Frequency vs Volume

[einstein197]

Almost everyone on here does nothing but frequency training, which is what I recommend to the noobs on here with questions as well. However, I have been doing a higher volume split for this past year, switch up the rep/set count and exercises of course. here's what my split looks like
Day 1 Chest/tri
Day 2 Back/bi
Day 3 Legs
Day 4 Shoulders/traps

I lift 6 days a week, taking every Sunday off. So essentially I am getting each muscle group in 6 times a month. I started this routine post injury after losing a TON of muscle (from about 230 down to 195) I am now back up to what some would consider my genetic peak in the past month maybe even 6 weeks. I have hit a wall (as I did before at this point) my diet is great but I can't seem to gain anymore weight and I haven't put a bit of size on my chest, arms, legs, or anything in this time span. I was wondering if I should try a novice frequency routine to break this wall.
Also many people say the transition from frequency to volume is more about your strength and less about experience ect.. so I am also fairly strong. I have not done 1rm for any lifts in a long time but my bench is in the range of 335-350 and after a very serious hip and knee injury I am still nursing my lower body back to where it was but am finally able to squat 315 for 10. Unfortunately I haven't been able to dead lift since the hip separation so I haven't dead lifted in over a year
So from the info given would you recommend a frequency routine or am I to the point where volume is the better fit for me?

[ironwill2008]

I can't seem to gain anymore weight and I haven't put a bit of size on my chest, arms, legs, or anything in this time span.

If you're not gaining weight, you're simply not eating enough.

[einstein197]

If you're not gaining weight, you're simply not eating enough.

I'm eating 4000 calories a day. 60% carbs 25% protein and 15% fats. Beyond that any recommendations to my training routine?

[PRico24]

why not try a push/pull/legs? still use a split and get to hit everything 2x per week?
legs
push: chest/tri/delts
pull: back bis
rest
repeat

[ironwill2008]

I'm eating 4000 calories a day. 60% carbs 25% protein and 15% fats. Beyond that any recommendations to my training routine?

But are you gaining weight at this amount of intake?

[Adrian77]

I think you are asking the wrong question.

The frequency is dependant on your level of development. No matter how far you progress or what volume you use, you still only get about 48 hours post workout of muscle growth (unless you are cheating). So you should always maximise your frequency while still getting enough stimulus and enough recovery. For you, I'd say an upper/lower or Push/Pull (hitting each muscle group twice a week) is ideal. More volume than you actually need to create a maximum growth response just makes you tired and nothing else.

The question you should be asking is, "what volume and intensity should I be doing for a twice a week frequency?". For you, I'd say most likely 2-3 exercises per muscle group. The intensity comes down to the style of training you like. I think a program like 5/3/1 BBB could be a good option. Lyle McDonald's generic Bulking routine is also a good option because it avoids deads.

[pHUiii]

I think you are asking the wrong question.

The frequency is dependant on your level of development. No matter how far you progress or what volume you use, you still only get about 48 hours post workout of muscle growth (unless you are cheating). So you should always maximise your frequency while still getting enough stimulus and enough recovery. For you, I'd say an upper/lower or Push/Pull (hitting each muscle group twice a week) is ideal. More volume than you actually need to create a maximum growth response just makes you tired and nothing else.

The question you should be asking is, "what volume and intensity should I be doing for a twice a week frequency?". For you, I'd say most likely 2-3 exercises per muscle group. The intensity comes down to the style of training you like. I think a program like 5/3/1 BBB could be a good option. Lyle McDonald's generic Bulking routine is also a good option because it avoids deads.

this is entirely correct, listen to this man

[Jasonk282]

I'm eating 4000 calories a day. 60% carbs 25% protein and 15% fats. Beyond that any recommendations to my training routine?

Well...since you are not GAINING weight...you need to eat more.

[einstein197]

I think you are asking the wrong question.

The frequency is dependant on your level of development. No matter how far you progress or what volume you use, you still only get about 48 hours post workout of muscle growth (unless you are cheating). So you should always maximise your frequency while still getting enough stimulus and enough recovery. For you, I'd say an upper/lower or Push/Pull (hitting each muscle group twice a week) is ideal. More volume than you actually need to create a maximum growth response just makes you tired and nothing else.

The question you should be asking is, "what volume and intensity should I be doing for a twice a week frequency?". For you, I'd say most likely 2-3 exercises per muscle group. The intensity comes down to the style of training you like. I think a program like 5/3/1 BBB could be a good option. Lyle McDonald's generic Bulking routine is also a good option because it avoids deads.

Thank you, this makes perfect sense to me.

[MrJB00G13]

I think you are asking the wrong question.

The frequency is dependant on your level of development. No matter how far you progress or what volume you use, you still only get about 48 hours post workout of muscle growth (unless you are cheating). So you should always maximise your frequency while still getting enough stimulus and enough recovery. For you, I'd say an upper/lower or Push/Pull (hitting each muscle group twice a week) is ideal. More volume than you actually need to create a maximum growth response just makes you tired and nothing else.

The question you should be asking is, "what volume and intensity should I be doing for a twice a week frequency?". For you, I'd say most likely 2-3 exercises per muscle group. The intensity comes down to the style of training you like. I think a program like 5/3/1 BBB could be a good option. Lyle McDonald's generic Bulking routine is also a good option because it avoids deads.

Very helpful response!!

[einstein197]

I think you are asking the wrong question.

The frequency is dependant on your level of development. No matter how far you progress or what volume you use, you still only get about 48 hours post workout of muscle growth (unless you are cheating). So you should always maximise your frequency while still getting enough stimulus and enough recovery. For you, I'd say an upper/lower or Push/Pull (hitting each muscle group twice a week) is ideal. More volume than you actually need to create a maximum growth response just makes you tired and nothing else.

The question you should be asking is, "what volume and intensity should I be doing for a twice a week frequency?". For you, I'd say most likely 2-3 exercises per muscle group. The intensity comes down to the style of training you like. I think a program like 5/3/1 BBB could be a good option. Lyle McDonald's generic Bulking routine is also a good option because it avoids deads.

I read up on the 5/3/1 BBB and It is a 3 month plan increasing the 5x10 each month by 10% but there is a deloading for the 5/3/1 every fourth week. So do you start over with the same weight for week 5 as you did in week 1? Because the percentages dont change for the 5/3/1 month to month.

[Jasonk282]

I read up on the 5/3/1 BBB and It is a 3 month plan increasing the 5x10 each month by 10% but there is a deloading for the 5/3/1 every fourth week. So do you start over with the same weight for week 5 as you did in week 1? Because the percentages dont change for the 5/3/1 month to month.

No...not even close

You up you training max(90% your 1RM) each cycle and your deload(which you don't have to do) is 40,50 and 60% your training max.

[Divall213]

Just hop on a good full body routine that hits everything 3x a week (frequency>volume) such as Jason DBS 5x5

Eat loads of food and watch your strength and size rocket.

[Adrian77]

Start with a realistic idea of your one-rep max, and follow Wendler's instructions to base all training weights on 90% of that max. You can make it really easy on yourself by spending a couple of workouts working up to a four-rep-max set of each of the four core lifts. Your 4RM should be about 90% of your 1RM. Once you have that 4RM, you can skip a step in your calculations and just use it for all your subsequent percentages. Look for s 5/3/1 calculator to make life easy for yourself. If you can't find one, mp me your email address. Even easier are free apps you can get on your phone.

When you start a new four-week cycle, add five pounds to your 1RMs for bench and shoulder presses and 10 pounds for squats and deadlifts, and recalculate training weights using the new numbers. Weight on accessories are adjusted to hit the reps programmed. Because each week the core lifts fluctuate, the weight you can use on accessories will also fluctuate. Try to get 1-2 reps short of failure.

It works best if you train four times a week, although three times a week could work as well if you don't have a choice, as long as you train all four core lifts before repeating. (In other words, don't skip one so you can do the other three once each week.) Don't train more than two days in a row.

[mariusdeac]

How can it not be obvious?? If you are not gaining weight you aren't eating enough calories.

[einstein197]

No...not even close

You up you training max(90% your 1RM) each cycle and your deload(which you don't have to do) is 40,50 and 60% your training max.

It says to do one 5/3/1 lift per day and for the other you do a 5x10 for example if you do the 5/3/1 for squat then you do 5x10 deads after (then the second day for the week you swap the two exercises). It is a 3 month program and the 5x10 starts at 50% training max month 1 then 60% for the second then 70% for the third. So I was confused about the percentages for the 5/3/1 after. I have the table for that as well and after the deload you are saying to up the weight for week 5 (which makes sense) but then does that mean I calculate my 60% for the 5x10 with the new weight? So I would be upping the percentage and the weight used to calculate to percentage?
Ill post the article too but you need 50 posts to do that and this was my 50th so I have to put it separately.

[einstein197]

Ill post the article too but you need 50 posts to do that and this was my 50th so I have to put it separately.

http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_...onth_challenge

[Adrian77]

It says to do one 5/3/1 lift per day and for the other you do a 5x10 for example if you do the 5/3/1 for squat then you do 5x10 deads after (then the second day for the week you swap the two exercises). It is a 3 month program and the 5x10 starts at 50% training max month 1 then 60% for the second then 70% for the third. So I was confused about the percentages for the 5/3/1 after. I have the table for that as well and after the deload you are saying to up the weight for week 5 (which makes sense) but then does that mean I calculate my 60% for the 5x10 with the new weight? So I would be upping the percentage and the weight used to calculate to percentage?
Ill post the article too but you need 50 posts to do that and this was my 50th so I have to put it separately.

I think you are confusing yourself. The 50%,60%,70% is of your 1RM. As your 1RM increases, the weight will increase to match the percentage. Roughly, if you did 10reps, 1-2 reps short of failure, it would work out to be 70% of your 1RM. 50% is probably 3-4 reps left in the tank. 60% is about 2-3reps left in the tank. So you increase the weight independently of time. It's about always being within the percentage. So as you get stronger you will have to increase the weight to stay in those brackets.

The percentage you choose is optional but the higher you use the faster you can progress. I wouldn't worry too much about hitting these percentages however, because from week to week the 531 lifts fluctuate in volume and intensity so this will throw out what you can do with the accessories.