Just curious if taking my vitamins and prescribed medication will break my fast?
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05-29-2013, 02:30 PM #1
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05-29-2013, 04:03 PM #2
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05-29-2013, 05:35 PM #3
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05-31-2013, 01:52 PM #4
and what would happen if they did "break your fast"?
would you magically no longer lose weight because you consumed 1 calorie 4 hours before you were supposed to break your fast?
Let's assume you do 12 hour fasts.....you want to know the difference between:
fasting 8 hours eating multivitamins then fasting for 4 more hours VERSUS fasting 12 hours then eating your multivitamins.......
I'll just put my 2cents in here: you will see no significant difference in body composition.....now the absorption issue of the vitamins, well that is a separate issue.
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05-31-2013, 02:32 PM #5
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06-04-2013, 07:31 AM #6
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06-04-2013, 09:08 AM #7
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06-14-2013, 05:46 PM #8
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06-17-2013, 05:46 AM #9
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06-17-2013, 05:01 PM #10
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06-17-2013, 05:31 PM #11
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07-02-2013, 10:53 AM #12
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07-20-2018, 09:02 PM #13
Not EVERYONE who is fasting is trying to lose weight.
Some people are intermittent fasting for health reasons. Insulin resistance is a pre diabetic state. Fasting shuts down insulin response anything that spikes insulin breaks the fast and therefore doesnt give the benefit of reversing insulin resistance. The question is a valid one. Weight gain is merely a symptom for someone who is insulin resistant. They are attempting to cure the core issue not bulk up or tone down or live off some number on a scale. So it is not about body composition it is about not developing diabetes. When someone asks a question the answer shouldnt come from a place of assuming it is for weight loss but from evaluating the information given where no such assertion was made. That being said, to the original poster - take your vitamins after the fast. A prescription med cannot be moved around your fast, this is a good question. Someone qualified should put in their *2 cents*.
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07-20-2018, 09:05 PM #14
Good question. Hope someone qualified answers you with the due respect. Im sure you can move around your vitamins, the prescription meds however you may need to reach out to your doctor or the company which produces it to share with you some data on insulin response which will break your fast if you are fasting for health reasons.
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07-20-2018, 10:27 PM #15
Bigger meal will trigger more insulin than small meal so i dont think fasting as IF is good for IR vs multiple meals spread during the day.
High fat high protein low carb diet is fine for IR.
Ketone bodies provoke a (relatively weak) insulin response. If you're eating a TON of fat and ketogenesis is going nuts, your insulin will go up a little bit. This response is also why people with normal metabolism don't go into DKA. Since T1 diabetics can't produce significant insulin due to destruction of beta cells in the pancreas, ketogenesis goes nuts (as well as blood glucose levels).
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07-21-2018, 03:48 AM #16
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07-21-2018, 03:52 AM #17
Don't worry about a med you need to take during your fast
Just take daily vitamins during your feeding period. Most things get absorbed better with fat. And although everyone has different fasting rules if you want to "maximize" it I would think there are things in your multi that would effect your insulin.
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07-21-2018, 03:57 AM #18
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07-21-2018, 04:03 AM #19
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07-21-2018, 04:56 AM #20
If insulin was important for fat loss low carb diets would outperform high carb diets, yet they don't.
Fat loss is driven by a calorie deficit, not by keeping insulin low.
IF doesn't have a special effect on fat loss, but it can make it easier for some to create a calorie deficit. Not for everyone though.
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07-21-2018, 05:07 AM #21
23 Studies on Low-Carb and Low-Fat Diets
Keep in mind that all of these studies are randomized controlled trials, the gold standard of science. All are published in respected, peer-reviewed medical journals.
These studies are scientific evidence, as good as it gets, that low-carb is much more effective than the low-fat diet that is still being recommended all over the world.
https://www.healthline.com/nutrition...diets#section9
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07-21-2018, 05:16 AM #22
That article is written by Kris Gunnar, who's been promoting low carb diets on his blog for a long time.
The studies he cites didn't match protein between conditions. If you match protein low carb doesn't do better, in spite of lower insulin levels.
Suggested reading:
https://examine.com/nutrition/low-fa...r-weight-loss/
https://examine.com/nutrition/really...at-lower-carb/
Energy expenditure and body composition changes after an isocaloric ketogenic diet in overweight and obese men
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4962163/
Calorie for Calorie, Dietary Fat Restriction Results in More Body Fat Loss than Carbohydrate Restriction in People with Obesity
http://www.cell.com/cell-metabolism/...131(15)00350-2
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07-22-2018, 08:23 AM #23
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07-22-2018, 08:27 AM #24
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07-22-2018, 10:28 AM #25
This first link is an interesting read for sure, thanks for posting something that actually makes me think and is worth time to look over, srsly. But after reading nothing changes really for me, my belief of calories being number one impact on weight lost and gained reinforced, but still believe there is a good chance carbs matter. The fact that such guidelines on what to eat were given make this FAR from what your average carb eater intakes, along with the fact that the average carb intake was 132, FAR from what your fitness minded person would consumer on low carb, keto being less than half of that. I think the guy who wrote this examine article has a carbs don't matter agenda, which is fine, most people want to reinforce what they believe but his agenda and take on the study is apparent to me. I find myself just thinking different about the study findings, calories matter, and food quality matters as the main takeaways. To me the biggest factors of this study are a calorie deficit of 500-600 and guidelines to not eat processed carbs, even for the carb group. Even the conductor himself focused more on food quality at his takeaway saying "Perhaps the biggest takeaway from this study, Gardner said, is that the fundamental strategy for losing weight with either a low-fat or a low-carb approach is similar. Eat less sugar, less refined flour and as many vegetables as possible. Go for whole foods, whether that is a wheatberry salad or grass-fed beef." To me a study like this is designed to test that calories are #1, that the average person can easily make any diet work that they please if they don't eat too much, which is great. But doesn't really challenge the impact, or lack of impact of the low carb diet. The low carb group eating well over 100 carbs a day and the difference between the two groups being just 48 - 30 % is simply not enough of a difference to test the theory IMO. A theory that becomes even more secondary than it already was when other stronger factors such as calories reduction and food quality are introduced in the mix. In other studies really testing low carb we are looking at much lower carb intake as well as greater ratios between the two groups. A quick google brought be to one that keeps protein consistent at 20% in both groups, but carb variance between the two groups at 55 - 5 % in this one, https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4271639/ .
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07-22-2018, 10:46 AM #26
True. That's why the Hall ketogenic study (3rd link) had people eating 31 gram carbs per day. It had the highest level of control because the study was ran in a metabolic ward. Metabolic ward studies are generally considered the highest level of evidence. Main outcome:
Despite rapid, substantial, and persistent reductions in daily insulin secretion and RQ after introducing the KD, we observed a slowing of body fat loss. Therefore, our data do not support the carbohydrate–insulin model predictions of physiologically relevant increases in EE or greater body fat loss in response to an isocaloric KD. However, it is possible that dietary carbohydrate restriction might result in decreased ad libitum energy intake—a prediction of the carbohydrate-insulin model that was not tested in the current study but deserves further investigation.
The Jacob Wilson study. Caloric intake wasn't controlled. Heavy carb loading before the DEXA scans in the low carb group to make the results look better. After that study Wilson got fired at the university of Miami.
Good read: https://sci-fit.net/wilson-keto-analysis/
Keto doesn't provide a fat loss benefit over a high carb diet with matched calories. The only real benefit of a ketogenic diet is a spontaneous reduction in caloric intake. And some people feel better on it of course. I like the feeling of ketosis myself, I'm doing it at the moment.Last edited by Mrpb; 07-22-2018 at 11:55 AM.
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07-22-2018, 11:06 AM #27
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07-24-2018, 09:31 AM #28
Sorry for the late response, your posts had me really want to dig into this and I've looked over a number of things as well listened to some podcast type things while in the car.
I must say I get the feeling of agenda from the way many things are worded on the sci-fi net. My very minor investigative work would indicate some of the same writers over at examine who had that very biased write-up you pasted before. So honestly, I definitely do not think they are as unbiased as they claim to be. However, with that said after going over many things and their evaluations of keto, it has changed my mind a bit, and my quick glance didn't find any glaring issues with what they presented. I would like to see some of these pro keto guys really evaluate their work, but until then your main point that if cals and protein are matched keto provides no significant benefit in regards to fat loss apeears valid. My conclusion and the conclusion of many that I see is that keto accelerates weight loss in other studies because a high fat diet helps patients stay under cals by simply keeping people feeling full. But like you, I enjoy the feeling of my body running off of fat rather than glycogen, and I have really surprised myself going from on and off keto to just staying on most of the time because I feel so much better, I am at the point now where unless it's a special occasion I rather just avoid the carbs because I feel so much better. A real shame however that I have seen statements like "ketosis accelerates fat burning" a billions times if there is not significant reduction in bodyfat.
But that makes me want to ask you, there is a significantly growing number of doctors and scientists claiming a link to insulin and other hormones to metabolic rate and body composition, do you completely dismiss that concept at this point? That's something I'd like to spend some time looking into next.
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07-24-2018, 10:03 AM #29
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07-24-2018, 10:12 AM #30
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