AllPro: A Simple Beginner's Routine part IIII

[BlueDay93]

Thanks noobydooby and northerntiger. Cant wait to get started!

[nacnacmetz]

thanks red! that's what I figured. I'll start bulking when I feel like the program is at a point where I need to bulk to not stall! Thanks for the logic check

[chris424]

Hi guys, quick question about the program. I'm starting this today and sticking to the original plan. However, I was just wondering. Would it be more beneficial to do this program over 6 workout days rather than 3 workout days? Hitting 6 compound exercises in the one training session is a lot of work and by the time you hit the last few compounds, fatigue and/or energy loss may set in and you won't be able to give them your all. So, wouldn't it be beneficial to split the compounds and do something like this;

MON, WED, FRI - Squats / Bench Press / Bent-Over Rows
TUE, THU, SAT - Overhead Barbell Presses / Stiff-Legged Deadlifts / Barbell Curls / Calf Raises

Thus, splitting the compounds up and following the Hard > Med > Light plan with both.

I'm just thinking out-loud as maybe an option. Would this work? What pro's and con's would there be?

Cheers,
Chris

[FrankFF]

Hi guys, quick question about the program. I'm starting this today and sticking to the original plan. However, I was just wondering. Would it be more beneficial to do this program over 6 workout days rather than 3 workout days? Hitting 6 compound exercises in the one training session is a lot of work and by the time you hit the last few compounds, fatigue and/or energy loss may set in and you won't be able to give them your all. So, wouldn't it be beneficial to split the compounds and do something like this;

MON, WED, FRI - Squats / Bench Press / Bent-Over Rows
TUE, THU, SAT - Overhead Barbell Presses / Stiff-Legged Deadlifts / Barbell Curls / Calf Raises

Thus, splitting the compounds up and following the Hard > Med > Light plan with both.

I'm just thinking out-loud as maybe an option. Would this work? What pro's and con's would there be?

Cheers,
Chris

I would just run the program as written, if it would have worked a better being split Allpro would have written it that way. Looking at the way you have written up the split as a first observation you hit your triceps on bench and then again the next day on OHP, the same with Biceps on BOR and Curls.

Muscles need recovery time to grow, give them it or you will end up burning out and not making any progress,

[davidolson22]

I would just run the program as written, if it would have worked a better being split Allpro would have written it that way. Looking at the way you have written up the split as a first observation you hit your triceps on bench and then again the next day on OHP, the same with Biceps on BOR and Curls.

Muscles need recovery time to grow, give them it or you will end up burning out and not making any progress,

Agreed about Chris's version of the split being counterproductive, but it might be reasonable to split it up into a leg day then an upper body day.

[FrankFF]

Agreed about Chris's version of the split being counterproductive, but it might be reasonable to split it up into a leg day then an upper body day.

I did wonder about that but thought that it may hamper leg recovery slightly as they are use as stabilisers/ support muscles for the upper body exercises?

FrankFF

[GKC45]

Hi guys, quick question about the program. I'm starting this today and sticking to the original plan. However, I was just wondering. Would it be more beneficial to do this program over 6 workout days rather than 3 workout days? Hitting 6 compound exercises in the one training session is a lot of work and by the time you hit the last few compounds, fatigue and/or energy loss may set in and you won't be able to give them your all. So, wouldn't it be beneficial to split the compounds and do something like this;

MON, WED, FRI - Squats / Bench Press / Bent-Over Rows
TUE, THU, SAT - Overhead Barbell Presses / Stiff-Legged Deadlifts / Barbell Curls / Calf Raises

Thus, splitting the compounds up and following the Hard > Med > Light plan with both.

I'm just thinking out-loud as maybe an option. Would this work? What pro's and con's would there be?

Cheers,
Chris

That's a horrible idea and not even AllPros program anymore. Its just a bro split at that point. The exercise order is designed to prefatigue muscle groups to maximize hypertrophy. Once you change the order, split the days, etc, you are no longer running the program.

[GKC45]

Agreed about Chris's version of the split being counterproductive, but it might be reasonable to split it up into a leg day then an upper body day.

I don't even think that is a good idea. One of the reasons there is no direct ab/obliques work on this program is because they are hit so intensively between the lower and upper body work. Once you split them up, you are no longer giving your core that intense workout day followed by recovery day.

[GKC45]

Which exercise did most of you guys add after Cycle 3? And do you test your 10RM for that exercise as well?

I added shrugs first because I felt like my traps just weren't getting worked. http://www.bodybuilding.com/exercise.../barbell-shrug

Next, I added standing tricep extensions to supplement the OHP. http://www.bodybuilding.com/exercise...ceps-extension

[chris424]

That's a much better idea David. That way, we're not hitting muscles consecutively. Don't get me wrong, I am doing the program exactly as it's written but I was blowing sweat out of my arse come the deadlifts.

Squats and deadlifts on the same day are the devil's work. I just think this program, for people that can hit the gym 6 days a week could be even better with an upper/lower split, allowing us to allocate our energy resources to the max. I hate to be the "newbie" that tries to reinvent the wheel, but thought I'd put it out there for discussion anyway.

I've just posted my work-out journal in the journal thread "AllPro - The Ultimate Test." Feel free to critique!

[ubikon]

What is the recommended weight for the first 2 sets of warmup if the final weight is a bit on the low side?

Assuming that I'm using 135 lbs:
- 25% of that 33.75 lbs, while an empty olympic barbell weights 45 lbs. Is it ok if I simply use an empty barbell for the first warmup set?
- 50% of 135 lbs is 67.5 lbs. If I used an empty barbell for the first set, should I still stick with the 50% for the second set or should I just jump directly to work 100% weight?

Also, how is warming up handled between different workout days? Should I stick with the same warming weight (specific for heavy day) for the entire week, or should I adjust it accordingly in regards to medium / light days?

Thanks.

[GKC45]

What is the recommended weight for the first 2 sets of warmup if the final weight is a bit on the low side?

Assuming that I'm using 135 lbs:
- 25% of that 33.75 lbs, while an empty olympic barbell weights 45 lbs. Is it ok if I simply use an empty barbell for the first warmup set?
- 50% of 135 lbs is 67.5 lbs. If I used an empty barbell for the first set, should I still stick with the 50% for the second set or should I just jump directly to work 100% weight?

Also, how is warming up handled between different workout days? Should I stick with the same warming weight (specific for heavy day) for the entire week, or should I adjust it accordingly in regards to medium / light days?

Thanks.

Whenever your 25% weight is less than the barbell, go with the barbell. Same with the 50% if it is less than the barbell.

Adjust your percentages according to the weight your are lifting on heavy/medium/light day.

[Defgarden]

Hi guys, quick question about the program. I'm starting this today and sticking to the original plan. However, I was just wondering. Would it be more beneficial to do this program over 6 workout days rather than 3 workout days? Hitting 6 compound exercises in the one training session is a lot of work and by the time you hit the last few compounds, fatigue and/or energy loss may set in and you won't be able to give them your all. So, wouldn't it be beneficial to split the compounds and do something like this;

MON, WED, FRI - Squats / Bench Press / Bent-Over Rows
TUE, THU, SAT - Overhead Barbell Presses / Stiff-Legged Deadlifts / Barbell Curls / Calf Raises

Thus, splitting the compounds up and following the Hard > Med > Light plan with both.

I'm just thinking out-loud as maybe an option. Would this work? What pro's and con's would there be?

Cheers,
Chris

The biggest con that I see is that a 6-day split requires a LOT of dedication and discipline. If you're doing a 3 day routine and you miss one day, you can rectify that by either doing two heavy days that week, or simply doing the one you missed the next day and just moving the schedule over a bit. With a 6-day split, you don't leave yourself much room for changes and real life situations that force you not to be able to do a particular day.

Also, the routine as it is isn't very long. It only takes me about 30 minutes (up to an hour on REALLY crowded days). Just doing 3 or 4 exercises is only going to take 10-15 minutes really, and then you'd probably want to fill up your time doing other things at the gym that may be counterproductive to the overall goals of the program.

Just some thoughts.

[Defgarden]

C2W3 Heavy day.

I keep failing on OHP. Even on my first set, I have to kind of jerk my body to get the bar all the way up. I think I went too heavy. Next cycle, assuming I don't pass, I'm gonna lower the weight down a bit. Currently 70 lbs. I'll check on my medium and light days what weight feels more appropriate. All other exercises are good/challenging/not impossible.

Also, I've noticed since I've been more key on my diet (cutting) that my breath stinks so bad. I can feel it. Apparently its caused by your body going into ketosis and releasing ketones. My wife is not too happy haha. Any ideas on how to limit this other than mouthwash/breath mints?

[FitnessFan76]

Given that OHP is clearly lagging behind the other exercises, I asked a trainer for some shoulder strengthening exercises today (C4W1) and he suggested lateral dumbell raises/front raises. I was pleasantly surprised; the last time I tried lateral raises months back, I could only move a truly pathetic amount of weight or lack thereof (I must have had the shoulder strength of a goldfish) - doing them today, I found I could lift around five times as much. Really enjoyed the new cycle's weights, but then again this is eight rep week...get back to me in three weeks time.

A question about the extra exercises: how many can you add after Cycle 3? Would it be OK to do one set of lateral raises and one set of front raises, and do you reduce the weight for the extra exercise on medium/light days?

[GKC45]

Given that OHP is clearly lagging behind the other exercises, I asked a trainer for some shoulder strengthening exercises today (C4W1) and he suggested lateral dumbell raises/front raises. I was pleasantly surprised; the last time I tried lateral raises months back, I could only move a truly pathetic amount of weight or lack thereof (I must have had the shoulder strength of a goldfish) - doing them today, I found I could lift around five times as much. Really enjoyed the new cycle's weights, but then again, this is eight rep week...get back to me in three weeks time.

A question about the extra exercises: how many can you add after Cycle 3? Would it be OK to do one set of lateral raises and one set of front raises, and do you reduce the weight for the extra exercise on medium/light days?

Your front delts are already getting hit pretty good between bench and OHP. Maybe add side lateral raises and rear lateral raises to fill out the shoulder instead.

[FrankFF]

Given that OHP is clearly lagging behind the other exercises, I asked a trainer for some shoulder strengthening exercises today (C4W1) and he suggested lateral dumbell raises/front raises. I was pleasantly surprised; the last time I tried lateral raises months back, I could only move a truly pathetic amount of weight or lack thereof (I must have had the shoulder strength of a goldfish) - doing them today, I found I could lift around five times as much. Really enjoyed the new cycle's weights, but then again, this is eight rep week...get back to me in three weeks time.

A question about the extra exercises: how many can you add after Cycle 3? Would it be OK to do one set of lateral raises and one set of front raises, and do you reduce the weight for the extra exercise on medium/light days?

I think AllPros recommendation is to only add one new exercise per cycle because if you add two and one of the core lifts starts to fail because of the addition you will not know which of the two caused the adverse affect.

FrankFF

[JMcC775]

Week 3 day 1. All passed except set two of bench i only got 6 reps. Strength endurance is something I lack. Feeling bummed about it. Hopefully just an off day because it felt heavy on the first set.

[FitnessFan76]

Your front delts are already getting hit pretty good between bench and OHP. Maybe add side lateral raises and rear lateral raises to fill out the shoulder instead.

Here's the exercise I added today - so that's side lateral raises, with dumbells.

I think AllPros recommendation is to only add one new exercise per cycle because if you add two and one of the core lifts starts to fail because of the addition you will not know which of the two caused the adverse affect.

FrankFF

Thanks; I'll stick with the side lateral raises.

[GKC45]

Here's the exercise I added today - so that's side lateral raises, with dumbells.

perfect

[afurry91]

Whenever your 25% weight is less than the barbell, go with the barbell. Same with the 50% if it is less than the barbell.

Adjust your percentages according to the weight your are lifting on heavy/medium/light day.

I thought we were supposed to use the same warm up weight for all three days (heavy, medium, light)? Can someone confirm?

Also, are the warm up sets supposed to progress in number of reps from 8-12 as well?

[jfall]

I thought we were supposed to use the same warm up weight for all three days (heavy, medium, light)? Can someone confirm?

Also, are the warm up sets supposed to progress in number of reps from 8-12 as well?

No, it's not the same weight for heavy/med/light days. You use the percentage of the total work set for the given day

[BJWCH]

When doing this weekly, is the heavy day always after 2 days of rest? And the medium and light days are after one day of rest? (if Mon-wed-fri, heavy day is monday), or if Tues-thurs-sat, heavy day is tuesday?

[Electrolytes]

I'm actually kind of wondering about the warm up reps as well, should it be 8-12 as well? Because I'm on week 4 and I feel like the warm up sets are tiring me out too much so it gets more difficult for me to complete my work sets

[fergsuk]

Been a lurker on here since i started 5 weeks ago, reading the new posts every night and slowly making my way through the original few threads. Gotta say im really liking it. Like most of the newbies i've had to start on really low weights but those extra reps and because its my C2W1 Heavy day today, being able to up the weight, even in such small increments, has had me beaming with pride. I WILL make a difference to my health and fitness and i've found a way i really enjoy in All Pro's. Thanks for putting it together!

If anyone is around the same distance in and wants an internet workout buddy to chat with, compare and throw around some motivation, i'll happily get involved. I may even decide to post pictures once i stop looking like im pregnant hah

fergs

[teaayemmmmwhy]

C4W5 test day tonight... trying to get myself proper pumped up as w4 heavy day wasn't the best!

Come on!!!

[GKC45]

When doing this weekly, is the heavy day always after 2 days of rest? And the medium and light days are after one day of rest? (if Mon-wed-fri, heavy day is monday), or if Tues-thurs-sat, heavy day is tuesday?

you have it correct

I'm actually kind of wondering about the warm up reps as well, should it be 8-12 as well? Because I'm on week 4 and I feel like the warm up sets are tiring me out too much so it gets more difficult for me to complete my work sets

the warm up reps always equal the workset reps. 8 reps week 1, 9 reps, week 2... 12 reps week 5.

[GKC45]

C4W5 test day tonight... trying to get myself proper pumped up as w4 heavy day wasn't the best!

Come on!!!

kick it's ass sea bass!

[GKC45]

Been a lurker on here since i started 5 weeks ago, reading the new posts every night and slowly making my way through the original few threads. Gotta say im really liking it. Like most of the newbies i've had to start on really low weights but those extra reps and because its my C2W1 Heavy day today, being able to up the weight, even in such small increments, has had me beaming with pride. I WILL make a difference to my health and fitness and i've found a way i really enjoy in All Pro's. Thanks for putting it together!

If anyone is around the same distance in and wants an internet workout buddy to chat with, compare and throw around some motivation, i'll happily get involved. I may even decide to post pictures once i stop looking like im pregnant hah

fergs

That's what it's all about. Each week you go up a rep means you were stronger than the week before. Every five weeks you get to prove it by upping your weight.

[DeltaCharlie75]

I thought we were supposed to use the same warm up weight for all three days (heavy, medium, light)? Can someone confirm?

Also, are the warm up sets supposed to progress in number of reps from 8-12 as well?

Use the warm up weight from heavy day for all your warm ups. Keep the simple beginners routine simple.