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  1. #1
    Registered User RichTooBig's Avatar
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    Advice on i.f. + keto....

    i have a question. i am 46 years old and im ashamed to admit that i weigh 460 lbs. I used to workout at 4;30 am 4 -5 days a week...eating 6 sml meals {body for Life} i went from 438 down to 375 over 8-9 months. but after my divorce, i started stuffing the junk food and slacked at the gym.i dont drink,smoke, or do drugs, ...due to medicating with fast food, i put on 90 lbs. i am sick and tired of being a fat pig. i did Atkins years ago, lost 125 lbs. , it all came back cuz i started eating garbage again. anyway, i want{need} to turn my life around and drop weight now. i have been doing SKD for a couple weeks, i went from 472 to 460 . i have started lifting again, and am planning on lifting 3 times a week. i have bad knees, so cardio is limited. but i am open to advice. obviously my main focus and goal is fat loss, but still like to build muscle . im thinking of doing full upper body routine twice a week, and lower body/abs once.{ body for life} resting only 45-60 seconds rest between sets. do you think skd at my size is best for fat loss, ive read up on Intermittent fasting, i wanted to know how keto worked while you did I.F. Do you think this is best for me to lose fat, im on disability for next few months due to knee pain, so im flexable to when i go to the gym... what do you think for lifting plan. ect. i want to lose 60-100 lbs asap... i know slow weight loss is better, but its either this way or docs want me to consider stomach surgery...i dont want to do that. i just have soo much fat to lose...its depressing when i consider im almost 500 lbs. at 5'10..i probly need to lose 225-245 lbs.long term ,but i did it to myself . my immediate goal is get down to 400 lbs.... i have 3 boys, 13,10,&7. i very much want to live and be an active dad for them. thank you in advance for your help
    thx, Rich
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  2. #2
    Registered User buckiaj's Avatar
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    To address the cardio issue first, if you have knee issues that could be long term, I would just ignore any kind of cardio that puts any stress on them. If you can find some kind of machine in your gym that lets you perform light cardio without the pressure on your knees, great, if not, i wouldnt push it. Your knees are an invaluable piece of your body you will need for the rest of your life.

    At your size, the biggest thing i can stress, is that perfection on any diet is not mandatory. Count your calories, aim for about a 1000 calorie deficit everyday, and put it on cruise control. Keto diet is a wonderful thing, but honestly is not the reason why you would have success. Pick a diet that is easiest for you to hit that daily deficit. Never forget that if you have a slip up and a bad day, just get right back on the horse the next day. Its the best thing you can do.

    As far as lifting, beginners strength is a popular one. But if you have been in a gym before, just make sure you are lifting heavy all of your major body parts every week. 3 or 4 days in the gym lifting is all you really need. And again, that cardio is not nec if you want to drop the fat. DIET DIET DIET

    Good Luck man!
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  3. #3
    Wackadoo Grifts's Avatar
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    I am just beginning IF + keto combo. Working great so far.

    I have difficulty eating enough calories some days (within my window) and am definitely full.

    Otherwise, everything else buckiaj said. Cardio isn't necessary, or if it causes pain, not recommended. Injuring yourself would be a huge detriment to weight loss. Once you lose weight, I bet your knees will get better.

    Unless you want to do keto for some other reason, just cleaning up your diet will be effective.
    Last edited by Grifts; 11-29-2012 at 04:48 AM.
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  4. #4
    Registered User transformerchad's Avatar
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    u dont need to go so extreme from the start , make it a lifestyle , just eat healthy balanced food and cut the junk . stick with portion control for now, u dont want to lose weight too fast it can be very bad on ur health and u may regain the weight back
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  5. #5
    Wackadoo Grifts's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by transformerchad View Post
    u dont need to go so extreme from the start , make it a lifestyle , just eat healthy balanced food and cut the junk . stick with portion control for now, u dont want to lose weight too fast it can be very bad on ur health and u may regain the weight back
    As long as he meets macro and micro nutrient needs, he should be fine. He has a history of yo-yoing - but that is on him and food choices. You can't magically regain 100 lb because you lost weight too quickly.

    check out this case report:
    Features of a successful therapeutic fast of 382 days' duration
    http://pmj.bmj.com/content/49/569/203.abstract

    Abstract

    A 27-year-old male patient fasted under supervision for 382 days and has subsequently maintained his normal weight. Blood glucose concentrations around 30 mg/100 ml were recorded consistently during the last 8 months, although the patient was ambulant and attending as an out-patient. Responses to glucose and tolbutamide tolerance tests remained normal. The hyperglycaemic response to glucagon was reduced and latterly absent, but promptly returned to normal during carbohydrate refeeding. After an initial decrease was corrected, plasma potassium levels remained normal without supplementation. A temporary period of hypercalcaemia occurred towards the end of the fast. Decreased plasma magnesium concentrations were a consistent feature from the first month onwards. After 100 days of fasting there was a marked and persistent increase in the excretion of urinary cations and inorganic phosphate, which until then had been minimal. These increases may be due to dissolution of excessive soft tissue and skeletal mass. Prolonged fasting in this patient had no ill-effects.
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    Sugar Alcohols...Explained http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=151110953

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  6. #6
    sleep- work- lift- bacon resilience5241's Avatar
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    I've been nursing a knee injury for a couple months now. Some good low-impact cardio you can do would be walking backwards on the treadmill while it's inclined (start with a small incline and only put the speed at 2-2.5 to start). Also try an elliptical (or similar machine) and pedal in the opposite (backwards) direction. You will feel less stress on the joints. This should help strengthen your knees, but if you end up feeling any pain/discomfort you've probably got a more dynamic issue with your joints and I would recommend avoiding cardio until you can talk to a doctor of physical therapist.

    On to you next question. Considering you have quite a bit of weight to lose, I wouldn't worry about incorporating IF just yet. You will be able to shed a good amount of weight just by ditching carbs and eating below maintenance. IF/cardio/carb-ups/etc should be used sparingly when your progress has plateaued for a significant amount of time. I would recommend starting at a 500cal deficit and slowly incorporating more exercise into your routine. Once you start to stall, drop your intake another 100-200 cals or add another day of lifting. Alternate these until you've hit a weight loss wall, then consider IF. If you start out doing too much you won't have many options available to you once your progress starts to stall.
    If it is important to you, you will find a way.
    If it's not, you will find an excuse.

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  7. #7
    Wackadoo Grifts's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by resilience5241 View Post
    I've been nursing a knee injury for a couple months now. Some good low-impact cardio you can do would be walking backwards on the treadmill while it's inclined (start with a small incline and only put the speed at 2-2.5 to start). Also try an elliptical (or similar machine) and pedal in the opposite (backwards) direction. You will feel less stress on the joints. This should help strengthen your knees, but if you end up feeling any pain/discomfort you've probably got a more dynamic issue with your joints and I would recommend avoiding cardio until you can talk to a doctor of physical therapist.

    On to you next question. Considering you have quite a bit of weight to lose, I wouldn't worry about incorporating IF just yet. You will be able to shed a good amount of weight just by ditching carbs and eating below maintenance. IF/cardio/carb-ups/etc should be used sparingly when your progress has plateaued for a significant amount of time. I would recommend starting at a 500cal deficit and slowly incorporating more exercise into your routine. Once you start to stall, drop your intake another 100-200 cals or add another day of lifting. Alternate these until you've hit a weight loss wall, then consider IF. If you start out doing too much you won't have many options available to you once your progress starts to stall.
    Swimming would also be good cardio/low impact.

    I disagree on only 500 calorie deficit. Obese people can safely have larger deficits than leaner. IF OP really changes/cleans up his diet, it may be very difficult for him to consume enough calories to be at a 500 calorie deficit only.
    www.squidoo.com/keto-diet

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  8. #8
    Registered User buckiaj's Avatar
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    After reading thru this thread and seeing the posts, here is my 2 cents for the OP:

    1. Being Obese, you can SAFELY eat a 1000 calorie deficit for a long time. 1000 calorie deficit for someone your size, is akin to a 300-500 calorie deficit for a lean person.
    2. Meal timing doesn't matter, and esp doesnt matter when you have that much fat to lose. Lets not get caught up in the details yet? You have plenty of time down the road to do that when leaner
    3. Start learning the difference between emotional eating and hunger eating. Even if you still indulge in emotional eating, recognize thats what it is, and try and cut that back. The more and more you can identify when it happens, the easier it will be to stop it in the future. Believe, i've been there. I went thru a pretty big transformation myself. Feel free to check out my progress pics in my sig or bodyspace.

    But seriously, heed my advice and you will profit
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    http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=152062853

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  9. #9
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    I would do a protein sparing modified fast for a month, keto for a month. Repeat every other month. Do higher calories on the keto month, very low on the PSMF month.
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  10. #10
    Registered User Cowmustard's Avatar
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    I had knee surgery a couple years ago, I lost some weight after that by sitting on the couch perfecting my Wii sports boxing and watching what I ate. just fyi
    Log->mfp=Cowmustard

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  11. #11
    Registered User RichTooBig's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by buckiaj View Post
    To address the cardio issue first, if you have knee issues that could be long term, I would just ignore any kind of cardio that puts any stress on them. If you can find some kind of machine in your gym that lets you perform light cardio without the pressure on your knees, great, if not, i wouldnt push it. Your knees are an invaluable piece of your body you will need for the rest of your life.

    At your size, the biggest thing i can stress, is that perfection on any diet is not mandatory. Count your calories, aim for about a 1000 calorie deficit everyday, and put it on cruise control. Keto diet is a wonderful thing, but honestly is not the reason why you would have success. Pick a diet that is easiest for you to hit that daily deficit. Never forget that if you have a slip up and a bad day, just get right back on the horse the next day. Its the best thing you can do.

    As far as lifting, beginners strength is a popular one. But if you have been in a gym before, just make sure you are lifting heavy all of your major body parts every week. 3 or 4 days in the gym lifting is all you really need. And again, that cardio is not nec if you want to drop the fat. DIET DIET DIET

    Good Luck man!
    thank you for your response...with keto, im not hungry
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  12. #12
    Registered User RichTooBig's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by buckiaj View Post
    After reading thru this thread and seeing the posts, here is my 2 cents for the OP:

    1. Being Obese, you can SAFELY eat a 1000 calorie deficit for a long time. 1000 calorie deficit for someone your size, is akin to a 300-500 calorie deficit for a lean person.
    2. Meal timing doesn't matter, and esp doesnt matter when you have that much fat to lose. Lets not get caught up in the details yet? You have plenty of time down the road to do that when leaner
    3. Start learning the difference between emotional eating and hunger eating. Even if you still indulge in emotional eating, recognize thats what it is, and try and cut that back. The more and more you can identify when it happens, the easier it will be to stop it in the future. Believe, i've been there. I went thru a pretty big transformation myself. Feel free to check out my progress pics in my sig or bodyspace.

    But seriously, heed my advice and you will profit
    you are 100% right on emotional eating...after my wife of 17 years divorced me for a guy she knew in high school who was on facebook, i crawled in a fast food bag for a year ,and put on 100 lbs. i am the only guy i know who gained weight during divorce, most people lose 30 lbs. but enough friggin pity party,,,,partys OVER
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  13. #13
    sleep- work- lift- bacon resilience5241's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by RichTooBig View Post
    you are 100% right on emotional eating...after my wife of 17 years divorced me for a guy she knew in high school who was on facebook, i crawled in a fast food bag for a year ,and put on 100 lbs. i am the only guy i know who gained weight during divorce, most people lose 30 lbs. but enough friggin pity party,,,,partys OVER
    You wouldn't believe the amount of people I know that have had this happen. Sorry to hear about it. Now that the party's over, work hard and make her eat her heart out
    If it is important to you, you will find a way.
    If it's not, you will find an excuse.

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  14. #14
    Registered User RichTooBig's Avatar
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    yeah, the guy from high school is a prison inmate do life on 3 strikes....so sad and crazy. the grass isnt always greener on the other side of the fence, its green where it is watered!!
    thanks for the encouragement. at least i have 3 beautiful boys God has blessed me with. Now its time to get strong and Healthy so i can play Hard and be Strong for Them....
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    Good Luck

    Dec of last 2011 I weighed in at 317lbs. Today I weighed in at 216. I was a diabetic, high blood pressure, off the charts cholesterol issues, etc. (I went from taking 12 prescription drugs to taking a multi and fish oil). Learn everything you can about nutrition. I've been low carbing for the last year and it works for me. Satiety is increased for me when I don't eat carbs. I've only recently started IF (last couple of months) and it just fits my schedule. As cliche as it sound the best diet is the one you can stick with.

    Good Luck and enjoy it. It's definitely worth it.
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  16. #16
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    My experience on IF plus keto is that it's awesome, makes weight drop like crazy and doesn't affect me throughout the day. However, once I do eat, I feel like sleeping for 1,000 hours. Not sure if this is good long term despite the popularity it has, but for me I don't like being that sluggish for no reason.

    I've decided to keep IF as a weapon to be used for a plateau instead of using a blitzkrieg right off the bat. With that said, use the knowledge of IF as a comfort to know that as long as you hit your macros it doesn't matter when you eat. That has helped me be more balanced more than anything else.
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