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  1. #1
    Et tu, Brute? Ragana's Avatar
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    Layne Norton vs. Dorian Yates (Booksmart vs Experience)



    I'm sure some of you have seen this little argument between Layne Norton and Dorian Yates. I remember a few weeks back an argument erupted on Misc on which guy you would trust me and why. No better place to ask than the IFBB section.. What do you guys think?

    I would personally trust Dorian myself. No matter how much schooling has someone behind them, the guy who has been in the trenches for so many years, won all the Olympia's, built an amazing physique and has the record to back it up takes my vote.
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  2. #2
    Registered User Natural_O's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Ragana View Post


    I'm sure some of you have seen this little argument between Layne Norton and Dorian Yates. I remember a few weeks back an argument erupted on Misc on which guy you would trust me and why. No better place to ask than the IFBB section.. What do you guys think?

    I would personally trust Dorian myself. No matter how much schooling has someone behind them, the guy who has been in the trenches for so many years, won all the Olympia's, built an amazing physique and has the record to back it up takes my vote.
    Was this recent?
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  3. #3
    Et tu, Brute? Ragana's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Natural_O View Post
    Was this recent?
    Don't quote me on this but I believe it happened a couple of weeks ago.
    I could be wrong.
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  4. #4
    Registered User B-Neva's Avatar
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    you know Layne has lifted for like 10-15 years lol it's not like he's "new" to training
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    Originally Posted by Ragana View Post
    I would personally trust Dorian myself. No matter how much schooling has someone behind them, the guy who has been in the trenches for so many years, won all the Olympia's, built an amazing physique and has the record to back it up takes my vote.
    LOL, bros gonna bro.... I am a huge Dorian fan, but I would put my money on Layne each & every time for advice to naturals. Competitive non-natties, on the other hand, would benefit greatly from Dorian's insight, for obvious reasons.
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  6. #6
    caught you mirin Devils's Avatar
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    It looks like a classic case of "I would look like that if I took as many steroids as that guy"
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  7. #7
    Et tu, Brute? Ragana's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by alan aragon View Post
    LOL, bros gonna bro.... I am a huge Dorian fan, but I would put my money on Layne each & every time for advice to naturals. Competitive non-natties, on the other hand, would benefit greatly from Dorian's insight, for obvious reasons.
    I see what you're saying but from what I recalled, Layne has flip-flopped on a LOT of the things he used to preach a few years back. Seems to me like often time, he rides a trend.

    Originally Posted by Devils View Post
    It looks like a classic case of "I would look like that if I took as many steroids as that guy"
    Sort of how I see it as well.
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  8. #8
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    Fkn twitter, took me 5 minutes to figure out the dialog
    What does he mean by prop up his PhD? He puts Layne Norton PhD everywhere he goes, it's like his last name
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  9. #9
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    kinda noticing a trend here...

    those that bring up studies are always the ones with the inferior physique
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  10. #10
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    "You don't see me constantly prop up my PhD..." Bullcrap...his Twitter username is "DR. Layne Norton." Although I'm a big fan of Layne's physique and think he does have some great ideas...my impression on him has also been that he's just a rich kid with a fancy degree. Dorian is quite knowledgeable as well. I wouldn't really trust either since I can't train like Dorian for obvious reasons, and I'm not anal enough to worry about the things Layne worries about.
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    I respect Layne and his advice. He without a doubt understands the human body better than Dorian Yates, but the studies, Layne refers to, are not with individuals on AAS. Without a doubt that is going to change M-Tor production, etc etc etc. My wife and I named our dog Dorian so I am not hating on him, but I would rather rack Layne's brain over Dorians. In the end, I like what John Meadows has to say more than either of them.
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  12. #12
    caught you mirin Devils's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by alan aragon View Post
    LOL, bros gonna bro.... I am a huge Dorian fan, but I would put my money on Layne each & every time for advice to naturals. Competitive non-natties, on the other hand, would benefit greatly from Dorian's insight, for obvious reasons.
    Ironically the same advice may not work as well for naturals who produce less testosterone than someone else.
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  13. #13
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    I'm a big fan of both, but I would personally listen to Norton over Yates, and this is strictly due to me being a natural. If I was using, then I would prefer Yates' advice.
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    One thing about studies, is they're a conclusion based upon limited information. That's why even huge concepts like Newtons Law of Gravity don't always hold up under every condition. Einsteins theories come into play in those situations.

    I think we forget this when reading all these studies. The results they get are specific to the factors used in the experiment. Ill give you one example. Serotonin is always cited as a major factor in depression. Medications that increase serotonin help depressed people. But when they take normal people and deplete them of serotonin, for some reason they don't become depressed.

    Why is this? Obviously the medication is doing something. But obviously serotonin is not the whole story either.
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    To be honest, I love Dorian, his work ethic and his accomplishments speak for themselves. but to answer something like he did makes him sound a big arrogant.

    On the other than, DO NOT LIKE Layne.....he is so full of himself and I just have a wish to disagree with him on everything, but bodybuilders and bodybuilding (and everything else) could only benefit from scientific studies. To say that something will work because it worked for you is bro-science and it is funny to hear from a former Mr. O.

    So while I might not like Layne personally, I think his advice to look at the studies closer makes sense and should not be dismissed by calling rank. Silly move Dorian. But then again, maybe Dorian just finds Layne as unpalatable as the rest of us and just wanted to not agree with him.
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    Originally Posted by TTimmerman View Post
    kinda noticing a trend here...

    those that bring up studies are always the ones with the inferior physique
    you're comparing apples to oranges here.
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    "Why do you believe the studies are flawed? Please cite specific points."

    ...

    ...

    "6xMr O"

    How is this even worthy of discussion, honestly?
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    ^
    Are you that Ian guy from the debate?
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    Originally Posted by TTimmerman View Post
    kinda noticing a trend here...

    those that bring up studies are always the ones with the inferior physique
    those that bring up studies can be really annoying, too. not all the time... but many of the time...
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    Originally Posted by RoroCwalker View Post
    ^
    Are you that Ian guy from the debate?
    Yes sir.
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    Originally Posted by TTimmerman View Post
    kinda noticing a trend here...

    those that bring up studies are always the ones with the inferior physique
    Comparing their physiques isn't relevant and we both know the reason why.
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  22. #22
    Pre Contest 2014 RoroCwalker's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by imccarthy View Post
    Yes sir.
    inb4 I'm getting trolled and it's not actually you.

    anyway...you're the one who's relying so much on science and preach it, defend it and what not against Dave no? Shouldn't you be the one defending Norton?
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  23. #23
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    im believing the guy who studies the science. Norton looks good himself and won a few shows. Dorian winning Olympias doesnt mean much in this argument. You all would do well to listen to the educated guy.
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    Originally Posted by jld010 View Post
    im believing the guy who studies the science. Norton looks good himself and won a few shows. Dorian winning Olympias doesnt mean much in this argument. You all would do well to listen to the educated guy.
    They're both educated. Layne has a PHD and Dorian has a ton of real life bodybuilding experience. Both sources of knowledge are very applicable to any discussion involving bodybuilding. It's funny that Dorian is arguing with Layne. I'm not sure what the argument is, but I do recall that Dorian did practice something that Layne supports that most if not all "BROS" will say is bs.

    5 mins in.
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    Improve my total every time I step on the platform.

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  25. #25
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    Originally Posted by zmcdole View Post
    They're both educated. Layne has a PHD and Dorian has a ton of real life bodybuilding experience. Both sources of knowledge are very applicable to any discussion involving bodybuilding. It's funny that Dorian is arguing with Layne. I'm not sure what the argument is, but I do recall that Dorian did practice something that Layne supports that most if not all "BROS" will say is bs.

    5 mins in.
    Layne has more of the understanding, he has a PHD in this chit, and makes it his lifes ambition to understand every single aspect of the science involved. Dorian had a Body of a Demi God, why does this fool so many ppl. The genetic aspect in bb is almost everything. He responded unbelievablly and took only 3-4 years beofre he won the UK champs. Dont tell me that msot of BB.com users are those typical tards that always ask the big dudes in the gym with the massive 22inch arms, that roid themselves to the gills and use shoddy form for advice beacuse he must surely know more than everyone. Respect the science, and in this case, Norton knows and understands much more on the subject than Dorian.
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    ^
    Yeah, I'll trust a piece of paper stating my degree of knowledge instead of doing something that's beneficial for myself.
    And, everyone is different genetically, therefore nothing should be set in stone.
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    The shoddy form comment was not aimed toward Dorian. In terms of prep, training style, apporach and discipline, Doiran exmplifies all that is right with prof bb.
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    Both.
    A pattern in the chaos.
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  29. #29
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    Lettuce be cereal. Layne trains just as hard as Dorian. Dorian just has elite genetics (super sups also help lol).
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    declarative knowledge vs procedural knowledge

    GOGOGO
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