I will never understand why Americans are so against health care reform.

[holtmcg]

I don't get it. Universal healthcare would (literally) benefit everybody. It's a shame the American health care system is so broken.

[Igmann]

It's okay, not everyone was meant to understand it.

[otisthebat]

universal healthcare would benefit everyone except those who are footing the bill.

also, take a look at the state that medicare/medicaid is in. you really want all that fraud and mismanagement to be multiplied 100 fold?

[fitnessislife]

I love seeing the looks of Obama supporter's faces when they find out how "free" their Obamacare has become.

[nutsy54]

I don't get it. Universal healthcare would (literally) benefit everybody. It's a shame the American health care system is so broken.

Universal health care has nothing to do with the crap that was rammed down our throats under the veil of false claims, with legislation written in secret behind closed doors and passed during a last-minute midnight vote along purely partisan lines...

Also, the U.S. Federal Government has an abysmal track record with programs that are big on unfulfilled promises, and even bigger on overspending and failed claims (as we've already seen with this "deficit neutral" program that will cost $Trillions).

Something given away for "free" has no value, and is easily abused.

[holtmcg]

universal healthcare would benefit everyone except those who are footing the bill.

also, take a look at the state that medicare/medicaid is in. you really want all that fraud and mismanagement to be multiplied 100 fold?

It works in literally EVERY sovereign state in the world. But yeah... it would just be horrible here...

[TLTrooper]

healthcare reform =\= universal healthcare


You're old enough to know this. True healthcare reform ought to actually begin with costs, and reforming costs begins with considerations of fiscal reductions. Basically, by the time you dial back everything that causes expensive healthcare, you won't even be dealing with healthcare related cuts. The entire system is tied together. A massive complete overhaul is needed.

[Stizzel]

I don't get it. Universal healthcare would (literally) benefit everybody. It's a shame the American health care system is so broken.

If I felt I benefited from it I'd participate in it without having a government force me to do it.

[TLTrooper]

It works in literally EVERY sovereign state in the world. But yeah... it would just be horrible here...

You know the problem with what you've said? While Europe is collapsing faster than we are, everyone over there is saying "we need to be more like America" while people like you are saying "we need to be more like Eurostates"

[otisthebat]

It works in literally EVERY sovereign state in the world. But yeah... it would just be horrible here...

the USA has unique problems, and a much larger population than any of those countries that have universal healthcare.

also, you failed to respond to what i said about medicare/medicaid.

[holtmcg]

You know the problem with what you've said? While Europe is collapsing faster than we are, everyone over there is saying "we need to be more like America" while people like you are saying "we need to be more like Eurostates"

Europe isn't collapsing.

[nutsy54]

It works in literally EVERY sovereign state in the world. But yeah... it would just be horrible here...

Except, of course, that it doesn't. Massive cost overruns and/or rationed care are the only ways it "works".

[holtmcg]

Except, of course, that it doesn't. Massive cost overruns and/or rationed care are the only ways it "works".

There are ZERO "massive cost overruns"


ZERO

[BrocepCurls]

Except, of course, that it doesn't. Massive cost overruns and/or rationed care are the only ways it "works".

European countries spend about 1/2 as much per capita on healthcare as you and have vastly better health outcomes.... Yeah you guys are really doing it right LOL

American health system is the best in the world... said literally no one in the history of ever

[nutsy54]

There are ZERO "massive cost overruns"

ZERO

Just keep believing the fiction, while ignoring the facts...

NHS finances in crisis due to rising demand and budget cuts
http://www.theguardian.com/society/2...d-deficit-2020

NHS in crisis: English health service runs �500m deficit in just three months
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...s-9744702.html

Health spending frozen to fight deficit
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-br...icit-1.1314512

[holtmcg]

Just keep believing the fiction, while ignoring the facts...

NHS finances in crisis due to rising demand and budget cuts
http://www.theguardian.com/society/2...d-deficit-2020

NHS in crisis: English health service runs �500m deficit in just three months
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...s-9744702.html

Yeah... Ignore the facts...

[nutsy54]

European countries spend about 1/2 as much per capita on healthcare as you and have vastly better health outcomes.... Yeah you guys are really doing it right LOL

American health system is the best in the world... said literally no one in the history of ever

I just cited multiple countries with massive cost overruns. Given the history of the U.S. Government, why do you believe we'd do any better?

Why do you believe a massive government takeover of health care will be the one time we get results as promised, delivered on time and under budget?

[nutsy54]

Yeah... Ignore the facts...

Yes, you are ignoring facts. You claimed no cost overruns, then when faced with facts that proved you wrong.... You posted a chart which has nothing to do with cost overruns and deficits.

Liars gotta lie, when that's the only way to support their failed claims.

[BrocepCurls]

I just cited multiple countries with massive cost overruns. Given the history of the U.S. Government, why do you believe we'd do any better?

Because your health system is a f'n shambles as it is. No one is saying universal healthcare doesn't ever run into issues, but go to anywhere in Europe that has it and they spend in some cases half or less than you guys do per capita, and have far far better health outcomes across the board. No tens of thousands of people a year dying from lack of medical insurance or being left with a $30k bill for some X Rays and a fracture plating. There is literally no one credible who disagrees with the merit of universal healthcare lol, the NHS is awesome

[anonymous]

$10 a gallon gas and a cost of living like those euro-topias would really benefit everyone, especially the working poor in high cost states like CA

You should share your personal experiences of European/Canadian healthcare OP and how they contrast with your personal experiences of healthcare here in the US.

[bigdogfarmhand]

Cause this is the land of the free not fukin England


They can have the 1% tax.

Fuk'em

[holtmcg]

$10 a gallon gas and a cost of living like those euro-topias would really benefit everyone, especially the working poor in high cost states like CA

You should share your personal experiences of European/Canadian healthcare OP and how they contrast with your personal experiences of healthcare here in the US.

Europe also has some of the best public transportation in the world along with basic human compassion in which the state actually cares about the well being of their citizens.

[anonymous]

Europe also has some of the best public transportation in the world along with basic human compassion in which the state actually cares about the well being of their citizens.

Exactly! please share your considerable experiences of living and working there, especially on a low wage.

[icetrauma]

If everything was that simple. Our population is much larger than that of our European counterparts. We have more people on public assistance/govt hand outs than our European counterparts. Our taxes are not as high as Europe. The American diet is not as clean and is in greater proportion than that of Europeans. When was the last time you where in a European country and ordered a Chicken Fried Steak the size of plate with 12 oz gravy, large scoop of mashed potato's with gravy, green beans, a roll and a large sweet tea which was preceded by fried pickles and rolls with butter and followed by an extra large dessert. ER visits are up due to Obama Care simply because our government chooses to reimburse general practioners a decent wage. The large influx of people with the newly ordered mandate of people must having insurance has over loaded ER's. There are a lot of Americans who choose the ER over going to a doctors office. Not to mention our great government has done such an awesome job managing Medicare/Medicaid. You want to make it harder on the middle class by upping their taxes to help pay for this "free insurance". It will not harm the rich because they have the means. It will not affect the poor because they will not pay.

[holtmcg]

Exactly! please share your considerable experiences of living and working there, especially on a low wage.

I had great experiences over there and I'm not in debt because of it. It's sad how Republicans hate their fellow man. Oh well.

[nutsy54]

I had great experiences over there and I'm not in debt because of it. It's sad how Republicans hate their fellow man. Oh well.

Democrats are the ones who forced a non-Universal Healthcare system down our throats, so why are you blaming Republicans?

The U.S. system today is 100% a Democrat product. Why are you discussing a topic where you don't know the facts, while changing the subject every time your previous lies are revealed?

[BrocepCurls]

I had great experiences over there and I'm not in debt because of it. It's sad how Republicans hate their fellow man. Oh well.

It's worth remembering that Republicans care about you deeply when you are a blastocyst, but couldn't give a **** if you die slowly from cancer while alive and conscious.

[anonymous]

I had great experiences over there and I'm not in debt because of it. It's sad how Republicans hate their fellow man. Oh well.

Sounds amazing, thankfully I still have my UK citizenship so one day maybe I can return to the island paradise.

These Republicans sound like pretty bad people.

[nutsy54]

It's worth remembering that Republicans care about you deeply when you are a blastocyst, but couldn't give a **** if you die slowly from cancer while alive and conscious.

It's kinda funny that in a thread directed against the current Democrat law, you guys keep wanting to attack, blame, and lie about Republicans...

[Stizzel]

It's worth remembering that Republicans care about you deeply when you are a blastocyst, but couldn't give a **** if you die slowly from cancer while alive and conscious.

If someone smokes their entire life and gets lung cancer that I, as a health conscious person, do not want to pay for, how much do libs care about me at that point?