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  1. #1
    Registered User DavieBanner's Avatar
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    Taller people do more work at same tonnage?

    If you take two individuals who lift the same weight, on say Bench Press and compare their work load to one another, is the taller person actually doing more work because of the distance?


    Person 1: 5'9, 200lbs, bench max 230x5

    Person 2: 6'2 200lbs, bench max 230x5 .....

    Obviously the person who is taller has a longer reach, or extension to complete a full rep bench pressing.
    For person 1 if they have a 1:1 ratio their arm span is 69 inches. For person 2 if they have a 1:1 ratio their arm span is 74 inches.
    That's an overall 10 inch difference when taking both arms into consideration. Thats roughly a 8% or 20lb difference due to distance.

    So does this mean person two is actually stronger than person 1?
    Bench Press: 205x5[x] 210x5[x] 215x5[x] 220x5[x] 225 x 5[x] 230x5 []

    ^^Scratched the 5x5 program. Lifting BP 255 x 10, do not know max as I could care less.
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  2. #2
    Off the wagon PeterGibbons316's Avatar
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    Oh great, this thread again.

    The bottom line is this: Strength is measured in the maximal amount of weight lifted. Doesn't matter how much you weigh, how tall you are, what your proportions are, how long your ROM is, what color your hair is, or what size shoe you wear. Either you can lift the weight, or you can't. Period.
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  3. #3
    Registered User MichaelCJ's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by PeterGibbons316 View Post
    The bottom line is this: Strength is measured in the maximal amount of weight lifted. Doesn't matter how much you weigh, how tall you are, what your proportions are, how long your ROM is, what color your hair is, or what size shoe you wear. Either you can lift the weight, or you can't. Period.
    Exactly. Strong is strong. Doesn't matter how you got there, or whether ir was relatively a little more or less challenging in whatever ways.
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  4. #4
    Registered User DavieBanner's Avatar
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    I'm just asking if a specific weight is the same when the distance moved against gravity varies. Yes or no.
    I searched it. No definitive answers.
    Bench Press: 205x5[x] 210x5[x] 215x5[x] 220x5[x] 225 x 5[x] 230x5 []

    ^^Scratched the 5x5 program. Lifting BP 255 x 10, do not know max as I could care less.
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  5. #5
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    work is irrelevant, force is what matters during a 1 rep max. A taller person has the advantage invariably given the same relative proportions.
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  6. #6
    Registered User DavieBanner's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by LegosInMyEgos View Post
    work is irrelevant, force is what matters during a 1 rep max. A taller person has the advantage invariably given the same relative proportions.
    Im asking because Im deciding if I should only go to parallel on bench or not. For me to drop the bar to my chest my elbows go far beyond parallel because my arm-span is roughly 76 inches and Im wondering if a shorter person is able to use more of their shoulders and triceps because they dont go below parallel as far
    Bench Press: 205x5[x] 210x5[x] 215x5[x] 220x5[x] 225 x 5[x] 230x5 []

    ^^Scratched the 5x5 program. Lifting BP 255 x 10, do not know max as I could care less.
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  7. #7
    vegan LegosInMyEgos's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by DavieBanner View Post
    Im asking because Im deciding if I should only go to parallel on bench or not. For me to drop the bar to my chest my elbows go far beyond parallel because my arm-span is roughly 76 inches and Im wondering if a shorter person is able to use more of their shoulders and triceps because they dont go below parallel as far
    The musculature you use when you bench is dependent ONLY one your relative proportions. Stopping at parallel for you will work the triceps/delts/chest in EXACTLY the same way stopping at parallel would for a shorter person.

    Having said that, just do the full range of motion, don't be a pussy.
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  8. #8
    Registered User DavieBanner's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by LegosInMyEgos View Post
    The musculature you use when you bench is dependent ONLY one your relative proportions. Stopping at parallel for you will work the triceps/delts/chest in EXACTLY the same way stopping at parallel would for a shorter person.

    Having said that, just do the full range of motion, don't be a pussy.
    Well one its causing me pain, two my chest never gets hit with bench only flys. The bench excersise has made my late blow up over the years along with my back. Because of the full Rom I noticed I'm very dependent on my back for bench and not my tris or chest which seems quite opposite as it should be
    Bench Press: 205x5[x] 210x5[x] 215x5[x] 220x5[x] 225 x 5[x] 230x5 []

    ^^Scratched the 5x5 program. Lifting BP 255 x 10, do not know max as I could care less.
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  9. #9
    vegan LegosInMyEgos's Avatar
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    wat?
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  10. #10
    Registered User DavieBanner's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by LegosInMyEgos View Post
    wat?
    Bench press has never hit my chest or my triceps. When I'm pushing up its all from my Lats because of how far my elbows go below parallel. I'm wider if by only going to parallel I will incorporate more chest/shoulder/tris. If you saw my Lats and back you wouldn't believe I've never done any specific back programs. All my bench power comes from my back and I noticed when I only go to parallel it hits my tris and chest way more just like someone with decreased Rom, possibly. I was trying to verify my anecdotal experiences with people of more info
    Bench Press: 205x5[x] 210x5[x] 215x5[x] 220x5[x] 225 x 5[x] 230x5 []

    ^^Scratched the 5x5 program. Lifting BP 255 x 10, do not know max as I could care less.
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  11. #11
    Registered User Protege385's Avatar
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    learn how to bench correctly
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  12. #12
    Registered User DavieBanner's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Protege385 View Post
    learn how to bench correctly
    Trying to do that right now!
    Bench Press: 205x5[x] 210x5[x] 215x5[x] 220x5[x] 225 x 5[x] 230x5 []

    ^^Scratched the 5x5 program. Lifting BP 255 x 10, do not know max as I could care less.
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  13. #13
    Not even my final form NZninja101's Avatar
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    Height on it's own isn't really the biggest factor here. Some of the best benchers are tall. The factors here are ability to arch, (longer spine from taller person may be able to arch more), rib cage size, (taller people probably have slightly larger rib cages), and the length of the arms, of which their is some correlation between being tall and having long arms. But height on it's own is not disadvantageous to bench press. That comes from arm length, arching ability and rib cage size.



    Originally Posted by PeterGibbons316 View Post
    Oh great, this thread again.

    The bottom line is this: Strength is measured in the maximal amount of weight lifted. Doesn't matter how much you weigh, how tall you are, what your proportions are, how long your ROM is, what color your hair is, or what size shoe you wear. Either you can lift the weight, or you can't. Period.

    THIS.


    Strength is more than simply force. If Person B can produce slightly more force but if their mechanics are bad then person A can still be stronger, even if they don't produce quite as much force.
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    Originally Posted by DavieBanner View Post
    I'm just asking if a specific weight is the same when the distance moved against gravity varies. Yes or no.
    I searched it. No definitive answers.
    Strictly speaking you are correct. Work is distance X weight and so the more you have to move the weight, the more work you're doing.
    Hasn't stopped some people though, check out Christian Cantwell (6'5"/196 cm and an armspan to match) 280kg/630lb bench press:




    Behdad Salimi who holds the current world record in the snatch and took the weightlifting gold at the London Olympics is taller still at 197cm/6'6":



    You have no excuses for your partial ROM.
    Strength + Speed = Power

    If you never fail, you aren't truly pushing yourself to the limit. If you never push yourself to the limit, how do you know what you're truly capable of?
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  15. #15
    bulking until 365lb bench stevemckenna's Avatar
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    So basically you're annoyed that a more smaller and compact person gets too much credit when surely the more gifted lifter (i.e. you) isn't showered with more adulation?
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    Originally Posted by stevemckenna View Post
    So basically you're annoyed that a more smaller and compact person gets too much credit when surely the more gifted lifter (i.e. you) isn't showered with more adulation?
    No. Idc about others. I'm asking if going parallel will give me the same results as someone who's smaller because technically the bar will be traveling the same distance as them and not further like right now when I go 4-6 inches below parallel
    Bench Press: 205x5[x] 210x5[x] 215x5[x] 220x5[x] 225 x 5[x] 230x5 []

    ^^Scratched the 5x5 program. Lifting BP 255 x 10, do not know max as I could care less.
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    bulking until 365lb bench stevemckenna's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by DavieBanner View Post
    No. Idc about others. I'm asking if going parallel will give me the same results as someone who's smaller because technically the bar will be traveling the same distance as them and not further like right now when I go 4-6 inches below parallel
    If you really didn't care, you'd know to always go full ROM because it's better for you.
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  18. #18
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    Technically the more the distance the weight is moved the more "work" is being done.
    Work = force x distance, force in this case would be mass x gravity.

    To answer your question though, keep squatting deep. It is manly and badass. You can get away with going to parallel if you want to but I squat ATG.

    This whole notion of wanting to do less work to get results does not seem like a healthy one.
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  19. #19
    Registered User DavieBanner's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by batman37 View Post
    Technically the more the distance the weight is moved the more "work" is being done.
    Work = force x distance, force in this case would be mass x gravity.

    To answer your question though, keep squatting deep. It is manly and badass. You can get away with going to parallel if you want to but I squat ATG.

    This whole notion of wanting to do less work to get results does not seem like a healthy one.
    We were talking about bench. And I'm asking because I had A RC injury and I can't get past a certain weight without ****ing my shoulder up everytime.

    You guys are no help
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    ^^Scratched the 5x5 program. Lifting BP 255 x 10, do not know max as I could care less.
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  20. #20
    Off the wagon PeterGibbons316's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by DavieBanner View Post
    We were talking about bench. And I'm asking because I had A RC injury and I can't get past a certain weight without ****ing my shoulder up everytime.

    You guys are no help
    .....

    Originally Posted by DavieBanner View Post
    If you take two individuals who lift the same weight, on say Bench Press and compare their work load to one another, is the taller person actually doing more work because of the distance?


    Person 1: 5'9, 200lbs, bench max 230x5

    Person 2: 6'2 200lbs, bench max 230x5 .....

    Obviously the person who is taller has a longer reach, or extension to complete a full rep bench pressing.
    For person 1 if they have a 1:1 ratio their arm span is 69 inches. For person 2 if they have a 1:1 ratio their arm span is 74 inches.
    That's an overall 10 inch difference when taking both arms into consideration. Thats roughly a 8% or 20lb difference due to distance.

    So does this mean person two is actually stronger than person 1?
    You never mentioned anything about an injury. If you keep injuring yourself at the same weight you are most certainly doing something wrong - and it is more likely to be stopping before you hit your chest than actually completing the ROM.

    If I were you, I would spend more time trying to figure out what I was doing wrong, and less time making excuses for being a little bitch.
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    Futurama Fanboy sharpieblet's Avatar
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    Seems like OP secretly wants an excuse for why people shorter than him at the gym are putting up way more weight.

    Leave us manlets alone.
    I'm a cybernetic organism, living tissue under metal endoskeleton.

    And yeah...i bulk even if i've got love handles, U MAD?
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  22. #22
    can't dodge the Rodge midcoastking33's Avatar
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    80 inch wing span here. not a strong presser but have no problem activating my chest on a flat bench press
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    To answer your question, yes moving the same weight through a greater ROM is more work. That doesn't mean you're stronger though. If you were stronger you'd be moving more weight.
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    Work dosent really matter for 1 rep max. U just burn more calorise. Leverage however can be a hudge factor. A person with tall arms and long forearms Will have it harder for example bicep curl as much as a manlet. Due to the mechanical disadvantage. Leverage can also work as an advantage for a tall person. Take for example strong man competition. If ur having rc problems with the bench i would suggest weighted push ups. Then your scapula can help to stabilize the shoulder and u get proper serratus activation.
    Last edited by Daashu; 12-17-2012 at 06:09 AM.
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  25. #25
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    taller guys will have bigger muscles. its proportion to the size of your body.
    tho at 5'9 200lbs and your 6'2 200lbs, you are weaker than the shorter guy.
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    If you move weighta greater distance, then yes you are doing more work. Work is force times distance, so that's grade 7 physics.

    Is that person stronger? Wtf. No. Giant leap to make that correlation.
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  27. #27
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    A couple things. Yes, you are doing more work because the bar is travelling a greater distance against gravity. Also, the bar has greater leverage over you because your longer humerus creates a longer torque/lever/moment arm against the shoulder. That's why Kevin Durant wasn't able to bench 185 once at the combine. Not that he's all that strong but to think a professional athlete's muscles couldn't do that if he had better leverage is ridiculous. That said, the rules of bench form still apply to you just like the apply to everyone else regardless of size or wingspan. If you're having pain it probably has nothing to do with your wingspan. It might be a grip width issue or some other form issue. Rotator cuff injuries tend to happen because of benching too high on the chest and not tucking your elbows. Feet in the right place, arch your back slightly, retract scapula (which in itself will reduce ROM slightly), correct grip width, tuck elbows, and bench to sternum. Yes shorter people have it easier, but when deadlifting, taller people have it easier and shorter people end up with horizontal backs because those same short arms that help with benching kill them when deadlifting. There are pros and cons to every body type. I don't make excuses when I deadlift, nor should you make excuses when you bench.
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  28. #28
    EricTheConqueror batman37's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by DavieBanner View Post
    We were talking about bench. And I'm asking because I had A RC injury and I can't get past a certain weight without ****ing my shoulder up everytime.

    You guys are no help
    You can apply this to concept to any lift. Do you bench with your elbows tucked or flared?
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  29. #29
    Registered User k9pit's Avatar
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    Nobody (that has any love for you) would tell you to keep doing something that continues to aggravate an injury.

    There's no point in comparing a short vs tall person here, unless you can morph into the other for yourself and compare. Do some people's genetic make up give them better leverages toward some moves, probably yes. I got long a** arms (80" )and took to deadlifting with ease, benching was okay after I got the hang of it but I built a nice chest without ever cracking 315lbs......But, what's the point of wondering why it's harder for me vs. a guy with shorter arms? If you want to build chest, figure it out what works best for you and move on.

    If you're getting no where with something or it's causing an injury then find an alternative way to build your body or meet your end goal.
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  30. #30
    Registered User DavieBanner's Avatar
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    Thanks for the elaborated replies everyone!

    My RC injury is actually from an accident where I was T boned and my arm came out of the socket. I broke my collar bone and now have a forever lasting impinent with a weak RC on the left side.

    My bench is about 300 max but I can't break 255x10 because everytime I lower the weight past parallel my injury kills me. It's only on the side that was injured. My right side feels like it could press way more weight.

    I was asking if you can progress on an incline by doing less than full rom reps because one these don't bug me and two my arm span is 76 inches. I figured if a smaller man gets good results at less rom than I do in comparison to their body type why can't I, and I wanted to verify it. Maybe I asked the wrong question to begin with but it made sense to me. My bench technique is fine. I don't flare, I tuck when using full ROM. I retract my shoulders. I do all that fun stuff. After all my bench after my accident max was 140 and now I'm up to 300lbs in a little over a year.

    Hope this clarifies my intentions.
    Bench Press: 205x5[x] 210x5[x] 215x5[x] 220x5[x] 225 x 5[x] 230x5 []

    ^^Scratched the 5x5 program. Lifting BP 255 x 10, do not know max as I could care less.
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