IF: Part Three

[adam81pdx]

Think this is a good route for me? I can gain and lose fat VERY easily but am skin and bones otherwise.. Every time I bulk and cut I end up at the same weight/body fat w/ little-to-no change in actual muscle mass.. Oh so frustrating.

[The Solution]

Think this is a good route for me? I can gain and lose fat VERY easily but am skin and bones otherwise.. Every time I bulk and cut I end up at the same weight/body fat w/ little-to-no change in actual muscle mass.. Oh so frustrating.

Thats your training problem. You need to increase your intensity and when you do workout you need to elevate your overall motivation and energy/focus. Thats the problem. 6'0 and 160 you need to eat!

[1quick1]

Think this is a good route for me? I can gain and lose fat VERY easily but am skin and bones otherwise.. Every time I bulk and cut I end up at the same weight/body fat w/ little-to-no change in actual muscle mass.. Oh so frustrating.

Sounds like to much back and forth (cutting/bulking) to me. How about eating 100 calories over maintenence per day for a MUCH longer period of time to make slow muscle gains.

[adam81pdx]

Well I'm 170 now and about 14% bf following my trip lol. My problem is I QUICKLY put on fat when I eat over.. maybe slightly over is the way to go. I figured by cycling carbs and doing a recomp or a slow bulk with leangains I might be able to offset some of that fat gain.

[mgering1]

Sounds like to much back and forth (cutting/bulking) to me. How about eating 100 calories over maintenence per day for a MUCH longer period of time to make slow muscle gains.

tried writing this before but wouldn't let me post. ^ seems like your gaining too much fat when bulking and when trying to cut you do it too aggressively and lose muscle. it sucks dieting for a long period but in the end its the smartest thing to do. The more aggressive you cut the higher percentage of muscle loss and less percentage of fat loss vs slower method.

[adam81pdx]

I think your spot on mgering1... My last bout was in 2012.. Went on a 5 month bulk from 162-193... so about a pound a week.. then went from 193-160 in about 4.5 months so 1.5 pounds or so a week. I ended up looking almost identical in the mirror! Was a huge waste of time given my dedication and effort.. I'm going to try this leangains route I think but keep my daily calories close on either side for workout/nonworkout days to slow down the process and do it right.. Patience!

[1quick1]

I think your spot on mgering1... My last bout was in 2012.. Went on a 5 month bulk from 162-193... so about a pound a week.. then went from 193-160 in about 4.5 months so 1.5 pounds or so a week. I ended up looking almost identical in the mirror! Was a huge waste of time given my dedication and effort.. I'm going to try this leangains route I think but keep my daily calories close on either side for workout/nonworkout days to slow down the process and do it right.. Patience!

That's because nobody in the world gains 31lbs of muscle in 5 months. It would take most people 3 years to gain that. Gaining 31lbs of pure muscle in 5 months would probably be difficult on steroids....

You are simply not eating the correct amount of calories. Simply as that.

[makeitright]

Have any of you guys that have been IF'ing for a longer period of time ever tried bulking both with AND without bcaa prior to training, keeping as many other variables constant as possible, then compared end results? Just curious because I have been training fasted without bcaas for about two weeks now and would love to continue saving money and just drinking a cup of coffee prior as I have been doing.

I've done my research and it seems as though the jury is still split on the matter. So I'd like to hear from first hand experience if possible before I decide to throw down the extra bucks on bcaas. I definitely don't want to do anything to hinder what little lean mass I've worked to gain thus far.

Bump.

Thinking I might play guinea pig and see how things pan out without the bcaas, then introduce them next time I bulk and compare results unless anyone else has any first hand experience.

[Wankelpt]

I am considering IF but I am not sure how to setup the feeding windows when we consider my training hours, due to the fact that I have a 9to5job.

I can do my weight lifting only at 2 specific times during the day.

Option A: 7AM before I go to work (need to wake arround 5am tho)
Option B: 5PM after work.

With option A I would have to eat all my calories during working hours.

With option B I would have to eat my first meal in the gym and the rest during the night.

So I would like to know from people that did IF and had similiar schedule issues which stratagies they used to go arround this problem.

[1quick1]

I am considering IF but I am not sure how to setup the feeding windows when we consider my training hours, due to the fact that I have a 9to5job.

I can do my weight lifting only at 2 specific times during the day.

Option A: 7AM before I go to work (need to wake arround 5am tho)
Option B: 5PM after work.

With option A I would have to eat all my calories during working hours.

With option B I would have to eat my first meal in the gym and the rest during the night.

So I would like to know from people that did IF and had similiar schedule issues which stratagies they used to go arround this problem.

If is simple for 9-5 for me at least. I do cardio at about 7am before work lift at 1pm on break from work. I'll eat between 4-10pm.

IMO I would work out in the AM. This all comes down to finding out what works for you but fasted cardio/training has worked better for me. I also really like knowing at 5pm I get to go home and eat for 5 hours and not do anything but watch TV as I've already hit the gym 2x and worked 8 hours.

[germaine07]

I am considering IF but I am not sure how to setup the feeding windows when we consider my training hours, due to the fact that I have a 9to5job.

I can do my weight lifting only at 2 specific times during the day.

Option A: 7AM before I go to work (need to wake arround 5am tho)
Option B: 5PM after work.

With option A I would have to eat all my calories during working hours.

With option B I would have to eat my first meal in the gym and the rest during the night.

So I would like to know from people that did IF and had similiar schedule issues which stratagies they used to go arround this problem.

If it doesn't suit your lifestyle, don't do it.

That being said, you could easily break your fast at lunch in work.

[VixTrader]

This thread is AWESOME !

So somewhere in the middle of part 2 I saw someone mention that it seems a lot of the success stories with IF are for people who are already pre-disposed to being lean. They wanted examples of people where that isn't the case. I started doing IF every day on May 1st, 2013 ( about 7 weeks ago)


18 hour fast / 6 hour eating window from 2-8. 2000 calories a day from 2 healthy meals plus 1 crappy Starbucks Frappuccino everyday. 150 grams protein, 300 grams of carbs, no supplements or protein shakes of any kind ever.


May 1st, 2013:

6'0"
215 lbs
20% BF
running about 3 x 10km runs a week, average time about 47 minutes each
weightlifting twice a week. (5x3 on Bench-press @ 225 / 5x8 on deadlift @ 275. Not a power lifter by any stretch, but not weak either )


Today, June 27th, 2013 (7 weeks later)

6'0" (nope I didn't grow taller yet)
195 lbs
14% BF
I've improved my 10km running times by at least 4 minutes each
I'm now Benching 5 sets of 5 @ 225 easily and will be going up to sets of 7 soon, and my 275 deadlift sets are a breeze now.


Conclusion:

I've lost 20 pounds in 7 weeks, reduced my body fat by 6%, and I'm much stronger and faster then I ever was before. Also, I find the 18 / 6 eating window to be tremendously easy at this point. The only time I'm ever tempted to snack is around 2-3 am ( I stay up late because of work )

Anybody who says you can't lose weight, gain muscle and strength, and clean up your diet simply hasn't tried IF. It's amazing. The hardest part about Intermittent fasting is convincing all the meat heads around me that there is actually real science behind it and IT WORKS !

[germaine07]

Conclusion:

I've lost 20 pounds in 7 weeks, reduced my body fat by 6%, and I'm much stronger and faster then I ever was before. Also, I find the 18 / 6 eating window to be tremendously easy at this point. The only time I'm ever tempted to snack is around 2-3 am ( I stay up late because of work )

Anybody who says you can't lose weight, gain muscle and strength, and clean up your diet simply hasn't tried IF. It's amazing. The hardest part about Intermittent fasting is convincing all the meat heads around me that there is actually real science behind it and IT WORKS !

Don't confuse gaining strength with gaining muscle. They are not the same thing.

The hardest part about IF is convincing people that it's not magic and that it's the calories restriction that makes an impact, not when you choose to eat.

[adam81pdx]

I have a cardio question in relation to leangains.. Couldn't find much online regarding doing HIIT. I'm doing a (hopefully) short leangains cut following their +10 -35 macros and cycling carbs with a 4 day a week workout setup. If I add in HIIT for 20 minutes a day 2 of my 3 off days a week would I modify my intake those days and if so, would I add any carbs or just more fats/proteins?

I'm trying to shed about 10 lbs of fat I put on during an extended vacation to get back into summer shape before starting a slow bulk on this setup..

[germaine07]

If it's just a short cut, I wouldn't add back those calories. Defeats the purpose of doing cardio.

[adam81pdx]

I figured as much but wasn't sure if I'd lose too much muscle by not giving myself some carbs...

[Enlightening]

Big IF fan here. Currently running 4 hours on rest days and 6 hours in PWO window on lifting days. I find this suits me better during a cut - does anyone else find that they have less issues of hunger on longer fasts? When I go back to 16 hours I sometimes get hungry around 14 hours in, but doing 20 every day and I have to remind myself to eat.

[Enlightening]

I have a cardio question in relation to leangains.. Couldn't find much online regarding doing HIIT. I'm doing a (hopefully) short leangains cut following their +10 -35 macros and cycling carbs with a 4 day a week workout setup. If I add in HIIT for 20 minutes a day 2 of my 3 off days a week would I modify my intake those days and if so, would I add any carbs or just more fats/proteins?

I'm trying to shed about 10 lbs of fat I put on during an extended vacation to get back into summer shape before starting a slow bulk on this setup..

Hey bro have you heard Layne Norton's latest on this? He and Jake Wilson say 6x30 seconds is all you need saying "any longer than 30 seconds isn't high intensity". Apparently it has a massive positive metabolic effect so you shouldn't need to worry about changing your diet so much, might be worth checking out. Not tried it myself however as I can't fit HIIT around my lifting schedule.

[EmperorRyker]

Bump.

Thinking I might play guinea pig and see how things pan out without the bcaas, then introduce them next time I bulk and compare results unless anyone else has any first hand experience.

This is something I've also asked multiple times, but never received answers. So if you update us on your experiment, that'd be great!

[USMARINE8152]

Tired IF a while ago when PBATEMEN was running his journal...I did drop some weight but as usual I get worried given all the broscience in the world that training intense and heavy on an empty stomach is bad so I stopped since I felt like I was wasting away which im sure was mostly in my mind....does anyone in here actually powerlift and IF???

[klaximilian]

One topic I didnt see covered:

Is it counter-productive to break the fast for one day per week, to maybe enjoy a full day of meals with the family? If anything, I'd do this one a lifting day to make sure I'm burning a little extra and using the fuel in the gym.

[davo26]

One topic I didnt see covered:

Is it counter-productive to break the fast for one day per week, to maybe enjoy a full day of meals with the family? If anything, I'd do this one a lifting day to make sure I'm burning a little extra and using the fuel in the gym.

im sure thered be no problems whatsoever. IF is meant to fit your calories into your lifestyle, its not a magic formula for success. if it suits you to eat a full day of meals with your family then go ahead :-)

[makeitright]

This is something I've also asked multiple times, but never received answers. So if you update us on your experiment, that'd be great!

Well, starting tomorrow I'll be going on my third week of completely fasted training with just black coffee pre-workout. Most of my lifts are continuing to go up (bench is my nemesis, heh) and energy is great. I absolutely love it.

As far as body composition, growth also seems to be going in the right direction. The weird thing is though, since I doing a true 16/8 the scale has sky rocketed the past 3-4 weeks (nearly 5 lbs gained) but I don't seem to have noticed much in the way of excess fat gains. Yet again, I do see myself every day, so who knows. I'm guessing that it might be increased glycogen/water, so hopefully that won't make tracking gains via scale too hard. I'm trying to rely on the mirror/how my clothes fit as much as possible though.

It'll be interesting to see how things go next time I bulk if I decide to go the route of bcaa supplementation and compare end results.

[determined4000]

This is something I've also asked multiple times, but never received answers. So if you update us on your experiment, that'd be great!

i have said many times that I dont use BCAAs

[determined4000]

One topic I didnt see covered:

Is it counter-productive to break the fast for one day per week, to maybe enjoy a full day of meals with the family? If anything, I'd do this one a lifting day to make sure I'm burning a little extra and using the fuel in the gym.

o
if should fit into ur life
not the other way around

[EmperorRyker]

i have said many times that I dont use BCAAs

Oh OK, but what I'm interested in is a) what are your results and progression, and b) how do they compare with using BCAA's if you've ever gone that route, as well?

[klaximilian]

o
if should fit into ur life
not the other way around

Thanks, I was probably going to do it anyway. I just like the assurance that I'm not screwing it up by expanding the 8-hour window once a week.

[determined4000]

Oh OK, but what I'm interested in is a) what are your results and progression, and b) how do they compare with using BCAA's if you've ever gone that route, as well?

a. have gained muscle (based on incrased lifts) and weight (scale)
never have used BCAAs

[Wankelpt]

How important is the carb/calorie cycling if you are cutting with IF?

I still have arround 18% bodyfat btw.

At the moment I am eating with 500 calorie deficiet each day.

[germaine07]

How important is the carb/calorie cycling if you are cutting with IF?

It's not important at all.