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08-31-2014, 11:36 PM #181
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08-31-2014, 11:37 PM #182
Such a liar. The last thread of yours I can remember you were 'disproving' evolutionary theory by posting a link to a video, when I challenged you to express your own thoughts on the matter for rebuttal you dodged like the little bitch you are. At least lasher admits to trolling without being a sanctimonious hypocrite about it.
"A stupid man's report of what a clever man says can never be accurate, because he unconsciously translates what he hears into something he can understand."
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08-31-2014, 11:39 PM #183
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08-31-2014, 11:45 PM #184
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08-31-2014, 11:49 PM #185
- Join Date: Aug 2010
- Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
- Age: 31
- Posts: 12,506
- Rep Power: 2605
Unfortunately, this has nothing to do with what I'm asking. You're making descriptive statements, I'm asking for prescriptive ones. Obviously, the question here is whether it is or isn't more moral to take whatever you need by force in order to save the child than to respect the private property rights.
You seem to make statements about inalienable moral tennets, yet pus$y out when it's time to carry them out...I rate it 9/11
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08-31-2014, 11:50 PM #186
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08-31-2014, 11:51 PM #187
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08-31-2014, 11:55 PM #188
- Join Date: Aug 2010
- Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
- Age: 31
- Posts: 12,506
- Rep Power: 2605
So I don't understand why you keep re-visiting this discussion when I state its logical conclusion. You believe one ought to not steal the material needed to effectively carry out the rescue and therefore your moral stance is completely insane, imo, because it is devoid of any kind of realistic perspective.
I rate it 9/11
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09-01-2014, 12:04 AM #189
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09-01-2014, 12:04 AM #190
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09-01-2014, 12:46 AM #191
I grew up a poor child, nobody ever gave us sheit. Nothing is stopping your poor child from learning. Those who want to learn will find a way. When there is a will, there is a way.
Listen, let me try to help you:
It's easy to make money, go knock on people's doors, be charming, next thing you know you'll be cutting everyone's lawn in your neighborhood and living in a $500'000 house. I know two people that did just this on my block alone. No education, no nothing, no hand outs. They didn't camp out in anyone's backyard and they didn't steal from anyone to fund their education.
I know a rich musical instrument maker who made and donated hundreds of instruments to poor kids. THIS is the way bro. Not forcing him to make instruments for those kids or stealing his money. You gave up on humanity. Your intentions may be good, but you fail to realize that government attracts the worst power-hungry scum and gives them all the tools to make sure that boy of yours remains poor and is a dependent underclass.
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09-01-2014, 12:48 AM #192
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09-01-2014, 01:07 AM #193
What's the topic at hand?
I'm just saying, you need to live in reality! On paper you can imagine government taking from evil let's call him Rockefeller and giving his money to a poor boy for his education. In reality Rockefeller owns government, and the poor boy will never see that money nor any education, the money will be stolen by the government to fund government officials' golf vacations. Some peanuts will indeed trickle down to that poor boy's education in form of Communist education like in Sweden when your poor boy will not know what sex he is, or like in New York where your poor boy will not know how to read upon graduation. This is the reality. You gotta take human factor into account, not just make up communist utopia on paper. If you give something to someone for free where they don't earn it, they will abuse it. Obvious stuff.
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09-01-2014, 03:38 AM #194
I would like to invoke my 5th amendment right not to provide an answer which might incriminate myself at this time.
Whats wrong with being an anarchist? (which Im not btw)EX IGNORANTIA AD SAPIENTIAM
EX LUCE AD TENERBRAS
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09-01-2014, 05:05 AM #195
I swear Christians and their inane "God says so and he's fukking the essence of righteousness brah" is more tolerable than helpless rationalists trapped in a cognitive corner talking about rights as if they are real things. They are so full of shyt that it has formed a shyt river and overflowed its banks into this thread.
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09-01-2014, 05:49 AM #196
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09-01-2014, 06:03 AM #197
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09-01-2014, 06:19 AM #198
I dunno. I think there's a legit difference between recognizing value and then understanding causal effects. IMO this is why morality conversation gets so screwed up. You can map moral language legitimately onto emotions and cognitive processes giving rise to speech. You can legitimately say humans have a 'human nature'. Based on that you can derive a 'most likely to be moral' which is masquerade on top of 'most likely to be recognized as moral eventually'. Assuming everybody in the universe does eventually die you end up with an objective answer to 'most likely moral' only nobody is practically going to have access to that information.
I think Stizzel just shoots from the hip but isn't a bad shot when it comes to morality. Grant people as a reflection of the universe in some respect and you quickly get golden rule and all of the other goodies which you can scrape off of that.
The worst IMO is to have your morality derived from possible consequences enforced by an invisible being who actually doesn't exist. That's nuts. BRB this life sucks but that's fine. I get a replay in heaven.EX IGNORANTIA AD SAPIENTIAM
EX LUCE AD TENERBRAS
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09-01-2014, 06:29 AM #199
He's awful at defending his position. Besides, I'm pretty sure I agree more with his moral preferences than you do, so this is confusing to me that you would support his position. Since when are you down with initiation of force against a non-agressor being universally/objectively/rationally immoral?
Also, humans have a nature whose final preferences and behaviors is largely conditioned by chaotic environmental factors and socialization. I don't think it is likely that the answer to "what is most likely to be recognized as moral" is going to apply for very long.
I don't think you can quickly or easily get the Golden Rule out of granting people as an aspect of the universe.Last edited by DizzySmalls; 09-01-2014 at 06:37 AM.
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09-01-2014, 06:51 AM #200
Don't make the fallacy fallacy tho (a poorly argued position doesn't indicate the position is incorrect -- thanks myriad).
Originally Posted by Dizzy
Originally Posted by Dizzy
So, when I see riots in the street I'm often thinking we probably need more tanks and smoke. I won't say that's moral, but it is effective at establishing harmony. Like Godzilla. His job is to wake up and go chase the other giant evil monster wrecking everything. That's sort of how I see a well functioning government. It's not ideal, but it still works anyway.
Originally Posted by Dizzy
Originally Posted by DizzyEX IGNORANTIA AD SAPIENTIAM
EX LUCE AD TENERBRAS
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09-01-2014, 07:06 AM #201
Taken to an extreme, it's really not great. Besides, if you know human nature, there is always going to be someone with a will to create disharmony and enact change. Someone will always disagree, and there will always be people who struggle to enact their preferences onto reality. I'll go full Nietzsche and claim that suffering, struggle between values and ideas, and changes in the order/priority of the natural impulses over time are necessary aspects of existence.
Originally Posted by goo
Originally Posted by GOO
Originally Posted by Goo
Originally Posted by Goo
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09-01-2014, 08:11 AM #202
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09-01-2014, 08:13 AM #203
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09-01-2014, 09:08 AM #204
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09-01-2014, 09:19 AM #205
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09-01-2014, 09:27 AM #206
I like Lasher, Ringdips, ZenBowman, kusok, metroins, and Lakersbake.
I don't always agree with them, but you can tell they're smart people so I like them.
IDBLOL, Tekkendo, brighamw, and bushmaster as well. they bring the most character to R/P. Always stirring the chit, but intelligent people. Spartan too, i see his lulzy posts on regular misc.
Of course, I can't forget ICrapBig, dude knows his stuff. I love his thoughtcrimes, he says the taboo, which is required for a democratic society.*MIDF*
Misc Internet Defense Force
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09-01-2014, 09:45 AM #207
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09-01-2014, 09:50 AM #208
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09-01-2014, 10:03 AM #209
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09-01-2014, 10:35 AM #210
The nut job sociopaths and psychopaths got to us.
I don't think there is such a thing as natural state. Natural state changes with environment and circumstances. What's natural for one may not be natural for another.
A free society (aka anarchy) is actually the goal as we continue to shake off the chains of slavery, taxation, serfdom, government and other BS relics of the stone age.
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