All of the above^^, here is my "instinctive" calf day
seated calf raises 4 sets 6 plates to failure on each set
hack squat toe raises 4 sets Phil Heath style 15's ( 5 slow/5 fast 5 slow) 5 plates up to 8
standing raises 4 sets Heath Style 15's (stack)
body weight on a block toe raises 4 sets to failure
So depending on my energy(stressful day/easy day) the above 16 sets may be cut down to 10/12 or the Heath style reps may be changed to regular standard reps(easier). The goal is the above 16, however many variables ( a 4 mile run) may change the above plan, thus the "instinctive" label.
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03-01-2013, 07:04 AM #61
Last edited by x-trainer ben; 03-01-2013 at 07:22 AM.
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03-01-2013, 07:15 AM #62
- Join Date: Jul 2006
- Location: Ohio, United States
- Posts: 3,477
- Rep Power: 9111
I have found the good ole plain linear progression of reps and weight works the best for me. As long as I'm going up even one pound or a rep every week or so I'm happy. Undulating periodization.
http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_...a_pr_every_dayLast edited by JRT6; 03-01-2013 at 07:30 AM.
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03-01-2013, 09:27 AM #63
- Join Date: Jan 2005
- Location: San Diego, California, United States
- Posts: 7,660
- Rep Power: 54074
hmm, let me put it this way. My workouts have a plan and a goal but certain aspects are subject to change. I'll use yesterdays squat workout as an example.
My main goal yesterday was to add is some good mornings and really focus on my form for those and my RDL's. I started off with my deep squats, pausing at the bottom and was just sailing through. When I get to 365, the set was so easy that I figured I'd go for a new PR (which wasn't planned). My mistake was jumping 50 pounds from 365 to 415 and next time I'll split the difference with a single at 390 so the additional weight doesn't surprise me like it did yesterday. Live and learn.
From there I moved on to my good mornings which went alright, I still don't have the feel for these yet. Then I finished up with some lighter RDL's comparing myself to this Rippetoe tutorial I found on Youtube.
Power Pause Squats- 135x3, 225x3, 245x3, 275x3, 295x3, 315x3, 345x2, 365x2, 415xfail
Good Mornings- barx5, 95x5, 135x5, 135x5, 135x5 (still trying to get the feel for these down)
RDL- 200x5, 200x5, 200x5
I never did get around to doing any calf raises like I normally do but it's no big deal, I'll hit my calves while doing my leg press on Saturday.
I guess to me 'instinctive training' means I'm not following a plan where I plug in my numbers and the program tells me to do X number of sets with Y amount of weight on Z days. Like the 5/3/1 does. I've done 5/3/1 and consider it to be a great program, I just think there's more than one way to skin a cat.
This was the last cycle I started of the 5/3/1 back on 02-25-2012:
It's pretty much exactly 1 year later and I've been able to add 88lbs since and the most disappointing would be my squats. But I stopped squatting almost entirely for a few months after thinking I had a stroke doing high reps for that widow maker comp. Luckily it was just high blood pressure.Eat, Sleep, Lift...Repeat!
OV35 Journal: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=388841&page=90
xccellence.com, theironden.com
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03-01-2013, 12:12 PM #64
Thanks guys for all the responses.
I am convinced (More then ever) that a structured plan is the best route for my goals. (as strength and increasing it is of importance to me).
I found something that might fit me quite well. It is wendlers "Big but Boring". Basically a 5/3/1 for your main compounds and then a pyramiding 5 sets of 10 of secondary exercises. (the percentages of 1rm going up every month).
A quick scan makes the program look like something I can get excited about. If I can see some the strength increases these programs have generated for others, I think it will be pretty remarkable as I consider myself to be in a high state of train right now.
There is also one other program I am looking at. I am waiting on the details before I decide. I have a deload all next week anyway. Family is going to Disney! The walking should re-hab my leg good....and the rest will be good for the joints.RAW lifts
635 Dead http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mATRBZ0gwdg
585x7 Dead reps http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yf2ZkdNNNQ
420 Bench (paused) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJ2_Q-TLIB8
535 Squat https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kdgVaiTi4-8&feature=youtu.be
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03-01-2013, 12:35 PM #65
- Join Date: Sep 2010
- Location: Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, United States
- Age: 34
- Posts: 12,347
- Rep Power: 41864
I personally always know what body parts I'm working and know the compound I'll lead with that day. I don't know exact weights I will use, but focus on continually trending up in strength on my primary compound by looking at my top sets for that compound. Work up to heavy triples. Only compound that is different is DLs. If I find a gym that'll let me DL again, then I work mostly in singles/doubles and some triples. Almost never go above 5 reps for DL. After, I go more by feel. Have a number of sets that I won't go under, but can go for more if I'm feeling good. Have a general template for most workouts in terms of things I do, but they may vary a little. When cutting, I allow for strength progression to be slower, especially dependent on the macros and deficit that I'm currently sitting at. When bulking, I pretty much require constant weekly strength progression even if that is a small progression - microplate added for top set, extra rep on heaviest set, the exact progression will kind of depend on how my previous work out ended. If I only got 1 rep for my heaviest set the week before, then the next week I'll focus on getting it for a double or triple. If I got a solid triple the week before, then I'll bump weight for the heaviest. That's another part of where I work intuitively.
Tbh, it has worked well for me, even with regards to strength. My focus is less on strength currently, but I still value it. In my first year of serious lifting, I had a 385 bench, 585 DL(should've been 600, but got banned from DLing over 405 since they require you to only use bumper plates and only have 45s), and a 405 squat. While those number are puny comparatively to real strength athletes, I was happy with my first year. When I start back to bulking, I will start re-incorporating more focus on my Big 3. Still mulling over programming in my head, but considering high volume/high intensity day devoted to each of the big 3 with some added fluff after, then a full day focused on hypertrophy. Something like this:
Back/bi fluff
Bench focus(10-15 sets)/chest/tri fluff
Squat focus(10-15 sets)/legs/shoulder fluff
Off
DL focus(10-15 sets)/back/bi fluff
Chest/tri fluff
Legs/shoulder fluff
RepeatLast edited by Lvisaa2; 03-01-2013 at 12:41 PM.
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03-01-2013, 12:49 PM #66
I think once you have a good foundation of experience after a few years there is nothing wrong with instinctive training. The coaches I worked with as a strength coach used to fight with me because I didn't plan out workouts months in advance. I used to make my workouts for my athletes fresh each day often on the spot. The reason why was because you need to take into account each day how the athletes feel, what they did the day before, what else is going on in their life. Just because its heavy squat day in your calendar that you made 5 months ago doesn't automatically mean heavy squats is a great idea today. What if your knees hurt? What if last night you got 2 hours sleep?
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03-01-2013, 01:01 PM #67
YES!! This is pretty much my philosophy as well.
For example, it's Saturday at 9AM. Emily shows up. My plan is to set a C&J PR because last week she set a 10-lb PR on her front squats. So I want to push her today.
Me: How are you, Emily? How's school? How are your mom and dad?
Emily:I'm good. My basketball team won last night. My legs are beat. And, btw, I have softball practice at 5:00 PM today because my coach rescheduled.
Me: No sweat. Today we're gonna do some technique work. We're gonna focus on speed under the bar. Then the last 15 minutes we'll do some prehab and stretches.
That's more or less my version of instinctive when I train my young athletes.
And of course, I could go the other way and trick Emily into thinking we're only gonna approach 1 rep max, but in reality we're gonna set a PR..
A basic plan is still required, but I think just like anything else in life, common sense must be exercised.This above all..
To thine ownself be true..
And it must follow, as the night the day..
Thou can'st not then be false to any man..
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Bros, my Weightlifters and Powerlifters are my credentials.
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03-01-2013, 04:13 PM #68
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03-11-2013, 05:22 PM #69
Just bumping this thread and giving an update on the direction I am choosing going forward.
I am going to for the first time try a 5/3/1 program (with a bodybuilding twist) Wendler calls it "big but boring"
Basically you do your accessory work in 5 sets of 10 with 50-70% 1rm.
I did my first workout tonight and it was strange not to take a set to failure. I will hold out some good hopes....and hopefully the more power based training will benefit me.
will updateRAW lifts
635 Dead http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mATRBZ0gwdg
585x7 Dead reps http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yf2ZkdNNNQ
420 Bench (paused) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJ2_Q-TLIB8
535 Squat https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kdgVaiTi4-8&feature=youtu.be
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03-11-2013, 05:37 PM #70
ID,
I actually mentioned your name in the Chinese system thread I started. Their system is pretty instinctive.
Your plan is good, though. Work that volume.This above all..
To thine ownself be true..
And it must follow, as the night the day..
Thou can'st not then be false to any man..
-----------------------------------------------
Bros, my Weightlifters and Powerlifters are my credentials.
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