I Have Serious Problem with My Client About Fat Loss

[ZIKKIM]

Hi
One of my client is need to lose body fat. Her body is pear shape (wide hips).
Her stats/tanita is here: hoca tanita.JPG

Her nutrition :
Protein: 1,8-2,0 gr/kg(FFM)
Carb: 2.5 gr/kg(FFM)
Fat: 1gr/kg(FFM)

Her Training:
doing superset in weight training+cardio. 2 times per week (tue and thu). And she is doing 2 times pilates without me 2 times/week (mon and fri)

Blood Tests:
All normal


BUT!!!
She is looking gain fat and lose muscle and her total weight almost same!!!!!!
What is my mistake HELP PLEASEEEEEE!!!!

[WoofieNugget]

As soon as I saw that you are using a Tanita I completely disregarded anything else. But I can probably tell you your problem is that her diet sucks. no matter what she tells you she is likely lying and overeating.

[rdferguson]

Okay, I just added up her macro-nutrients, and that works out to be about 1,800kcal/day, which is pretty much right on target. And a total of 4 workouts per week sounds good. That being the case, here are some potential issues:

1) Compliance: Is she actually eating according to the plan? Is she actually doing the Pilates workouts when she's not with you?

2) Does she know that alcohol and other drinks contain calories? Does she account for this? (Note: a lot of people write off alcoholic calories because they aren't directly stored in the body, and the body immediately works to get rid of them. This is a flawed practice, for the same reasons that fasted cardio and the "fat burning zone" are flawed practices.)

3) How much energy is she burning in her workouts with you and her workouts without you? Obviously you can't know this with any degree of certainty (unless, perhaps, you're training her in an exercise scientist's lab). But consider the intensity of each workout and how much of her body she's using at any given time. Pilates uses the whole body, but it's at a fairly low intensity. An hour of Pilates probably isn't burning anywhere near as much energy as she burns with you. According to Fred Hatfield, at her weight, you could predict her to be burning energy at the following rate per minute based on heart rate:

100bpm = 4.5kcal/min
125bpm = 7.2kcal/min
150bpm = 9.9kcal/min
175bpm = 12.6kcal/min

These aren't absolute figures, and it's old research, so more recent research probably gives different numbers and accounts for more nuance, but they're still a useful guideline, if for no other reason than that they point to the relationship between body mass, intensity of exertion, duration, and calories burned.

4) Could you give an example of a workout with you? Supersets + cardio could mean mixing squats with lat pull downs and deadlifts with push ups, followed by half an hour of HIIT. Or it could mean mixing seated bicep curls with lying triceps extensions and leg extensions with leg curls, followed by half an hour of steady state cardio. Depending on her fitness level and various personal factors, the latter may be better for her, but the former would almost definitely burn more energy and have a higher total muscular stimulus, ultimately being more effective for body composition.

5) How long has she been doing this for, and what are her actual results in that time? You haven't told us how long you've been training her, or what changes there have been in her measurements. You generally wouldn't want her losing more than 2kg/month, and biompedence has an inaccuracy of about 3% when you do everything right, meaning that if someone's at 30% body fat, it'll say anywhere between 27-33% at the best of times. That also means that if the first time you measure it comes up at 27% (for a 30% individual), you might need to get their body fat down to 23% in order for it to show up as 26%, meaning that for a 1% difference in measurement, and actual 7% difference has taken place. If the right preparation hasn't been met (which is almost always the case), bioimpedence is even less accurate. Calipers, tape measures and photographs are more reliable measures of change.

If all of the above is going right, try reducing her calories by 100kcal/day (by reducing her CHO intake by 25g/day; or her fat intake by 11g/day; or finding a middle ground between those two). A greater shift in calories is not needed or wise. Make a small adjustment and see what happens. If she starts losing fat, great. If after a couple weeks she hasn't started losing fat, knock off another 100kcal or get her doing another intense workout during the week.

[Jhertilus]

Hi
One of my client is need to lose body fat. Her body is pear shape (wide hips).
Her stats/tanita is here: Attachment 6795503

Her nutrition :
Protein: 1,8-2,0 gr/kg(FFM)
Carb: 2.5 gr/kg(FFM)
Fat: 1gr/kg(FFM)

Her Training:
doing superset in weight training+cardio. 2 times per week (tue and thu). And she is doing 2 times pilates without me 2 times/week (mon and fri)

Blood Tests:
All normal


BUT!!!
She is looking gain fat and lose muscle and her total weight almost same!!!!!!
What is my mistake HELP PLEASEEEEEE!!!!

Zone Diet Dude
Calories 1320/day
Carbs 132g/day
Protein 99g/day
Fat 44g/day (mainly from cooking oils and nuts)
-Make sure her water is 8 cups or more
-at least 1 cup of green tea a day w/ a tbsp of apple cider vinegar
-cinnamon on everything
-cayenne pepper wherever applicable

Guaranteed in 3 weeks she'll drop

[SerpentHearted]

Zone Diet Dude
Calories 1320/day
Carbs 132g/day
Protein 99g/day
Fat 44g/day (mainly from cooking oils and nuts)
-Make sure her water is 8 cups or more
-at least 1 cup of green tea a day w/ a tbsp of apple cider vinegar
-cinnamon on everything
-cayenne pepper wherever applicable

Guaranteed in 3 weeks she'll drop

tempted to neg.

[rdferguson]

Zone Diet Dude
Calories 1320/day
Carbs 132g/day
Protein 99g/day
Fat 44g/day (mainly from cooking oils and nuts)
-Make sure her water is 8 cups or more
-at least 1 cup of green tea a day w/ a tbsp of apple cider vinegar
-cinnamon on everything
-cayenne pepper wherever applicable

Guaranteed in 3 weeks she'll drop

[ZIKKIM]

Okay, I just added up her macro-nutrients, and that works out to be about 1,800kcal/day, which is pretty much right on target. And a total of 4 workouts per week sounds good. That being the case, here are some potential issues:

1) Compliance: Is she actually eating according to the plan? Is she actually doing the Pilates workouts when she's not with you?

2) ........

Helloo

1) , 2) Yes she doing plates im sure and she say “i dont drink alcohol” before we start but i dont know How can i ask her: “are you tell me the truth ?” She is professor and 44 years old

3) OK

4) Example:
Chest+Back, Legs+Shoulder or Hams+Calf etc. Im using dumbbells and compound movements
But, last session, i try this circuit kind training:
8-10sets x 15-20reps (below her 20rm)
Dum Bench + Dum Row + Dum Squat + Standing Dum Shoulder Press no rest or 20sec rest and start again.

5) we start 2-3 months ago.
01.23.2014: Her bf: % 32,1 Impedance: 463
02.12.2014: Her bf: % 31,6 Impedance: 436
03.08.2014: Her bf: % 32,9 Impedance: 474 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
03.12.2014: Her bf: % 31,8 Impedance: 450
03.24.2014: Her bf: % 30,8 Impedance: 425
04.04.2014: Her bf: % 31.3 Impedance: 430
MEASUREMENTS:
She is looking GAIN size from her legs, hips, and arms. LOSE from waist

Am i bad trainer ?

NOTE: @ WoofieNugget @Jhertilus @SerpentHearted Thanks for all guys

[WoofieNugget]

Depends - is she actually following her eating plan or just telling you she is? Odds are she isn't and for some reason you're blaming yourself. First of all, stop doing that because it is her choice to not eat properly and secondly, make sure she knows that if she isn't getting results, a large part of it is on her for not eating well. Just cutting out drinking isn't going to cut it.

Also, how often do you see her? Is she exercising on her own? Even if you see her 3 times a week she likely needs another 1-2 to really see results, and the fact she hasn't budged in three months means she either isn't putting forth an effort and/or is eating like crap or there is something else going on. What she is doing for workouts likely has little to do with it.

[PeteratCastle]

What else does she do outside the workouts? Is she just sedentary?
What's her hydration like? How much does she drink and what does she drink to stay hydrated? I once had a client tell me she drank 5 glasses of orange juice per day to stay hydrated.

How has her bodyshape changed? Do you have before and after pics and can you see a change on them? I find before and after pics much more useful to determine whether my client is moving in the right direction. (Don't post them on here obv.)

[Jhertilus]

tempted to neg.

Calories calculated using the The Katch-McArdle Formula (based on lean body mass) + 20% for her activity level
Macros follow the zone plan - 40/30/30
Water, green tea, cinnamon, and cayenne pepper are all natural and not harmful.
All bloodwork normal, so she's otherwise healthy
No specific food suggestions, just a framework

What's so negative?

[jay96sportster]

tempted to neg.

I was thinking the same thing

[jay96sportster]

Calories calculated using the The Katch-McArdle Formula (based on lean body mass) + 20% for her activity level
Macros follow the zone plan - 40/30/30
Water, green tea, cinnamon, and cayenne pepper are all natural and not harmful.
All bloodwork normal, so she's otherwise healthy
No specific food suggestions, just a framework

What's so negative?

1320 sounds low.

[coolguy7414]

Helloo

1) , 2) Yes she doing plates im sure and she say “i dont drink alcohol” before we start but i dont know How can i ask her: “are you tell me the truth ?” She is professor and 44 years old

3) OK

4) Example:
Chest+Back, Legs+Shoulder or Hams+Calf etc. Im using dumbbells and compound movements
But, last session, i try this circuit kind training:
8-10sets x 15-20reps (below her 20rm)
Dum Bench + Dum Row + Dum Squat + Standing Dum Shoulder Press no rest or 20sec rest and start again.

5) we start 2-3 months ago.
01.23.2014: Her bf: % 32,1 Impedance: 463
02.12.2014: Her bf: % 31,6 Impedance: 436
03.08.2014: Her bf: % 32,9 Impedance: 474 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
03.12.2014: Her bf: % 31,8 Impedance: 450
03.24.2014: Her bf: % 30,8 Impedance: 425
04.04.2014: Her bf: % 31.3 Impedance: 430
MEASUREMENTS:
She is looking GAIN size from her legs, hips, and arms. LOSE from waist

Am i bad trainer ?

NOTE: @ WoofieNugget @Jhertilus @SerpentHearted Thanks for all guys

To ask her you say r u weighing and tracking ur food correctly either way as long as she is paying who cares I used to scam people on craigslist by being there personal trainer I had them doing quick pointless workouts so I could go back home it was quick money.

[jay96sportster]

To ask her you say r u weighing and tracking ur food correctly either way as long as she is paying who cares I used to scam people on craigslist by being there personal trainer I had them doing quick pointless workouts so I could go back home it was quick money.

That's nice

[PerFit]

I can assure you shes not eating correctly.

She may be being untruthful to you or simply unaware of what she is eat.

Get her to take a picture of EVERYTHING she eats and drinks and send it to you.

[rdferguson]

Helloo

1) , 2) Yes she doing plates im sure and she say “i dont drink alcohol” before we start but i dont know How can i ask her: “are you tell me the truth ?” She is professor and 44 years old

3) OK

4) Example:
Chest+Back, Legs+Shoulder or Hams+Calf etc. Im using dumbbells and compound movements
But, last session, i try this circuit kind training:
8-10sets x 15-20reps (below her 20rm)
Dum Bench + Dum Row + Dum Squat + Standing Dum Shoulder Press no rest or 20sec rest and start again.

5) we start 2-3 months ago.
01.23.2014: Her bf: % 32,1 Impedance: 463
02.12.2014: Her bf: % 31,6 Impedance: 436
03.08.2014: Her bf: % 32,9 Impedance: 474 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
03.12.2014: Her bf: % 31,8 Impedance: 450
03.24.2014: Her bf: % 30,8 Impedance: 425
04.04.2014: Her bf: % 31.3 Impedance: 430
MEASUREMENTS:
She is looking GAIN size from her legs, hips, and arms. LOSE from waist

Am i bad trainer ?

NOTE: @ WoofieNugget @Jhertilus @SerpentHearted Thanks for all guys

Do you mean to say that her legs, hips and arms are bigger, while her waist is smaller? Because, if so, that would be a sign of changes in body composition.

[ZIKKIM]

Helloo againnn :=)
Yesterday we talk about nutrition and "i think" she belive this nutrition program too much for her. She is biology professor and she want to say, "this nutrition prog. can be too much for womans (protein amount etc.)" But i cant make believe her.

Im tooo dispirited

IMPORTANT NOTE:
Sorry for my bad English

THANKS all for help I am grateful

[BC02]

if you arent going heavy enough and always supersetting, the supersetting may have the same results as cardio resulting in her not losing fat or adding muscle. I say try to go heavier and make sure her diets in check

[foodandfitness]

Easy solution OP. Have her download the dietsnaps app or meal logger app if she has android.

Look at the pics of what she's eating. She won't be able to miss estimate pics. This has worked wonders for my hard to help clients.

[Mikexherman]

To ask her you say r u weighing and tracking ur food correctly either way as long as she is paying who cares I used to scam people on craigslist by being there personal trainer I had them doing quick pointless workouts so I could go back home it was quick money.

Publicly admitting to being a huge douche. How nice.

[Ronin4help]

As soon as I saw that you are using a Tanita I completely disregarded anything else. But I can probably tell you your problem is that her diet sucks. no matter what she tells you she is likely lying and overeating.

This happens more than young, sincere, trainers realize. Clients misrepresent their diets all the time. Nothing can be their fault, it has to be the sole responsibility of the trainer. When the client lies, it is very difficult to pinpoint the real problem.

[MattPercy1991]

I can assure you shes not eating correctly.

She may be being untruthful to you or simply unaware of what she is eat.

Get her to take a picture of EVERYTHING she eats and drinks and send it to you.

Was pretty much going to say this. Have her do something like write you out a food diary each day and tell her to be 100% with it, any little food or drink throughout the day write it down. That way you can check that she is in fact hitting her targets and not either going over them due to just overeating or just estimating badly. From what you've said it doesn't sound like you're doing anything wrong on your end buddy.

[ZIKKIM]

OK THANKS all for help guys. I am grateful

[SouljaJoe010]

Zone Diet Dude
Calories 1320/day
Carbs 132g/day
Protein 99g/day
Fat 44g/day (mainly from cooking oils and nuts)
-Make sure her water is 8 cups or more
-at least 1 cup of green tea a day w/ a tbsp of apple cider vinegar
-cinnamon on everything
-cayenne pepper wherever applicable

Guaranteed in 3 weeks she'll drop

What the hell is this. ....

[TrendingUpward]

educate her more about nutrition. a person that has that body stats doesn't know much about healthy eating. be her mentor and trainer at the same time.

[Kalidane]

I was thinking the same thing

It was my first thought.



You're dealing with a pile of psychology here so it could be tough. Reverse the approach with the client.

Instead of telling her to eat to these macro and caloric targets, ask her to spend the next 2 weeks just keeping an accurate food diary. How much and what. Everything weighed/measured. Even drinks.

Don't use those stupid fancy scales again. Ever. God I hate those things. ****ing impedance lol. Have her buy a tape measure and measure herself at home. Thighs, waist, chest, biceps. Calves if you think she cares. Have her record those things BUT not tell you. The objective is to get an accurate record. No shame/guilt/whatever. She measures and records. She can make a private record of weight if she wants. You don't need it today. A few bathroom selfies for _her_ record also.


If lucky, her 2 week record will highlight something. Any kind of clue.

She will feel more empowered and in control because she isn't reporting to the "teacher" every day or two and will hopefully be honest.


Many weeks from now, she might be very happy to get out the tape measure again and tell you the numbers, plus what they are now...

[jay96sportster]

It was my first thought.



You're dealing with a pile of psychology here so it could be tough. Reverse the approach with the client.

Instead of telling her to eat to these macro and caloric targets, ask her to spend the next 2 weeks just keeping an accurate food diary. How much and what. Everything weighed/measured. Even drinks.

Don't use those stupid fancy scales again. Ever. God I hate those things. ****ing impedance lol. Have her buy a tape measure and measure herself at home. Thighs, waist, chest, biceps. Calves if you think she cares. Have her record those things BUT not tell you. The objective is to get an accurate record. No shame/guilt/whatever. She measures and records. She can make a private record of weight if she wants. You don't need it today. A few bathroom selfies for _her_ record also.


If lucky, her 2 week record will highlight something. Any kind of clue.

She will feel more empowered and in control because she isn't reporting to the "teacher" every day or two and will hopefully be honest.


Many weeks from now, she might be very happy to get out the tape measure again and tell you the numbers, plus what they are now...

I like your way of thinking.