Feedback on Madcow/Bill Starr Intermediate 5x5

[ProgressIsGood]

Hey guys, after doing Texas Method for some time, I feel like I'm stuck in all of my lifts even after resetting.

I would like to hear some feedback from people have done Madcow, how did all of their lifts improve. It would help if you write the time frame, your starting lift numbers (Squats, Bench and Deadlifts) and your finishing lift numbers.

Thanks in advance...

[rjm522]

OP - I have run Madcow three times for about 4 months each time. I made progress on it and would recommend it to anyone. I started off with Rippetoes Starting Strength and then moved over to Madcow. I think ending numbers are meaningless since everyone is different. I made solid progress and many others on this board have also. It is a good, solid program to run.....you won't go wrong if you decide to try it out.

I switched off of Madcow about seven months ago in favor of Wendlers 531. This program suits my needs better and I plan on running it for the foreseeable future. It is *very* flexible and I like lifting four times a week.

I would run Madcow for at least four months and then reevaluate your progress. At your age just about any program you run consistently will pay off. Don't over estimate your true max poundages, set up an Excel sheet for the percentages and stick with it. Eat enough real food, sleep and prosper.

Good luck.

[ProgressIsGood]

OP - I have run Madcow three times for about 4 months each time. I made progress on it and would recommend it to anyone. I started off with Rippetoes Starting Strength and then moved over to Madcow. I think ending numbers are meaningless since everyone is different. I made solid progress and many others on this board have also. It is a good, solid program to run.....you won't go wrong if you decide to try it out.

I switched off of Madcow about seven months ago in favor of Wendlers 531. This program suits my needs better and I plan on running it for the foreseeable future. It is *very* flexible and I like lifting four times a week.

I would run Madcow for at least four months and then reevaluate your progress. At your age just about any program you run consistently will pay off. Don't over estimate your true max poundages, set up an Excel sheet for the percentages and stick with it. Eat enough real food, sleep and prosper.

Good luck.

Yeah I once ran it and used a too heavy of a max, probably the reason I stalled. This time I will even use a max of 5lbs lighter.

[stumpy06]

How did you run the Texas Method? I am just curious. Did you do the standard three days a week? Did you throw in an assistance day? Did you rotate Intensity and speed days? Did you go to a 4 day Upper Body/Lower Body split for volume and intensity days?

[ProgressIsGood]

How did you run the Texas Method? I am just curious. Did you do the standard three days a week? Did you throw in an assistance day? Did you rotate Intensity and speed days? Did you go to a 4 day Upper Body/Lower Body split for volume and intensity days?

I just did the standard three days a week. The assistance I did are pullups and rows, I did them texas method style as well, and it worked very well. I can do pullups now with 110lbs added (and I weigh 185lbs) for 3 reps. I also added curls.
This template seemed to work well in all lifts, but I just can't seem to progress now even after resseting.
Even my bench press which is something I suck it, is now at a 1 rep max of 250lbs which is not that shabby considering my previous history with this lift.

[justroberson]

There's a ton of stuff you could be doing wrong with the TM that's causing the stalling (VD and ID too close, too much volume on VD, etc). There's also a bunch of tweaks you can do to it to get going again (cycling rep ranges on ID, lower volume on VD, switching it to a 4 day split, etc.) Check out the new 3rd edition of Practical Programming if you haven't, it goes into serious depth as to how to run TM for a really long time.

As to Madcow, i've tried it before (admittedly on a deficit) and i think it sucks. I hate the ramping sets, you're crapped out by the top set that is supposed to be a PR. And i think it's too rigid and tough to keep progressing on (you're supposed to hit a PR triple and then do it for a set of five 3 days later?). TM is far superior.

[xRequiem]

Madcow > TM

Ran TM much longer tried all the different ways to spur progress. Madcow is simply effective. It works, no over thinking.

[trancebreak]

Madcow was great. Added 88lb to my Squat, 40ish lb to my Bench and 100ish on my Deadlift. Time frame was 9 months. Could've been less but I decided to run a few weeks on a deficit so that kinda slowed me down.

I'm on TM atm, really believe that the next step after beginner programming should be Madcow THEN Texas Method. Because on MC you're still hitting PR's twice a week compared to TM where you're getting the Friday PR

[Dawes]

Madcow I hit 385/265/440 @ 140bw for my first meet.
I got injured in July last year and have been set back a lot, but I'm re running it now and have just got back to where I was and I reckon I can hit 420/275/475 by the end of may.

Very easy program to progress on.

[StrongmanSteve]

I've been running madcow on and off for years. I've had a bad habit of inconsistency. The best gains I made on it I increased my 5rm squat by 100lbs, dead by 80, bench by 40, and ohp by 40 in 10 weeks. But my bodyweight also went from 185 to 205. Now I'm looking to total 1400 at 175 at my first meet, all gains made from madcow.

[ProgressIsGood]

I've been running madcow on and off for years. I've had a bad habit of inconsistency. The best gains I made on it I increased my 5rm squat by 100lbs, dead by 80, bench by 40, and ohp by 40 in 10 weeks. But my bodyweight also went from 185 to 205. Now I'm looking to total 1400 at 175 at my first meet, all gains made from madcow.

When you did it, did you make sure to start with a light weight and work your way up?
Also when you got stuck, did you start the entire program over, or did you just go back a few weeks?

[Filmbuff81]

When you did it, did you make sure to start with a light weight and work your way up?
Also when you got stuck, did you start the entire program over, or did you just go back a few weeks?

When a lift stalls you reset so you break that new RM in week 5.

That's essentially starting over. But only do it for the struggling lift not all of them if the others continue to progress.


As for starting light you can choose to break rep maxes later than week 5 if you want to. But generally 4 weeks of building up steam is enough.

[Link815]

Intermediate 5x5 is great for squat, I hit a new 5 rep PR today at 530x5 in sleeves. I'm still making progress on it. I use intermediate just to slowly build up and get acclimated to the 5x5, then I use advanced to peak my squat when I need to.

[ProgressIsGood]

Intermediate 5x5 is great for squat, I hit a new 5 rep PR today at 530x5 in sleeves. I'm still making progress on it. I use intermediate just to slowly build up and get acclimated to the 5x5, then I use advanced to peak my squat when I need to.

What about the Bench press, how was your success with that?

[Filmbuff81]

Intermediate 5x5 is great for squat, I hit a new 5 rep PR today at 530x5 in sleeves. I'm still making progress on it. I use intermediate just to slowly build up and get acclimated to the 5x5, then I use advanced to peak my squat when I need to.

Do you transition into heavy singles near a meet or do you just do advanced as is and wait until meet day for singles?

[Link815]

What about the Bench press, how was your success with that?

I don't think it has enough volume at higher percents for bench. I think it would work fine for a true beginner/intermediate lifter, but it progresses too quickly to maintain it for long if you start with a big bench (I probably had a ~455 squat and 405 bench when I started using it) I have used advanced on bench though and that has more volume at higher percents and was still able to make some progress.

[Link815]

Do you transition into heavy singles near a meet or do you just do advanced as is and wait until meet day for singles?

For advanced I usually give myself about 3 weeks of 2x a week doing heavy doubles and singles before a meet. I do ~90% percent of my training in sleeves, but I compete in wraps, so I use those last few weeks to give myself some time to get used to the heavier weight and the wraps again.

If I'm feeling up for it, I'll do a set 10% heavier than my last on some weeks throughout the cycle just to try to stay used to wraps. Right now I'm doing intermediate 5x5, but I do an extra triple in wraps after the heavy triple on Friday's squat session if I feel up for it.

[IronOynx]

Texas method/bill starr took my bench from 360 to 405+ i probably can hit 440 now. Mind you i started using it in 2013. It worked very very well for my bench.