A quick idea on training

[MikeyH83]

Hey guys I'm new to powerlifting and was thinking about the different training methods out there. I bought the 5,3,1 book and am reading through that. I had an idea that makes sense in my head, but I was wondering what you guys thought.

Monday
Squat
Work 8-10 sets going from 65% to 99%
Supplemental Work: Leg Curls, Leg Press

Wednesday
Bench
Work 8-10 sets going from 65% to 99%
Supplemental Work: Skull Crushers, Closegrip Bench

Friday
Deadlift
Work 8-10 sets going from 65% to 99%
Supplemental Work: Hyperextensions, Shrugs, Dumbell Rows

Saturday
Military Press
Work 8-10 sets going from 65% to 99%
Supplemental Work: Rear delt pec dec, Dumbell Shoulder Press

Sunday-Complete Rest Day NO increased physical exertion outside of the gym. (eat, sleep, watch tv... veg out)

Throughout the cycle you consistently keep your main lift percentages the same. But every weak you increase your supplemental work by 5-10% For the week. Then the following month increase your main lift 10% and start week 1 with your supplemental work, where you left off on week 4 of the previous month.


The school of thought is, if you keep making your body hit 99%, as well as raise your supplemental work weight, in my head at least, it should increase strength by a really good amount. My only concern is hitting your CNS. Basically it's really similar to 5,3,1 except you're hitting 99% every week in order for your body to grow accustomed to that load and that lift. Anybody try anything like this? Or is there a similar program out there in place already?

[thom2355]

You mean linear progression? You are right, that is probably a good concept of thinking for training. I wonder if there is a program in the stickies that would cover this?

[MikeyH83]

You mean linear progression? You are right, that is probably a good concept of thinking for training. I wonder if there is a program in the stickies that would cover this?

To answer your sarcastic question, yes there is. And yes linear progression... but I didn't see any that had you hit your 99% mark every week.

[dtaps24]

This is where you run into what I call the Icarus conundrum. You will continually roll the ball up the hill but once you get too close the ball will melt in the heat of the sun. You don't want to be like Icarus.

[arian11]

You mean linear progression? You are right, that is probably a good concept of thinking for training. I wonder if there is a program in the stickies that would cover this?

Is that how you understood it? I understood it as Max Effort squat, Max Effort bench, Max Effort deadlift, Max Effort Military Press...except without any conjugation.

[InspecktaDeck]

Looks like a bb'ing routine.

[MikeyH83]

Looks like a bb'ing routine.

That's kinda where I got it from. Basically an altered version of what I've been doing for the last 2 years. But I've never gone to 99% I've always stopped around 80% as my heaviest since I was worrying about hitting 5-8 reps instead of 1 rep max. I don't know... I just brought it up because it worked for me in bodybuilding but I don't know if it would be too taxing going ME like that.

[scottyk31]

this is your typical commercial gym routine that usually gets people stuck for years and wondering why.

You do not have to go to 99% every workout. If you do want a program that uses the max effort method do westside. But 4 maximal efforts in a week will crush you. If you do not believe me go into the log section here and see how many people with high totals are maxing on each lift each week.

5/3/1 is a program that calls for you to "leave one in the tank" and progress linearly. If you are at 99% all the time you will not be able to keep adding 5lbs to your max each week.

Trust this advice:
pick a program that fits your schedule and lifter style (go to program sticky)
do the program AS WRITTEN, the authors of these programs really do know what they are doing.

you will be successful following this

also there is a reason no programs on linear progression do not hit 99% every week. It pretty much defeats the principal

[MikeyH83]

this is your typical commercial gym routine that usually gets people stuck for years and wondering why.

You do not have to go to 99% every workout. If you do want a program that uses the max effort method do westside. But 4 maximal efforts in a week will crush you. If you do not believe me go into the log section here and see how many people with high totals are maxing on each lift each week.

5/3/1 is a program that calls for you to "leave one in the tank" and progress linearly. If you are at 99% all the time you will not be able to keep adding 5lbs to your max each week.

Trust this advice:
pick a program that fits your schedule and lifter style (go to program sticky)
do the program AS WRITTEN, the authors of these programs really do know what they are doing.

you will be successful following this

also there is a reason no programs on linear progression do not hit 99% every week. It pretty much defeats the principal

Just what I was looking for. Thanks for the reply!

[scottyk31]

No problem. I used to max all the time and do forced reps etc... before I decided to compete. When I decided to compete I used 5/3/1 and basically followed it up to my first competition. In a years time I made more gains using this method than pretty much the last 2-3 years before that going to a maximum basically every workout. Its all in the head. I thought I would regress, but instead I progressed.

[BuckWyld]

This is where you run into what I call the Icarus conundrum. You will continually roll the ball up the hill but once you get too close the ball will melt in the heat of the sun. You don't want to be like Icarus.

I prefer to think of it as the Sisyphus conundrum. You will continually fly up to the top of a hill but then your wings will roll back down each time. I mean as long as we are mixing metaphors...

[DrunkonMilk]

Just to add to what everyone is saying. The 5-3-1 program also has your training max's at 90% of your true 1 rm for each lift. That is a huge part of the program. Just saying in case you missed that.

[MikeyH83]

Just to add to what everyone is saying. The 5-3-1 program also has your training max's at 90% of your true 1 rm for each lift. That is a huge part of the program. Just saying in case you missed that.

Yep I picked up on that. I was just thinking that if I hit my max on a consistent basis my body would adjust quicker. I mean logically to me , it makes sense lol. But from what Scotty said, it seems in practice it may not work as well as I think.

[scottyk31]

It just comes down to programming. It seems like a great thought, that if I push that maximum level, I will keep improving. Westside does this but you do not max in 4 lifts in a single week, plus you are changing exercises from week to week. If you have a meet planned and you are not far away, most lifters use a program that either peaks or includes heavy singles. For example 5/3/1 for powerlifting, most sheiko programs taper the volume down to some heavy singles, I use the Joshstrength method by Josh Bryant and the final 3 weeks the heavy work is for a rep around 90-95%.

If you are serious about getting into powerlifting find a meet, submit your form in so you are committed, learn the rules of that federation and start with a reputable program. Getting a meet in will give you starting numbers as well as the experience of what passable lifts are. Dont worry about big numbers or what your weight class is in this meet.

You will be surprised of how much of a learning experience just competing is.

[arian11]

Yep I picked up on that. I was just thinking that if I hit my max on a consistent basis my body would adjust quicker. I mean logically to me , it makes sense lol. But from what Scotty said, it seems in practice it may not work as well as I think.

You should read up on the John Broz Method.

[MikeyH83]

It just comes down to programming. It seems like a great thought, that if I push that maximum level, I will keep improving. Westside does this but you do not max in 4 lifts in a single week, plus you are changing exercises from week to week. If you have a meet planned and you are not far away, most lifters use a program that either peaks or includes heavy singles. For example 5/3/1 for powerlifting, most sheiko programs taper the volume down to some heavy singles, I use the Joshstrength method by Josh Bryant and the final 3 weeks the heavy work is for a rep around 90-95%.

If you are serious about getting into powerlifting find a meet, submit your form in so you are committed, learn the rules of that federation and start with a reputable program. Getting a meet in will give you starting numbers as well as the experience of what passable lifts are. Dont worry about big numbers or what your weight class is in this meet.

You will be surprised of how much of a learning experience just competing is.

There's one about an 2 hours north of here in Orlando in April Maybe I'll give it a shot lol. There's on in Feb too, I'm gonna go to watch and see what it's all about... maybe I'll compete in April! Try to hit my goals by then.

[arian11]

There's one about an 2 hours north of here in Orlando in April Maybe I'll give it a shot lol. There's on in Feb too, I'm gonna go to watch and see what it's all about... maybe I'll compete in April! Try to hit my goals by then.

You live in Florida, brah?

If you want to go watch some of the best lifters lift, go to Raw Unity Meet 6 in Tampa on Feb 23-24th. Also, USAPL Raw Nationals is in Orlando in July and you can see some great lifters there. If you want to get started with a local meet, USAPL is doing a state meet in Ft. Lauderdale at the end of March. I might be there, as well as a few other posters in the powerlifting section.

[MikeyH83]

You live in Florida, brah?

If you want to go watch some of the best lifters lift, go to Raw Unity Meet 6 in Tampa on Feb 23-24th. Also, USAPL Raw Nationals is in Orlando in July and you can see some great lifters there. If you want to get started with a local meet, USAPL is doing a state meet in Ft. Lauderdale at the end of March. I might be there, as well as a few other posters in the powerlifting section.

Oh nice! Yeah I'll definitely go to the Tampa one. The one in April is at Europa so it would be a bit packed for my to compete but I may do it anyway just to do it. And I'll definitely be going to the Fort Lauderdale meet as that's just an hour south. Maybe I'll start there actually.

[arian11]

Oh nice! Yeah I'll definitely go to the Tampa one. The one in April is at Europa so it would be a bit packed for my to compete but I may do it anyway just to do it. And I'll definitely be going to the Fort Lauderdale meet as that's just an hour south. Maybe I'll start there actually.

Yea, this is actually a good year in Florida for big time meets. USAPL will be having several national meets held in Florida. And RUM always brings out the best of the best. So any of those will be great to go watch some strong ass people lift heavy. But like you said, it will be crowded and maybe even discouraging to compete in those for your first meet. Plus you have to qualify for them.

But any state meet would be a great place to start. Raw United, USAPL, and SPF have several meets in Florida year round and I hear RPS is going to start doing meets in Ft. Lauderdale soon. I am a bit biased towards USAPL, that is why I suggested it. Plus there will be a few of us there if you need any help.

[MikeyH83]

I've been looking mostly at USAPL since they were fairly active in Florida last year. I never made it to a meet but I've been interested since about September, and just decided this week to jump in. I'm looking forward to March and hopefully find a state meet towards the second half of 2013 that I may be able to get my feet wet with.

[Fivefootkillerz]

you must live close too me there is 3 uspa meets in port st lucie as well

[predator187]

I had a lot of success running the Westside for Skinny Bastards 1 program. Its not that complicated, you can customize it (to a certain extent) and it developed a pretty good foundation for me to build on, check it out.

[MikeyH83]

you must live close too me there is 3 uspa meets in port st lucie as well

I live in PSL lol I gotta find those meets!

Thanks predator I'll check it out!

[nevergain]

I'm curious why you say 99% instead of 100%. Unless you are doing 500+ lbs on all lifts there will be no difference.


Edit: unless you have micro weights.

[MikeyH83]

I'm curious why you say 99% instead of 100%. Unless you are doing 500+ lbs on all lifts there will be no difference.


Edit: unless you have micro weights.

Because as you've already noted, as you get higher in your lifts 1% becomes substantial...

[scorpionsf]

Because as you've already noted, as you get higher in your lifts 1% becomes substantial...

you aren't at that point

[MikeyH83]

you aren't at that point

lol ya think? Yet those that are at that level... it would be relevant... And from what I've been reading most methods use 99% rather than 100% for that reason. So I decided to incorporate that. I'm currently working on my PhD and am tired of arguing over why I'm using certain figures over others... I can't even escape that **** here.

[arian11]

lol ya think? Yet those that are at that level... it would be relevant... And from what I've been reading most methods use 99% rather than 100% for that reason. So I decided to incorporate that. I'm currently working on my PhD and am tired of arguing over why I'm using certain figures over others... I can't even escape that **** here.

What methods have you read? And what are you getting your Ph. D in?

[scorpionsf]

What methods have you read? And what are you getting your Ph. D in?

all those methods that use 99%. they are top secret though, this is why his "program" looks so wrong to us. we haven't been informed of those deep dark 99% methods that all of the best lifters use

[MikeyH83]

What methods have you read? And what are you getting your Ph. D in?

Mechanical Engineering... and if you know about the industry please don't lecture me on how useless this degree is, I'm fully aware of that face. lol I'm just so close I figured, 'what the hell'.