Hypertrophy/Bodybuilding Routine

[sternumj]

Also... Im not getting sore. Barely sore if any. The first week I was sore as hell but no longer getting sore. Is this a problem or does this mean im just recovering well?

I'm the same way. I haven't started this program yet but I'm on a beginner strength program hitting PRs every week and I never get soar anymore.

Except when I switch my isolation exercises. Anything I introduce into my routine that's new makes me sore but yeah, just for the first week or two.

[kush007bond]

When it comes to gaining strength it's very important that you attempt to perform the concentric portion of every rep as explosively/fast as possible, always 100% maximal effort.

When I started the routine with relatively lesser weight I could lift explosively on every rep. As I have been progressing in terms of 12RM, my explosiveness has been decreasing. Does that mean one is actually not ready to increase the weight further yet? There seems to be a tradeoff between explosiveness and 10-12RM.

[nathangreen]

So for example on bench, you would bring the bar down slow, touch chest, then explode the bar up as fast as possible?

Also... Im not getting sore. Barely sore if any. The first week I was sore as hell but no longer getting sore. Is this a problem or does this mean im just recovering well?

Soreness is not a direct indicator of muscle growth. You can get sore doing things that would illicit no growth at all. As long as you are progressively overloading and adding weight/volume over time, you should be fine.

Is this enough progressive overload to make change? It seems very slow.

Best not to compare yourself to others, but yea that is slow compared to most. I've been lifting for years and still improve much quicker than that. It's personal in the end, just improve the best you can.

When I started the routine with relatively lesser weight I could lift explosively on every rep. As I have been progressing in terms of 12RM, my explosiveness has been decreasing. Does that mean one is actually not ready to increase the weight further yet? There seems to be a tradeoff between explosiveness and 10-12RM.

He simply ment with 100% effort. Of course the bar isn't gonna move as fast as if it was empty, its simply a mental cue to try and move it as fast as possible (even if it doesn't move fast in reality)

[daghetto]

anyone have a variation of the OPs posted routine in terms of excercise selection? ive been doing this routine for the last 7-8 months with the addition of an extra bicep and tricep excercise and getting kind of bored of it lol. its about time i change up some excercises, but dont know how to do it and keep the routine balanced. can anyone post any examples of excercises there using for each P/P/L day?

[ThatOneLurker]

Just thought I'd drop an update:

Think I'm going to run IF indefinitely. I've done a workout on a 20 hour fast and was completely fine. 100-200mL black coffee + 10g of BCAA's preworkout and there are no issues.

Waist is almost at 30 inches, down from 32 inches. My weight is still 190-193lbs. Getting a bit leaner; increased my vascularity a little bit.

IF is proving to be very useful in my recomp, I can only imagine what it's like to cut on it.

[Kelei]

Just thought I'd drop an update:

Think I'm going to run IF indefinitely. I've done a workout on a 20 hour fast and was completely fine. 100-200mL black coffee + 10g of BCAA's preworkout and there are no issues.

Waist is almost at 30 inches, down from 32 inches. My weight is still 190-193lbs. Getting a bit leaner; increased my vascularity a little bit.

IF is proving to be very useful in my recomp, I can only imagine what it's like to cut on it.

Muscles release BCAAs which are then used for the synthesis of glutamine and alanine which are the primary gluconeogenic amino acids, glutamine and alanine are then synthesised into glucose via gluconeogenesis. A low blood glucose level is the primary stimulus for the release of BCAAs from muscle tissue. Training in a fasted state will result in a rapid rate of protein breakdown, you can greatly reduce the rate of protein breakdown by eating protein before you train or by supplementing with BCAAs or glutamine and/or alanine.

Leucine is converted into glutamine and alanine while isoleucine and valine are converted to Krebs cycle components.

It's actually more efficient and cheaper to supplement directly with glutamine and/or alanine rather than BCAAs, glutamine/alanine is usually cheaper on a per gram basis and you also require fewer grams overall (5 grams of glutamine is probably equivalent to 10 grams of BCAAs). Supplementing with glutamine/alanine prevents BCAA catabolism because the liver already has a supply of glutamine available and the kidneys already have a supply of alanine available, there's no need to release BCAAs from muscle tissue in order to produce glutamine/alanine.

[ThatOneLurker]

Muscles release BCAAs which are then used for the synthesis of glutamine and alanine which are the primary gluconeogenic amino acids, glutamine and alanine are then synthesised into glucose via gluconeogenesis. A low blood glucose level is the primary stimulus for the release of BCAAs from muscle tissue. Training in a fasted state will result in a rapid rate of protein breakdown, you can greatly reduce the rate of protein breakdown by eating protein before you train or by supplementing with BCAAs or glutamine and/or alanine.

Leucine is converted into glutamine and alanine while isoleucine and valine are converted to Krebs cycle components.

It's actually more efficient and cheaper to supplement directly with glutamine and/or alanine rather than BCAAs, glutamine/alanine is usually cheaper on a per gram basis and you also require fewer grams overall (5 grams of glutamine is probably equivalent to 10 grams of BCAAs). Supplementing with glutamine/alanine prevents BCAA catabolism because the liver already has a supply of glutamine available and the kidneys already have a supply of alanine available, there's no need to release BCAAs from muscle tissue in order to produce glutamine/alanine.

So while taking BCAAs before a fasted workout is solid advice and a very common recommendation it's not really ideal, glutamine/alanine supplementation is just as effective, more efficient and much cheaper.

Very interesting, thank you. Will look into it after my BCAAs run out.

[crisputer]

Just thought I'd drop an update:

Think I'm going to run IF indefinitely. I've done a workout on a 20 hour fast and was completely fine. 100-200mL black coffee + 10g of BCAA's preworkout and there are no issues.

Waist is almost at 30 inches, down from 32 inches. My weight is still 190-193lbs. Getting a bit leaner; increased my vascularity a little bit.

IF is proving to be very useful in my recomp, I can only imagine what it's like to cut on it.

I'm inspired by your post to give this a try. Mind sharing what you eat during your eating window? My eating window would be in the evening before bed is yours? My current diet is eggs/toast/milk in the morning. Oatmeal/cheese/milk for lunch. Working out after work and eat whatever the wife makes for supper. Would I just keep the diet the same but just cram all of it in before bed? Thanks!

[crisputer]

Muscles release BCAAs which are then used for the synthesis of glutamine and alanine which are the primary gluconeogenic amino acids, glutamine and alanine are then synthesised into glucose via gluconeogenesis. A low blood glucose level is the primary stimulus for the release of BCAAs from muscle tissue. Training in a fasted state will result in a rapid rate of protein breakdown, you can greatly reduce the rate of protein breakdown by eating protein before you train or by supplementing with BCAAs or glutamine and/or alanine.

Leucine is converted into glutamine and alanine while isoleucine and valine are converted to Krebs cycle components.

It's actually more efficient and cheaper to supplement directly with glutamine and/or alanine rather than BCAAs, glutamine/alanine is usually cheaper on a per gram basis and you also require fewer grams overall (5 grams of glutamine is probably equivalent to 10 grams of BCAAs). Supplementing with glutamine/alanine prevents BCAA catabolism because the liver already has a supply of glutamine available and the kidneys already have a supply of alanine available, there's no need to release BCAAs from muscle tissue in order to produce glutamine/alanine.

Would you recommend a Glutamine or Alanine product? Should you take both or just one? If just one which would be better? Thanks!

[Kelei]

Would you recommend a Glutamine or Alanine product? Should you take both or just one? If just one which would be better? Thanks!

Glutamine is better than alanine but I suspect a synergistic effect by combining them. The liver uses glutamine to produce glucose while the kidneys use alanine to produce glucose, by providing both substrates it should increase your overall rate of gluconeogenesis because the liver and kidneys both have a rate limit when it comes to gluconeogenesis, they can only produce glucose so fast. I recommend glutamine/alanine in a 2/1 ratio. Something like 6 grams of glutamine and 3 grams of alanine should work well.

In all honesty though guys the easiest and cheapest way to reduce protein breakdown during training is to simply consume a small amount (15-20 grams) of glucose/starch directly, relying on gluconeogenesis from protein/BCAA/glutamine/alanine is an unnecessarily convoluted way of going about things.

I always try to eat before I train, usually meat and rice, something like that, protein + starch. If I'm unable to eat something I'll just drink a few cups of milk throughout my workout, milk is probably the most anabolic and anti-catabolic food in existence, I kid you not.

[crisputer]

Glutamine is better than alanine but I suspect a synergistic effect by combining them. The liver uses glutamine to produce glucose while the kidneys use alanine to produce glucose, by providing both substrates it should increase your overall rate of gluconeogenesis because the liver and kidneys both have a rate limit when it comes to gluconeogenesis, they can only produce glucose so fast. I recommend glutamine/alanine in a 2/1 ratio. Something like 6 grams of glutamine and 3 grams of alanine should work well.

In all honesty though guys the easiest and cheapest way to reduce protein breakdown during training is to simply consume a small amount (15-20 grams) of glucose/starch directly, relying on gluconeogenesis from protein/BCAA/glutamine/alanine is an unnecessarily convoluted way of going about things.

I always try to eat before I train, usually meat and rice, something like that, protein + starch. If I'm unable to eat something I'll just drink 2-3 cups of milk throughout my workout, it even has the added benefit of providing electrolytes.

Thanks Kelei! I don't know how in the world you guys are so well educated on these topics but I'm so glad you are and that you're sharing the knowledge with others. Thanks for your help. Maybe I'll just try the milk thing then before I try supplementing.

[davo26]

anyone have a variation of the OPs posted routine in terms of excercise selection? ive been doing this routine for the last 7-8 months with the addition of an extra bicep and tricep excercise and getting kind of bored of it lol. its about time i change up some excercises, but dont know how to do it and keep the routine balanced. can anyone post any examples of excercises there using for each P/P/L day?

may not be for you but kelei gave me a minimal routine which i really enjoy at present.
PUSH - bench press and rope pulldowns. 1st exercise should be twice as long as 2nd. i do 40 mins bench (100 reps), 20 mins rope (75 reps), add in lat raise 10 mins (40 reps total) for good measure
PULL- chins and supported row. i do 100 weighted chins (30 mins), 90 rows (20 mins), add in close grip upright row 40 reps (10 mins) and ez bb curl 40 reps (10 mins)
LEGS i keep the same as before, high bar back squat (40 reps), RDL (50 reps), leg ext (40 reps), leg curl (40 reps) standing calf raise (100 reps)

Just thought I'd drop an update:

Think I'm going to run IF indefinitely. I've done a workout on a 20 hour fast and was completely fine. 100-200mL black coffee + 10g of BCAA's preworkout and there are no issues.

Waist is almost at 30 inches, down from 32 inches. My weight is still 190-193lbs. Getting a bit leaner; increased my vascularity a little bit.

IF is proving to be very useful in my recomp, I can only imagine what it's like to cut on it.

tis what i used to cut, had great success and would always use it now for cutting. its not voodoo particularly, just a really effective way of managing calories.

Thanks Kelei! I don't know how in the world you guys are so well educated on these topics but I'm so glad you are and that you're sharing the knowledge with others. Thanks for your help.

agreed, thanks mate

i posted a few vids in my log, but theres far more traffic on here, would you all mind critiquing my form please?

first one, my squat attempt. always done FS so this is my first attempt at back squats. feels a lot comfier to do, feels like my a*se is nearly touching the ground but vid shows its only just lower than 90 :-)



second, my RDL at working weight, 110kg (apologies for the grinning buffoon at the end :-))



thirdly RDL at a really light weight (50kg). idea behind these two is that id like opinions on whether forms better/lower with a lighter weight? it looks like i go very slightly lower but im just not sure. what do you chaps reckon?

[CrayJay]

Davo, from what I can gather, your form is on point in all three videos, it sounds as if the high bar squat will be more suitable for you than the front squat was. The one area I see for improvement is bar speed, specifically that of the concentric phase. Your eccentric phases look well timed to me, but you should try to be as explosive as you when you are fighting gravity in the squat and deadlift.

Flexibility is what will restrict your ROM in the romanian deadlift, not the amount of weight lifted. You maintained solid back positioning when you went deeper, so flexibility clearly isn't an issue, but what happens when you try and hit that ROM with more mass, have you tried?

[oludara]

Is it okay to do the example exercises, at least 30 each, but cut out one exercise each day? I go to the gym before work and I don't have that much time.

[ThatOneLurker]

Glutamine is better than alanine but I suspect a synergistic effect by combining them. The liver uses glutamine to produce glucose while the kidneys use alanine to produce glucose, by providing both substrates it should increase your overall rate of gluconeogenesis because the liver and kidneys both have a rate limit when it comes to gluconeogenesis, they can only produce glucose so fast. I recommend glutamine/alanine in a 2/1 ratio. Something like 6 grams of glutamine and 3 grams of alanine should work well.

In all honesty though guys the easiest and cheapest way to reduce protein breakdown during training is to simply consume a small amount (15-20 grams) of glucose/starch directly, relying on gluconeogenesis from protein/BCAA/glutamine/alanine is an unnecessarily convoluted way of going about things.

I always try to eat before I train, usually meat and rice, something like that, protein + starch. If I'm unable to eat something I'll just drink a few cups of milk throughout my workout, milk is probably the most anabolic and anti-catabolic food in existence, I kid you not.

Informative post as always Kel, thank you.

I'm inspired by your post to give this a try. Mind sharing what you eat during your eating window? My eating window would be in the evening before bed is yours? My current diet is eggs/toast/milk in the morning. Oatmeal/cheese/milk for lunch. Working out after work and eat whatever the wife makes for supper. Would I just keep the diet the same but just cram all of it in before bed? Thanks!

My macros look something like 170-210g carbs (mostly rice/potatoes, occasional simple carb)
160-170g protein (1lb of turkey, chicken or beef and eggs/milk make up the rest)
I don't count fats, whatever they happen to be, so be it.

How long do you plan on making your eating window?

Mine is anywhere from 6-8 hours with my fasting window being anywhere from 16-18 hours.

[GeraltOfRivia5]

Yeah, that's a very good inquiry Geralt, but I was thinking the exact same thing as sonny. Kelei simply states that side delts respond very well to high frequency, and I'm thinking just because they are not heavily depended upon in any major exercise. Therefore it wouldn't matter if they are fatigued, unlike front and rear delts.

Yeah you and Sonny are probably right -- and if daily facepulls was a superior choice for fixing this commonly lagging rear delts/mid back/external rotator while still hitting the side delts well, Kelei would probably have recommended that over daily side raises. There has to be a reason.

Something I've been thinking about regarding this -- what about devoting all back work volume to horizontal rows (no pull-ups etc, just rows)? Horizontal rows still hit the lats well while also hitting those common lagging muscles (mid back, rear delts), wouldn't that pretty much eliminate the lats being a common overpowered muscle and put the mid back + rear delt in great proportion? What would the cons be?

[ttuTRAP]

so i worked out about 2 times in the past 2 months. Will eating more protein be worth it for the muscle memory? hoping to be 90% back in a few weeks

[davo26]

Davo, from what I can gather, your form is on point in all three videos, it sounds as if the high bar squat will be more suitable for you than the front squat was. The one area I see for improvement is bar speed, specifically that of the concentric phase. Your eccentric phases look well timed to me, but you should try to be as explosive as you when you are fighting gravity in the squat and deadlift.

Flexibility is what will restrict your ROM in the romanian deadlift, not the amount of weight lifted. You maintained solid back positioning when you went deeper, so flexibility clearly isn't an issue, but what happens when you try and hit that ROM with more mass, have you tried?

thanks for the input, its reassuring to know im there or thereabouts with form. as for explosiveness, it is what it is im afraid. im aware that i should make the concentric as fast as poss, but the weight restricts me to what you see, i just cant push any faster.
yep, flexibilitys rubbish, i wish i could go back further with the hams. interesting that you thought i actually did go deeper when i went lighter, i wasnt sure myself, and if i did, i wasnt sure if it was just my back lowering a little further on its own once ham extent had been reached.

it brings up another question ive been meaning to ask...... what does the extra 'ass to ground' part of the squat bring to the table? if a person can lift more weight lowering to just 90 degrees (which would probably be good enough?) than when they go ATG, why is ATG better?
i suppose the same question could apply to the RDL form. if going lighter meant an extra inch lower, is that better? its hard for me to know where the line is for upping the weight.

thanks

[ThatOneLurker]

thanks for the input, its reassuring to know im there or thereabouts with form. as for explosiveness, it is what it is im afraid. im aware that i should make the concentric as fast as poss, but the weight restricts me to what you see, i just cant push any faster.
yep, flexibilitys rubbish, i wish i could go back further with the hams. interesting that you thought i actually did go deeper when i went lighter, i wasnt sure myself, and if i did, i wasnt sure if it was just my back lowering a little further on its own once ham extent had been reached.

it brings up another question ive been meaning to ask...... what does the extra 'ass to ground' part of the squat bring to the table? if a person can lift more weight lowering to just 90 degrees (which would probably be good enough?) than when they go ATG, why is ATG better?
i suppose the same question could apply to the RDL form. if going lighter meant an extra inch lower, is that better? its hard for me to know where the line is for upping the weight.

thanks

Why don't you stop worrying about depth and just do what feels 'right'. You've developed enough mind muscle connection at this stage of your lifting career to disregard textbook form and go with what feels comfortable to you.

[crisputer]

Informative post as always Kel, thank you.



My macros look something like 170-210g carbs (mostly rice/potatoes, occasional simple carb)
160-170g protein (1lb of turkey, chicken or beef and eggs/milk make up the rest)
I don't count fats, whatever they happen to be, so be it.

How long do you plan on making your eating window?

Mine is anywhere from 6-8 hours with my fasting window being anywhere from 16-18 hours.

Thanks Lurker! Eating window for me would be right after my workout; so a 4-5 hour window. Probably not enough time though. If I eat or drink milk before the workout I guess that opens it up to more like 6 hours.

[bmcblinz]

Something I've been thinking about regarding this -- what about devoting all back work volume to horizontal rows (no pull-ups etc, just rows)? Horizontal rows still hit the lats well while also hitting those common lagging muscles (mid back, rear delts), wouldn't that pretty much eliminate the lats being a common overpowered muscle and put the mid back + rear delt in great proportion? What would the cons be?

Bump! I want to know the answer to this also.

[ThatOneLurker]

Thanks Lurker! Eating window for me would be right after my workout; so a 4-5 hour window. Probably not enough time though. If I eat or drink milk before the workout I guess that opens it up to more like 6 hours.

What are you trying to do? Recomp? Bulk? Cut?

[Kelei]

may not be for you but kelei gave me a minimal routine which i really enjoy at present.
PUSH - bench press and rope pulldowns. 1st exercise should be twice as long as 2nd. i do 40 mins bench (100 reps), 20 mins rope (75 reps), add in lat raise 10 mins (40 reps total) for good measure
PULL- chins and supported row. i do 100 weighted chins (30 mins), 90 rows (20 mins), add in close grip upright row 40 reps (10 mins) and ez bb curl 40 reps (10 mins)
LEGS i keep the same as before, high bar back squat (40 reps), RDL (50 reps), leg ext (40 reps), leg curl (40 reps) standing calf raise (100 reps)

tis what i used to cut, had great success and would always use it now for cutting. its not voodoo particularly, just a really effective way of managing calories.

agreed, thanks mate

i posted a few vids in my log, but theres far more traffic on here, would you all mind critiquing my form please?

first one, my squat attempt. always done FS so this is my first attempt at back squats. feels a lot comfier to do, feels like my a*se is nearly touching the ground but vid shows its only just lower than 90 :-)

second, my RDL at working weight, 110kg (apologies for the grinning buffoon at the end :-))

thirdly RDL at a really light weight (50kg). idea behind these two is that id like opinions on whether forms better/lower with a lighter weight? it looks like i go very slightly lower but im just not sure. what do you chaps reckon?

I'm not a fan of close grip upright rows mate, wide grip upright rows are superior in every way and much safer. Your squat and RDL forms are perfect, I'm impressed.

Yeah you and Sonny are probably right -- and if daily facepulls was a superior choice for fixing this commonly lagging rear delts/mid back/external rotator while still hitting the side delts well, Kelei would probably have recommended that over daily side raises. There has to be a reason.

Something I've been thinking about regarding this -- what about devoting all back work volume to horizontal rows (no pull-ups etc, just rows)? Horizontal rows still hit the lats well while also hitting those common lagging muscles (mid back, rear delts), wouldn't that pretty much eliminate the lats being a common overpowered muscle and put the mid back + rear delt in great proportion? What would the cons be?

Face pulls are great for the rear delts, side delts, mid back and external rotators but they can cause wrist/elbow problems if performed too often and the mid back isn't designed to take that kind of beating on a daily basis. By all means add some face pulls to the end of your pull workouts but don't perform them every day.

You can build a great back using horizontal rows alone if you choose the right combination of exercises, generally you need the following:

- A narrow grip row with the elbows tucked and the bar/handle pulled low (upper abs level)
- A wide grip row with the elbows flared and the bar pulled high (mid pec level)

thanks for the input, its reassuring to know im there or thereabouts with form. as for explosiveness, it is what it is im afraid. im aware that i should make the concentric as fast as poss, but the weight restricts me to what you see, i just cant push any faster.
yep, flexibilitys rubbish, i wish i could go back further with the hams. interesting that you thought i actually did go deeper when i went lighter, i wasnt sure myself, and if i did, i wasnt sure if it was just my back lowering a little further on its own once ham extent had been reached.

it brings up another question ive been meaning to ask...... what does the extra 'ass to ground' part of the squat bring to the table? if a person can lift more weight lowering to just 90 degrees (which would probably be good enough?) than when they go ATG, why is ATG better?
i suppose the same question could apply to the RDL form. if going lighter meant an extra inch lower, is that better? its hard for me to know where the line is for upping the weight.

thanks

You don't need to actually move the weights fast, just attempt to move them as fast as possible (even if they move slowly). Your RDLs are deep enough (flexibility is much better than it used to be), stop worrying about it. Go as deep as your flexibility allows during squats, if your lower back starts rounding you're going too deep, I squat until my hamstrings hit my calves, I literally can't go any deeper lol.

[crisputer]

What are you trying to do? Recomp? Bulk? Cut?

Recomp. My main issue is belly fat. I've always had a pot belly but I haven't always worked out. Never worked out in my life until a few years ago (36 yrs old at the time). I'd love to get rid of the belly once and for all and if this technique will work I'm all over it lol.

[ThatOneLurker]

Recomp. My main issue is belly fat. I've always had a pot belly but I haven't always worked out. Never worked out in my life until a few years ago (36 yrs old at the time). I'd love to get rid of the belly once and for all and if this technique will work I'm all over it lol.

I've been seeing good results with it. I've also been using the ab-roller every other or every 2 days as well.

Give it a shot, what's the worst that could happen?

[davo26]

I'm not a fan of close grip upright rows mate, wide grip upright rows are superior in every way and much safer. Your squat and RDL forms are perfect, I'm impressed.

thanks Kelei, appreciated. can you give me your reasoning on the CGUR? i know theyre not one of your recommended exercises, i just stuck them in there for my traps which i believe are lagging. genetics have given me a long thin neck so attempting to make it look thicker. it was either those or shrugs, and the barbell shrugs feel a little awkward so thought these would be next best. are WGUR actually superior for traps still or should i try shrugs again?

You don't need to actually move the weights fast, just attempt to move them as fast as possible (even if they move slowly). Your RDLs are deep enough (flexibility is much better than it used to be), stop worrying about it. Go as deep as your flexibility allows during squats, if your lower back starts rounding you're going too deep, I squat until my hamstrings hit my calves, I literally can't go any deeper lol.

i wasnt particularly worrying about squat depth too much, just curious. always trying to learn little improvements and wondering whether it actually benefits you to go as low as possible if that means using lower weight. just my quest for total knowledge! :-D

thanks

[Kelei]

thanks Kelei, appreciated. can you give me your reasoning on the CGUR? i know theyre not one of your recommended exercises, i just stuck them in there for my traps which i believe are lagging. genetics have given me a long thin neck so attempting to make it look thicker. it was either those or shrugs, and the barbell shrugs feel a little awkward so thought these would be next best. are WGUR actually superior for traps still or should i try shrugs again?

i wasnt particularly worrying about squat depth too much, just curious. always trying to learn little improvements and wondering whether it actually benefits you to go as low as possible if that means using lower weight. just my quest for total knowledge! :-D

thanks

A wide grip upright row increases side delt and trap recruitment, it's a myth that close grip upright rows are better for the traps, the upper traps have a more direct line of pull when the shoulders are somewhat abducted. Shrugs aren't all that great for the upper traps, they actually target the levator scapulae primarily.

When it comes to dynamic movements the best exercises are vertical rowing movements where the shoulder is somewhat abducted, for example wide grip upright rows and snatch grip high pulls (amazing upper trap exercise). But here's something most people aren't aware of, the upper traps are primarily stabilisation muscles, although they can perform dynamic contractions they are actually designed to work best when there's no actual movement going on, they respond best to isometric contractions.

The best upper trap exercises on the planet are:

- Farmer's walks (without the walking, just hold the weights lol)
- Barbell holds (if you don't have the equipment for farmer's walks)

For barbell holds you want to set up pins at the right height so that you barely need to lift the weight, your arms must remain perfectly straight at all times, you absolutely must use lifting straps and a double overhand grip. When you walk up to the barbell it should be very slightly below your hand level, you take your grip (your hands should be shoulder width, arms perfectly vertical when viewed from the front, never narrower or wider than this), make sure your arms are straight and locked and then use your back to unrack the barbell, just like the very top (lockout) of a deadlift or rack pull. Now that you're standing upright with the barbell in your hands you simply need to hold it, there's no shrugging or any movement at all, just hold the weight for as long as you can or until 60 seconds pass by, that's one set. Once you can easily hold the barbell for 60 seconds you need to add more weight.

If you have the equipment for farmer's walks you should also make sure that the handles are only slightly below the level of your hands, you might need to set the base on top of something so that you don't need to bend over too far, you definitely don't want to have to perform a partial deadlift to assume the starting position, the weights you'll be lifting will be far too heavy even for rack pulls, you only want to perform a very slight deadlift lockout to pick the weights up.

Perhaps some of you guys can give it a go and report back here, let me know what you think, it might take a few workouts to find your proper working weights, most people start far too light at first.

[GeraltOfRivia5]

Face pulls are great for the rear delts, side delts, mid back and external rotators but they can cause wrist/elbow problems if performed too often and the mid back isn't designed to take that kind of beating on a daily basis. By all means add some face pulls to the end of your pull workouts but don't perform them every day.

You can build a great back using horizontal rows alone if you choose the right combination of exercises, generally you need the following:

- A narrow grip row with the elbows tucked and the bar/handle pulled low (upper abs level)
- A wide grip row with the elbows flared and the bar pulled high (mid pec level)

Thanks Kelei, appreciate the answer!

Curious, why are pull-ups such a staple back exercise in pretty much every routine (even this one in the original post) if dominant lats and lagging mid back + rear delt are super common -- wouldn't running with this combo* you said fix this problem and be better in every way, or what are the cons? To me this seems superior (for balancing mid back/rear delt/lats ratio while still building a great back) but maybe im missing something here?

*
- A narrow grip row with the elbows tucked and the bar/handle pulled low (upper abs level)
- A wide grip row with the elbows flared and the bar pulled high (mid pec level)


Thanks again.

[davo26]

A wide grip upright row increases side delt and trap recruitment, it's a myth that close grip upright rows are better for the traps, the upper traps have a more direct line of pull when the shoulders are somewhat abducted. Shrugs aren't all that great for the upper traps, they actually target the levator scapulae primarily.

When it comes to dynamic movements the best exercises are vertical rowing movements where the shoulder is somewhat abducted, for example wide grip upright rows and snatch grip high pulls (amazing upper trap exercise). But here's something most people aren't aware of, the upper traps are primarily stabilisation muscles, although they can perform dynamic contractions they are actually designed to work best when there's no actual movement going on, they respond best to isometric contractions.

The best upper trap exercises on the planet are:

- Farmer's walks (without the walking, just hold the weights lol)
- Barbell holds (if you don't have the equipment for farmer's walks)

For barbell holds you want to set up pins at the right height so that you barely need to lift the weight, your arms must remain perfectly straight at all times, you absolutely must use lifting straps and a double overhand grip. When you walk up to the barbell it should be very slightly below your hand level, you take your grip (your hands should be shoulder width, arms perfectly vertical when viewed from the front, never narrower or wider than this), make sure your arms are straight and locked and then use your back to unrack the barbell, just like the very top (lockout) of a deadlift or rack pull. Now that you're standing upright with the barbell in your hands you simply need to hold it, there's no shrugging or any movement at all, just hold the weight for as long as you can or until 60 seconds pass by, that's one set. Once you can easily hold the barbell for 60 seconds you need to add more weight.

If you have the equipment for farmer's walks you should also make sure that the handles are only slightly below the level of your hands, you might need to set the base on top of something so that you don't need to bend over too far, you definitely don't want to have to perform a partial deadlift to assume the starting position, the weights you'll be lifting will be far too heavy even for rack pulls, you only want to perform a very slight deadlift lockout to pick the weights up.

Perhaps some of you guys can give it a go and report back here, let me know what you think, it might take a few workouts to find your proper working weights, most people start far too light at first.

great info, thanks a lot. i certainly dont have equipment for farmers walks, so ill swap the close grip upright row for barbell holds. if 60 seconds is one set, i assume its probably a good idea to do 6 or 7 sets to last 10 mins or so?

[Natex86]

How's this workout?

Same sets across all rep ranges
15,10,5

Incline bench/ 2 sets
(pec deck) optional / 1 set
Wide grip pull-ups/ 2 sets
Hammer strength low rows/ 2 sets
Dumbbell shoulder press/ 2 sets
(Laterals raises) optional/ 1 set
Reverse pec deck/ 1 set
Squats/ 2 sets
Biceps pull-ups/ 2 sets
Triceps dips/ 2 sets
Calf raises/ 2 sets
Crunches/ 2 sets