American Sniper: Everybody else has one... what's your opinion?

[NumeroOnce]

As a movie, it was great. B+. Clint Eastwood took an unwieldy personal biography of four tours in Iraq and turned it into a good storyline which highlighted things soldiers in the ME face both back home and when fighting abroad. Bradley Cooper performed the role amazingly (although probably not realistically), giving us an honorable, selfless, patriotic protagonist. The movie was a little vague in it's main point, but imo a movie based on a biography should be.

As patriotic propaganda, the movie sucked. Or was good, depending on how you look at it. The Kyle of the movie is portrayed differently than the Kyle of irl, who sounds like a psychopath who sees everything in black or white terms. The movie failed to mention the controversy over why we went to Iraq in the first place (WMD's), and ties Kyle's deployment to Iraq as being a result of 9/11. Sadly, this logic was used on the American people at the time, but 10 years later with 20/20 hindsight we should all be able to admit that Bush had his own reasons for going into Iraq. When you take this into consideration, Kyle looks like a terrorist himself, rolling around with guns and tanks and kicking in doors of innocent people and holding them at gunpoint, risking their livelihoods just by asking them to cooperate. The movie is biased because (besides Eastwood being a noted conservative) it portrays a dead soldier whose family would only allow the movie to be made if it was a positive portrayal of their son.

I think Seth Rogen said it best with his comparison to the Nazi sniper movie shown in Inglorious Basterds. This movie is patriotic propaganda that will influence those who don't think critically about how well the movie represents history, which means it influences a good portion of our country. With the way things are going around the world right, part of me suspects that the recent war movies that have come out (American Sniper, Unbroken, Fury) are conditioning us for conflict.

Discuss.

[Dave22reborn]

Haven't seen it but.

http://whatculture.com/film/american...lied-about.php

[Lakersbake]

I think Seth Rogen said it best with his comparison to the Nazi sniper movie shown in Inglorious Basterds. This movie is patriotic propaganda that will influence those who don't think critically about how well the movie represents history, which means it influences a good portion of our country. With the way things are going around the world right, part of me suspects that the recent war movies that have come out (American Sniper, Unbroken, Fury) are conditioning us for conflict.

Discuss.

This. Portrays the war as being hell, but necessary.

[ZenBowman]

I thought the manner in which the warfighters interacted with each other was consistent with my observations of reality, the story was pretty good, and it also brought a little attention to the problems warfighters face once out of theater.

The bit about 9/11 was pretty lol-worthy though, I agree with you on that.

Your claim that Eastwood is pushing to to condition us for conflict is inaccurate IMO:

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/rac...s-going-754761

"I was against going into the war in Iraq since I figured we would probably trip over ourselves in some way," Clint Eastwood revealed after screening his new film American Sniper on Saturday at the Academy of Motion Picture Artists and Sciences' Goldwyn Theater in Beverly Hills.

...

"Sometimes the arrogance of wanting just to burst into war and not really researching the value of it and the tragic ending it's going to be for so many people …" Eastwood trailed off, before continuing, "Sometimes it's inevitable. I grew up during World War II. I was 11 years old when Pearl Harbor was bombed. I was, at that age, very fascinated by everything, and everything was very patriotic — but that was going to be the war to end all wars! Well, [a few] years later, I'm standing at the draft board, with the Korean War going, and I'm standing there naked, and people are asking me to cough. I'm thinking, 'What the hell? I thought that was the war that was going to end all wars.' And then, pretty soon, we're in Vietnam. And so, at some point, you start saying, 'It's fun to talk about [war]. It's fun to talk about the emotions of it, getting in. And in Letters From Iwo Jima, it was fun to explore how it felt from the other side as well. But, by the same token, there are other stories that maybe [society should] tell that aren't as tragic about life."

During the Q&A, Eastwood also spoke about how he has treated violence in his films. While Eastwood famously carried a gun and killed people in many of his early movies, he also has featured violence in his films to send an anti-violence message. Part of what made Unforgiven, his 1992 film that won the best picture Oscar, so powerful was that the character he plays in that movie says of killing a man: "It's a hell of a thing, killing a man. Take away all he's got and all he's ever gonna have." When a much younger man says, "Yeah, well, I guess they had it coming," he replies, "We all got it coming, kid."

Said the four-time Oscar winner, "Contrary to public opinion, I abhor violence."

[wolfLarson]

I loved it.
Kicking in doors is part of the job. You clearly did not recall the entire city declared a war zone and evacuated.

Anyone still in the city is either stupid, resistant, or an enemy.

I see nothing wrong with the actions as portrayed in the movie.

I also love this country. Grew up on punk "fuk the government" type music, but after traveling and learning more about this countries history, there is a reason why the US is so reviled in some parts of the world.

haters gonna hate

go America

[Boxman]

This. Portrays the war as being hell, but necessary.

Necessary? The US hasn't fought a "necessary" war since WWII. Ok you could make a good argument that Korea 1950 was necessary but let's be honest: since then, every war the US has fought has been a war of aggression manufactured to serve geopolitical goals and\or feed the military industrial complex.

[kusok]

Didn't watch, don't give a flying f_ck, shove your propaganda up your arse crew.

[Dave22reborn]

Didn't watch, don't give a flying f_ck, shove your propaganda up your arse crew.

Was 300 a propaganda movie?

[Lakersbake]

I loved it.
Kicking in doors is part of the job. You clearly did not recall the entire city declared a war zone and evacuated.

Anyone still in the city is either stupid, resistant, or an enemy.

I see nothing wrong with the actions as portrayed in the movie.

I also love this country. Grew up on punk "fuk the government" type music, but after traveling and learning more about this countries history, there is a reason why the US is so reviled in some parts of the world.

haters gonna hate

go America

brb we invaded you and declared a war zone (but congress did not actually declare war) all of your rights are evaporated.

Necessary? The US hasn't fought a "necessary" war since WWII. Ok you could make a good argument that Korea 1950 was necessary but let's be honest: since then, every war the US has fought has been a war of aggression manufactured to serve geopolitical goals and\or feed the military industrial complex.

Wasnt my view, but what I viewed the movie as portraying.

I agree with you, although I dont think US involvement in WW2 was necessary either.

[lsiberian]

Necessary? The US hasn't fought a "necessary" war since WWII. Ok you could make a good argument that Korea 1950 was necessary but let's be honest: since then, every war the US has fought has been a war of aggression manufactured to serve geopolitical goals and\or feed the military industrial complex.

That is really a simpleton approach to the complex issues surrounding each of those conflict. I recognize that not everyone spends time with politicians, but the ones I know make the best choices they can given their realistic options. Obviously that doesn't always work out, but I seriously doubt that any of the wars were undertaken simply to feed the military industrial complex. For example Bush and Cheney actually believed they were liberating Afghanistan and Iraq. They believed those nations were ruled by evil brutal men bent on doing us harm. They believed war was the solution to those problems. I think it's clear that some of those beliefs were wrong, but that doesn't change their actual reasons for war.

[Dave22reborn]

brb we invaded you and declared a war zone (but congress did not actually declare war) all of your rights are evaporated.



Wasnt my view, but what I viewed the movie as portraying.

I agree with you, although I dont think US involvement in WW2 was necessary either.

Let's see, Japan attacked us, and Germany, and Italy declared war on us. It was also better for western Europe for us to finally get involved.

[USAPump]

I dont think US involvement in WW2 was necessary either.

Pls elaborate

[Bullroarer]

-Awesome propaganda movie. America needs more of em.
-All the critics who hated it missed the point. It's not meant to be an expos� of Bush/Cheney's dumbfukkery, it's about a soldier.
-The subtext to the criticisms from Salon and HuffPo was that sophisticated intellectuals living in big coastal cities are extremely uncomfortable with depictions of white/redneck machismo.
-Based on the number of tall tales Kyle told since coming back to civilian life, enough that debunking them is turning into a cottage industry, I won't be surprised if people who knew and served with him start coming out one by one in the next few years to say some of his war stories were made up or didn't happen the way he described, but didn't say anything while the movie's out because of what a hero he is right now.
-Awesome propaganda movie, watch with brain turned off and let the pure, shameless patriotism wash over you.

[sm1zzle]

You clearly did not recall the entire city declared a war zone and evacuated.

Anyone still in the city is either stupid, resistant, or an enemy.

Those citizens lived in those homes inside of those towns. Just because you think they were enemy does not make it true. I'm sure some of them were enemy but many of them were average citizens with have large families and no transportation.

Evacuate...should they have just gathered their whole family, kids and all, and wandered out to the desert and dug a hole in the sand ?


How would you feel if Russia invaded tomorrow, kicked in your door and demanded you to leave your pad because they say you are the enemy ?

If you are like me you would fight back... because I'm not about to let someone come take mine without a fight. Now, once we put up that fight.....
Russia would kill us and say "Anyone still in the city is either stupid, resistant, or an enemy. "

[kusok]

Was 300 a propaganda movie?

No, just a stupid comic book homo crap for homos and bitches who like to see muscles.

Why?

[Dave22reborn]

No, just a stupid comic book homo crap for homos and bitches who like to see muscles.

Why?

Iran thought otherwise.

[wolfLarson]

Those citizens lived in those homes inside of those towns. Just because you think they were enemy does not make it true. I'm sure some of them were enemy but many of them were average citizens with have large families and no transportation.

Evacuate...should they have just gathered their whole family, kids and all, and wandered out to the desert and dug a hole in the sand ?


How would you feel if Russia invaded tomorrow, kicked in your door and demanded you to leave your pad because they say you are the enemy ?

If you are like me you would fight back... because I'm not about to let someone come take mine without a fight. Now, once we put up that fight.....
Russia would kill us and say "Anyone still in the city is either stupid, resistant, or an enemy. "

Believe it or not, a majority of the population feared/loathed their government. Democracy is something many people want over there, but lets face it, it will never happen.

Source: Four of my uncles who served over there. Said they were brought flowers by locals and told they were making a difference many times. They are the bluntly honest type too, so I couldnt ever see them makin **** up.

Believe it or not, but fathers and mothers dont prefer to live in areas where their sons and daughters heads could be chopped off due to a tribal squable.

Not saying the all the reasons were just in going over there or all us soldiers acted honorably or admirably.

But its war, war is never pretty. Things arent as simple as what you are inferring.

And the people that complain and say it was only for oil are no doubt peeps that complain about any increase in gas prices. We are all part of things, whether we know it or not.

Some good issues ITT though

[tsbalr120]

It was entertaining. As it suppose to be. Everyone is reading too much into this just to take shots at the military.

[tk217]

Haven't seen it - I don't like watching real life war movies.

[StevePT]

Awesome movie to watch without thinking about it too much, did feel it was a bit of propaganda though like a lot of the other war movies coming out of the US at the moment. Entertaining nonetheless.

[NumeroOnce]

Your claim that Eastwood is pushing to to condition us for conflict is inaccurate IMO:

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/rac...s-going-754761

Perhaps not Eastwood, but the industry in general. From the way the movie was made, I at least assumed that he thought the war was justified, even if he didn't think it was necessary. I just wish he would've touched on these issues in the movie, even for just a line or two, so it doesn't seem so conservatively biased.

I loved it.
Kicking in doors is part of the job. You clearly did not recall the entire city declared a war zone and evacuated.

Anyone still in the city is either stupid, resistant, or an enemy.

I see nothing wrong with the actions as portrayed in the movie.

I also love this country. Grew up on punk "fuk the government" type music, but after traveling and learning more about this countries history, there is a reason why the US is so reviled in some parts of the world.

haters gonna hate

go America

So invaders from Russia or China come to Stratford, NJ, kick in your door and hold you at gunpoint, and tell you that your city is a war zone and you must leave... you gonna be happy about that?

That is really a simpleton approach to the complex issues surrounding each of those conflict. I recognize that not everyone spends time with politicians, but the ones I know make the best choices they can given their realistic options. Obviously that doesn't always work out, but I seriously doubt that any of the wars were undertaken simply to feed the military industrial complex. For example Bush and Cheney actually believed they were liberating Afghanistan and Iraq. They believed those nations were ruled by evil brutal men bent on doing us harm. They believed war was the solution to those problems. I think it's clear that some of those beliefs were wrong, but that doesn't change their actual reasons for war.

Do you remember the Cheney/Haliburton issue? Liberation wasn't even the reasoning for the war in Iraq, it was WMD's. If America's top reason for invasion was liberation, we'd be in a lot more countries around the world right now.

Believe it or not, a majority of the population feared/loathed their government. Democracy is something many people want over there, but lets face it, it will never happen.

Source: Four of my uncles who served over there. Said they were brought flowers by locals and told they were making a difference many times. They are the bluntly honest type too, so I couldnt ever see them makin **** up.

Believe it or not, but fathers and mothers dont prefer to live in areas where their sons and daughters heads could be chopped off due to a tribal squable.

Not saying the all the reasons were just in going over there or all us soldiers acted honorably or admirably.

But its war, war is never pretty. Things arent as simple as what you are inferring.

And the people that complain and say it was only for oil are no doubt peeps that complain about any increase in gas prices. We are all part of things, whether we know it or not.

Some good issues ITT though

Many people, after 'being liberated,' soon found themselves wishing for the way things were before America arrived, so it probably goes both ways. IMO America shouldn't claim to be doing things out of pure liberty, because if America was really concerned about liberty then we'd already have blown Kim Jung Un away and we'd have boots all over the ground in Africa to fight Boko Haram.

It was entertaining. As it suppose to be. Everyone is reading too much into this just to take shots at the military.

True... but any entertainment that claims to be based on true events and then manipulates those events should be treated more like fiction and not a biopic.

[criticalmass00]

It looks like a bunch of propaganda but I still want to see it. In fact, I'm downloading it right now because I'm not paying money to see the mofo.

[wings_unhinged]

It was a decent movie.

Debating the portrayal of Kyle is a waste of time. It's not a documentary.

[Tamorlane]

I thought it sucked and aside from how the movie was made it's just another piece of american propaganda feeding into the benefit of the military industrial complex.

[GolfPants]

Don't know the dude's real story, and don't care to, so I can't comment on how accurate I thought it was or how much was propaganda or anything like that.

Judging it just as a film, I'd say it was decent. I was entertained, but I think it has gotten way too much hype. It wasn't remotely the best movie I saw this year. Hell it wasn't even the best war movie I saw this year (Fury).

[YUL]

Necessary? The US hasn't fought a "necessary" war since WWII. Ok you could make a good argument that Korea 1950 was necessary

Grenadians hate you brah

[GentlemanLifter]

There can't possibly still be people who hear Hollywood describe a movie as "Based on a True Story!" and actually expect it to bear more than a faint resemblance to something that may have happened once.

The movie was pretty good. Some fine cinematography.

[moksha16]

If you want to give your honest opinion on this movie be prepared to be negged way into the red by a couple of 'patriot' mods who don't like your opinion.

because freedom?

[ArmUndKrank]

leftists are terrified that young white kids will view him as a role model.
they're also angry that it came out the same weekend as selma and made 10x as much.

[GreatOldOne]

It was a very sad movie on a number of levels.