Airliner apparently shot down over E. Ukraine

[DocHoss]

Another tragedy for Malaysian Airlines as a 777 from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur is apparently shot down over eastern Ukraine. No survivors.

The sh*t gets deeper.


www. b b c com/news/world-europe-28354856

[EvanStroud]

Aware.

[FlaIronMind]

Watching this unfold now, both on US news sources and European. Those reporting that this civilian airliner "crashed" are talking out their fcking ass. It came down in pieces. From the air. The only uncertainty at this point is who fired and where they fired from (i.e., surface or air).

Meanwhile, Israel has released the hounds and begun one hell of an operation in Gaza.

[paolo59]

Looking at the news this morning, this world isn't exactly a 'sea of tranquility.' I don't guess it ever really has been.

[FlaIronMind]

Looking at the news this morning, this world isn't exactly a 'sea of tranquility.' I don't guess it ever really has been.

A certain book, towards the end, lets folks who read it know it's going to get worse. Far worse. But, in the end, we know who wins.

BTW, Israeli ground offensives just started in Gaza.

[Old-Time-Lifter]

Haven't heard anything about this on the radio???

[ajdahlheimer]

Liberal news sites are saying terrorists show it down.

Right-wing sites are saying the Russians did.

[Old-Time-Lifter]

Liberal news sites are saying terrorists show it down.

Right-wing sites are saying the Russians did.

They're talking about it now. The local talk radio guy here has been railing about the border all day.

[FlaIronMind]

Dore Gold, advisor to Netanyahu, just said, "Peace comes through strength; not through a hopeful wish."

Amen. Many in our own nation need to understand that.

[kimm4]

http://news.msn.com/world/malaysian-...-zone-295-dead

[FlaIronMind]

US officials reporting it was surface to air missile. Intelligence tracked missile. Now who fired and where from?


FWIW - rebels seized a nearby Buk missile site a while back.

US saying this was a Buk missile.

[SP1966]

I'm sure Obumbles and staff are working up a very strongly worded letter as we speak! It will also be interesting to see how badly John Kerry screws up whatever he says regarding the situation.

[FlaIronMind]

Manifest says 23 Americans on board.

If accurate, this requires a very certain response.

[Phattso]

Liberal news sites are saying terrorists show it down.

Right-wing sites are saying the Russians did.

I have been following all day and I haven't noticed liberals calling it a terrorist act or rights blaming Russians. Ukraine is accusing "terrorists." Most sites I have seen are saying that a missile probably brought the plane down.

[paolo59]

Lots of surmising at this juncture. The Ukraine evidently lost a military aircraft to a surface to air missile on Monday in the same region, flying at just over 21,000 feet. Rebels immediately claimed responsibility for that one. Nobody seems to want to claim any responsibility for what has just taken place.

[pvsampson]

All reports here are confirming it was shot down by Pro-Russian militants in the Ukraine.Recordings are being played of those involved.

[Old-Time-Lifter]

Why was a commercial jet flying over a war zone???

[pvsampson]

Why was a commercial jet flying over a war zone???

It had every right to be flying where it was.It is an international flight path.

[SP1966]

It had every right to be flying where it was.It is an international flight path.

I have every right to walk around Watts late at night while knowing not a single soul and understanding the dangers. I also have the right to not be a complete idiot and avoid doing so.

[Phattso]

I disagree. It is dangerous to fly over a war zone. The airlines only does it to save fuel. They risk the lives of their passengers and crew to save a few bucks. No one has the right to do that.

Very good point. That is also so obvious I didn't think about it. Did they really think flying over 33K feet, that they would avoid missiles? The airline is just as culpable as whoever shot the missile. The Malaysian government should have shut that pathway down, too.

[FlaIronMind]

I disagree. It is dangerous to fly over a war zone. The airlines only do it to save fuel. They risk the lives of their passengers and crew to save a few bucks. No one has the right to do that.

While I don't know this airline's motivation behind flying over Ukrainian airspace, pretty much ^^^^. FWIW, the FAA sent out warnings to avoid Ukrainian airspace months ago.

[DocHoss]

I'm sure Obumbles and staff are working up a very strongly worded letter as we speak! It will also be interesting to see how badly John Kerry screws up whatever he says regarding the situation.

Will indeed be interesting to see how the President's response compares to that of Ronald Reagan when the Soviet Union shot down the Korean Airlines 747 carrying a (Republican, FWIW) member of Congress, among other Americans.

All reports here are confirming it was shot down by Pro-Russian militants in the Ukraine.Recordings are being played of those involved.

If the recordings are true - they can, of course be faked, and Ukraine would have motive to do so, though I don't think they have. I think the rebels shot it down deliberately, but thinking it was Ukrainan.

Why was a commercial jet flying over a war zone???

It had every right to be flying where it was.It is an international flight path.

I disagree. It is dangerous to fly over a war zone. The airlines only do it to save fuel. They risk the lives of their passengers and crew to save a few bucks. No one has the right to do that.

Very good point. That is also so obvious I didn't think about it. Did they really think flying over 33K feet, that they would avoid missiles? The airline is just as culpable as whoever shot the missile. The Malaysian government should have shut that pathway down, too.

While I don't know this airline's motivation behind flying over Ukrainian airspace, pretty much ^^^^. FWIW, the FAA sent out warnings to avoid Ukrainian airspace months ago.

Airspace over Ukraine was still open, though they have now shut it. It's Ukraine's responsibility alone as far as I know. The FAA has no jurisdiction there, though I'm sure it advised US airlines to avoid the area. Most airlines have already been avoiding it, though as eomrat points out, it costs fuel and time to do so. I'm sure they thought that a civilian jetliner flying far overhead would not be a target. The rebels have shot down a number of Ukrainian military planes though. Also, most commonly available missiles would not have reached that high.

[SP1966]

Will indeed be interesting to see how the President's response compares to that of Ronald Reagan when the Soviet Union shot down the Korean Airlines 747 carrying a (Republican, FWIW) member of Congress, among other Americans.

"It looks like it might be a terrible tragedy"

Yeah, might be. Guess we'll have to wait to be sure.

[SP1966]

they're rebels and not some government that can be held responsible....

there's nothing to do but bark...

Well then bark without coming across as a complete idiot. "Might be a terrible tragedy"? I don't know, maybe English is his second language and he says things like "They're exact".

[Brackneyc]

they're rebels and not some government that can be held responsible....

there's nothing to do but bark...

I am sure efforts are underway to bring the perpetrators to justice.

[SP1966]

I am sure efforts are underway to bring the perpetrators to justice.

I sure hope their computer didn't crash and take all the evidence with it.

[Phattso]

Well then bark without coming across as a complete idiot. "Might be a terrible tragedy"? I don't know, maybe English is his second language and he says things like "They're exact".

Let me explain Mr. O to you: When he says what he means, it might not be exactly what he means. When he says what he does not mean, it might be exactly what he means.

Thanks a bunch, Obama.

[so-tex]

I disagree. It is dangerous to fly over a war zone. The airlines only do it to save fuel. They risk the lives of their passengers and crew to save a few bucks. No one has the right to do that.

As I understand, it was still an approve international flight zone, so they did have the right fly over. Was it right? He'll no! I'm not disagreeing at all with the rest of your post.

[Brackneyc]

Let me explain Mr. O to you: When he says what he means, it might not be exactly what he means. When he says what he does not mean, it might be exactly what he means.

Thanks a bunch, Obama.

Exactly....

[SP1966]

wtf are you talking about kid ?

i think its relatively clear pops .