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  1. #1
    Registered User anderson1010's Avatar
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    No Barbell. Dumbbells Only.

    Max 10kg in the gym can i still strive to dunk at the height of 5' 9' 16years old. Maybe i can still grow but its very unlikely but i still hope.
    Squats with dumbbells. Calf Raises. Lunges. Is it possible?

    sometimes my knee throbs throughout the day because of squats? can someone tell me is this bad? should i stop? or continue i train everyday
    i'm slightly overweight 198lbs and standing at 5 9' standing vertical about 11' cant even touch the board but i will try.
    i ply center but now i want to cut the fat and be a PG since my country ppl are short in Malaysia lol.

    Any ideas how to gain muscle and lose fat on the treadmill does it help in muscle distribution? i need answer guys pls
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  2. #2
    Registered User runnergrl13's Avatar
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    yes... pretty much every exercise with a barbell can be done with dumbbells for legs.

    as for the throbbing in the knees... it could possibly be bad. where on your knee does it hurt? my guess is that your form is probably wrong. the location of the pain might be an indicator of what is wrong with the form. make sure that your knees NEVER go past your toes. at the bottom of the squat- if you look down make sure you can see your toes and your knee is not further in front then them. also on the way up from the squat make sure that your knees are not turning inward, push them out. i tell people to use the visual that they are pushing the outside of there knee over their pinkie toe (i am a fitness trainer and i got that analogy from snowboarding-i'm a snowboard coach, and much like the squat people will turn their knees inward so i offer that analogy).

    the other thing that could be problematic for your knees is your training. you only mentioned squats, lunges and calf raises (you might do more for leg strength but if that's it there's an issue). you want to make sure that you are training all your leg muscles not just quads and calves. a lot of people have knee problems due to overly developed quads and weak overstretched hamstrings, glutes, hip adductors, etc. make sure your doing a full leg routine, hit the hamstrings with deads and hamstring curls and hit those outer and inner thighs with some lateral lunges and sumu squats/deads.

    i honestly don't like the treadmill... and therefore don't use it, running outside is far more enjoyable and effective. however, you can use it to help aid in weight/fat loss (it won't help by itself but in combination with weight training it can play a part). it won't help with muscle gain/distribution (not sure what you mean by distribution). try some HIIT (high intensity interval training) cardio after your strength training sessions (there are many ways to go about this find an article on it, me trying to explain it would be super long and this reply is lengthy as is).

    good luck.
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  3. #3
    Registered User anderson1010's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by runnergrl13 View Post
    yes... pretty much every exercise with a barbell can be done with dumbbells for legs.

    as for the throbbing in the knees... it could possibly be bad. where on your knee does it hurt? my guess is that your form is probably wrong. the location of the pain might be an indicator of what is wrong with the form. make sure that your knees NEVER go past your toes. at the bottom of the squat- if you look down make sure you can see your toes and your knee is not further in front then them. also on the way up from the squat make sure that your knees are not turning inward, push them out. i tell people to use the visual that they are pushing the outside of there knee over their pinkie toe (i am a fitness trainer and i got that analogy from snowboarding-i'm a snowboard coach, and much like the squat people will turn their knees inward so i offer that analogy).

    the other thing that could be problematic for your knees is your training. you only mentioned squats, lunges and calf raises (you might do more for leg strength but if that's it there's an issue). you want to make sure that you are training all your leg muscles not just quads and calves. a lot of people have knee problems due to overly developed quads and weak overstretched hamstrings, glutes, hip adductors, etc. make sure your doing a full leg routine, hit the hamstrings with deads and hamstring curls and hit those outer and inner thighs with some lateral lunges and sumu squats/deads.

    i honestly don't like the treadmill... and therefore don't use it, running outside is far more enjoyable and effective. however, you can use it to help aid in weight/fat loss (it won't help by itself but in combination with weight training it can play a part). it won't help with muscle gain/distribution (not sure what you mean by distribution). try some HIIT (high intensity interval training) cardio after your strength training sessions (there are many ways to go about this find an article on it, me trying to explain it would be super long and this reply is lengthy as is).

    good luck.
    I thought that knees going past the toes is okay? i always do a wide stance and then i put the weight on the side and i go up and down by just using the legs lol. its just a tingling sensation no pain yet but is it some sort of warning? i might upload a video about me doing the squats i'll pm u about it and can u look at my workout? i wanna add somethings that u mention about the deadlifts and hamstrings i'll pm u during december pls help dude repped here's a sketch

    Back: One Arm Dumbbell Rows (10 reps)
    Chest: Chest Press Machine (10 reps) 100lbs
    Shoulders: Standing Dumbbell Press (10 reps)
    Biceps: Dumbbell Curls (10 reps)
    Triceps: Triceps Extensions (20 reps) 8kgs dumbbells
    Traps: Shrugs (20 reps)
    4rounds

    Core: Sit-Ups (35 reps)
    Chest: Dumbbell Chest Press (5 reps)
    Legs: Bulgarian Split-Squats (5 reps) 8kgs dumbbells
    4rounds

    Legs: Squats (25 reps)
    Legs: Lunges (15 reps) 8kgs dumbbells
    Legs: Lying Leg Curls (10reps)
    Back: Lat Pull Downs (30 reps) 50lbs
    4rounds

    HIIT: 8speed/age 3mins 10speed/age 2mins for 20mins

    Legs: Calf Raises (35 reps) 4rounds at home no dumbbells

    i gonna do this everyday is it okay?
    Last edited by anderson1010; 11-28-2012 at 12:46 AM.
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  4. #4
    Registered User runnergrl13's Avatar
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    so, i researched the knee/toe positioning... i had no idea that it can be okay in some instances (i am a certified fitness trainer and in the course i took that was taught "knees should never go past the toes in squats/lunges"). from what i gathered- wide stance squat: knees shouldn't go past toes, close stance squats: knees will go past toes just by the nature of the movement and therefore it's okay. also, knees shouldn't pass toes in squats/lunges when un-conditioned and limited ROM is a factor, but when there is full ROM and an athlete is well-conditioned the knees can travel to the 2nd toe in lunges and squats. thanks for that- i had no idea that there was even a notion of that being okay. However, with that said- with knee pain, don't let it happen. A few years ago I tore my ACL, meniscus and MCL while snowboarding and had surgury. During my rehab period (which was 6 months) I had to re-learn how to do all leg exercises (including walking). My doctor and physical therapists always said to make sure that the knees never passed the toes. if you think about from a knee joint perspective with weak joints, ligaments, tendons it makes sense. in the position where the knee is over the toe there is a lot of strain on those structures, which can cause problems with weight added to it. for now until the pain goes away if i were you i'd make sure the knee doesn't go past the toes. and yes, a tingling sensation can be bad. to be safe i'd get it looked at if i were you. the knee is nothing to mess with.

    as for your current routine... it's flawed (sorry to tell you that). as far as the hamstrings go you are hitting them at the lower end where they tie into the knee, but your not getting the upper portion- the glute/ham tie-in. i'm very meticulous about strength training and hitting every portion of every muscle to avoid muscular imbalances which can lead to injury. think about adding in some deadlifts (maybe stiff-deads since your knees are having issues at the moment) and/or bridges of some sort (single-leg, weighted, etc.. there are 100's of versions). also get those inner/outer quads with sumu squats or courtsey lunges and lateral lunges/squats/step-ups. also in regards to your lunges since your already doing the split squat (which is similar to a forward lunge) i'd make them a reverse lunge this will engage more of the glutes/upper hamstrings). and if your having issues with the bending/straightening of the knee at the moment you could do some standing/lying leg lifts, ab and adductions and hamstring kickbacks with a straight leg and ankle weights or resistance band (i'm suggesting those b/c if there is something wrong with your knee you can strengthen the surround muscles without the bending/straightening that cause further aggreviate it). i'd seriously get it looked at though. when something doesn't feel right and the pain isn't just from fatigue it's best to err on the side of caution. you can't undo work that you do, but you can go back and do more if your okay.... once the damage is done there's no turning back. i ran through some lateral knee pain that was a sharp stabbing pain that started with a tingling in my knee and I'm still paying for it now- 6 months after the fact (I have ITBS from running on the shoulders of roads for stupid distances).

    As far a muscles besides you legs... same thing, your missing a lot. as far as your shoulders go your only getting your rear delts with the military press and your missing the anterior and medial delts. in regards to the triceps it's called the triceps b/c it has 3 heads...your only hitting one with the extensions- if you want to see results there quicker add triceps kick-outs and kickbacks to get them all. as far as the back goes your doing slightly better, but still are lacking a bit. what kind of rows are you doing (high/low, bent over/standing)? also you should add in something for your lower back like good mornings and/or supermans. traps- again, only hitting on part add in some upright rows to that. also the calves- are these standing or seated? if your only doing standing calf raises again missing something the calf has two muscles the gastreonimius and the soleous (may be a spelling error there sorry). one you hit with straight leg calf raises, one you hit with seated/bent knee calf raises. one way that you can do them without a seat calf raise machine is to leave one foot on the floor and put the other on a step/box and then raise onto both toes, then switch legs (i like this one b/c you can hit both in one move).

    as far as your core goes... i'm personally not a huge fan of sit-ups. they can cause back issues and if you have weak ab muscles you can use your neck for them. also, they over-stretch the back and shorten the abdominal muscles and if the form is off that can cause low back issues. in addition they don't hit the lower abs or obliques. your core is huge.... hence core it's where all your strength comes from. i'd start with some planks- start with some static center and side planks and work torwards dynamic planks. planks are great b/c they work the entire core and all the muscles that support the back (sometimes a weak core can cause knee issues). in addition i'd add in something for your obliques- roman twists with a db or medicine ball, torso twists and/or some windshield wipers on the floor or hanging depending on your strength for the lower portion of the obliques. also, perhaps some reverse crunches, hanging or kings chair knee raises.

    also... (sorry, i could talk exercise forever, hence why i made it my job) in regards to your knees. make sure that you stretch after training legs and running/cardio. particularly stretch your hip flexors, quads, and IT bands. Also, i just read the last line of your post- you do this whole routine everyday? not a good idea. your muscles need 24-48 hours to recover from strength training before you go at them again (abs, not so much some say you can train them every day). i'd do a split routine if i were you. perhaps upper body 2x week and lower body 2x week so say M- upper body, T- lower body, W- cardio/abs, Th- upper body, Fri- lower body (you can do abs everyday but do more on W). or if you want to train 6x week in the weight room you could do M- chest/traps/tris, T-lower body, W- back/shoulders, th- chest/traps/tris, fri- lower body, s- back/shoulders, sunday- off. depends on your schedule- you can mix it up however those are just examples just make sure to give each muscle group at least 24 hours of rest. do the HIIT after you strength train to maximize fat loss... perhaps change it up (not sure what your wrote means). hope this helps a bit. and get those knees checked just to be safe.
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  5. #5
    Registered User Vousden's Avatar
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    at 5'9 , 198lbs , you gotta lot of weight to shift before youll be near dunking. i didnt start dunking until aged 16, and i was 6'0 maybe 6'1 weighing about 145/150lbs . Keep training legs hard doing what's said above.

    losing lbs and gaining this leg strength will help you get towards your goal of dunking, explosiveness is needed though ,try to incorporate a session of plyometric based training, as well as jump squats into your routine.

    these should help build explosive leg power, which is key.
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  6. #6
    Registered User anderson1010's Avatar
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    I did this from nov 1 to today its 29th November so i went the gym and did this routine almost 29days but still no gain... might be because i am still fat and need to cut weight and about ur post wait me do another sketch of the workout.Idk why but after the 1st week i am not sore anymore .... so i think i am doing too less or smth....
    i go the gym at 12.00pm and no breakfast then i return at 1.30pm then eat lunch. is that 24hrs enough? i sleep at 12~10am. Cause its the holidays here now lol.

    Today even before squatting i feel like there is a sharp pain damn...but not when doing squats but also can hear noises like cracking when i squat and after coming back home i can still feel pain but only sometimes its not painful until crazy,its a like a line of ant bites should i stop squatting?its like a ninja but happened only twice maybe i do HIIT after doing squats the muscle might get used to it cause it sometimes feel like my muscles are tight
    not that i don't want it checkout but in my country the doctors aren't that good and i'm 16 dont wanna waste my parents money....
    mind my english i'm chinese lol

    Back: One Arm Dumbbell Rows (10 reps)
    Chest: Chest Press Machine (10 reps)
    Shoulders: Standing Dumbbell Press (10 reps)
    Biceps: Dumbbell Curls (10 reps)
    Triceps: Triceps Extensions (20 reps)
    Traps: Shrugs (20 reps)
    4 rounds 8kgs

    Core:Sit-ups using a machine at the gym 35reps
    4 rounds

    Legs
    Squats:25reps
    Lunges:10reps for each leg
    I used to use 7kgs but last saturday i wasn't sore anymore so i used 8kgs but not sore 2
    Lat Pull Downs:50lbs 30reps
    4 rounds

    Calf Raises:35reps
    4 rounds
    Last edited by anderson1010; 11-29-2012 at 02:27 AM.
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  7. #7
    Registered User anderson1010's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Vousden View Post
    at 5'9 , 198lbs , you gotta lot of weight to shift before youll be near dunking. i didnt start dunking until aged 16, and i was 6'0 maybe 6'1 weighing about 145/150lbs . Keep training legs hard doing what's said above.

    losing lbs and gaining this leg strength will help you get towards your goal of dunking, explosiveness is needed though ,try to incorporate a session of plyometric based training, as well as jump squats into your routine.

    these should help build explosive leg power, which is key.
    man i'm 16 and still can't dunk sad but i will, thanks.
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  8. #8
    Registered User Vousden's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by anderson1010 View Post
    man i'm 16 and still can't dunk sad but i will, thanks.
    Doesn't matter about your age too much, just keep going at it, working towards it.

    Hope to god that you grow another few inches lol, and get cracking on this leg work.

    what weights you using for your leg work?
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  9. #9
    Registered User anderson1010's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Vousden View Post
    Doesn't matter about your age too much, just keep going at it, working towards it.

    Hope to god that you grow another few inches lol, and get cracking on this leg work.

    what weights you using for your leg work?
    8kgs dumbbells i dont have barbell its a free gym.... yea bro thanks i will rush and hope to god lol
    but man many ppl say without a barbell and the max being 10kg dumbbells at my gym i will not dunk but i must at least try i will add more weight in jan or something
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  10. #10
    Registered User runnergrl13's Avatar
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    sorry about the knees man... that's a bummer that the doctors aren't that good and it's expensive. here's my advice having gone through injuries in my knees: take a week off from leg work. shooting/stabbing/sharp pains aren't good. if you keep pushing through and injury your going to make it worse. think about it this way- say you have a small tear/irritation/strain somewhere near the knee that is causing that pain- compare that pain to a rubber band that is starting to become weak in one part due to someone pulling it over and over again. if you keep working out (bending and straightening you knee by lifting with your legs through pain) it's going continually weaken until you end up with a full blown injury that could need surgery to fix... similar to if you keep pulling on that elastic it's going to snap. after resting your legs for a week start with some minimal strengthening using resistance bands/ankle weights... i'll dig out my old exercises that i did in physical therapy when i was recovering from my knee injuries and post them or private message you them. if any of the exercises cause that pain to return stop.

    if you can take some NSAIDS (advil/aleve) to help with the swelling- even if it's not visible outside the knee a bursa sac or tendon could be inflamed. also ice your knees several times a day leaving the ice on for 20 minutes each time. perhaps do some gentle stretching. trust me a week off is better than having to take 6-8 months off b/c you pushed through an injury- i've been there and i wish someone would have told me what i am telling you now.

    in the mean time you can work-out and focus on correcting your upper body routine. for a well rounded routine perhaps try this out
    shoulders:
    * db military presses
    * db medial delt raises
    * db frontal raises
    * bent over/head on an incline bench r. flys
    back:
    * lat pull-dwons
    * low-row (either on a machine or single are db rows like your currently doing)
    * supermans/ hyper-extensions & reverse hypers
    chest:
    * db bench press
    * db pec flys
    traps:
    *upright rows (these can be done with dumbbells)
    * shrugs
    bis/tris:
    *overhead/lying triceps extensions
    *overhead/lying triceps kick-outs
    *bicep curl to triceps kickbacks- i like this one b/c it used the full range of each muscle group
    *hammer curls (you can skip these b/c your indirectly engaging that head of the biceps with the triceps extension or you can add it if you looking to gain bicep size)
    core:
    * static planks: center/right/left- hold for 30-60 seconds (i don't know you core strength so i can't recommend anything) and repeat 3-5 times
    * lying windshield wipers with a stability ball or medicine between ankles if available
    * v-ups or a stability ball pass (movement is that of the v-up but you start with the ball in hands, then do a v-up pass the ball to the feet, back down with ball in feet the back up and pass ball to hands, then down= 1 rep)
    * static bridge (or static single leg bridge) if for any reason this bothers your knees stop and just do some more supermans

    as far a reps/breakdown goes that's up to you. usually a stating set/rep range is 2-3 sets at 10-12 reps... i'd go with this for the first week as you'll be adding in exercises you haven't done yet. aim for a weight load that will leave you struggling by the last rep- if the 1st set was too easy go up in weight for the next.
    an example of a plan could be:
    *Monday: back/shoulders/traps and abs
    *Tuesday: chest/bi/tris and abs
    * Wednesday: off
    * Thursday: back/shoulders/traps and abs
    * Friday: chest/bis/tris and abs
    i gurantee if you do this work-out you'll fell that soreness. and make sure you're using a weight that leaves you exhausted by the last rep. you can either do each exercise were you do all sets and reps for one exercise before you move to the next or you can do a circuit or you can superset... for expample for back/shoulders do a set of lat pull-downs then immediately without rest do a set of military presses, then go back to the lat pull-downs then reps for however many sets/reps.

    hope this helps and in all seriousness take a break from legs sharp/shooting/tinglings/numbness/stabbing pains are nothing to mess with. you have plenty do for upper body. if you have a heavy bag do some boxing for cardio or just some shadow boxing to get that heart rate up.
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  11. #11
    Registered User anderson1010's Avatar
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    Back: One Arm Dumbbell Rows (10 reps) i do them standing like a lunge form and one arm on the leg infront without the bench
    Triceps: Triceps Kickbacks (5 reps) can i do them standing after the dumbbell rows? i mean without the bench
    Shoulders: Medial Delt Raises (5 reps) doing it after the kickbacks without the bench
    Shoulders: Front Raises (5 reps) uses bench to sit on lol.
    Shoulders: Side Raises (5 reps)
    Chest: Chest Press Machine (10 reps)
    Shoulders: Standing Dumbbell Press (10 reps)
    Biceps: Dumbbell Curls (10 reps)
    Triceps: Triceps Extensions (20 reps)
    Traps: Shrugs (20 reps)
    Traps: Upright Row (5 reps)
    4 rounds (are these called superset if i do them in a circuit?)

    Core: Sit-Ups (35 reps)
    Chest: Dumbbell Bench Press (5 reps) tried this and notice my stabiliser muscles are weak
    Legs: Bulgarian Split-Squats (5 reps)
    Legs: Deadlifts (5 reps)
    Legs: Sumo Squats (5 reps)
    4rounds

    Legs: Squats (25 reps)
    Legs: In Place Lunges (15 reps)
    Legs: Lying Leg Curls (10reps)
    Back: Lat Pull Downs (30 reps)
    4rounds

    HIIT: 8speed/age 3mins 10speed/age 2mins for 20minutes idk why but my treadmill uses speed/age wonder if its in mph or smth.

    Legs: Calf Raises (35 reps) 4rounds (i do them standing on the stairs without weights)

    all the workouts that i do 5reps is i haven't done it before and will try thanks a bunch b

    is this good enough bro? cause some of the exercise idk how to do them so i think i would start off with these first.
    yea i think i will get a week off. better safe than sorry thanks bro for the advice i don't wanna injure myself or anything
    i will do core exercise at home lol the gym is really small. is this workout already okay? i really wanna transform my body.. u can just imagine me lol just a lump of meat i don't even like my photo taken lol.
    how do i do kickouts? i searched google and came out with nothing
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  12. #12
    Registered User runnergrl13's Avatar
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    you should call me sis not bro no worries on that though.

    definitely go for the week off- glad to hear you'll be doing that

    the routine looks better and you can most certainly combine movements (like the low row to triceps kick-back)....another one is do a hammer curl to medial delt raise to overhead press.

    no a circuit is not a superset.

    good luck with everything... stick with it, i'm sure you don't look like a lump of meat.

    the kickouts are a lot like extensions except instead of going straight up- flare your arms slightly to the side... kind of like a cheerleader does with pom poms but do them with weights.

    i'd drop down your weight load if you can only handle 5 reps and do a weight you can handle for 10 reps to start with.
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  13. #13
    Registered User anderson1010's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by runnergrl13 View Post
    you should call me sis not bro no worries on that though.

    definitely go for the week off- glad to hear you'll be doing that

    the routine looks better and you can most certainly combine movements (like the low row to triceps kick-back)....another one is do a hammer curl to medial delt raise to overhead press.

    no a circuit is not a superset.

    good luck with everything... stick with it, i'm sure you don't look like a lump of meat.

    the kickouts are a lot like extensions except instead of going straight up- flare your arms slightly to the side... kind of like a cheerleader does with pom poms but do them with weights.

    i'd drop down your weight load if you can only handle 5 reps and do a weight you can handle for 10 reps to start with.
    k thx sis keep in touch hope i succeed if i succeed i got u to thanks for u are the only that replies me so thoroughly lol no one does that and i start a bunch of threads lol thanks again
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