Intermediate lifter - No gains for two years - suggestions?

[koatliki]

Hi,

It's been a while since I posted here, but I wanted to get some advises which may give me some new ideas as I seem to be stuck. Reps provided for helpful suggestions.

Here is my story:
2010: I am 5'11" and was 187lb. I thought I was 'buff', but really I was just fat with some muscle. That's when I started serious diet regimen.
2013: This is how I look at 5'11" and 158lb.

2014: Look about the same as in 2013

[Diet]
For the past two years I did regular 'let's bulk during winter and cut during spring' routine. Now when I did it for another year I noticed that a year later I still look about the same as I looked on the picture above a year ago. (I went up to 177lb slowly (aiming for 3-4lb/month gain and now almost back to 158lb (currently 161lb)). After doing it for two years it almost seems pointless to do bulk/cut routine. I generally eat healthy.

[Exercises]
I work out 5 days a week, I try to increase lifts and always start with the base compound movements (bench press, deadlifts, military press, and squats) and then do 'supplemental' exercises. I lift fair amounts of weights for my size. Bench press I can do ten reps with 225lb when I am 158-160lb. My strength goes slightly up during bulking and then goes back done to normal during cutting. I start with the heaviest weights (till failure) and then go down on all exercises.

[Supplements]
I don't do too many supplements: occasional multi, fish oil and pre-workout supplements.

I always wanted to be more of a 175-180lb defined guy rather than defined 160lb manlet, but I just can't seem to make progress. I look more like Zac Efron and I want to look more like Wolverine. Am I at my genetic limit? I would hate that to be the case.

Any suggestions are welcome.

[jgreystoke]

You are nowhere near your genetic limit, if you stop sabotaging your size gains. If I believed that sort of thing, I'd still be 130lbs.

You bench two plates x 10. That's really great at your size.

Do you squat three plates x 10?


Let's say that you are:

158 @ 8% = 145lbs lean + 13lbs fat mass.

Let's say you were:

187 @ 15% = 159lbs lean mass + 28lbs fat mass.

Maybe you should stop trying to get small(even tho' you are stronger than most small guys for bench).

15% is in the middle of the healthy male range for strength athletes(like a boxer "in shape" for a fight). If you gave yourself permission to get to:

200 @ 15% = 170lbs lean + 30lbs fat mass,

you'll be vastly more intimidating than you are at your light bodyweight. And you won't be fat, altho' that is what supplement catalogs(muscle magazines) want you to think. It is like the way women's mags(really beauty product catalogs) want women to feel inadequate so they will spend their lives buying useless sh!te.

If you had the good fortune to get to:

220 @ 15% = 187lbs lean mass + 33lbs fat mass,

you'd be as intimidating as Mike Tyson. A whopping 42lbs of extra muscle will do that. Ok, you'd have to train your neck, but that is a good thing.

Here is a great thread of Arnie. He is 12-15% in most of the pics. Even without a sixpack at 15%, he is really impressive because of muscular size. Meth addicts are leaner and have better sixpacks. And nobody is impressed. Arnie impressed everyone:

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...062891&page=22

Go through the entire thread and be inspired.

He only ever went down to around 9% to step on the Olympia stage. That is about the bottom end of the healthy male range.


So if you want size, stop starving yourself small. At least wait until people think you are one of the bouncers if you are standing outside a club. Or start asking "are you a weightlifter?". Or "what are you on?". What they won't ask, seriously, is "what is your BF?".

5 3 1 + the 5 3 1 Boring But Big assistance template for size will make you intimidating, if you stop sabotaging yourself. You should have no problem getting bigger than normal size manual workers/athletic guys your height who don't even lift.

5 3 1:

http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_..._pure_strength

5 3 1 Boring But Big Challenge:

http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_...onth_challenge

Black Iron Beast has a great 5 3 1 calculator. It helps you program you main lifts for over a dozen variations of 5 3 1:

http://blackironbeast.com/5/3/1/calculator

If you can't do it with the above, you can't do it because you won't let yourself do it.

Best of luck.

[magician27]

well you still need to bulk to make progress. instead of 4 lbs a month , gain 2lbs a month thats all you need especially as you get more advanced there is no point of doing 4-5 lbs a month bulks since your gain potential already gets smaller. i dont think you will hit your genetic ceiling in less 10-15 years, but gains definitely slow down past 3-4 years if you have done it right until that point. when you get advanced , try to optimize everything you do, your nutrition , training , exercise form,frequency , volume even start paying attention to meal frequency and stuff. also dont hesitate to carry some more bodyfat, maybe you wont look at your most aesthetic but you will feel stronger and have better endurance compare to low bodyfat and keep pushing hard , you should be mentally strong first to take it to next level, keep adding more weight to bar, try to play with weights that you never lifted, push harder further in terms of reps

[MEJ1990TM1]

If you are truly giving max effort, and still stalling, then mix up your rep scheme. I'm a big fan of 5x5 style stuff. I know some guys who have had good results with two warmup sets, and then a 5-3-1 scheme. It's more mental than it is physical. If you tell yourself, "I will do this no matter what.", then you will, or go into failure attempting. It really is a rare thing to see a guy who truly has that mentality. It doesn't happen over night, but eventually you will start living for that feeling like you are going to crap yourself, or damn near black out. Go ahead and laugh, but on heavy squats/DL I get light headed afterwards. Whatever you do don't sacrifice form for the sake of going heavier. You'll know you are going hard when you can only get 3-4 weeks of training in before you need to back off and take a deload week.

[koatliki]

Jgreystoke,

I squat 2 plates x 10, because I am a little too afraid for my back (injured my neck in Brazilian jiu-jitsu so I am scared of squats and dead lifts recently)

I should have taken a picture when I recently went up to 175-180lb, but generally I think I was flirting with 15% BF (if not higher). My general understanding is going above 15% BF is just asking for more fat. If I bulked to 200lb I don't even know what I would look like :-D And 220lb? I don't even dream of that.

By the way, I am not trying to get small and my goal is not necessarily to be intimidating, but be defined at a respectable weight (my girl likes my abs too ). I am not going to lie I may have to change my mindset: I feel like I am 'failing' when I am gaining weight and feel like I am making progress when I see my abs and veins pop out again. My ideal goal is kind of wolverine body not power lifter.

5 3 1 + the 5 3 1 Boring But Big assistance template for size will make you intimidating, if you stop sabotaging yourself. You should have no problem getting bigger than normal size manual workers/athletic guys your height who don't even lift.

I remember reading about this one couple of years ago and I think I will try it even though looks like I will need to do some math. Thank you and reps!

well you still need to bulk to make progress. instead of 4 lbs a month , gain 2lbs a month thats all you need especially as you get more advanced there is no point of doing 4-5 lbs a month bulks since your gain potential already gets smaller. i dont think you will hit your genetic ceiling in less 10-15 years, but gains definitely slow down past 3-4 years if you have done it right until that point. when you get advanced , try to optimize everything you do, your nutrition , training , exercise form,frequency , volume even start paying attention to meal frequency and stuff. also dont hesitate to carry some more bodyfat, maybe you wont look at your most aesthetic but you will feel stronger and have better endurance compare to low bodyfat and keep pushing hard , you should be mentally strong first to take it to next level, keep adding more weight to bar, try to play with weights that you never lifted, push harder further in terms of reps

Thank you, sir. I should definitely add more variety to my workout and my diet is definitely not dialed in: I focus too much on the overall calories and often don't consume enough proteinz. Reps.

If you are truly giving max effort, and still stalling, then mix up your rep scheme. I'm a big fan of 5x5 style stuff. I know some guys who have had good results with two warmup sets, and then a 5-3-1 scheme. It's more mental than it is physical. If you tell yourself, "I will do this no matter what.", then you will, or go into failure attempting. It really is a rare thing to see a guy who truly has that mentality. It doesn't happen over night, but eventually you will start living for that feeling like you are going to crap yourself, or damn near black out. Go ahead and laugh, but on heavy squats/DL I get light headed afterwards. Whatever you do don't sacrifice form for the sake of going heavier. You'll know you are going hard when you can only get 3-4 weeks of training in before you need to back off and take a deload week.

I will take another look at 5x5. To be honest, even though I think I lift hard I must not be anymore. I manage to work out in the gym 4-5 times a week during lunch and then have two jiu-jitsu (sometimes replaced by cardio) sessions a week too. I never feel like I need a rest week either. I guess I just need a fresh look at everything: I got too comfortable doing the same thing. My motivation is always good though: I love working out. Reps.

Thanks!

[morganmkm]

listen to everything Jgreystoke said


and youre nowhere near your genetic limit. Dont go to failure and get a program like 531 or something. If you really want to push yourself do smolov or smolov jr or sheiko