Leg press vs squat

[x-trainer ben]

And...he grew like mad after that too.

Jay Cutler doesn't squat either, his legs are far from being weak... I cant wait for more to chime in with "well you gotta consider they are using blah blah".

Every discussion always leads to that on here for some reason.

During his swollen monkey days/vids he squatted in the smith.

[GregSquats]

Squats are considered a compound exercise because it not only works your quads, but your core and back as well. Doing more compound exercises will get you bigger quicker than just focusing on one muscle group at a time. Thats not to discredit leg press though, because in all honestly I get a hell of a lot of a better pump from doing leg presses

[lancs_hotpot]

And...he grew like mad after that too.

Jay Cutler doesn't squat either, his legs are far from being weak... I cant wait for more to chime in with "well you gotta consider they are using blah blah".

Every discussion always leads to that on here for some reason.

It matters a lot what they are using, with the amounts they do use and thier elite genetics they'l have massive legs regardless of how they train.

[MrSilverback]

That doesn't make sense from a logical point of view.

Muscle growth is not exclusive to a certain type of exercise or movement.

I don't know really?

Clearly some guys have it figured out.

Think about it this way though...do you think your chest would be as big if all you did was flys and cable flys vs compound movements like bench?

[RoroCwalker]

I don't know really?

Clearly some guys have it figured out.

Think about it this way though...do you think your chest would be as big if all you did was flys and cable flys vs compound movements like bench?

It is a possibility, but to say that it wouldn't grow with flys and cable flys is not logical.

It might grow faster if you were to do compound movements, but there's no such thing as an exercise that "keeps that mass", whatever exercise you're doing, if the muscle fibres follows the protocol of "muscle growth" (including nutrition, of course), whatever it may be, then it'll grow.

What you're comparing is the effectiveness on a set period of time, but to say that it doesn't make them grow, is not logical.

That would also imply that Dorian stopped gaining leg size after he stopped squatting.

[lancs_hotpot]

It is not only muscle or tendon injuries with squats you have to worry about. Squatting heavy wreaks havoc on the joints too.

The question I always ask people is, how many powerlifters or bodybuilders do you see looking great into their older age? Not many. Sure there are exceptions, but mostly none, unless they are on the bike.

Yet you see more and more older people who look great in their older years, because they work out intelligently and don't overtax their joints, tendons and muscles when they are younger.

Like Haney said all the time...stimulate, don't annihilate.

You dont seem to understand that squatting correctly will do more to strengthen connective tissue, reduce injuries and improve health than it will to hurt you. Do people who push themselves to limit for competition get injured? Yes. Do old age powerlifters and very, very heavy squatters have bad knees? Probably, but none of us will get near those numbers or train that hard, so your worry about squats hurting you is just silly and based on a lack of info and bad argument.

The leg press can be effective, especially for someone with a legitimate reason not to squat. But the squat is the better movement for leg development, health and performance.

And most people can do it, they either pussy out because its hard or they cant be bothered to stretch and practice techique for a month to be able to get into the safe position.

[MrSilverback]

It is a possibility, but to say that it wouldn't grow with flys and cable flys is not logical.

It might grow faster if you were to do compound movements, but there's no such thing as an exercise that "keeps that mass", whatever exercise you're doing, if the muscle fibres follows the protocol of "muscle growth" (including nutrition, of course), whatever it may be, then it'll grow.

What you're comparing is the effectiveness on a set period of time, but to say that it doesn't make them grow, is not logical.

That would also imply that Dorian stopped gaining leg size after he stopped squatting.

I think you answered your own question in bold.

[RoroCwalker]

I think you answered your own question in bold.

I had no question to answer, I was dismissing the statement Drew Jemmott made, according to you.

[MrSilverback]

I had no question to answer, I was dismissing the statement Drew Jemmott made, according to you.

And you kinda proved it in your post?

Any sort of muscle stimulation via exercise is going to "keep" the muscle. Maybe I should have said maintain. A lot of guys also don't free squat because of the effects it can have making your midsection and lower abdominal areas blocky.

I don't really have a great answer for you. There are so many factors:

- Genetics
- How they structure their nutrition around leg day
- Being able to focus on certain muscles vs others

So yeah, I dunno? It's a good question to ask. In the end you typically see a lot of guys early in their career squatting. As they get older, they move away from it.

[RoroCwalker]

And you kinda proved it in your post?

Any sort of muscle stimulation via exercise is going to "keep" the muscle. Maybe I should have said maintain. A lot of guys also don't free squat because of the effects it can have making your midsection and lower abdominal areas blocky.

I don't really have a great answer for you. There are so many factors:

- Genetics
- How they structure their nutrition around leg day
- Being able to focus on certain muscles vs others

So yeah, I dunno? It's a good question to ask. In the end you typically see a lot of guys early in their career squatting. As they get older, they move away from it.

I'm not following what you're saying.

I proved my point, yes, not his.

The point is that any muscle stimulation via exercise can also "grow" the muscle.

If I never did any squats and I my legs grew in muscle size by 5 inches on the course of 3 years, just by doing leg presses, that means that not squatting does not put my growth on hiatus.

[porrapaulao]

For people with lower back pain, do you squat beltless or with a belt?

[1quick1]

I'm pretty sure the reason why leg presses give better overall results for legs for most guys, is because their ROM on the leg press is a lot bigger than when they're squatting.

A real squat is basically going as deep as possible, like having your knees up against your chest. Most guys can't do this because their core isn't strong enough/they're not used to the movement (this takes quite a lot of practice to perfect). They are only doing a parallel squat or a slightly-below-parallel squat they think is 'ATG'. When they use the leg press, their knees go right against their chest and the ROM has increased dramatically. You can do the same when squatting and have the extra development of your core as a bonus. But I must agree, a leg press machine is much safer to get the full ROM.

I don't think there is a greater ROM. I think the exact opposite. Squats I have a large ROM and in leg press it seems like I move them about 8" but that is also why I really like leg press now because it really keeps tension on the quads.

[lancs_hotpot]

For people with lower back pain, do you squat beltless or with a belt?

You should fix the pain before you squat mate.

[203mh]

For people with lower back pain, do you squat beltless or with a belt?

I usually stand on a plate or so and do sumo squats with a heavy dumbbell... I love it... my back has been feeling MUCH better

[caliguy2010]

squat

[Juggertha]

For people with lower back pain, do you squat beltless or with a belt?

I find any heavy compression really does a number on my back. Anything over 300lbs on my shoulders will have me walking on the edge of pain the next day - be it from squats of standing calf raises.

So for me, those lifts, when heavy, are a rarity and not worth it.

[HeroesFall]

For people with lower back pain, do you squat beltless or with a belt?

I started wearing a belt at 275lbs. I pulled 405 for Deadlifts without ever wearing a belt, I couldn't get comfortable wearing one, it just slips up my waist. I was fine with my lower back until about 335lbs or so and "toughed" it out to 355lbs at which point my lower back was feeling like **** on the regular. It was enough for me. Haven't had similar issues until recently doing SDL's, I think my worksets are at 310lbs now and after the previous exercises my lower back is tired as fuk. I'm all ears for a solution.


Most people who work an office job suffer from issues, like improper lower back engagement - among a plethora of other things. Unfortunately, going to visit a doctor / PT / chiro doesn't yield them giving any answers or solutions - they want to "treat" it, not solve it.

I'd happily squat if my lower back wouldn't go to ****. That said, I bust my arse every leg day and limp out of the gym empty of energy. I have 4 flights of stairs to walk to go from the gym to the train platform. I usually either end up laughing at my piss poor walking or wincing. No doubt, my legs are getting a solid workout - which is a small part of the equation, rest and recovery are actually more important.

[Caesar164]

My last leg workout that I squatted was about 3 weeks ago... I reached my last work set of 405. I was aiming for 8 reps which I completed. On my 7th rep I felt a tweak in the left side of my lower back. I was able to finish my leg work out, I had planned to also work my shoulders that day, but My back had stiffened and I could not. About a week past and I was feeling better, was working on biceps, on my last set of barbell curls I re-aggravated my lower back; freaking barbell curls lol. Anyway, since then, my lower back has felt better, the pain started at the left lumbar, but has since radiated to behind my left glute and slightly down my left hamstring... I had set a goal for myself of reaching and surpassing my PR of 500 that I performed in my mid to late twenties. Now my priorities have changed, don't think that I will ever squat more then 315 ever again. The back pain was excruciating, and I had to take a few days off from work because of it. I'm 37, I want to be able train for the rest of my life, chasing personal best is not the way to do so. I will start doing more hack squats and higher reps with a lot less weight on the squat. I still prefer them over leg presses, but I also do leg presses, the leg press also tends to round out your back if you go full legs to chest on your ROM.

[BrutasMaximus]

And...he grew like mad after that too.

Jay Cutler doesn't squat either, his legs are far from being weak... I cant wait for more to chime in with "well you gotta consider they are using blah blah".

Every discussion always leads to that on here for some reason.

Seen Jay do front squats plenty of times in his vids.

[TropicalSunset]

You dont seem to understand that squatting correctly will do more to strengthen connective tissue, reduce injuries and improve health than it will to hurt you. Do people who push themselves to limit for competition get injured? Yes. Do old age powerlifters and very, very heavy squatters have bad knees? Probably, but none of us will get near those numbers or train that hard, so your worry about squats hurting you is just silly and based on a lack of info and bad argument.

The leg press can be effective, especially for someone with a legitimate reason not to squat. But the squat is the better movement for leg development, health and performance.

And most people can do it, they either pussy out because its hard or they cant be bothered to stretch and practice techique for a month to be able to get into the safe position.

All I am saying is that everyone is different and people should go with what their body is telling them and also take into consideration their goals. But saying you HAVE TO squat or you are being a wuss is silly.

You CAN grow muscle doing other exercises. And while the squat is an amazing exercise, it is not a MUST in a workout regimen like many make it out to be.

[pyrolee]

You should fix the pain before you squat mate.

Good posts. The squat and leg press both have their place. Any exercise that is causing pain means you have some kind of biomechanical problem. Fix that first.

[porrapaulao]

Good posts. The squat and leg press both have their place. Any exercise that is causing pain means you have some kind of biomechanical problem. Fix that first.

I hurt my lower back training jiujitsu. I had pain most of the time, not only training, and I couldnt squat or DL more than a plate each side without a lot of pain and back stiffeness after. I fixed it by strengthening my lower back mainly by squatting and deadlifting with a belt. In theory it doesn't make much sense, but by using it I was able to lift much heavier weights and indirectly my lower back got stronger while doing it.
Of course I didnt rush things, it took a loong time, sometimes I would add like 4 pounds to my squat and my lower back would complain, the whole process took like a year.
After my hernia surgery I only squat beltless.

[Exane]

Im just going to say it....



Squats and oats, *******.

[Exane]

For muscle growth, per the individual, it probably dosent matter too much. Your legs will probably grow equally for both exercises, but the answers which works their legs better will always be skewed by which one and individual thinks works better. Id also say, depending on what your leverages are like, one may or may not work better then the other. Leverages probably have a huge influence on which one is safer as well.

I used to not leg press so much until I started pressing with my butt about two inches off the pad, it improved my leverages and reduced the tension Id get on my knees from bottoming out on full ROM.

[Larfleeze]

Is it just me or do hack squats feel like they're intentionally designed to destroy the knees?

[Exane]

Is it just me or do hack squats feel like they're intentionally designed to destroy the knees?

Have you tried them the way platz did them? I thought that they would be worse for the knees, but they actually feel better for me.

[spamy]

Is it just me or do hack squats feel like they're intentionally designed to destroy the knees?

How do you keep your feet? On the hack squat/Smith I place my feet in front of the ass, not on the same vertical line as the upper body. And I go only a little below 90 degrees when bending the knees.

[rcooper98]

Both are benifical, but nothing is more of a rush then bangin out heavy squats while the sound of the iron plates sing. Just my 2 cents

[democrat1]

i prefer squats myself but I feel like leg press is great as well

[Larfleeze]

Have you tried them the way platz did them? I thought that they would be worse for the knees, but they actually feel better for me.

How did he do them?

How do you keep your feet? On the hack squat/Smith I place my feet in front of the ass, not on the same vertical line as the upper body. And I go only a little below 90 degrees when bending the knees.

I've tried a few different positionings and they all feel "dangerous" for lack of a better word