Bulk or cut?

[fred2367]

I was skinny fat at the end of last summer and have been lifting consistently since then, I'm at 5'11 and about 165. I DO NOT want to look like a bodybuilder. I'm more interested in getting a physique that is more functional. I'm not trying to troll you guys by asking if a 165 pound guy should bulk or cut. I know most of you are into being as big and lean as possible, but please understand that this is not my goal. My goal physique is one of these:



or




and here is me:



I am stuck at a crossroads. I don't think I have enough muscle to do a cut and look decent, and I think if I go too heavy on my bulk I will put even more fat on. I have a bit of fat covering my chest and abs and I don't want to add much more. Thoughts on best course of action if your goal was one of the physiques above.

[Amirecan]

i cant really tell from your pic too well but id bulk bro and then when you get to a pretty good size as of muscle mass then cut

[selffirst]

If I were you, I'd clean bulk and lift like a beast. This way your fat levels will drop and muscle would be added over time...All the best.

[fred2367]

If I were you, I'd clean bulk and lift like a beast. This way your fat levels will drop and muscle would be added over time...All the best.

Okay. I am at 500 calories over maintenance. A typical day would be something like this:

Meal 1: 2 cups skim milk, large banana, cup and half oats, 2 tsp peanut butter
Meal 2 : Baked Chicken, Sweet potato.
Meal 3: 2 cups skim milk, large banana, cup and half oats, 2 tsp peanut butter ( whey protein added if this meal falls after a workout )
Meal 4: Pasta
Meal 5: Greek yogurt, half cup 2 percent cottage cheese with fruit and peanut butter

Nothing too crazy. About 2500 calories. I have already gained some weight and it looks like I've leaned up a bit in the process too. Keep calories same or bump it up? Maybe even decrease it? Since I'm reaping the benefits of noob gains and muscle memory ( I have been lifting for longer than what I would like to admit ) , do you think I''d be able to gain mass while going down on the calories a bit?

[selffirst]

Okay. I am at 500 calories over maintenance. A typical day would be something like this:

Meal 1: 2 cups skim milk, large banana, cup and half oats, 2 tsp peanut butter
Meal 2 : Baked Chicken, Sweet potato.
Meal 3: 2 cups skim milk, large banana, cup and half oats, 2 tsp peanut butter ( whey protein added if this meal falls after a workout )
Meal 4: Pasta
Meal 5: Greek yogurt, half cup 2 percent cottage cheese with fruit and peanut butter

Nothing too crazy. About 2500 calories. I have already gained some weight and it looks like I've leaned up a bit in the process too. Keep calories same or bump it up? Maybe even decrease it? Since I'm reaping the benefits of noob gains and muscle memory ( I have been lifting for longer than what I would like to admit ) , do you think I''d be able to gain mass while going down on the calories a bit?

You're eating a lot of carbs..drop the pasta and bananas..take those calories and eat protein...See what happens...

[boo99]

How did you figure your maintenance?

From the info you provided 2000 kcals seems low for maintenance, what is your height?

[fred2367]

You're eating a lot of carbs..drop the pasta and bananas..take those calories and eat protein...See what happens...

Fair enough. But should I be still eating as many calories ? ( replace the calories I was eating in carbs with protein )

How did you figure your maintenance?

From the info you provided 2000 kcals seems low for maintenance, what is your height?

I don't remember exactly where I got the formula for figuring it out. I'm 5'11. It seems close, but not sure it's exact. I have actually been lifting for loner than what I'd like to admit, but I have long lay offs and I typically make progress and then once I quit lifting I shrivel up and start to look anerexic. I've bulked before but ending up putting on Waaaay too much fat and overshot the calories and it ended up making me look fat everywhere. Based on passed experience and watching my weight through the years I would say that the number is close for me.

[allnatty06]

I don't think you should drop the carbs... You need carbs to grow, and you need carbs in a cut as well. You need WAY more protein IMO. Add more protein to every meal. Even if you have to drink it... go buy some Gainer or something. You won't put any muscle on if you don't eat big. ANd putting muscle on is very slow, so be patient.

[boo99]

I don't remember exactly where I got the formula for figuring it out. I'm 5'11. It seems close, but not sure it's exact. I have actually been lifting for loner than what I'd like to admit, but I have long lay offs and I typically make progress and then once I quit lifting I shrivel up and start to look anerexic. I've bulked before but ending up putting on Waaaay too much fat and overshot the calories and it ended up making me look fat everywhere. Based on passed experience and watching my weight through the years I would say that the number is close for me.

At your height and weight, I think your TDEE is higher than 2000, mine is 2500 @5 8" 165 (cut down to 155 now)

See what you come up by calculating it using the sticky below:

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hp?t=156380183


Best to get a better rough estimate of TDEE and bulk from there.

Even if you did no calculations and continued eating at 2500 kcals, based on those stats you possibly wouldn't gain in a bulk.

[JUSA]

I am stuck at a crossroads. I don't think I have enough muscle to do a cut and look decent, and I think if I go too heavy on my bulk I will put even more fat on. I have a bit of fat covering my chest and abs and I don't want to add much more. Thoughts on best course of action if your goal was one of the physiques above.

You don't have any muscle at all. That underwear model guy does. He looks like he lifts, you don't. I know you don't want to get "too big" or be like us, but if you want to look like that underwear guy, you're going to have to hit the gym at some point.

Cutting now would be pointless. You don't have much lean mass, so it'd be hard. You don't seem to have any knowledge of lifting or proper diet, either -- I say this because dropping weight the right way is a whole hell of a lot harder than putting weight on the right way. If you can't put weight on right, losing weight will be a trainwreck for you. And, even if you succeed and don't lose too much LBM when you cut, it won't matter since even then you'd look like a horrible stick.

The only sensible option for you is to get serious and hit the gym and put on some weight. Whatever you're doing isn't working. If you want to look good, you will have to dedicate yourself on some level to diet and fitness.

Right now: Get serious and stop ****ing around. You can't put on weight without getting fat? This means you eat like **** and you train like ****. You need to cross that hurdle before you'll ever make any progress with anything you try.

[fred2367]

I don't think you should drop the carbs... You need carbs to grow, and you need carbs in a cut as well. You need WAY more protein IMO. Add more protein to every meal. Even if you have to drink it... go buy some Gainer or something. You won't put any muscle on if you don't eat big. ANd putting muscle on is very slow, so be patient.

Thank you so much for the input. Your pic in the avi is pretty much what I'm going for so I will definitely head the advice.

At your height and weight, I think your TDEE is higher than 2000, mine is 2500 @5 8" 165 (cut down to 155 now)

See what you come up by calculating it using the sticky below:

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hp?t=156380183


Best to get a better rough estimate of TDEE and bulk from there.

Even if you did no calculations and continued eating at 2500 kcals, based on those stats you possibly wouldn't gain in a bulk.

Good advice and I do think I should increase the cals. I have protein some ON whey protein and I may start taking in an extra shake per day to up the protein a bit, maybe even throw an extra chicken breast in the mix too.

You don't have any muscle at all. That underwear model guy does. He looks like he lifts, you don't. I know you don't want to get "too big" or be like us, but if you want to look like that underwear guy, you're going to have to hit the gym at some point.

Cutting now would be pointless. You don't have much lean mass, so it'd be hard. You don't seem to have any knowledge of lifting or proper diet, either -- I say this because dropping weight the right way is a whole hell of a lot harder than putting weight on the right way. If you can't put weight on right, losing weight will be a trainwreck for you. And, even if you succeed and don't lose too much LBM when you cut, it won't matter since even then you'd look like a horrible stick.

The only sensible option for you is to get serious and hit the gym and put on some weight. Whatever you're doing isn't working. If you want to look good, you will have to dedicate yourself on some level to diet and fitness.

Right now: Get serious and stop ****ing around. You can't put on weight without getting fat? This means you eat like **** and you train like ****. You need to cross that hurdle before you'll ever make any progress with anything you try.

None of that whole rant helps me at all. You saying over and over again about how skinny I am really isn't helpful. You are just throwing around cliches in order for me to fix this by saying this like " you need to dedicate yourself to fitness ". Ummm okay?

Not everyone has the same goals. I see most of the guys that are jacked in my gym and I DO NOT want to look like them either, so why are you going to give me advice that is going to get me a physique that is full of beach muscle and little else? I'd rather stay a skinny twig because it takes less effort. There are a few guys in this thread that do have a physique that are much closer to my goal. I know its bodybuilding.com and there are going to guys whose goal is apparently trying to get bigger biceps but for not other reason than to get bigger biceps, but my goal is functional strength, and to have a decent well rounded physique compared to the average male. It is NOT to get bigger just so I can walk around the gym with my chest puffed out. Functionally strong, well rounded look is what I'm shooting for.

[boo99]

Good advice and I do think I should increase the cals. I have protein some ON whey protein and I may start taking in an extra shake per day to up the protein a bit, maybe even throw an extra chicken breast in the mix too.

Count and track ALL food calories/macros daily. Just dont throw in a chicken here etc. You need to know what you are/have been consuming accurately when the time comes to adjust it.

[MassMonster87]

Sorry to concur with the others but it's rather clear that you haven't put on any muscle whatsoever since you began 'lifting'. If I was you I'd seriously revisit my training programme and alter it somewhat.