Ukraine's Lesson for Israel: 'US Guarantee Worthless'

[AE793x]

yes, clearly jewish culture is only 70 years old mang. das it mang. loading my neg cannons mang. sounding like a retard mang. time for red mang. btw not christian mang. i guess there went your theory mang. das it mang.

lol. Do you even misc? Das not it mang. Lol thats why the Jews have been thriving for the past 3700 years right? Oh wait, they haven't. There goes your 'superior culture' theory. Would agree with a superior contemporary social culture, to say superior culture aka 3000 years + is fkn stupid.

[clocksnmirrors]

If obama bent over for Putin, he will go down history as a laughing stock. Palin is now vindicated.

This will haunt the Democrats in every election. The voters will be reminded about this. Democrats are weaklings that invite aggression and earn contempt from our enemy.

911 happened on bush's watch
it was the most aggressive attack on america since pearl harbor
bush is a republican

[PLZGO]

Grow up. This isn't child play.

Read post # 7 , #10, and then read op.

ok, i read your posts, and then the op. now it's your turn. read point 6 of the budapest memorandum, and tell me what action it authorizes the usa to undertake.

[DocHol1day]

lol. Do you even misc? Das not it mang. Lol thats why the Jews have been thriving for the past 3700 years right? Oh wait, they haven't. There goes your 'superior culture' theory. Would agree with a superior contemporary culture, to say superior culture aka 3000 years + is fkn stupid.

even without a state jews thrived mang. rothschild banking mang. do you even misc mang. sound like a retard mang. bout to be negged if you keep replying like a moron mang. das it mang. das it mang. das it mang. das it mang.

[gachase21]

so what is your suggestion. Build up military presence in Ukraine 'just to intimidate'? What if it leads to conflict? You want the US/NATO to go to war against Russia? Im all ears.

I'd start with an immediate build up of strategic ballistic missile defense systems in Europe.(as a show of force more than anything) this has been a touchy US/Russia subject

Provide arms, munitions, supplies to the Ukraine for now

Deploy additional Naval assets to the area

Freeze certain assets and visa's

Work on the diplomatic side of coalition of nations that will be supporting them

Move more troops and armament to strategic area's of Europe to show are ability and willingness if needed.

This to begin with, more possibly later

Don't count Obama out yet, he could still come through here.

[Tekkendo]

so what is your suggestion. Build up military presence in Ukraine 'just to intimidate'? What if it leads to conflict? You want the US/NATO to go to war against Russia? Im all ears.

Announce that we will provide fuel and other logistics, intelligence, anti armor, anti air weapons to Ukraine in the event of Russian invasion. Full economic sanction, trade embargo, freeze all personal assets of Putin and his cabinet, until all Russian troops withdraw from Crimea.

[AE793x]

even without a state jews thrived mang. rothschild banking mang. do you even misc mang. sound like a retard mang. bout to be negged if you keep replying like a moron mang. das it mang. das it mang. das it mang. das it mang.

lold. Das not it mang, das not it. Rotschild banking 3000 year old mang? Das not it mang? Jewish banking Time Machine mang? Strong superior stateless culture mang. That would make it religion not culture mang. Don't give a chit about your stupid negs mang. Look mang its a hood thang mang. Umad?

[DocHol1day]

lold. Das not it mang, das not it. Rotschild banking 3000 year old mang? Das not it mang? Jewish banking Time Machine mang? Strong superior stateless culture mang. That would make it religion not culture mang. Don't give a chit about your stupid negs mang. Look mang its a hood thang mang. Umad?

so muslims have had a state for their entire existence? christians? no, none have. irrelevant retarded point is irrelevant and retarded. though i've come to expect that from the pally cock suckers.


youre obviously too immature to actually have a conversation, mang


and no matter what you say, that IS it, mang.

feel free to have the last word now boy, i'm allowing it.

[AE793x]

I'd start with an immediate build up of strategic ballistic missile defense systems in Europe.(as a show of force more than anything) this has been a touchy US/Russia subject

Provide arms, munitions, supplies to the Ukraine for now

Deploy additional Naval assets to the area

Freeze certain assets and visa's

Work on the diplomatic side of coalition of nations that will be supporting them

Move more troops and armament to strategic area's of Europe to show are ability and willingness if needed.

This to begin with, more possibly later

Don't count Obama out yet, he could still come through here.

What is the exact use of a ballistic missile system in this case, they've had those for years.

Provide it to exactly who in Ukraine. Russia will do the same in that case, you want to spark a bloody civil war?

Freeze assets, don't think Putin will care much. Chump change/hidden foreign accounts.

What exactly will strategic troops in Europe do to help Ukraine?

Strong solutions we have here.

Announce that we will provide fuel and other logistics, intelligence, anti armor, anti air weapons to Ukraine in the event of Russian invasion. Full economic sanction, trade embargo, freeze all personal assets of Putin and his cabinet, until all Russian troops withdraw from Crimea.

And now lets hypothetically assume Putin ignores this and seeks annexation of Crimea, what do?

[clocksnmirrors]

Democrats are weaklings that invite aggression and earn contempt from our enemy.

911 happened on bush's watch
it was the most aggressive attack on america since pearl harbor
bush is a republican

pls respond

[gachase21]

What is the exact use of a ballistic missile system in this case, they've had those for years.

It would be a political move more than anything. It is the missile defense systems I'm talking about here. Russia has been pushing for us to reduce and remove them. It has been a hot point since we withdrew from the abm treaty in 2002.

It was also the same topic that Obama got caught on a mic promising more room after the election to the Russians.

Provide it to exactly who in Ukraine. Russia will do the same in that case, you want to spark a bloody civil war?

I want to stop Russia's aggression by showing we will support our commitment. More force could actually equal less fighting if done correctly.

Freeze assets, don't think Putin will care much. Chump change/hidden foreign accounts.

Again, political move to show we aren't going to sit here and do nothing

What exactly will strategic troops in Europe do to help Ukraine?

It could possible slow the escalation as Russia sees we are more serious that they thought at first.

Strong solutions we have here.

By far not the best solutions. The problem is our reputation is now very weak from the start. If our defense and reputation were strong enough, Russia probably never would have gone in. Our weakness allows for more deaths and fighting.

[kratosbrah]

Well, the Israeli's have a point. I do hope the Japanese are watching intently. You just can't depend on America anymore, or at least as long as we have clowns like Kerry and Obama running the show.

[gachase21]

911 happened on bush's watch
it was the most aggressive attack on america since pearl harbor
bush is a republican

pls respond

we could go back and forth all day about what event was really who's fault

This polarization of political sides in the US going into foreign affairs is a weakness of the US. There was a time we once said "politics stop at the waters edge"

Recently the republicans not backing up Obama on his intention to strike Syria probably caused us to be weaker. Had he followed though with that it would have shown as a nation we still are a threat despite our political differences stateside. Much the same of the democrats not fully supporting Bush on foreign events that Obama would have acted the same way on.


anyway, lets be cereal, 911 was pretty much all Clinton's fault.

[AE793x]

It would be a political move more than anything. It is the missile defense systems I'm talking about here. Russia has been pushing for us to reduce and remove them. It has been a hot point since we withdrew from the abm treaty in 2002.

It was also the same topic that Obama got caught on a mic promising more room after the election to the Russians.



I want to stop Russia's aggression by showing we will support our commitment. More force could actually equal less fighting if done correctly.


Again, political move to show we aren't going to sit here and do nothing


It could possible slow the escalation as Russia sees we are more serious that they thought at first.


By far not the best solutions. The problem is our reputation is now very weak from the start. If our defense and reputation were strong enough, Russia probably never would have gone in. Our weakness allows for more deaths and fighting.

They've been in place for a long time and Russia has already countered them with Iskandar/S class missile defence system/put some in Kaliningrad. Again, what exactly does a missile defence system do to help Ukraine?

Now many Crimean's will want annexation, providing a bunch of guns doesn't show much support and is yet rather dangerous in such a volatile situation. Whatever you do, Russia will do the same to its own supporters in Ukraine, it achieves nothing.

Political move that achieves nothing. Freezing a bunch of assets will do nothing major to Russia and will hurt the fragile US economy. Russia isn't Saudi Arabia, majority their assets aren't stored in US banks/bonds etc. It is the equivalent of doing nothing.

Russia has no desire or pretext to claim anything else in Europe for now, it wants Ukraine, tell me what soldiers in Poland, Baltics and and Romania will do to help Ukraine if you are not willing to head into a conflict with Russia.

Heres the thing, it has nothing to do with your reputation or defence. You outspend the world on 'defence' (defence in Ukraine lol), you've got more bases abroad/started more wars than i've had breakfasts. It has nothing to do with American weakness, you seem to hold the belief that unless the US is capable to destroy every living being/government on this planet it is 'weak'. The US is just another player, Asia, Russia are reawakening. Its just such a us-centrist view to view any scenario where the US cannot enforce its will as weakness.

[anonymous]

911 happened on bush's watch
it was the most aggressive attack on america since pearl harbor
bush is a republican

pls respond

And the US killed tens , maybe hundreds of thousands of Muslims in response to the Saudi terrorists attack over the last 12 years. So, lesson learned, mess with a bush and Muslim countries thousands of miles away are destroyed for decades to come.

[gachase21]

They've been in place for a long time and Russia has already countered them with Iskandar/S class missile defence system/put some in Kaliningrad. Again, what exactly does a missile defence system do to help Ukraine?

Now many Crimean's will want annexation, providing a bunch of guns doesn't show much support and is yet rather dangerous in such a volatile situation. Whatever you do, Russia will do the same to its own supporters in Ukraine, it achieves nothing.

Political move that achieves nothing. Freezing a bunch of assets will do nothing major to Russia and will hurt the fragile US economy. Russia isn't Saudi Arabia, majority their assets aren't stored in US banks/bonds etc. It is the equivalent of doing nothing.

Russia has no desire or pretext to claim anything else in Europe for now, it wants Ukraine, tell me what soldiers in Poland, Baltics and and Romania will do to help Ukraine if you are not willing to head into a conflict with Russia.

Heres the thing, it has nothing to do with your reputation or defence. You outspend the world on 'defence' (defence in Ukraine lol), you've got more bases abroad/started more wars than i've had breakfasts. It has nothing to do with American weakness, you seem to hold the belief that unless the US is capable to destroy every living being/government on this planet it is 'weak'. The US is just another player, Asia, Russia are reawakening. Its just such a us-centrist view to view any scenario where the US cannot enforce its will as weakness.

We will just fundamentally disagree on this then

[JFizzle23]

What part of avoiding WW3 don't you *******s understand?

smfh

[MajesticLion]

This is what the US undertook to do:

The Russian Federation, the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and the United States of America reaffirm their commitment to seek immediate United Nations Security Council action to provide assistance to Ukraine, as a non-nuclear-weapon State party to the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons, if Ukraine should become a victim of an act of aggression or an object of a threat of aggression in which nuclear weapons are used;

http://www.cfr.org/arms-control-disa...es-1994/p32484

Okay then.

[Tekkendo]

What part of avoiding WW3 don't you *******s understand?

smfh

As Reagan said, if you want peace that badly, there is one sure guaranteed way to get it and get it now. You can surrender.

[Tekkendo]

And now lets hypothetically assume Putin ignores this and seeks annexation of Crimea, what do?

Build up missile defence in Europe. Strengthen NATO. Build US bases in Poland, Ukraine, Georgia, the Baltic states. Trade embargo against Russia will wreck their economy the same way it did to Iran. Freeze Putin and his cronies' assets in Europe. Deny them visa to travel. Generally make it unpleasant and costly to them personally that Crimea is not worth the trouble.

[JFizzle23]

Build up missile defence in Europe. Strengthen NATO. Build US bases in Poland, Ukraine, Georgia, the Baltic states. Trade embargo against Russia will wreck their economy the same way it did to Iran. Freeze Putin and his cronies' assets in Europe. Deny them visa to travel. Generally make it unpleasant and costly to them personally that Crimea is not worth the trouble.

not sheriff srs or trolling and I'm afraid to find out...

[Tekkendo]

911 happened on bush's watch
it was the most aggressive attack on america since pearl harbor
bush is a republican

Check the list and see how your islamists liking it in hell and in US prisons.

http://www.globalpost.com/dispatch/n...r-arrested-911

[ZenBowman]

The real lesson here is that Israel should never give up it's nukes.

Agreed. If anything, they should ramp up production and testing of nuclear arms.

[gachase21]

not sheriff srs or trolling and I'm afraid to find out...

I know you posted in the other thread I made, Take time to read each post in that thread and I think you can fully understand where we are coming from here. We may disagree, however this is a very serious situation IMO. And no, we don't want WW3.

[Tekkendo]

not sheriff srs or trolling and I'm afraid to find out...

You can always run to blow Putin and beg for mercy.

[theghostofbeta]

You can always run to blow Putin and beg for mercy.

Putin knows he's checked. For some reason which is beyond contemporary foreign policy you think he has the upper-hand. Obama and his administration is vastly more clever than you perceive, you would likely see Putin stop in his initiatives in the upcoming months. But of course don't lose the chance for some cheap political shots!

[clocksnmirrors]

Check the list and see how your islamists liking it in hell and in US prisons.

http://www.globalpost.com/dispatch/n...r-arrested-911

a fine response after the fact

but your republican president was no deterrent to the act itself

edit: i'll remind you of your comment that democratic weakness invites aggression.
how then did these aggressors dare to attack with a republican at the helm

[EGamComp]

a fine response after the fact

but your republican president was no deterrent to the act itself

Wot


Even if Bush would've lost the election, 9/11 would still have occurred. Pre-9/11 security was pretty bad because there was no reason to up security.

Don't tell me another president would have prevented such an attack.

Bush's response to 9/11 reflect on him as a president, not the fact that it happened.

So unless Democrats at the time had an agenda to increase airport security, why the hell are you blaming Bush for 9/11? (Well at least you're not a truther)

[clocksnmirrors]

Don't tell me another president would have prevented such an attack.

i refer you to this comment:

Democrats are weaklings that invite aggression and earn contempt from our enemy.

if 911 had happened under obama, the sentiment expressed above would be the prevailing discourse among republicans.

it would have been a festival of blaming obama.

it's a hypothetical statement. disagree all you want. i believe there is strong evidence to support it.


but

since 911 happened under bush, the discourse is "well he did a good job of cleaning it up"


obama can do no right
bush can do no wrong



no matter what the facts

that's all i wanted to point out.
i don't expect agreement. i just needed to see it said in this forum.

[Liff_Wates]

i refer you to this comment:


if 911 had happened under obama, the sentiment expressed above would be the prevailing discourse among republicans.

it would have been a festival of blaming obama.

it's a hypothetical statement. disagree all you want. i believe there is strong evidence to support it.


but

since 911 happened under bush, the discourse is "well he did a good job of cleaning it up"


obama can do no right
bush can do no wrong



no matter what the facts

that's all i wanted to point out.
i don't expect agreement. i just needed to see it said in this forum.

So you think SUICIDE BOMBERS will be dissuaded by potential retaliation? Full potato.