC it took him at least 6 months to go from 400 to 410. Dude is a freak, but he is also very patient, and has been doing the same thing over and over for a long, long time. That's the key to anything.

The whole world is full of 'overnight successes' that have been grinding for decades.

[breathinglife]

I'd also add that it's a little easier to specialize in one lift. It's possible that guy could be a great squatter as well, but I think probably he doesn't squat or deadlift all that much since he has zero videos of it. It is much more difficult to have a huge total (take J. Harder "smokinHawk" above) than it is to just focus on one lift and get really good at it.

Again, I'm not trying to take away from the guy--405@157 is crazy. I haven't yet benched 4 plates and my bodyweight has gone over 200 at times.

We can't really know most variables about top lifters: who knows if they have great genetics or just average, or if they have access to great food, or have other things in their life that compete with powerlifting. The only real sure variable of the guys at the top is that we know they've worked really hard to get there!

[BioSmith91]

If I knew, I would be doing it too.

[dtaps24]

It's absolutely incredible.

Judging from how small his arms are (relative to his bench), I wouldn't be surprised if he can squat a ridiculous amount too.

His arms are jacked. His whole upper body is jacked, he's just really lean. I don't think he even competes and likes to fish more than workout. It's mostly genetics and some decently hard work mixed in.

[smokinHawk]

His arms are jacked. His whole upper body is jacked, he's just really lean. I don't think he even competes and likes to fish more than workout. It's mostly genetics and some decently hard work mixed in.

I disagree that it is genetics for him. His arms are relatively long, I would say it was his drive and work over the coarse of his life, which built the right muscles in the right places.

[dtaps24]

I disagree that it is genetics for him. His arms are relatively long, I would say it was his drive and work over the coarse of his life, which built the right muscles in the right places.

I did say "mainly" genetics. He was benching around 400 6-8 years ago in college without any supplemental help. He has elite genes for benching and (probably) strength generally. Pretty sure he's even said he got great genetics Dad at some point. There's more to genetics than arm length. That doesn't change how hard he's worked or that he's been consistent, but there are thousands of people who work as hard if not harder and don't get 75% of those results.

[smokinHawk]

I did say "mainly" genetics. He was benching around 400 6-8 years ago in college without any supplemental help. He has elite genes for benching and (probably) strength generally. Pretty sure he's even said he got great genetics Dad at some point. There's more to genetics than arm length. That doesn't change how hard he's worked or that he's been consistent, but there are thousands of people who work as hard if not harder and don't get 75% of those results.

still disagree as it cannot be proven. He could naturally produce more testosterone then the average male, but looking at his body the signs are not there, as to a hairy body and MPB. But it could be his diet over the coarse of his life, sleep, lifestyle, activity and exercises.
All we have is speculation, which in that case saying someones genetics are a main contributor is invalid.

[dtaps24]

still disagree as it cannot be proven. He could naturally produce more testosterone then the average male, but looking at his body the signs are not there, as to a hairy body and MPB. But it could be his diet over the coarse of his life, sleep, lifestyle, activity and exercises.
All we have is speculation, which in that case saying someones genetics are a main contributor is invalid.

No big deal but it's course not coarse.

I don't want to get into a big thing, but you have focused on 2 possible genetic markers, levers (arm length) and testosterone (using indicators that are biased due to ethnicity), and ignored the dozens if not hundreds of others such as muscle fiber composition, response to stimuli, tendon:muscle ratio, etc. I will say that we're gonna have to agree to disagree if you think that genetics are not the primary factor to a clear outlier like him or even you. That does not diminish the fact that hard, smart work is necessary, but for most (if not all elite) strength athletes this quote from Nuckols holds true "What did it take for me to break records? Train consistently, identify weaknesses, and avoid injury. Yes, that was entirety of the revolutionary strategy that helped me get to the top." Sources:

http://www.strengtheory.com/what-it-...world-records/

https://www.t-nation.com/training/tr...lding-genetics

http://gregnuckols.com/2014/02/06/genetics/

[IngeKJ]

still disagree as it cannot be proven. He could naturally produce more testosterone then the average male, but looking at his body the signs are not there, as to a hairy body and MPB. But it could be his diet over the coarse of his life, sleep, lifestyle, activity and exercises.
All we have is speculation, which in that case saying someones genetics are a main contributor is invalid.

Being hairy and MPB has nothing to do with test production

[nosirrahx]

People always talk about genetics and its influence on things like muscles and hormones but what about your CNS? Is it possible to have a genetically freaky CNS that lets you push more weight with less muscle?

[kmc06005]

No big deal but it's course not coarse.

I don't want to get into a big thing, but you have focused on 2 possible genetic markers, levers (arm length) and testosterone (using indicators that are biased due to ethnicity), and ignored the dozens if not hundreds of others such as muscle fiber composition, response to stimuli, tendon:muscle ratio, etc. I will say that we're gonna have to agree to disagree if you think that genetics are not the primary factor to a clear outlier like him or even you. That does not diminish the fact that hard, smart work is necessary, but for most (if not all elite) strength athletes this quote from Nuckols holds true "What did it take for me to break records? Train consistently, identify weaknesses, and avoid injury. Yes, that was entirety of the revolutionary strategy that helped me get to the top." Sources:

http://www.strengtheory.com/what-it-...world-records/

https://www.t-nation.com/training/tr...lding-genetics

http://gregnuckols.com/2014/02/06/genetics/

[smokinHawk]

The thing is that it is all theories and unproven, so until it is proven, to me is invalid.
there are to many variables in life and how one gets where they are at, and people just pump it into one cop-out and just say genetics. TO me that is a pet-peeve of mine.

[breathinglife]

The thing is that it is all theories and unproven, so until it is proven, to me is invalid.
there are to many variables in life and how one gets where they are at, and people just pump it into one cop-out and just say genetics. TO me that is a pet-peeve of mine.

Well, first let me say that I don't ever look at top lifters and think, "Meh, genetics. That guy probably pulled 500 the first time he set foot in the gym. If I had his genetics, I'd be lifting more than him."

That said, I don't think it's silly to assume that someone has good genetics even if it can't be proven. We can't prove that people worked hard either just based on a few youtube videos. You seem to have the attitude that big lifts are always the product of hard work. But again, by your logic, we can't really prove that either. It could be that a certain lifter's big lifts aren't the product of hard work at all, and he just happens to be a crazy genetic outlier with great supplementation. Unless we know a lifter personally, and have really seen how he trains, we honestly have no concrete evidence that he worked hard at all.

Basically, it is all speculation. But I don't think that it is unreasonable to assume that Usain Bolt or Maliek Derstine or Lance Armstrong have good genetics for their sports. I also don't think it is unreasonable to think they worked hard. None of that detracts from their accomplishments at all!

[lee__d]

Eric Head is nuts, too:





He also posted 405x5 raw in a ******** group a few weeks ago.

[isaku900]

Well, first let me say that I don't ever look at top lifters and think, "Meh, genetics. That guy probably pulled 500 the first time he set foot in the gym. If I had his genetics, I'd be lifting more than him."

That said, I don't think it's silly to assume that someone has good genetics even if it can't be proven. We can't prove that people worked hard either just based on a few youtube videos. You seem to have the attitude that big lifts are always the product of hard work. But again, by your logic, we can't really prove that either. It could be that a certain lifter's big lifts aren't the product of hard work at all, and he just happens to be a crazy genetic outlier with great supplementation. Unless we know a lifter personally, and have really seen how he trains, we honestly have no concrete evidence that he worked hard at all.

Basically, it is all speculation. But I don't think that it is unreasonable to assume that Usain Bolt or Maliek Derstine or Lance Armstrong have good genetics for their sports. I also don't think it is unreasonable to think they worked hard. None of that detracts from their accomplishments at all!

There's also evidence that one's ability to even put in hard work, and the response to said work is genetic. There are people with high baselines genetically who don't respond to practice very well, and there are people with relatively low baselines that respond exceedingly well to practice. This is discussed in David Epstein's book The Sports Gene.

While investigating a theory that practice is what distinguishes professional athletes from amateurs, Mr. Epstein meets a golf novice, Dan McLaughlin, who quit his job to test whether 10,000 hours of practice — called the “magic number for true expertise” in Malcolm Gladwell’s best-seller “Outliers” — could transform him into a P.G.A.-worthy professional. (He started in 2010 and is less than halfway to 10,000 hours; by June, his handicap was 5.5.) Whether (and how fast) chumps can become champs depends on their baseline ability and how rapidly they improve — factors highly influenced by genetics. After months of identical training, some exercisers make almost no fitness gains, while others increase their aerobic capacities by 50 percent or more. Scientists have identified more than 20 gene variants that can separate high responders from low ones.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/13/sc...cess.html?_r=0

[kmc06005]

There's also evidence that one's ability to even put in hard work, and the response to said work is genetic. There are people with high baselines genetically who don't respond to practice very well, and there are people with relatively low baselines that respond exceedingly well to practice. This is discussed in David Epstein's book The Sports Gene.


http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/13/sc...cess.html?_r=0

Are you saying that not everything is achievable by everyone?

Hater...

[dtaps24]

The thing is that it is all theories and unproven, so until it is proven, to me is invalid.
there are to many variables in life and how one gets where they are at, and people just pump it into one cop-out and just say genetics. TO me that is a pet-peeve of mine.

Did somebody say that your lifts were mainly genetics or something? If so, I wouldn't be bothered about it. Be glad you have good genetics for lifting and enjoy lifting. That said, telling a guy that is struggling to bench 225 that if he just plugs away like an elite bencher and he'll get there some day is a cool story but not based on any semblance of reality.

Again, I'm not saying it's all genetics and there's no real "cop out." I think it's safe to say that for an outlier of this magnitude (particularly given that by his own admission he does not really prioritize powerlifting, have a coach or a team, or do a lot of planning regarding his training) is mostly genetics. Plenty of people work as hard or harder than him and will never approach his numbers. The OP for instance. 99.99% of people on this subforum will never come close to that kind of lift on a relative strength scale.

As for something being "only a theory" if and when it's unproven, do you still believe in the Easter Bunny? Nobody has disproven his existence but there's lots of circumstantial evidence. Same thing here, there's plenty of 155 lbs. people who bench a heavy pyramid 2-3 times per week. He's the only one I've seen that benches 410 naturally, and he's been benching around 400 since he was like 20 years old.

With that, I'm out of this thread and everybody is entitled to his or her opinion.

[grouchyjarhead]

Strength develops over years. Give it time.

Awesome bench, impressive as hell.

[breathinglife]

There's also evidence that one's ability to even put in hard work, and the response to said work is genetic. There are people with high baselines genetically who don't respond to practice very well, and there are people with relatively low baselines that respond exceedingly well to practice. This is discussed in David Epstein's book The Sports Gene.


http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/13/sc...cess.html?_r=0

Intredasting! I'm a bit embarrassed to say this hasn't ever occurred to me.

I'm known for my good work ethic in my school/work, and to some extent in the gym, although I haven't had much time for that over the past year. That could be because my dad hammered these ideals into me as a child, but I'm also naturally a very high energy person. I have trouble sleeping, get extremely obsessed with anything that I'm interested in, and find it difficult to sit still. Even if I'm watching TV with the wife, I often have to be doing something else at the same time.

To me, it's literally almost unpleasant NOT to be working hard at something. That's kind of my baseline. I know there are plenty others like me out there, and it does seem clear that there is probably a large biological component to this.

[isaku900]

Intredasting! I'm a bit embarrassed to say this hasn't ever occurred to me.

I'm known for my good work ethic in my school/work, and to some extent in the gym, although I haven't had much time for that over the past year. That could be because my dad hammered these ideals into me as a child, but I'm also naturally a very high energy person. I have trouble sleeping, get extremely obsessed with anything that I'm interested in, and find it difficult to sit still. Even if I'm watching TV with the wife, I often have to be doing something else at the same time.

To me, it's literally almost unpleasant NOT to be working hard at something. That's kind of my baseline. I know there are plenty others like me out there, and it does seem clear that there is probably a large biological component to this.

Epstein basically concludes that its both nature and nuture. You had a high baseline AND a high response to your dad hammering those ideals into you. Someone else w/o the same response ability or baseline may get the same treatment but not be able to respond to it in the same manner, or respond by getting surly or withdrawing from conflict or w/e.