rest-pause "effective reps" vs straight sets?

[7asssa7]

I have read some articles about myo reps and rest-pause training which advocate the following approach :

Example: bench press: 1 st set you do 8-10 reps, 15 seconds rest then pushout 3 reps and so on.

How does it compare to straight sets in terms of hypertrophy? I thought hypertrophy is a matter of total laod and volume and some fatigue?

[7asssa7]

Bump

[ironwill2008]

I have read some articles about myo reps and rest-pause training which advocate the following approach :

Example: bench press: 1 st set you do 8-10 reps, 15 seconds rest then pushout 3 reps and so on.

How does it compare to straight sets in terms of hypertrophy? I thought hypertrophy is a matter of total laod and volume and some fatigue?

"Rest-Pause" is in the same bag as "failure;" neither necessary nor recommended for growth.

Stick with progressing weight and/or reps lifted with good form using conventional straight sets.

[7asssa7]

"Rest-Pause" is in the same bag as "failure;" neither necessary nor recommended for growth.

Stick with progressing weight and/or reps lifted with good form using conventional straight sets.

Thanks for your reply. But what about the claims of "effective" reps? So hypetrophy is all about volume and load, not fatigue that may come with rest-pause/myo reps?

[ironwill2008]

Thanks for your reply. But what about the claims of "effective" reps? So hypetrophy is all about volume and load, not fatigue that may come with rest-pause/myo reps?

Hypertrophy is all about stressing the muscle just a little bit more than you did during the previous workout, and then repeating it over a long period of time. The linchpin is progression, not training to failure or beyond.

While extreme tactics such as R-P may have some value as a plaueau-buster when used infrequently, trying to incorporate it all the time will leave you open to burnout and possible injury.

[gomez26]

"Rest-Pause" is in the same bag as "failure;" neither necessary nor recommended for growth.

While extreme tactics such as R-P may have some value as a plaueau-buster when used infrequently, trying to incorporate it all the time will leave you open to burnout and possible injury.

r-p does not have to be extreme i.e about failure & beyond.
its possible to stop a rep or 2 short of failure & still use this technique. e.g. do 10 reps of an 11 or 12 rep max, then rest just long enough & do 3 reps (where u could have done 4 reps in an all-out effort) and so forth continuing this way.
its just a different pattern of stimulus, progression can be tracked like in anything else.

[69Boss429]

r-p does not have to be extreme i.e about failure & beyond.
its possible to stop a rep or 2 short of failure & still use this technique. e.g. do 10 reps of an 11 or 12 rep max, then rest just long enough & do 3 reps (where u could have done 4 reps in an all-out effort) and so forth continuing this way.
its just a different pattern of stimulus, progression can be tracked like in anything else.

I agree. Myo Reps isn't about going to failure. So overreaching/overtraining is minimized.

Going to near failure, one rep left in the tank is where you want to be on reps. Rest 20-30 seconds between sets max.

Start with the activation set of 10-12 reps. Pick a weight where you will be near failure in that rep range. Rack the weight. Rest 20-30 seconds. Pick up the weight and rep out 5 more reps (mini-set). Rack the weight. Rest again for 20-30 seconds. And repeat mini-sets until rep speed slows down considerably. If you can rep more than 5 reps on mini-sets shorten the rest period. I find that on large muscle groups 20-30 seconds is good and with smaller muscle groups 10-15 seconds works well. Mini-sets are also taken to near failure.

Check out Gym Geek on iTunes it comes preloaded with a Myo Reps 4 day routine.

[7asssa7]

r-p does not have to be extreme i.e about failure & beyond.
its possible to stop a rep or 2 short of failure & still use this technique. e.g. do 10 reps of an 11 or 12 rep max, then rest just long enough & do 3 reps (where u could have done 4 reps in an all-out effort) and so forth continuing this way.
its just a different pattern of stimulus, progression can be tracked like in anything else.

Is there a point in doing this only rather than straight sets? How superior/more effective is that approach?

[Cheesin]

Hypertrophy is all about stressing the muscle just a little bit more than you did during the previous workout, and then repeating it over a long period of time. The linchpin is progression, not training to failure or beyond.

While extreme tactics such as R-P may have some value as a plaueau-buster when used infrequently, trying to incorporate it all the time will leave you open to burnout and possible injury.

I've noticed that you usually seem to know what you're talking about on these boards, and you're no doubt quite experienced, but I can't help but wonder if you've ever tried to progress on anything other than straight sets. Have you strayed from the "tried and true" methods to experience other methods first hand? I can tell you, that "rest pause" has got me progressing a bit faster than I ever have on straight sets. Now granted, there's some variables that I haven't quite accounted for (as I've increased my frequency as well) but I can say that progression is quite easily achievable through rest pause.

[pyaarawala]

"Rest-Pause" is in the same bag as "failure;" neither necessary nor recommended for growth.

Stick with progressing weight and/or reps lifted with good form using conventional straight sets.

I don't use rest pause often, but what if in the middle of a set of skullcrushers I pause for a few seconds in between the later reps? Because the starting position is comfortable and I could use the extra few seconds of rest to get the rest of my reps of the set in.

[7asssa7]

I've noticed that you usually seem to know what you're talking about on these boards, and you're no doubt quite experienced, but I can't help but wonder if you've ever tried to progress on anything other than straight sets. Have you strayed from the "tried and true" methods to experience other methods first hand? I can tell you, that "rest pause" has got me progressing a bit faster than I ever have on straight sets. Now granted, there's some variables that I haven't quite accounted for (as I've increased my frequency as well) but I can say that progression is quite easily achievable through rest pause.

The "effectiveness" of reps is a great idea and concept. But my issue is finding out how it compares to doing regular sets.

[69Boss429]

The "effectiveness" of reps is a great idea and concept. But my issue is finding out how it compares to doing regular sets.

You really need to understand the science behind Myo Reps to get a better grasp as to why it is more effective. Blood occlusion, auto regulation (fatigue control), muscle fiber stimulation, etc. You also spend less time in the gym because you have more effective reps with Myos vs Standard. In standard sets the first few reps in each set are not considered effective because you don't have 100% muscle fiber recruitment. With Myos every rep in the mini sets are effective.

Check out Gym Geek in iTunes, it comes preloaded with a Myo Reps routine andthe app is free!

[69Boss429]

"Rest-Pause" is in the same bag as "failure;" neither necessary nor recommended for growth.

Stick with progressing weight and/or reps lifted with good form using conventional straight sets.

This is an incorrect assumption about Myo Reps. You really have to understand the concept behind Myos, then you will see Myos is not in the same "bag" as failure. With Myos you avoid failure. You still use progressive technique with Myos and good form. Think of Myos as a 5x5 routine, except that you start out with an activation set to get your muscles primed to 100% muscle fiber recruitment. After the activation set you follow it up with the 5x5 sets. This is the most simplistic way of describing Myos. The good thing about Myos compared to a traditional 5x5 routine is you do not have to use as much weight to achieve 100% muscle fiber recruitment. Primary benefit muscle growth. Secondary benefit is less strain on joints and connective tissues because less weight is being used. In the case if Myos...less is more!

[7asssa7]

You really need to understand the science behind Myo Reps to get a better grasp as to why it is more effective. Blood occlusion, auto regulation (fatigue control), muscle fiber stimulation, etc. You also spend less time in the gym because you have more effective reps with Myos vs Standard. In standard sets the first few reps in each set are not considered effective because you don't have 100% muscle fiber recruitment. With Myos every rep in the mini sets are effective.

Check out Gym Geek in iTunes, it comes preloaded with a Myo Reps routine andthe app is free!

I understand the science, but what puzzles me is the idea of "effective" reps. Shouldn't 6-8 rep range activate all muscle fibers? Also you can do 3 sets of 6-8 reps and then proceed with further 3 sets of 12-15 reps for the same exercise? Won't that incorporate all of the muscle fibres?

[ironwill2008]

I've noticed that you usually seem to know what you're talking about on these boards, and you're no doubt quite experienced, but I can't help but wonder if you've ever tried to progress on anything other than straight sets. Have you strayed from the "tried and true" methods to experience other methods first hand? I can tell you, that "rest pause" has got me progressing a bit faster than I ever have on straight sets. Now granted, there's some variables that I haven't quite accounted for (as I've increased my frequency as well) but I can say that progression is quite easily achievable through rest pause.

Different people have a different definition of 'what works;' mine is something that will produce reasonably consistent results over a long period of time without an increased risk of injuries. If something is currently working well for you, by all means, continue with it until that's no longer the case.



To answer your direct question, I've used R-P in the past. I've used HIT. I've used GVT. None proved to be effective for me, but a former training partner grew like a weed on GVT when we were using it.

I don't use rest pause often, but what if in the middle of a set of skullcrushers I pause for a few seconds in between the later reps? Because the starting position is comfortable and I could use the extra few seconds of rest to get the rest of my reps of the set in.

If you feel it's something that works for you, try it.

[Cheesin]

I understand the science, but what puzzles me is the idea of "effective" reps. Shouldn't 6-8 rep range activate all muscle fibers? Also you can do 3 sets of 6-8 reps and then proceed with further 3 sets of 12-15 reps for the same exercise? Won't that incorporate all of the muscle fibres?

By my understanding, "effective reps" are basically the last 2 or 3 in a set. People theorize that these last few struggling reps are the most important for muscle building. The previous reps require less effort, and rarely any type of struggle. Another benefit of rest pause is the ability to hit many effective reps in a much shorter period of time.

It certainly sounds plausible, but I this leads me to more questions though. Like:

1. What does this really mean about rep ranges?
2. What would happen if altered the rap range to one not normally conductive to hypertrophy? Could it then become conductive, or would it remain ineffective? There has to be some benefit to even excessively higher rep struggling and effective reps, imo.

[ironman4life89]

I've used R-P for the means of Hypertrophy and Maximal Strength separately, and in my own experience, it worked very well. Better than straight sets only, but keep in mind, I combined the two throughout the week.

For example my goal for the month is Pectoral Hypertrophy, and I want to use R-P to attain this goal. First things first, if you plan to use R-P without finding yourself in a hospital, 6 day split routines are out the window. I only use R-P with a 3 day/week routine, and only use R-P once per week, preferably on Friday to give myself the entire weekend to recoup.
Now, my strategy for this scenario would be to do straight sets on Monday consisting of Fly's and Presses for the Pecs, pushing to failure and then one partner assisted rep. Followed by a Wednesday that leaves chest alone and focuses on Legs instead. Then back into Friday with R-P at the highest intensity without converting completely into Strength Training, by doing a Pre-Exhaust set of Fly's for 6-8 reps, into a 20 second breather and directly into Barbell Pressing for 6 reps, then another 20 second breather straight into another set for 6 reps with 10-20 lbs stripped off. Continue for 4 mini sets of Pressing.

This worked for me greatly, because the high intensity complemented the rest periods and allowed me to go forth without killing myself.

But honestly though, when modified for Strength is when R-P shines brightest. It brought my Press up 80 extra pounds in the span of only 3 1/2 months, but it was insanely intense and it pushed my limits to go so hard for so long, even with proper rest periods.

[shffl]

look up dc training

ironwill is right about risk of injury, therefore you have to be smart with exercise selection. i wouldn't rest pause on bench, squat, deadlift, etc.

[69Boss429]

Myos stemmed from DC & HST. Blade, the creator of Myos, applied science to DC and improved upon it.

Myos is not for the novice because of lack of experience under the bar. Strict form is important. It's ok to do the compound moves with Myos, just make sure safeties and spotter is in place and lift with perfect form. In the lower rep prescription it is recommended to avoid deads, but in higher rep prescriptions they are ok.

People that have not studied and tried Myo Reps are not qualified to comment on its lack of effectiveness or other negative claims about Myos.

With standard sets you do not have 100% muscle fiber recruitment on every rep, only the last few or so in each set. "Effective" reps is a rep that has 100% muscle fiber recruitment. With standard sets you are doing more work (more reps) than what you would be doing with Myos. The sayings, "Work smart not hard" and "Less is more" fits Myos well. Do you want to perform 36 total reps or 27 to achieve the same goal?

I do Myos 4 times a week. My split consist of:

Monday/Thursday - Torso - Chest/Back/Shoulders

Tuesday/Friday - Extremeties - Legs/Arms

[7asssa7]

Myos stemmed from DC & HST. Blade, the creator of Myos, applied science to DC and improved upon it.

Myos is not for the novice because of lack of experience under the bar. Strict form is important. It's ok to do the compound moves with Myos, just make sure safeties and spotter is in place and lift with perfect form. In the lower rep prescription it is recommended to avoid deads, but in higher rep prescriptions they are ok.

People that have not studied and tried Myo Reps are not qualified to comment on its lack of effectiveness or other negative claims about Myos.

With standard sets you do not have 100% muscle fiber recruitment on every rep, only the last few or so in each set. "Effective" reps is a rep that has 100% muscle fiber recruitment. With standard sets you are doing more work (more reps) than what you would be doing with Myos. The sayings, "Work smart not hard" and "Less is more" fits Myos well. Do you want to perform 36 total reps or 27 to achieve the same goal?

I do Myos 4 times a week. My split consist of:

Monday/Thursday - Torso - Chest/Back/Shoulders

Tuesday/Friday - Extremeties - Legs/Arms

Thanks for your reply. But that does not mean that one cannot build muscle and Mass with straight sets? Straight sets may be less optimal but they still build mass, right?

[69Boss429]

Thanks for your reply. But that does not mean that one cannot build muscle and Mass with straight sets? Straight sets may be less optimal but they still build mass, right?

Correct. Standard sets have been a proven method. Myo Reps is just another tool to have in your tool box. Use both, use different methods along with it. Try it, if you enjoy it and see results keep using it.

Check out Gym Geek an iPhone application, it comes pre-loaded with a great Myo Rep routine. It also comes with a standard style hypertrophy plan with for different phases. Try the hypertrophy phases first, do each phase for 8-12 weeks. After you completed the hypertrophy phases, do the Myo Rep routine for 8-12 weeks. After that you can see which style/ method you enjoy and which one produces the best results for you. Gym Geek is free on iTunes.

[RockCrab]

i wouldn't rest pause on bench, squat, deadlift, etc.

Look up the 20 rep squat program. It's a 20 rep set with your 10 rep max - you do the math on how long you think the 'pauses' have to be to complete THAT!

Definitely not for the novice.

[69Boss429]

Look up the 20 rep squat program. It's a 20 rep set with your 10 rep max - you do the math on how long you think the 'pauses' have to be to complete THAT!

Definitely not for the novice.

20 rep squats is basically a R-P protocol with your 10-12 RM weight. With 20 rep squats you are not performing reps in a continuous motion. It's a very effective R-P method for muscle growth.

[69Boss429]

The following shows "effective" reps in a standard/traditional 3x10 routine:
* indicates the "effective" rep - 100% muscle fiber recruitment.

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8* 9* 10*
1 2 3 4 5 6 7* 8* 9* 10*
1 2 3 4 5 6* 7* 8* 9*10*

30 total reps, but only 12 are "effective" reps.

The following shows the "effective" reps in a Myo Reps routine:

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8* 9* 10*
1* 2* 3* 4*
1* 2* 3* 4*
1* 2* 3*
1* 2* 3*
1* 2*

26 total reps with 19 "effective" reps.

Slightly less volume, but 7 more "effective" reps when compared to a standard/traditional routine. That's a 42% increase in "effective" reps!

So ask yourself if you want to do more work for less OR less work for more? Work smart...not hard!

I'm a Myo Rep junkie and I use the Gym Geek iPhone app to keep track of my workouts and progress.

[Big3PlusChin]

I have read some articles about myo reps and rest-pause training which advocate the following approach :

Example: bench press: 1 st set you do 8-10 reps, 15 seconds rest then pushout 3 reps and so on.

How does it compare to straight sets in terms of hypertrophy? I thought hypertrophy is a matter of total laod and volume and some fatigue?

My understanding is

1) Conventional set
4x10 with 2 mins rest.
100kg x 10
100kg x 10
100kg x 9 (we get more fatigue)
100kg x 8

Total volume/load you lift = 100kg x (10+10+9+8) = 3700kg

2) Rest pause set with 20-30 sec rest
Total reps: 40 reps. Same 4x10 as above.
100kg x 10, 4, 3, 3, 2,.... until total 40 reps.

Total volume/load = 100kg x 40 = 4000kg

Higher volume = more hypertrophy.

And also higher muscle stress from rest pause set. And shorter time training during rest pause set.

About progressive overload, we know for conventional set. For rest pause set, we just can use first set as our progressive overload. Eg, you use 8-12 rep range.

Week 1: 100kg x 10,4,3,3,2...
Week 2: 100kg x 12,5,4,3,3,2... we hit 12 reps and increase weight
Week 3: 102.5kg x 9,4,3,3,2....

[golfwolf]

Thread's over a year and a half old, but this looks like Kelei's program (currently stickied in workout section). He uses the term "money reps" which can be found in some of his earlier program threads.

[janson8000]

strong bump but does anybody know if there are any studies on rest pause training

[macdawg202]

strong bump but does anybody know if there are any studies on rest pause training

The only study needed is the one conducted on yourself.

Try a program such as DC or any RP based program and track your calories/macros, weight, progress photos, log book. After around 6 months you'll have all the information you need.