How important is mind muscle connection when the goal is physique related

[Ion33]

You always hear:
-Focusing on progressive overload is what builds muscle. Especially important for natural lifters.
-You have to focus on feeling the muscle working and squeeze it during reps
These seem somewhat contradicting

Say I can do 85lbs dumbbell incline bench for 10 reps SQUEEZING the muscle and focusing on activating it as much as possible
But while still maintaining perfect form and less focus on contractions, I can do 95x10.
Same for something like pull ups. Say I can do 15 with perfect form, feeling the muscle. But I can also just as easily do 45lbsx15 pull ups with great form.
Which is more correct?

I also feel like it may depend on the exercise

[chazzy1864]

If physique is the end goal, i'd say MMC is more important, than if just strength is the goal.

[kanis999]

They are both of vital importance (for size, not strength). For muscle size gain, the whole "progressive overload builds muscle" mantra should be revised to "progressive overload in good form builds muscle". Good form entails having a strong MMC and insisting that the target muscle does the majority of work. In your example above, I consider 85x10 superior, because you are using good form.

Note that what I'm considering "good form" is different for bodybuliding vs strength training. "Good form" in strength training is about coordination and efficiency. In hypertrophy training, good form is all about emphasizing the muscles you care about. In both schools, good form entails not getting injured as often.

The way I'd do bench pres for hypertophy is completely different than how I'd do it for strength, but the aspects of form that prevent injury are the same for each.

[ironwill2008]

You always hear:
-Focusing on progressive overload is what builds muscle. Especially important for natural lifters.
-You have to focus on feeling the muscle working and squeeze it during reps
These seem somewhat contradicting

Say I can do 85lbs dumbbell incline bench for 10 reps SQUEEZING the muscle and focusing on activating it as much as possible
But while still maintaining perfect form and less focus on contractions, I can do 95x10.
Same for something like pull ups. Say I can do 15 with perfect form, feeling the muscle. But I can also just as easily do 45lbsx15 pull ups with great form.
Which is more correct?

I also feel like it may depend on the exercise

You can "lift weight," or you can work the target muscle. It should be obvious which method will work better for bodybuilding.

[Ion33]

They are both of vital importance (for size, not strength). For muscle size gain, the whole "progressive overload builds muscle" mantra should be revised to "progressive overload in good form builds muscle". Good form entails having a strong MMC and insisting that the target muscle does the majority of work. In your example above, I consider 85x10 superior, because you are using good form.

Note that what I'm considering "good form" is different for bodybuliding vs strength training. "Good form" in strength training is about coordination and efficiency. In hypertrophy training, good form is all about emphasizing the muscles you care about. In both schools, good form entails not getting injured as often.

The way I'd do bench pres for hypertophy is completely different than how I'd do it for strength, but the aspects of form that prevent injury are the same for each.

Makes sense, thanks. And still 85x10 even though the 95x10 is perfect and controlled form from the outside looking in? The 85 almost feels like I'm purposely not working as hard or shortchanging myself. Same with an overhead press. I'm not squeezing my shoulders, I just lift as much as I can while controlling the weight and using proper ROM.

Also feel as if the 85 would limit strength potential. And a huge part of building muscle as a natural lifting is strength based, right?

[kanis999]

Makes sense, thanks. And still 85x10 even though the 95x10 is perfect and controlled form from the outside looking in? The 85 almost feels like I'm purposely not working as hard or shortchanging myself. Same with an overhead press. I'm not squeezing my shoulders, I just lift as much as I can while controlling the weight and using proper ROM.

Also feel as if the 85 would limit strength potential. And a huge part of building muscle as a natural lifting is strength based, right?

It should subjectively feel like you're lifting more weight when using proper MMC. Bench press, for example, should actually feel more difficult on the chest when using proper form. If 85 lbs doesn't feel like it is working chest as hard as 95 lbs, then go with 95. You would only want to drop weight and focus on MMC more if 95 lbs is NOT making you feel your chest at all, and is instead only challenging your shoulders and triceps. You would then drop weight in order to consciously reduce the effort of the shoulders and triceps, so that chest can carry the load.

Natty bodybuilding is indeed primarily about strength progression. In good form. If you don't feel that 95 lbs in your chest, and feel it in your shoulders and triceps instead, then that's not good form.

[subpolarbear]

Imo Mmc is best. Stick with it and your strength will catchup to cheat form. Throwing weight around may look impressive but the gains will lack. I'm sure you can think of some people that throw some serious weight around but look worse than those that make sure they are connecting with the muscle they are working.

[That70sShowDude]

I second guessed myself on this in the past as well and here's my take on it. Save the bigger mind muscle connections for isos. Generally with compounds just focus on proper execution of the lift and going heavy/getting stronger at it. I believe too much of a MMC on compounds is counter-productive. It limits strength and in theory could decrease activation of muscles aiding in the lift (which is a negative imo). Strength in itself is of vital importance for naturally building a developed physique. The guy who builds up that really strong incline bench will have more muscle development than the guy lifting lighter focusing too much of his energy on intense contractions. More strength = more potential.

[Turtora]

Mmc is incredibly important, but I would not neglect your strength levels. A 95 lb bench press isn't going to build as much as a 225 lb bench press. Just because you don't feel it in the muscle, doesn't mean you're not working it.

But that's just my opinion.

[magician27]

You always hear:
-Focusing on progressive overload is what builds muscle. Especially important for natural lifters.
-You have to focus on feeling the muscle working and squeeze it during reps
These seem somewhat contradicting

why is it contradicting ? dont you make any progress while feeling your muscles ? does it have to be either one ? one thing you need to understand is what builds muscle is progressive tension overload, not progressive overload of the weight you carry in your hand. MMC only means using good technique. people who get very strong tend the have perfect technique on their lifts

[psalms1441]

not sure about others, but after years of training, Im was able to develope the MMC without actually thinking about it. I think it actually come with studying muscle mechanics, moving the weight that the muscle actually moves, does that make sense? i dont do the movement super slow, concentrating on perfect form and "feeling" the contraction, i just do it, subconciously maybe?

[mikschu]

I'm discovering, as others have before me, the most important thing for building muscles is eating almost more food than I can stomach every day...

[DJAuto]

If physique is the end goal, i'd say MMC is more important, than if just strength is the goal.

Agreed.

[santi3tiago]

I feel like MMC is vital in order to make good steady progress when training.
Enough time under tension along with good form (full ROM) controlling the weight & feeling the negatives gives me the best results out of everything I've tried so far.

I'd sacrifice weight over a flawless technique any day.



Cheers.