Just lol at the Vatican

[MuscleXtreme]

Confirming gay marriage as bringing positive values.

Brb confirming other sins in the bible as having slight positive values.

I thought you Catholics got rid of the libs in your church?

Source:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/l...ular-families/

�turn respectfully� to couples such as those who live together unmarried or are of the same-gender and �appreciate the positive values� those unions may have.

[Tekkendo]

Hate the sins but love the sinners and let God be the judge. Let he who has no sin casts the first stone.

[confuoco]

Hate the sins but love the sinners and let God be the judge. Let he who has no sin casts the first stone.

So we can no longer define & uphold doctrine against what is immoral?

[boseador]

Oh no, God is gonna get angry and flood the world or something. lol. Or maybe this ebola outbreak was God's punishment?

[Tekkendo]

Oh no, God is gonna get angry and flood the world or something. lol. Or maybe this ebola outbreak was God's punishment?

way ahead of you, sucka.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...Dordrecht.html

[IbnKutub]

It's a shame really.

[lasher]

Why don't we wait and see what the documents the synod actually produces say rather than let the news spin things.

[homicidal_misc]

Not buying it

[servatius]

catholics , they lost the war ages ago .

[Fiyero]

Muscle seriously has some hate for gays which is a bigger sin than what the Vatican is doing. The Vatican hasn't changed their stance on the morality of same-sex relationships. Quit whining.

[lasher]

relatio ante disceptationem is a preperatory document and a summary of various speeches made so far by bishops at the synod. It is not an official vatican document.


But if they do actually implement some of the language in there into the synods final decision, the Society of saint Pius X will permanently seperate from the Vatican, and they will probably be just the start. The FSSP might break off as well, and I'd bet money that the sedevacantist movement will explode.

[Aesthetical]

Now muscle can feel accepted in his church.

[Anondragon2012]

Confirming gay marriage as bringing positive values.

Brb confirming other sins in the bible as having slight positive values.

I thought you Catholics got rid of the libs in your church?

Source:

This post is almost Islamic-like in its idiocy.

The official catechism of the Catholic church hasn't changed for hundreds of years and still considers homosexual acts as "disordered".
Further on the topic of Gay Marriage: http://www.catholic.com/documents/gay-marriage

Pope Francis himself has reiterated the catechism with regards to the Gay acts, just in 2013 : http://protectthepope.com/?p=7813

In his interview with journalists on the flight back from Rio’s WYD Pope Francis has spoken for the first time since becoming pope about homosexuality in which he has re-affirmed the Catechism of the Catholic Church’s presentation of sexual ethics. The *** reports:

He was responding to questions about whether there was a “gay lobby” in the Vatican. ”If a person is gay and seeks God and has good will, who am I to judge them?” ”The Catechism of the Catholic Church explains this very well,” Pope Francis said in a wide-ranging 80-minute long interview with Vatican journalists. ”It says they should not be marginalised because of this but that they must be integrated into society.” But he condemned what he described as lobbying by gay people. ”The problem is not having this orientation,” he said. “We must be brothers. The problem is lobbying by this orientation, or lobbies of greedy people, political lobbies, Masonic lobbies, so many lobbies. This is the worse problem.”

Pope Francis clearly sets his statement ‘If a person is gay and seeks God and has good will, who am I to judge them?’ in the the context of the Catechism of the Catholic Church, which explains what he means by not judging homosexual persons who are seeking God and have a good will.

The Catechism of the Catholic Church ( 2357-2359) categorically states that:
Homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity: tradition has always declared that “homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered.”142 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.
This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial.
They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided.
Homosexual persons are called to chastity: By the virtues of self-mastery that teach them inner freedom, at times by the support of disinterested friendship, by prayer and sacramental grace, they can and should gradually and resolutely approach Christian perfection.
The paragraphs on homosexuality in the Catechism that Pope Francis refers to include a reference to the CDF document ‘ Persona humana ’ when it states that ‘homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered.’

The CDF document ‘Persona humana’ makes the distinction between those living a homosexual life style because of poor education and bad example, and those persons who have a ’pathological constitution judged to be incurable’.

‘At the present time there are those who, basing themselves on observations in the psychological order, have begun to judge indulgently, and even to excuse completely, homosexual relations between certain people. This they do in opposition to the constant teaching of the Magisterium and to the moral sense of the Christian people.

A distinction is drawn, and it seems with some reason, between homosexuals whose tendency comes from a false education, from a lack of normal sexual development, from habit, from bad example, or from other similar causes, and is transitory or at least not incurable; and homosexuals who are definitively such because of some kind of innate instinct or a pathological constitution judged to be incurable.’

Pope Francis’ pastoral approach to persons with homosexuality is rooted in the following paragraph from ‘Persona humana’:

‘In the pastoral field, these homosexuals must certainly be treated with understanding and sustained in the hope of overcoming their personal difficulties and their inability to fit into society. Their culpability will be judged with prudence. But no pastoral method can be employed which would give moral justification to these acts on the grounds that they would be consonant with the condition of such people. For according to the objective moral order, homosexual relations are acts which lack an essential and indispensable finality. In Sacred Scripture they are condemned as a serious depravity and even presented as the sad consequence of rejecting God.[18] This judgment of Scripture does not of course permit us to conclude that all those who suffer from this anomaly are personally responsible for it, but it does attest to the fact that homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered and can in no case be approved of.

Protect the Pope comment: Predictably, the Main Stream Media and blogs have got over excited by Pope Francis’ brief statement on homosexuality, and have distorted his words with the headlines, ‘Who am I to judge gays?’ Pope Francis’ explicit reference to the Catechism was meant by the Holy Father to put his brief statement in the context of the Church’s consistent teaching on homosexuality being an inclination that is intrinsically disordered and homosexual acts being gravely depraved. Pope Francis is quoting directly from the CDF’s Persona humana when he states that they should be integrated into society.

The fact is that until catechism has been changed and gay marriage is tolerated aswell as homosexual acts....(Which will never happen as it hasnt happened since church creation in Ancient Rome)....Some Catholics can say anything they want for political reasons...It wont matter.

[TaeBoNinja]

Muscle seriously has some hate for gays which is a bigger sin than what the Vatican is doing.

He has a ton of self-hate.

[lasher]

This post is almost Islamic-like in its idiocy.

The official catechism of the Catholic church hasn't changed for hundreds of years and still considers homosexual acts as "disordered".
Further on the topic of Gay Marriage: http://www.catholic.com/documents/gay-marriage

Pope Francis himself has reiterated the catechism with regards to the Gay acts, just in 2013 : http://protectthepope.com/?p=7813


The fact is that until catechism has been changed and gay marriage is tolerated aswell as homosexual acts....(Which will never happen as it hasnt happened since church creation in Ancient Rome)....Some Catholics can say anything they want for political reasons...It wont matter.

Another factor to consider is that the Vatican is working extremely hard to unify with the eastern orthodox churches. They aren't going to undo decades of ecumenical dialogue with a poorly worded document that endorses disordered unions. The russians and the greeks would just walk away laughing.

[confuoco]

This post is almost Islamic-like in its idiocy.

The official catechism of the Catholic church hasn't changed for hundreds of years and still considers homosexual acts as "disordered".
Further on the topic of Gay Marriage: http://www.catholic.com/documents/gay-marriage

Pope Francis himself has reiterated the catechism with regards to the Gay acts, just in 2013 : http://protectthepope.com/?p=7813


The fact is that until catechism has been changed and gay marriage is tolerated aswell as homosexual acts....(Which will never happen as it hasnt happened since church creation in Ancient Rome)....Some Catholics can say anything they want for political reasons...It wont matter.

Not saying this is official yet, but for those who aren't Catholic, the assurance of the catechism remaining intact while the functional attitude & behavior of the Vatican changes isn't very satisfying.

[lasher]

Not saying this is official yet, but for those who aren't Catholic, the assurance of the catechism remaining intact while the functional attitude & behavior of the Vatican changes isn't very satisfying.

No, it certainly is not. But it still needs to be remembered that relatio ante disceptationem is only a preperatory document. And from what I am reading, there is a great deal of outcry among many bishops to have its wording heavily edited.

[Tekkendo]

relatio ante disceptationem is a preperatory document and a summary of various speeches made so far by bishops at the synod. It is not an official vatican document.


But if they do actually implement some of the language in there into the synods final decision, the Society of saint Pius X will permanently seperate from the Vatican, and they will probably be just the start. The FSSP might break off as well, and I'd bet money that the sedevacantist movement will explode.

My bet is, the Vatican will not make such drastic changes, but rather an elaboration of what I posted in #2.

The fundamental principle of Christianity is compassion, not condemnation.

[confuoco]

Compassion implies correction, not endorsement. Also there is the whole "I did not come to bring peace, but a sword" obstacle.

[MuscleXtreme]

Why don't we wait and see what the documents the synod actually produces say rather than let the news spin things.

The issue with waiting and seeing is that if the Christian voice is not heard NOW. We, the Christian church, are tacitly allowing the authoritative Word to be potentially altered by a bunch of libs.

The Vatican needs to know that this is not acceptable and will not be tolerated.

[MuscleXtreme]

This post is almost Islamic-like in its idiocy.

The official catechism of the Catholic church hasn't changed for hundreds of years and still considers homosexual acts as "disordered".
Further on the topic of Gay Marriage: http://www.catholic.com/documents/gay-marriage

Pope Francis himself has reiterated the catechism with regards to the Gay acts, just in 2013 : http://protectthepope.com/?p=7813


The fact is that until catechism has been changed and gay marriage is tolerated aswell as homosexual acts....(Which will never happen as it hasnt happened since church creation in Ancient Rome)....Some Catholics can say anything they want for political reasons...It wont matter.

Yeah Vatican II has really allowed me to put my trust in the liberal hijacking inside the Catholic church.

[lasher]

The issue with waiting and seeing is that if the Christian voice is not heard NOW. We, the Christian church, are tacitly allowing the authoritative Word to be potentially altered by a bunch of libs.

The Vatican needs to know that this is not acceptable and will not be tolerated.

But again, you aren't hearing what the Vatican is saying, because they haven't said anything yet. You are only hearing the news spin things. The synod ends on the 19th. Only then will the actual decisions made there be public and official.

[MuscleXtreme]

Compassion implies correction, not endorsement. Also there is the whole "I did not come to bring peace, but a sword" obstacle.

This!!!

The Word of God is eternal, perfect and unchanging. It does not change on the social trends of a hedonistic society.

[lasher]

The forums over at fisheaters.com are going apeshyt over this lol.

[MuscleXtreme]

But again, you aren't hearing what the Vatican is saying, because they haven't said anything yet. You are only hearing the news spin things. The synod ends on the 19th. Only then will the actual decisions made there be public and official.

True, but it's not as if what is being reported is made up out of thin air. Will what is being discussed right now be codified as is? Possibly not. But the fact that even one iota of a possibility exists that it can - is still too much.

Voices need to be heard now that this is unacceptable.

[lasher]

True, but it's not as if what is being reported is made up out of thin air. Will what is being discussed right now be codified as is? Possibly not. But the fact that even one iota of a possibility exists that it can - is still much.

Voices need to be heard now that this is unacceptable.

I'm still going to withold judgement until I read what is officially decided. If the Catholic Church actually does end up condoning same sex unions in any way shape or form, I'll be the first person to call Francis an apostate and the seat of peter vacant.

[lasher]

good post over on fisheaters.com on what this document actually says and is.

http://www.fisheaters.com/forums/ind...opic=3466262.0

[Tekkendo]

Compassion implies correction, not endorsement. Also there is the whole "I did not come to bring peace, but a sword" obstacle.

Feel free to cry when they ACTUALLY endorse those. Until then...

[Tekkendo]

good post over on fisheaters.com on what this document actually says and is.

http://www.fisheaters.com/forums/ind...opic=3466262.0

One of the report’s 58 sections—the one causing the biggest stir—is titled, “Welcoming homosexual persons.”

“Homosexuals have gifts and qualities to offer to the Christian community,” the passage begins. “Are we capable of welcoming these people, guaranteeing to them a fraternal space in our communities? Often they wish to encounter a Church that offers them a welcoming home. Are our communities capable of providing that, accepting and valuing their sexual orientation, without compromising Catholic doctrine on the family and matrimony?”

(False)Prophet Tek called it a few posts up.

[TranceNRG]

As I read this thread, I appreciate the hesitancy towards media and their potential spin on catholic doctrines.

I hope the same hesitancy and caution is given to the doctrines of other religions as well that the media puts out.