A Log For My Joints With Flexible From Formutech Nutrition

[ragnar1199]

Alrighty, time to get this log going. I was chosen to log Flexible from Formutech Nutrition. Thank you very much for picking me. I'm 31 years old and I've been getting some achy joints the last few years, so I usually take a joint supp (I've been working out seriously for about 12 years). I also do high weight and low reps most of the time, so that doesn't help the joints any. I'm currently doing Jim Stoppani's Shortcut to Size, so the reps go from high to low for four weeks, then repeat. It's a 12 week program and I will be starting week 8 in 2 days, which is 3-5 reps on most exercises, with a drop set on the last set of everything.

I wanted to use flexible because it has a nice ingredient panel, all the basic ingredients for joints, plus the cissus and hyaluronic acid:

Serving Size: 4 Veggie Capsules

Glucosamine Sulfate 750 mg
Chondroitin Sulfate 600 mg
MSM (Methylsulfonylmethane) 750 mg
Hyaluronic Acid 100 mg
Cissus Quadrangularis Extract 1,000 mg

I have a little bit of experience with Formutech supps, having logged their Endurance BCAA Plus a while back, which I enjoyed and I think is a very good product.

So, today is actually Day 3 that I have taken this product. I'm hoping it can help out my right knee, which bothers me sometimes when squatting. Also, my left elbow hurts sometimes when doing triceps, and my shoulders haven't felt the greatest this year. We'll see what happens. For what it's worth, my joints felt good today, and I was carrying a back pack leaf blower most of the day (I do landscaping and it's leaf clean-up season).

I guess that's it for now. My next workout is in two days, that's probably when my next post will be. Here's a pic of the Flexible I received:

[aaaaaaaaaachooo]

Looks good!!
Will be following along!

8 weeks into your training program, how are you feeling?

[Raigs]

I'm in and in for answer above

[CoachChuckD]

In - interested in hearing how you like the product.

[ragnar1199]

8 weeks into your training program, how are you feeling?

I'm feeling pretty good. This is the second time I've done that Shortcut to Size routine. I like it. I haven't really gained any size (weight), but that's because I haven't been getting enough calories. At this point in my life and training, I've found I need to consume around 4500 to 5000 calories to really put on more weight. If I had a job where I was less active, I probably wouldn't need as much.

That being said, I have gained some strength every week. Now, I wasn't exactly the strongest I've ever been when I started the program, but with the diet being crappy at times, I think the strength gains I've made have been pretty good. I really do enjoy the program and recommend people try it out.

So, yesterday was day 5. I did some chest. Got out there a little late and didn't hit triceps like I was supposed to, just did some chest. Low volume, but I hit it hard. I workout in my landlord's barn (it was 20 degrees here yesterday morning. I had on lots of layers). Joints all felt good, some slight pain in my wrists while benching, but overall not bad for 4 rep sets. No pain in my shoulders, which I usually expect a little bit of when bench pressing. The workout:

Flat Bench: 4x285, 4x285, 4x285, drop to 205 for 7

Incline DB Flye: 6x99, 5x99, drop to 59 for 8

Decline Bench: 4x245, 5x245, drop to 195 for 5

Flat DB Flye: 6x69, 5x69, drop to 49 for 5

That was it, some good numbers. I'm about to go out and hit back. It's 18 degrees outside right now and it'll be about 5:00 by the time I get started. Today is back and biceps, but I might only have time for back. I'm thinking of making up biceps and triceps tomorrow. Anyway, time to go deadlift, my favorite. I'm looking to do 450 for about 5 reps.

[Raigs]

Any chance on pictures of barn gym. It is cold out that shows dedication.

Some strong benching

[ragnar1199]

Any chance on pictures of barn gym. It is cold out that shows dedication.

Some strong benching

I've got a Yukon Power Rack and a Body Solid flat/incline/decline bench, 580 lbs of weight, and an old Gold's Gym multi-bench thingy. The Gold's Gym bench is pretty sweet, actually. It's got a pulley attachment, leg and preacher attachment, all in a a pretty small unit. The uprights adjust in or out for use with standard or olympic bars. My plan is to get the pulley and dip attachments for the Yukon rack, as well as the leg attachment for the body solid bench and get rid of the Gold's Gym bench.

I found a video I took in May this year doing a little tour of my gym:



And thanks.

[Raigs]

Not a bad set up at all. Nice power rack can get some real work done with it

[aaaaaaaaaachooo]

Mirin' dat dere setup. Unfortunately I train at a gym...
...But at least da honies be mirin' ...? lol

[ragnar1199]

Mirin' dat dere setup. Unfortunately I train at a gym...
...But at least da honies be mirin' ...? lol

I've actually been wanting to drop in at the gym I used to work out in. I haven't been there in like 3 years and there's actually a different owner now. A good friend of mine has been working out there since like '04, and I started working out there in '05. It's a small gym, more older people trying to stay in shape than hardcore lifters, but I think I'd like to drop in and show the few young bucks in there how to put in some real work.

By the way, I'm jealous of your squat. My best in the gym is 440. I did a powerlifting meet about a year and a half ago. My best numbers there were 400/300/550 (squat/bench/deadlift). I failed a 420 and 430 squat due to depth, I couldn't get a 320 bench which pissed me off (I did like 335 with a pause a couple weeks before), and I failed a 575 deadlift attempt. My best numbers in the gym are 440/335/570. I did hit a 350 bench one time touch and go. I'd like to get back to that. I might do another meet next April as long as I can stay consistent and injury free.

So anyway, I'd figured I'd mention the other supps I'm using right now. They include:

Betancourt Big Blend (almost gone, I have some VPX Syngex to try next)
Scivation Mass Gainer (vanilla sugar cookie=hands down the best tasting weight gainer I've ever used)
LCLT
DAA (decided to use a little tub I've had for a long time)
AEN APE (almost gone)
Universal Storm
Universal Atomic 7

I think that's about it. As far as a pre-workout is concerned, I recently finished up 10 samples of the new Twinlab MVP Fuel, which I enjoyed. So now, I'm finishing up some Uncut I have leftover from an App Nut stack I did a little while ago.

The workout went well this morning. Getting my deadlift back up there (deadlifts aren't a part of the Shortcut to Size routine, but I gotta do 'em):

Deadlift: 4x460, 5x460

T-Bar Row: 6x180, 5x180, 5x180, drop to 140 for 4

Pulldown: 8x160, 7x160, 7x160, drop to 120 for 7

Chins: 8xBW, 7xBW, 6xBW (just started doing these two weeks ago)

That was it. Workout went well. I should be doing arms tomorrow.

[aaaaaaaaaachooo]

Strong numbers man.

Thanks for the squat compliment.
Finally hitting 5pps was a pretty good milestone for me. lol
I too need to work on getting the Bench #'s up.

Too bad I'm starting my cut...the Mass Gainer sounds great.
I'm a sucker for pastries. lmao

Keep putting in the work & continue doing those chin-ups.
Good stuff.

[Raigs]

Pretty good Deads! You cant cut deads out I just like them to much myself

[aaaaaaaaaachooo]

*IN* for shortcut-to-size results!! Heard nothing but good things about the program.

[ragnar1199]

Yeah, I gotta keep doing deadlifts, it's what I'm best at in the gym. They're lagging behind a bit now, but I'll get 'em back up there.

Did legs yesterday (minus calves) and a couple biceps exercises to make up for missing 'em last Thursday. I also have to quit slacking on calves and abs. I was doing them twice a week for about the first 6 weeks of this routine, but then I started skipping 'em.

Pre-workout - 3 caps of Uncut, half a scoop of Storm, 1.6 grams of beta alanine
Intra - 2 scoops of Atomic 7
Post - 1 scoop of Storm, 1 gram of LCLT, then 3 scoops of Mass Gainer with 12 oz of milk

As for the Flexible, I've been doing 4 caps with breakfast and 4 caps with dinner. The workout:

Squat: 3x360, 4x360, 3x360 drop to 270 for 6

Close Stance High Bar Squat: 6x255, 6x255, 6x255 drop to 185 for 7

Leg Extension: 8x155, 10x155, 7x160 drop to 115 for 10

Leg Curl: 5x55, 4x55, 4x55 drop to 40 for 8

Incline DB Curl: 9x39, 8x44, 7x49 drop to 25 for 7

Standing BB Curl: 8x105, 8x105, 8x105 drop to 75 for 7

I took some videos with my wife's cellphone, they're kinda crappy. It was dark, so I brightened 'em up with youtube, which just makes the quality worse. I usually use my camera, but my old desktop computer won't read memory cards anymore and I can't find the usb cable to plug the camera right into the computer. (My laptop stopped working, otherwise I wouldn't be using this 10 year old desktop). Anyway, here's a few vids:

360 for 4 squat:



255 for 6 close stance squat:



2nd set of Leg ext and Inc DB Curls:



My right knee was bothering me a tad doing squats, but not as bad as it has recently, which is surprising since I was doing low reps. It's usually the close stance squats that bother it more, but it really wasn't too bad yesterday. Hopefully this Flexible will help it feel better over time.

In other news, I decided to get some Ben & Jerry's on the way home from work today and I just ate most of it after dinner, which was pasta and chicken breast (well, I had a grilled cheese sandwich after that, then the ice cream). Chocolate Fudge Brownie, omg that **** is good, I had to stop myself from eating it all.

Song of the day (I'm a metal head, but decided to put a couple Eminem songs on):

[aaaaaaaaaachooo]

Strong squats brotha! Especially with knee issues.
Flexible should be kicking in full force real soon.

[ragnar1199]

Hit chest and triceps this morning. Today starts week 9 of Shortcut to Size, which is 12-15 reps sets with a rest/pause on the last set of everything. Used too much weight to start out with on flat bench and kept lowering it. I seem to have crappy endurance when doing higher reps, just not used to it I guess.

4:00 - Get up, 3 caps of Uncut
4:15 - 1/2 scoop of Storm, 1.6 grams of beta alanine
4:45 - Begin workout, 2 scoops of Atomic 7 Intra
6:05 - End Workout
Post - 1 scoop of Storm, 1 gram of LCLT

The workout:

Flat Bench: 10x245, 9x235, 9x225, R/P 2 reps

Incline DB Flye: 14x69, 10x69, R/P 2 reps

Decline Bench: 14x185, 10x185, 10x175, R/P 4 reps

Flat DB Flye: 13x49, 10x49, R/P 4 reps

Triceps Pressdown: 14x75, 12x75, 11x75, R/P 3 reps

Overhead BB Extension: 13x70, 12x70, R/P 4 reps

Skullcrusher: 14x60, 11x60, R/P 4 reps

Pretty good workout, minimal joint pain. I haven't done skullcrushers in a month. They're known for making my elbows hurt, mostly my left one, but they felt fine today. Part of it might be because of the higher reps and lighter weight (one of the reasons I do them last is so my elbows are as warmed up as possible), but I had hardly any joint pain anywhere. So, things are looking good so far.

Song of the Day:

[aaaaaaaaaachooo]

Good work today man.
Solid program you're on. How are the results 2 months in?

[Raigs]

Looks like flexible kicked in!

Nice bench work. I hate high reps myself.

Big universal fan lol

[ragnar1199]

Looks like flexible kicked in!

Nice bench work. I hate high reps myself.

Big universal fan lol

Yeah, I think I'm noticing a difference.

And Universal, yeah, I use a few of their things. Right now it's just the Storm and Atomic 7. I alternate brands all the time because I always like to try different ones. I'm just about out of Storm and decided to order a more basic creatine this time, some Nutrex Creatine Drive Black (which I have used once before).

[aaaaaaaaaachooo]

Yeah, I think I'm noticing a difference.

And Universal, yeah, I use a few of their things. Right now it's just the Storm and Atomic 7. I alternate brands all the time because I always like to try different ones. I'm just about out of Storm and decided to order a more basic creatine this time, some Nutrex Creatine Drive Black (which I have used once before).

I really like "Con-cret". Something about the Creatine HCI that just works really well.
All the strength gains w/out loading, cramping, & not much bloat.

[Raigs]

I like SNS creatine bulk is the way to go! OR I use volatile and dont need to take any. It provides it all

[ragnar1199]

Well today started off kinda crappy. I had to drive my wife to the dmv so she could finally switch her driver's license over to the state where we live now (her car is not currently registered). The dmv we planned on going to no longer does that service, they only do license renewals, which I found out on their website last night. So I let her know that we would have to go to another one farther away and get up earlier (when she got home from work at 1 in the morning). I was hoping we could go another day next week, but she still wanted to go, so when I got up I had to look up the directions and I didn't have time to eat. I got a sucky sandwich at the gas station for breakfast (around 7:15) and didn't eat again until we got back home at about 10:15.

So anyway, caloric consumption for the morning sucked, but I had a pretty good delt and calf workout at about 2:30 in the afternoon (I very much prefer doing my workouts first thing in the morning). I got a sample tub of a pre-workout supp that I took a scoop of, which helped out (I was tired), and I got it done.

Standing DB Press: 15x49, 12x49, 10x49, R/P 3 reps

Prone Rear Raise: 13x34, 13x34, 12x34, R/P 4 reps

DB Side Lateral: 13x24, 13x24, R/P 4 reps

Seated Rear Raise: 14x49, 12x49, 12x49, R/P 4 reps

BB Front Raise: 13x50, 13x50 R/P 5 reps

BB Shrug, Behind the Back: 12x325, 11x325, 11x325, R/P 5 reps

Seated Calf Raise: 70x100 for as many sets as it took, resting 30 sec each time I hit failure

Standing Calf Raise, BB: 9x225, 8x225, 8x225, 60 sec rest between sets

Good workout. First time doing calves in a few weeks. No joint issues, everything feels pretty good. Squats tomorrow, we'll see how the right knee feels. It'll be 12-15 reps, which will probably burn up my lower back more than it will bother my knee.

Some clips of today's workout:



Song of the day:



Haven't listened to Alice in Chains in a while. Whenever I put 'em on, I always remember how awesome they were, and they're still pretty good. Great band.

[ragnar1199]

Had a good leg workout this morning. My quads aren't feeling the greatest right now. 300 for 14 reps on squats, then it took me a few minutes to catch my breath. That **** is brutal. My right knee felt fine until close stance squats, but it only bothered my slightly on the first set, after that it was fine.

Took a scoop of a pre-workout supp after getting up, some Atomic 7 intra, and after the workout I had a scoop of Big Blend and a scoop of Scivation Mass Gainer in 8 oz of whole milk. About an hour after that was a big bowl of pasta and 3 eggs over easy on 2 slices of Arnold Multi-Grain bread.

The Workout:

Squat: 14x300, 12x300, R/P 2 reps (4 weeks ago I did 275 for 14 then 290 for 12. I'd say I'm making some progress and getting my squat back up).

Close Stance High Bar Squat: 11x205, 12x205, R/P 2 reps

Leg Ext: 14x135, 13x135, 14x135, R/P 6 reps

Stiff Leg DL: 12x235, 10x235

Leg Curl: 16x30, 14x35, 12x35, R/P 4 reps

Reverse Wrist Curl, BB: 12x45, 11x45, 9x45

Wrist Curl, BB, Behind the Back: 20x85, 15x95, 14x95, R/P 6 reps

Abs: Ashley Conrad Clutch Cut Circuit (My wife did that clutch cut routine for 5 weeks a while back. I like the ab circuit).

[ragnar1199]

A couple days ago I kicked off week 10 of the Shortcut to Size routine, which is going well in the strength department, but I'm not gaining any weight. In fact, I've been weighing less this past week, down to 205-207, from 210. I guess I'm just not eating enough, but since I'm still getting stronger, it's all good.

My joints have been feeling pretty damn good, I've definitely noticed an improvement overall. My wrists were beginning to bother me about a month ago doing curls with the straight bar, which is what I've always used to curl with. However, when I did curls yesterday, they felt a lot better. I must say I'm happy with Flexible so far. Unfortunately, I'm having some rotator cuff issues in my right arm. It was bothering me during my last chest workout and is still bothering me a bit. It sucks, it hasn't been an issue in a while.

I did chest and triceps a two days ago. This week is sets of 9-11 reps with a rest/pause on the last set of everything:

Flat Bench: 10x250, 8x250, 8x250, R/P 2 reps

Incline DB Flye: 11x79, 8x79, 6x79, R/P 2 reps

Decline Bench: 9x205, 8x195, 9x185, R/P 4 reps

Triceps Pressdown: 9x85, 9x85, 9x85, R/P 4 reps

Overhead Ext, BB: 10x80, 9x80, 9x80, R/P 4 reps

Skullcrusher: 13x70, 10x75, 11x75, R/P 4 reps

Yesterday was back and biceps. Like I said before, my wrists felt better doing the straight bar curls, so that's nice. All my other joints felt good, no pain.

Deadlift: 11x430 (nice), 6x430 (yeah, I guess that first set wore me out)

DB Row: 9x129, 9x129, 9x129, forgot to do the damn rest/pause

Pulldown: 12x140, 10x150, 9x150, R/P 3 reps

Chins: 7xBW, 9xBW, 8xBW, R/P 2 reps

Incline DB Curl: 10x44, 10x44, 7x44, R/P 2 reps

Standing BB Curl: 9x95, 8x95, R/P 3 reps

Abs: Ashley Conrad Clutch Cut Ab Circuit x2

Clips from yesterday's workout:

[Raigs]

I got un subscribed from this thread.

Seriously some killer work in here. Great going with the high reps on those weights. Especially those dreads and squats.

Sucks the shoulder hurts. I can relate.

[aaaaaaaaaachooo]

Seriously some killer work in here. Great going with the high reps on those weights. Especially those dreads and squats.

This.
Putting in work! Glad to hear flexible is doing it's job!!

[ragnar1199]

Just a quick update. Joints are feeling good, Flexible is doing it's job. Reps go down a bit starting tomorrow (6-8), we'll see how that goes. I got sick on Thanksgiving. I still did my delt workout on Saturday, but I didn't go all out because of being sick and because of the rotator cuff. I skipped the leg workout on Sunday because I knew that would just put a hurting on my body. Went to work on Monday, but came home early. Decided to stay home today. I'm feeling a lot better right now and am planning to kick off week 11 of Shortcut to Size tomorrow.

It'll be chest and triceps. The rotator cuff is feeling a lot better now, but not quite 100%. I'll just have to see how it goes.

[Raigs]

Glad the rotator cuff is doing better now. Almost out of flexible excited for the review. Sounding like you enjoy it.

Hope you are feeling better. Ready for a new strong workout

[aaaaaaaaaachooo]

Great log so far man ~ appreciate the input!!

[ragnar1199]

Well, I guess this is the end. Thanks again for picking me to log Flexible and sorry I didn't make more posts.

Flexible has been great. Before using it I had been having some pain in my right knee when squatting (mostly when doing close stance high bar squats), as well as in my wrists when doing straight bar curls. And my elbows usually have some pain doing triceps exercises more often times than not. Flexible has alleviated the pain I was feeling. Not 100%, but it has definitely improved how my joints have been feeling. I don't know if it's the added Cissus or what, but I was using Animal Flex when I was having those pains before doing this log.

Flexible claims to promote healthy tendons and muscles and to support lubrication in the joints and other tissues. It's kinda hard to determine to what extent it does those things, but I say the product works. In the last two weeks of using the product, I've had almost no pain in my right knee and less pain in my wrists, as well as almost none in my elbows.

Now let's compare some prices (using bb.com prices). Flexible is about $0.90 per day at full dose. Animal Flex is about $0.61 per day, but doesn't have Cissus. It does, however, quite a few other ingredients, including a couple vitamins and minerals. One con I've always considered Flex to have is that it's all blends, individual ingredient dosages are not listed. However, I've used it for years. Now let's look at the cost of Cissus. On this site, the cheapest pure Cissus product is $0.33 per day (equaling or close to equaling the 2 gram per day dose in Flexible). The most expensive is $0.90 per day. One of the things I've thought about this past year is if I just added Cissus to my supplement regimen. Let's say I use Flex and the cheapest Cissus product, together they would equal about $0.94 per day, 4 cents more than using Flexible (which isn't much, about $1.20 more per month, but it's still easier to just use the Flexible if it works well).

A couple of other joint products I've used are Osteo-Sport from Applied Nutriceuticals and Joint Help from iForce. Osteo-Sport, at my bodyweight, costs about $1.15 per day (and worth it in my opinion if you're really having some painful joints). Joint Help (which isn't sold at bb.com, so I checked another popular site) is about $1.00 per day, and I didn't think it was that great.

So, considering all that, Flexible is worth the price imo. I still think that Osteo-Sport is probably the best joint supplement I've used, but Flexible has worked very well, maybe better than Animal Flex, which would make it the second joint supplement I've liked better than Animal Flex. That just goes to show you that you should keep trying different brands. You may think what you're using works great, but you still might find something that is better. I used Flex for years before I used Osteo-Sport, and I think Osteo-Sport was better, but only worth the price if you already have some joint issues, I don't think it's worth it for preventative maintenance. (I'm not knocking Flex, I still think it's a great supp to use all the time to help keep your joints healthy). Flexible, on the other hand, just may be worth the extra price to use it all the time. In fact, I'm gonna keep using it for now (well, as soon as I can order more, which will be on the 16th when I get paid next).

I guess that's about it. To sum it up, I like Flexible, it works. Not the cheapest joint supp, but not the most expensive either. I think adding cissus to the basic joint supplement ingredients was a great idea. This now makes two products from Formutech that I've enjoyed, the other being BCAA Endurance Plus. And their customer service is great in my experience. I logged the BCAA Endurance back in January and had an issue with the amount of scoops in my container (about 22 instead of 30) and Bruce Davis (username ganutrition), who works for Formutech (or is owner or something, I don't remember), messaged me his phone number. After talking to him, he sent me out another tub. That was pretty awesome.

Anyway, I recommend Flexible. Now, I found the cable to hook my camera up to my old desktop computer (the memory card reader doesn't work anymore), so I can finally put better videos up now.

Clips from yesterday's delt and triceps workout:



Today, legs and biceps:



Song of the Day (from one of the greatest metal bands of all time, from one of the greatest live albums of all time imo):



Edit: I decided to copy this and post it in the Product Reviews section: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hp?t=158772633