overtraining - but got no choice because of cycle commute

[dragonfly102]

I'm pretty sure I'm suffering from overtraining syndrome, with an elevated resting heart rate. I'm 39 years old and doing the stronglifts 5x5 routine, but also have an 8 mile commute to and from work (16 total), by bicycle, over hilly country, 5 days a week.

any ideas on remedies? apart from the obvious getting a car.

[Marius_Ursus]

Why is riding 8 miles and strong lifts a formula for over training? That's really just training.

Get yourself checked out. There's no way that combination is "over training".

[crupiea]

how about a motorcycle

[Marius_Ursus]

how about a motorcycle

Hoodlum!

[dragonfly102]

Why is riding 8 miles and strong lifts a formula for over training? That's really just training.

Get yourself checked out. There's no way that combination is "over training".

You've not seen the hills involved, it's nearly an hour and a half's cardio every day, 5 days a week.

[DuracellBunny]

You've not seen the hills involved, it's nearly an hour and a half's cardio every day, 5 days a week.

Which is completely irrelevant to overtraining.

Overtraining is a chronic condition of the central nervous system brought about by prolonged, repetitive use of a high number of contractile fibres.

Unless you are regularly using weights over 85% of your 1RM you are not overtraining; that's simply how it works. You can not overtrain from cycling to work. Your current lifestyle and level of conditioning is making it difficult for you to recover. Eat, train, sleep. Your conditioning will improve and diet/sleep is down to you.

[dragonfly102]

Which is completely irrelevant to overtraining.

Overtraining is a chronic condition of the central nervous system brought about by prolonged, repetitive use of a high number of contractile fibres.

Unless you are regularly using weights over 85% of your 1RM you are not overtraining; that's simply how it works. You can not overtrain from cycling to work. Your current lifestyle and level of conditioning is making it difficult for you to recover. Eat, train, sleep. Your conditioning will improve and diet/sleep is down to you.

But the guy who writes stronglifts.com insists that you should do minimal cardio while on the programme - although having said that, he's not medically qualified and some of the stuff he writes is very patronizing.

I might pay more attention to my diet though, I'm currently running on 2000 calories a day in an attempt to get my body fat down - the stronglifts workout is intended to minimize muscle loss while I'm doing it.

[DuracellBunny]

But the guy who writes stronglifts.com insists that you should do minimal cardio while on the programme - although having said that, he's not medically qualified and some of the stuff he writes is very patronizing.

I might pay more attention to my diet though, I'm currently running on 2000 calories a day in an attempt to get my body fat down - the stronglifts workout is intended to minimize muscle loss while I'm doing it.

Cardio adds to both required calories and recovery and as such all resistance training becomes more difficult unless those 2 factors from cardio are taken in to account. As long as you compensate for those 2 factors, you are good to go. Cycling is zero impact, unlike running, so your joints don't take a pounding. Your diet and sleep will be a suck it and see issue, but when you get those right you will be fine.

[ironwill2008]

I'm pretty sure I'm suffering from overtraining syndrome, with an elevated resting heart rate. I'm 39 years old and doing the stronglifts 5x5 routine, but also have an 8 mile commute to and from work (16 total), by bicycle, over hilly country, 5 days a week.

any ideas on remedies? apart from the obvious getting a car.

But the guy who writes stronglifts.com insists that you should do minimal cardio while on the programme - although having said that, he's not medically qualified and some of the stuff he writes is very patronizing.

I might pay more attention to my diet though, I'm currently running on 2000 calories a day in an attempt to get my body fat down - the stronglifts workout is intended to minimize muscle loss while I'm doing it.

Eat more; it sounds like you're starving yourself.

[Opaq]

You are probably overdoing it with only 2000 kcal a day, with all that biking and strength training on top of it. You will feel more tired and your weight lifting will stall too soon.

[PiperBill]

I am in a similar situation but I think it's more fatigue than anything else. Yesterday I stacked 25kg cases of meat from the floor and onto pallets for 8 hours and then did my SL 5x5. I am totally waisted today and had to do the same job again. Luckily it's my rest day from 5x5.

I am thinking of dropping to 3x5 for squats on days when it's chaotic and heavy at work. That might be an option for you until you figure out how to keep your energy levels up.

Bill

[tobymax123]

I'm pretty sure I'm suffering from overtraining syndrome, with an elevated resting heart rate. I'm 39 years old and doing the stronglifts 5x5 routine, but also have an 8 mile commute to and from work (16 total), by bicycle, over hilly country, 5 days a week.

any ideas on remedies? apart from the obvious getting a car.

Is your resting heart rate suddenly higher than it used to be? If so, see a doctor. Maybe get a stress test. Get it checked out.

[JerryB]

But the guy who writes stronglifts.com insists that you should do minimal cardio while on the programme - although having said that, he's not medically qualified and some of the stuff he writes is very patronizing.

I might pay more attention to my diet though, I'm currently running on 2000 calories a day in an attempt to get my body fat down - the stronglifts workout is intended to minimize muscle loss while I'm doing it.

Appears to be more of issue of insufficient caloric intake.
How did you derive at the 2,000 calories?
The Bodybuilding.com thread at http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hp?t=156380183 may help you determine the reasonableness of the 2000 calories given your training, commute to work and body composition goals.

[Jbizzlechizzle]

Appears to be more of issue of insufficient caloric intake.
How did you derive at the 2,000 calories?
The Bodybuilding.com thread at http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hp?t=156380183 may help you determine the reasonableness of the 2000 calories given your training, commute to work and body composition goals.

Yes, OP. You definitely need more food. You're probably burning well over 1000 cal/day alone just one your commute and you're lifting weights on top of that (also burning calories). If you're feeling run down, it's because you're not eating enough.

[Marius_Ursus]

You've not seen the hills involved, it's nearly an hour and a half's cardio every day, 5 days a week.

That's not over training. You don't understand your own body.

Get your heart checked. Seriously.

[DuracellBunny]

Nobody has asked yet, but what supplements are you taking? If you are taking anything with stimulants in it, stop it for a week and then measure your heart rate again. The same thing applies to coffee if you are drinking more coffee due to being tired.

[Brackneyc]

I used to walk to school in the snow. 5 miles uphill both ways.

[DCSpartan]

any ideas on remedies? .

eat. 16 miles of biking is easy volume.

[mcbourque]

Just my opinion/experience but something similar happened to me in grad school.

Biked 10k back and forth (20k), taught high impact aerobics for an hr and lifted for 30 min. 5 days a week biking, 6 days classes.

And yes I was overtraining. My resting heart rate shot up consistently (measured first thing in the morning) after 4 months of this. I was 28. I was always taught that one indication of cardiovascular overtraining is an elevated resting heart rate (taken upon waking up).

So I had to start taking the bus to school a couple of days a week so I could keep teaching my classes and lift and things got better.

It was a common thing that happened to fitness instructors who taught intense cardio classes 15 or more hrs a week. We were warned to watch for it.

OP I don't know what to tell you but more food and sleep might be an option.

There was also a good NOVA science movie a while ago that talked about sports performance and overtraining. Might be worth digging to find it.

[drudixon]

Eat more; it sounds like you're starving yourself.

This. Almost all overtraining is undereating.

[dragonfly102]

thanks everyone, according to the link posted previously I should be taking 3150 calories a day. I'd got to the 2000 calorie based on what's worked for me previously - but then I didn't use to cycle to work.

I might also drop the stronglifts workout to once a week - since muscle maintenance and fat loss is my goal more than muscle building at the moment. I'm 19% body fat a the moment and my goal is to get it down to 12%.

The big question now is how to best get these extra 1000 calories - in addition to increasing portion size in normal meals, I'm thinking a bowl of porridge with some whey protein mixed in around 4pm. What I do is look on the labels of foods and avoid anything with more than 5% fat - shredded wheat and skimmed milk looks like a winner as a between meal snack too. I don't 'do' atkins, I can't stand the menu, and it means I can't drink lager - a pint of which after work is pure nectar of the gods to me! (just one pint mind, my 2000 cals a day weren't entirely from lager).

[Mojoke]

thanks everyone, according to the link posted previously I should be taking 3150 calories a day. I'd got to the 2000 calorie based on what's worked for me previously - but then I didn't use to cycle to work.

I might also drop the stronglifts workout to once a week - since muscle maintenance and fat loss is my goal more than muscle building at the moment. I'm 19% body fat a the moment and my goal is to get it down to 12%.

The big question now is how to best get these extra 1000 calories - in addition to increasing portion size in normal meals, I'm thinking a bowl of porridge with some whey protein mixed in around 4pm. What I do is look on the labels of foods and avoid anything with more than 5% fat - shredded wheat and skimmed milk looks like a winner as a between meal snack too. I don't 'do' atkins, I can't stand the menu, and it means I can't drink lager - a pint of which after work is pure nectar of the gods to me! (just one pint mind, my 2000 cals a day weren't entirely from lager).

Undereating would mean you're losing weight. If you're not losing weight, you're not undereating.
Most trainees however do way too much. If you can't recover from what you're doing, cut back. Training twice a week is a great alternative and help you with recovery.

Even when cutting down you should not have such a kind of experience. extreme fatigue usually comes from not enough rest/recovery, not from undereating

[grubman]

Appears to be more of issue of insufficient caloric intake.
How did you derive at the 2,000 calories?
The Bodybuilding.com thread at http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hp?t=156380183 may help you determine the reasonableness of the 2000 calories given your training, commute to work and body composition goals.

What Jerry and others have said. I walk 12-15 miles a day for my job (up hills and porch steps) and I eat just a little under 3,000 calories a day just to maintain a (fairly lean) bodyweight around 160 (give or take a couple pounds). Unless you are smaller than me you need to eat more.

All that aside, I'm grateful for the benefits I get from all the bonus "exercise". It may not be ideal for building muscle mass, but I believe it has certainly helped my general fitness. I have more endurance, I still feel "young", and every single time I'm in a doctors office for anything they commend on my condition and how great my blood pressure and heart rate are...so, win win.

[Casedogg43]

Eat more; it sounds like you're starving yourself.

Agreed. if you are doing 1.5hr of cardio 5 days a week. Still have body fat while eating 2000 cal day, something is off.

How long have you been doing this routine of biking and working out @ 2000cal day?

[dragonfly102]

Agreed. if you are doing 1.5hr of cardio 5 days a week. Still have body fat while eating 2000 cal day, something is off.

How long have you been doing this routine of biking and working out @ 2000cal day?

Several months now, but only this last month have I been doing it 5 days a week - I used to get a ride to work on Tuesdays and Thursdays, but this option is no longer available. I've been losing fat all this time, and keeping muscle as far as I can tell (I've not been getting weaker on the weights any way).

[RestoringTally]

The big question now is how to best get these extra 1000 calories - in addition to increasing portion size in normal meals, I'm thinking a bowl of porridge with some whey protein mixed in around 4pm. What I do is look on the labels of foods and avoid anything with more than 5% fat - shredded wheat and skimmed milk looks like a winner as a between meal snack too. I don't 'do' atkins, I can't stand the menu, and it means I can't drink lager - a pint of which after work is pure nectar of the gods to me! (just one pint mind, my 2000 cals a day weren't entirely from lager).

Get rid of that mindset that fats are bad. You should be eating at least 1/2 g/lb BW of fats. If you want to retain or grow muscle the rule of thumb is eat at least 1 g/lb BW of protein. Check out the Nutrition forum stickies. It sounds like you need help with your nutrition.

[Pablo Escovar]

Get rid of that mindset that fats are bad. You should be eating at least 1/2 g/lb BW of fats. If you want to retain or grow muscle the rule of thumb is eat at least 1 g/lb BW of protein. Check out the Nutrition forum stickies. It sounds like you need help with your nutrition.

Yeah, Dragonfly. Eat like I do and keto adapt. I ate a little over 5000 Kcals today, and the macros broke down as follows:
carbs < 40g
fat about 440g (mostly dairy fat like butter and cream cheese)
protein about 300g (from high quality, complete protein animal sources such as salmon and cheddar cheese)

After you keto adapt, biking the hills will become a breeze because fat will be a higher percentage of the total fuel you burn at all submaximal levels of effort. I too have a bike commute of a mere 2 miles one way, but it's long enough for me to get past the lactate accumulation after the first hill climb, and then the rest of the ride is a lactic acid free experience (and I'm still moving along at a good clip).

Also, eating more fat and restricting carbohydrates to ketogenic inducing levels will make you a fat blob like me... ;>)

As the Hodge twins are fond of saying for their disclaimer, "This is all just advice, do whatever the ****! you wanna do.

But, if you decide you want to learn more then check out "The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Performance" by Phinney and Volek to get a better handle on keto adaptation and what a well formulated ketogenic diet looks like. I'm looking forward to getting a pork shoulder cooking in the crock pot, adequately spiced with sea salt and pepper and maybe an onion, overnight so that I can have me some savory, fatty meat with bone broth tomorrow for breakfast and lunch (my only two meals of the day). I'm salivating already...

[RestoringTally]

I'm looking forward to getting a pork shoulder cooking in the crock pot, adequately spiced with sea salt and pepper and maybe an onion, overnight so that I can have me some savory, fatty meat with bone broth tomorrow for breakfast and lunch (my only two meals of the day). I'm salivating already...

That sounds good. What time should I come over?

[Pablo Escovar]

That sounds good. What time should I come over?

Sorry Man. The pork is all gone, but I just started working on some crock pot chicken leg quarters this morning. I threw in a couple of sticks of butter to make sure the meat would be adequately lubricated. The salt and pepper and multiple cloves of garlic added to the chicken and cooked overnight have made this batch quite tasty.

Feeding time is now, and there will be some left for tomorrow morning too.