If I take Citrulline (Malate) regularly, will I build tolerance?

[domu221]

If I workout 4 times a week for a year and alternate between a caffeinated preworkout and a non-caffeinated preworkout, both of which has Citrulline (or Citrulline Malate) as the main ingredient, will I build tolerance over it?

[rhadam]

It's an amino acid. Do you think you can build a tolerance to aminos?

[xXDaBOSSXx]

I know this is an old thread but let me make it clear.
Citrulline is an amino acid. For most aminos, you wouldn't build a tolerance to. However, some aminos do. For example, arginine. The more you use it, the less you absorb it. That's because your body only allows a specific amount of each amino in your body. Using citrulline everyday may cause your body to be dependent on it making you unable to rid of ammonia during exercise. This has been research approved. Many issues may also rise.
Malic acid is also another one. You won't BUILD a tolerance BUT your body will be more DEPENDENT on it. That's because consuming large amounts of malic acid causes the body to not produce a lot of it. Think of it like using synthetic hormones.
So there. I haven't just read it on the Internet but I've also experienced it.
It gave me lots of energy, but after use... Not so well.
I do 10 grams Citrulline Malate everyday. I can tell a difference after using it for a month and going off of it.

[kardoxo]

Citrulline is an amino acid and I don't think your body will get used to it. Maybe take less on some days but its an amino acid so the answer to your question is no.

[Mr.Cooper69]

I know this is an old thread but let me make it clear.
Citrulline is an amino acid. For most aminos, you wouldn't build a tolerance to. However, some aminos do. For example, arginine. The more you use it, the less you absorb it. That's because your body only allows a specific amount of each amino in your body. Using citrulline everyday may cause your body to be dependent on it making you unable to rid of ammonia during exercise. This has been research approved. Many issues may also rise.
Malic acid is also another one. You won't BUILD a tolerance BUT your body will be more DEPENDENT on it. That's because consuming large amounts of malic acid causes the body to not produce a lot of it. Think of it like using synthetic hormones.
So there. I haven't just read it on the Internet but I've also experienced it.
It gave me lots of energy, but after use... Not so well.
I do 10 grams Citrulline Malate everyday. I can tell a difference after using it for a month and going off of it.

Lol, please explain to me how you can shutdown THE KREBS CYCLE (which produces malate) by supplementing malate. If this were true, you would immediately go comatose and die after using malate supplements chronically

[eldawg]

Lol, please explain to me how you can shutdown THE KREBS CYCLE (which produces malate) by supplementing malate. If this were true, you would immediately go comatose and die after using malate supplements chronically

Its a miracle that I continue to survive on my an apple a day habit.

[TMac26]

I just facepalmed so many times reading that paragraph.

[xXDaBOSSXx]

Lol, please explain to me how you can shutdown THE KREBS CYCLE (which produces malate) by supplementing malate. If this were true, you would immediately go comatose and die after using malate supplements chronically

You shouldn't have said shutdown. And explaining it would be too hard to do due to the fact that there isn't enough research. But I can give you my experience.
Your body is smart. Even smarter than you are...maybe. Anything that it takes from outside is utilized in the body. It is a very simple concept that the more you take in, the more the body will have to put up with it. Whether it'd be to increase tolerance, get rid of the rest as a waste or many other ways, your body will always try to maintain equilibrium.
I myself have experienced of citrulline malate. Everyday for two months, I would intake 10g of CM. after the two month period, I ran out of it and decided to take a little rest. That short rest without it, when exercised, has gotten me out of breath equal to before I did cardio without CM. However, after only a couple weeks, I've seen sudden changes again. I was feeling more energized and my cardio went through the roof.
Now, let me think... What the ef happened there?!?! Maybe malate? Maybe the citrulline? Who gives a ****! My one-man experiment conclusion led me to believe that my body lowered the amount of malate production due to the fact that I was recieving malate elsewhere. I truly felt like I was drowning when I did cardio. But hey! This is only me. So be my guest if you think I'm wrong because I sure am ready for some of your criticism. Btw, that last paragraph I wrote was when I haven't had enough sleep. So if I said something that made it ironic or over exaggerated, don't think of it as my final words were I can correct myself anytime of the day or night.

[Mr.Cooper69]

You shouldn't have said shutdown. And explaining it would be too hard to do due to the fact that there isn't enough research. But I can give you my experience.
Your body is smart. Even smarter than you are...maybe. Anything that it takes from outside is utilized in the body. It is a very simple concept that the more you take in, the more the body will have to put up with it. Whether it'd be to increase tolerance, get rid of the rest as a waste or many other ways, your body will always try to maintain equilibrium.
I myself have experienced of citrulline malate. Everyday for two months, I would intake 10g of CM. after the two month period, I ran out of it and decided to take a little rest. That short rest without it, when exercised, has gotten me out of breath equal to before I did cardio without CM. However, after only a couple weeks, I've seen sudden changes again. I was feeling more energized and my cardio went through the roof.
Now, let me think... What the ef happened there?!?! Maybe malate? Maybe the citrulline? Who gives a ****! My one-man experiment conclusion led me to believe that my body lowered the amount of malate production due to the fact that I was recieving malate elsewhere. I truly felt like I was drowning when I did cardio. But hey! This is only me. So be my guest if you think I'm wrong because I sure am ready for some of your criticism. Btw, that last paragraph I wrote was when I haven't had enough sleep. So if I said something that made it ironic or over exaggerated, don't think of it as my final words were I can correct myself anytime of the day or night.

Every post I make on this forum is in a state of sleep deprivation. That said, you have grossly oversimplified how the body works. I'm going to go easy on you because you are only 18 and have probably taken an AP biology class or something, but your body has not lowered malate production. Because that would again imply that is has reduced krebs cycle activity, which is dead wrong. The krebs cycle is stimulated in response to very acute stimuli related to NAD/NADH + ADP/ATP status. This fluctuates throughout the day, meal to meal, between meals, as you sleep, as you exercise, etc. Malate is not a regulator of the krebs cycle, it has no negative feedback on any of the relevant enzymes or rate-limiting steps, and it will only stop being produced the exact moment that you ingest malate because you are providing it for the cycle so production isn't needed. The malate you ingested will be consumed for energy, and then the krebs cycle will resume immediately.

An example of something that slows down or stops the krebs cycle is arsenic, which depletes lipoic acid as a necessary cofactor for pyruvate dehydrogenase complex and a-ketoglutarate dehydrogenase. When you ingest something like this that slows down the krebs cycle, the effects are profound, with textbook signs of toxicity. Conversely, when you stop using malate, absolutely nothing changes. Period.

[NewAgeMayan]

Every post I make on this forum is in a state of sleep deprivation.

You dont want to sleep too often anyway bro, or you'll build a tolerance to it.

[xXDaBOSSXx]

Every post I make on this forum is in a state of sleep deprivation. That said, you have grossly oversimplified how the body works. I'm going to go easy on you because you are only 18 and have probably taken an AP biology class or something, but your body has not lowered malate production. Because that would again imply that is has reduced krebs cycle activity, which is dead wrong. The krebs cycle is stimulated in response to very acute stimuli related to NAD/NADH + ADP/ATP status. This fluctuates throughout the day, meal to meal, between meals, as you sleep, as you exercise, etc. Malate is not a regulator of the krebs cycle, it has no negative feedback on any of the relevant enzymes or rate-limiting steps, and it will only stop being produced the exact moment that you ingest malate because you are providing it for the cycle so production isn't needed. The malate you ingested will be consumed for energy, and then the krebs cycle will resume immediately.

An example of something that slows down or stops the krebs cycle is arsenic, which depletes lipoic acid as a necessary cofactor for pyruvate dehydrogenase complex and a-ketoglutarate dehydrogenase. When you ingest something like this that slows down the krebs cycle, the effects are profound, with textbook signs of toxicity. Conversely, when you stop using malate, absolutely nothing changes. Period.

Not depriving yourself of malate stores will hinder your tca cycle adaptation. So by giving your body energy, it DEPENDS on that energy. Sure your muscles may have gotten a good workout but not your tca cycle! Your body creates its own malates for a reason. To keep you going.
If you lower the amount of malate present by working out, your tca cycle will have to work harder. So the next time you go to the gym, your tca cycle will definitely come out much much stronger. The malate you consume only acts as a boost. It really doesn't give your aerobic pathway a good workout. You can only work it out by doing EXTRA work or when the malate you consumed has already been all used up.

[Nyrin]

Not depriving yourself of malate stores will hinder your tca cycle adaptation. So by giving your body energy, it DEPENDS on that energy. Sure your muscles may have gotten a good workout but not your tca cycle! Your body creates its own malates for a reason. To keep you going.
If you lower the amount of malate present by working out, your tca cycle will have to work harder. So the next time you go to the gym, your tca cycle will definitely come out much much stronger. The malate you consume only acts as a boost. It really doesn't give your aerobic pathway a good workout. You can only work it out by doing EXTRA work or when the malate you consumed has already been all used up.

I, uh... really wouldn't recommend going head-to-head with Coop on this one with anything short of a Ph.D.

[BigPapiJR]

I, uh... really wouldn't recommend going head-to-head with Coop on this one with anything short of a Ph.D.

Legendary thread.

[xXDaBOSSXx]

I, uh... really wouldn't recommend going head-to-head with Coop on this one with anything short of a Ph.D.

I understand...

I may not have much knowledge, but I have common sense. Which of course is enough to make things clear and reasonable.

[Rob1882]

Legendary thread.

In

[AMeyer9]

I understand...

I may not have much knowledge, but I have common sense. Which of course is enough to make things clear and reasonable.

well it DEPENDS on if he feels like giving you a lesson, but you might be getting in some EXTRA knowledge when he replies.

[TMac26]

I understand...

I may not have much knowledge, but I have common sense. Which of course is enough to make things clear and reasonable.

Lol no you don't.

[dazedncnfz]

lol no you don't.

rofl

[Mr.Cooper69]

Not depriving yourself of malate stores will hinder your tca cycle adaptation. So by giving your body energy, it DEPENDS on that energy. Sure your muscles may have gotten a good workout but not your tca cycle! Your body creates its own malates for a reason. To keep you going.
If you lower the amount of malate present by working out, your tca cycle will have to work harder. So the next time you go to the gym, your tca cycle will definitely come out much much stronger. The malate you consume only acts as a boost. It really doesn't give your aerobic pathway a good workout. You can only work it out by doing EXTRA work or when the malate you consumed has already been all used up.

So what you're saying here is that improvements in exercise performance are due to your TCA cycle getting stronger? Not increased stroke volume from physiologic hypertrophy of the heart, not improved respiratory capacity, not more sarcomeres added in parallel to type II fibers...but tca cycle "adaptations?" Will my tca cycle adapt to eating carbs as well? Will my oxidative chain adapt to breathing oxygen? Think about what you're saying man. I don't want to give you a hard time, but you're really missing the point here.

[Mr.Cooper69]

I understand...

I may not have much knowledge, but I have common sense. Which of course is enough to make things clear and reasonable.

If science depended on common sense, we'd have solved the world's mysteries many millenia ago and continued to believe the earth is flat. We are debating science here, not common sense.

[xavengedx23]

So what you're saying here is that improvements in exercise performance are due to your TCA cycle getting stronger? Not increased stroke volume from physiologic hypertrophy of the heart, not improved respiratory capacity, not more sarcomeres added in parallel to type II fibers...but tca cycle "adaptations?" Will my tca cycle adapt to eating carbs as well? Will my oxidative chain adapt to breathing oxygen? Think about what you're saying man. I don't want to give you a hard time, but you're really missing the point here.

How do you honestly keep so much information stored in dat noggin coop? o_o

Inb4 photographic memory

[eatyourspinach]

This is the best 2 year old thread bump ever.

[giarmyjoe]

I understand...

I may not have much knowledge, but I have common sense. Which of course is enough to make things clear and reasonable.

[BigPapiJR]

So what you're saying here is that improvements in exercise performance are due to your TCA cycle getting stronger? Not increased stroke volume from physiologic hypertrophy of the heart, not improved respiratory capacity, not more sarcomeres added in parallel to type II fibers...but tca cycle "adaptations?" Will my tca cycle adapt to eating carbs as well? Will my oxidative chain adapt to breathing oxygen? Think about what you're saying man. I don't want to give you a hard time, but you're really missing the point here.

Why?