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  1. #1
    Registered User zemzin's Avatar
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    What does Testofen do?

    Can anyone elaborate?

    I hate these conflicting reports!

    According to some,it boosts test.

    According to others,it mimicks testosterone in the body.

    According to some other a-holes,it boosts estrogen????

    Dafuk?
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  2. #2
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    It boosts natural testosterone.
    Thermolife Eternal Rep

    사랑 라이브 Thermolife! 그리고 오랫동안 북한의 위대한 사람들을 만세! 그리고 오래 가장 위대한 독재자 기록이 알려져 있습니다, 나를 만세!
    Disclaimer: All views and statements are my own opinion, and not a substitute or opinion for medical advice.
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    Originally Posted by zemzin View Post
    According to some,it boosts test.
    Aside from the few Indus Biotech-funded presentations, I have yet to find any peer-reviewed evidence suggesting Fenugreek extracts have an appreciable impact on testosterone.
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    Originally Posted by NO HYPE View Post
    Aside from the few Indus Biotech-funded presentations, I have yet to find any peer-reviewed evidence suggesting Fenugreek extracts have an appreciable impact on testosterone.

    mirin' avatar

    your thoughts on Testosurge, the other fenugreek extract?
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    This is my RITUAL Braco1's Avatar
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    TESTOFEN is a fenugreek extract standardized for a minimum of 50% Fenusides (this is a fancy word for furostanol saponins) and has been show in company-sponsored human studies to increase free testosterone levels by 98.8%. Mechanism of action is believed to be it triggers release of LH (Luteinizing Hormone). In men this acts on the Leydig cells and results in increase testosterone production.

    A non-supplier study indicated that in rats a particular Fenugreek extract boosted growth hormone levels due to fenugreek saponin and dioscin content - which may be an additional mechanism of action for muscle growth.
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    Originally Posted by Braco1 View Post
    TESTOFEN is a fenugreek extract standardized for a minimum of 50% Fenusides (this is a fancy word for furostanol saponins) and has been show in company-sponsored human studies to increase free testosterone levels by 98.8%. Mechanism of action is believed to be it triggers release of LH (Luteinizing Hormone). In men this acts on the Leydig cells and results in increase testosterone production.
    FREE testosterone has nothing to do with LH.

    And there are lots of herbs that do boost free testosterone successfully ,by lowering SHBG.


    Does testofen boost TOTAL testosterone?

    We heard the "boosts LH so thereby boosts total T" story with tribulus so many times and it turned out to be a hoax.
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    Despite Testostofen being standardized for 'furostanol saponins' and Testosurge being standardized for it's 'grecunin' content, I'm not aware of any literature [other than the Indus Biotech presentations] suggesting that Fenugreek extracts have an appreciable effect on testosterone, aromatase, ect.

    As far as the 'grecunin' compound goes.... there's no identification/quantification data on it whatsoever. I can't even find a CAS number on it. At this point I'm thinking the indus biotech employees that were involved with it's 'identification', signed a confidentiality agreement or something.

    I've got a recent 2012 Trigonella foenum-graecum identification analysis and there's no mention of this elusive compound in it, or in either of the previous literature for that matter --> not that it would be listed under the name grecunin anyway, but still, nothing in reguards to any compounds that affect aromatase or testosterone. The legitimacy of the purported effects are questionable at best.





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    Last edited by NO HYPE; 11-27-2012 at 07:40 AM.
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    Almost every medical published study I found was about its effects on diabetes, insulin, and cholesterol. Apparently its really good for you it that regard, I found 1 on libido, but that doesn't mean it effects test.

    I did find this one

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20878698
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    Originally Posted by Faust24 View Post
    Almost every medical published study I found was about its effects on diabetes, insulin, and cholesterol. Apparently its really good for you it that regard
    Yeah, Fenugreek's antihyperglycemic properties in diabetic subjects are primarily attributed to the 4-HI/trigonelline/galactomannan constituents of Fenugreek.
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    Originally Posted by Braco1 View Post
    TESTOFEN is a fenugreek extract standardized for a minimum of 50% Fenusides (this is a fancy word for furostanol saponins) and has been show in company-sponsored human studies to increase free testosterone levels by 98.8%. Mechanism of action is believed to be it triggers release of LH (Luteinizing Hormone). In men this acts on the Leydig cells and results in increase testosterone production.

    A non-supplier study indicated that in rats a particular Fenugreek extract boosted growth hormone levels due to fenugreek saponin and dioscin content - which may be an additional mechanism of action for muscle growth.
    To the OP - this... ^^^^

    Originally Posted by NO HYPE View Post
    Aside from the few Indus Biotech-funded presentations, I have yet to find any peer-reviewed evidence suggesting Fenugreek extracts have an appreciable impact on testosterone.
    However, this as well... ^^^

    IMO... this is still a relatively new ingredient with more research to be done. Specifically by a third party. I do use a Testofen product from time to time with confidence on the current research. However, I too would like to see third party research down the road.
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    Originally Posted by Faust24 View Post
    I found 1 on libido, but that doesn't mean it effects test.
    Here's one indicating Fenugreek positively affected libido, but had no impact on testosterone or prolactin in humans.


    Phytother Res. 2011 Feb 10. doi: 10.1002/ptr.3360.
    Steels E, Rao A, Vitetta L.
    Physiological Aspects of Male Libido Enhanced by Standardized Trigonella foenum-graecum Extract and Mineral Formulation.

    In the Global Study of Sexual Attitude and Behaviours of 27,500 men and women in 30 countries including the United States, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand, 18% of men reported low libido or lack of interest in sexual activity, low sexual drive, or lack of urge or desire.1 Low libido can be caused by psychological issues, physical conditions, or combinations of other factors. Some medications, such as diuretics, antidepressants, and statins can contribute to this problem. Estrogen/testosterone ratios influence libido; estrogen therapy inhibits libido in women, and androgen therapy has a positive effect on libido in both men and women.

    Recently, interest has increased in herbal medicines used traditionally to improve sexual function and performance. Fenugreek (Trigonella foenum-graecum)is rich in steroidal saponins that can serve as sex hormone precursors. Fenugreek seed extract has exhibited estrogenic activity, binding to estrogen receptors and inducing the expression of estrogen-responsive genes.

    These authors, from Brisbane, Queensland, Australia, conducted a study to evaluate the effects of a formulation containing the Testofen brand of fenugreek extract (Gencor Pacific Ltd.; Anaheim, California) combined with magnesium, zinc, and pyridoxine on healthy males with low libido but without sexual dysfunction. Participants were recruited through local media advertising and clinical trial databases. All were healthy heterosexual males aged 25 to 52 years interested in increasing libido who were not experiencing sexual dysfunction. They were in a stable sexual relationship, sexually active for at least 6 months and anticipating a stable sexual relationship for the following 8 weeks. At baseline, a case history was taken on the 60 consenting participants. Each underwent a brief medical assessment and had blood samples drawn for a full blood count (FBC), prostate-specific antigen (PSA), and testosterone and prolactin levels.

    The participants were assigned randomly to 2 groups of 30. The active treatment product was an herbal formulation tablet containing 300 mg of Testofen brand fenugreek extract powder, 17 mg magnesium, 15 mg elemental zinc, and 5 mg pyridoxine, as well as pharmaceutical grade excipients. The placebo product contained 50 mg rice bran and the same pharmaceutical grade excipients. The primary outcome was treatment efficacy determined by using the Derogatis Interview for Sexual Functioning-Self Report (DISF-SR) (males), a set of 21 questions in 4 domains: sexual cognition/fantasy, sexual arousal, sexual behavior/experiences, and orgasm. All participants completed the questionnaires at the start of the trial (baseline) and at weeks 3 and 6. A secondary outcome was quality of life (QOL) assessed by using a 5-point satisfaction scale at baseline and at 6 weeks. The scale rated the participants' satisfaction with libido, performance, muscle strength, energy, stamina, mood, and sleep.

    FBC, serum testosterone, and serum prolactin were measured again at 6 weeks. Of the 60 recruited participants, 54 completed the study (27 in each group). Average age (41.3 years) and body mass index were similar in the 2 groups. The authors report that statistically significant increases were seen in total DISF-SR scores in the Testofen group at both 3 weeks (67.59 to 75.67;P<0.01) and 6 weeks (67.59 to 82.48; P<0.01). A statistically significant decrease in total DISF-SR score was seen in the placebo group at week 6 (72.93to 66.81; P<0.01). Regarding subscores of the DISF-SR, at week 3, statistically significant changes were seen in sexual arousal, sexual behavior, and orgasm in the Testofen group. At week 6, statistically significant increases were seen in all 4 domains of the DISF-SR in the Testofen group. No statistically significant changes were reported for the placebo group in any of the domains throughout the study. Regarding QOL, most of the Testofen group participants reported improved libido (81.5%), recovery time (66.7%), and quality of sexual performance (63%). Also, most ofthe Testofen group participants reported improved general energy (81.5%) and well-being (55.6%). Overall, little change in mood and sleep was reported ineither group. The placebo group participants reported no improvement in any ofthe QOL factors.

    Serum prolactin and testosterone levels remained within normal reference range for all participants in both groups. No adverse events were reported during the trial. The authors cite several unpublished studies supporting fenugreek's role in balancing hormones and supporting libido in healthy males. They conclude that in this study fenugreek extract powder was efficacious in enhancing male libido in healthy adult males with normal testosterone, prolactin, and PSA levels. Positive changes in the physiological aspects of libido (particularly, sexual arousal and orgasm) as well as improved QOL (well-being, muscle strength, and energy) were reported by participants in the Testofen group.
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    Originally Posted by Gym God View Post
    IMO... this is still a relatively new ingredient with more research to be done. Specifically by a third party.
    Indeed.



    Originally Posted by Gym God View Post
    I do use a Testofen product from time to time with confidence on the current research.
    Yeah, it would be nice to see some actual peer-reviewed/non-affiliated research on Fenugreek for the purpose of testosterone enhancement. These company-sponsored poster presentations are getting tiresome.
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    Originally Posted by NO HYPE View Post
    Regarding QOL, most of the Testofen group participants reported improved libido (81.5%), recovery time (66.7%), and quality of sexual performance (63%). Also, most ofthe Testofen group participants reported improved general energy (81.5%) and well-being (55.6%). Overall, little change in mood and sleep was reported ineither group. The placebo group participants reported no improvement in any ofthe QOL factors.

    Serum prolactin and testosterone levels remained within normal reference range for all participants in both groups No adverse events were reported during the trial. The authors cite several unpublished studies supporting fenugreek's role in balancing hormones and supporting libido in healthy males. They conclude that in this study fenugreek extract powder was efficacious in enhancing male libido in healthy adult males with normal testosterone, prolactin, and PSA levels. Positive changes in the physiological aspects of libido (particularly, sexual arousal and orgasm) as well as improved QOL (well-being, muscle strength, and energy) were reported by participants in the Testofen group.[/i]
    Even if it doesn't raise test the study does say it increases energy and muscle strength. Also the study I posted "Fenu-FG (35 mg/kg p.o.) showed anabolic activity without androgenic activity"

    So everything I am seeing it says this will increase muscle mass, without raising hormone levels. which if that is true count me in.
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    Originally Posted by NO HYPE View Post
    Yeah, it would be nice to see some actual peer-reviewed/non-affiliated research on Fenugreek for the purpose of testosterone enhancement. These company-sponsored poster presentations are getting tiresome.
    I know NO HYPE but they all have to start from somewhere. It's been probably about 8 years since Testofen has been on the market. It is surprising though that this third party attempt has yet to be done.
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    Originally Posted by Faust24 View Post
    Even if it doesn't raise test the study does say it increases energy and muscle strength.
    No. That was merely the participants 'perception' of Testostofen's effects, as indicated by the quality of life questionnaire. Muscle strength and/or energy was not a priority in this study, so it was never analytically measured.
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    Originally Posted by NO HYPE View Post
    No. That was merely the participants 'perception' of Testostofen's effects, as indicated by the quality of life questionnaire. Muscle strength and/or energy was not a priority in this study, so it was never analytically measured.
    so do you see the claims of test boosters with testofen as hype?
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    Originally Posted by Gym God View Post
    I know NO HYPE but they all have to start from somewhere. It's been probably about 8 years since Testofen has been on the market. It is surprising though that this third party attempt has yet to be done.
    Exactly --> and the fact that 8+ years have already passed in the absence of any supporting research whatsoever, casts some serious doubts reguarding the validity of the claims as far as I'm concerned.
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    Originally Posted by evankyle View Post
    so do you see the claims of test boosters with testofen as hype?
    The testostofen/testosurge claims are currently exclusive to the companies that produce them. There is no independent/peer-reviewed research to support them that I know of.
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    Originally Posted by Faust24 View Post
    Almost every medical published study I found was about its effects on diabetes, insulin, and cholesterol. Apparently its really good for you it that regard, I found 1 on libido, but that doesn't mean it effects test.

    I did find this one

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20878698
    I find fenugreek extracts have a tremendous effect on my mood and sense of well being. I use natty test booster mainly for this reason. I'm usually kinda moody but I find that I feel less stressed when using.....
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    Originally Posted by NO HYPE View Post
    The testostofen/testosurge claims are currently exclusive to the companies that produce them. There is no independent/peer-reviewed research to support them that I know of.
    bad business
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    Originally Posted by 80benrichards View Post
    I find fenugreek extracts have a tremendous effect on my mood and sense of well being. I use natty test booster mainly for this reason. I'm usually kinda moody but I find that I feel less stressed when using.....
    Well that's an added bonus however, it would be much more desirable if we knew it had an appreciable impact on testosterone.

    Are there any accompanying actives, or do you use a standalone Fenugreek extract?

    What dose do you use to elicit those effects?
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    Originally Posted by NO HYPE View Post
    Well that's an added bonus however, it would be much more desirable if we knew it had an appreciable impact on testosterone.

    Are there any accompanying actives, or do you use a standalone Fenugreek extract?

    What dose do you use to elicit those effects?
    IIRC, I recall some blood work showing a decrease in T, and an increase in E over a 35 day use of Testofen.

    I have zero interest in ever using this product because of the lack of research and the readily available ingredients that have backing.
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    Originally Posted by Gym God View Post
    To the OP - this... ^^^^


    Originally Posted by zemzin View Post
    FREE testosterone has nothing to do with LH.

    And there are lots of herbs that do boost free testosterone successfully ,by lowering SHBG.


    Does testofen boost TOTAL testosterone?

    We heard the "boosts LH so thereby boosts total T" story with tribulus so many times and it turned out to be a hoax.

    To Gym God....this^^^^
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    Originally Posted by Daycrawler View Post
    IIRC, I recall some blood work showing a decrease in T, and an increase in E over a 35 day use of Testofen.
    I recall hearing something like this.

    I hope it`s not true as I am using Testopro right now and would hate to have to go to AI headquarters and kick ass.
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    Originally Posted by zemzin View Post
    To Gym God....this^^^^
    I could only provide you with information provided by Gencor -->http://www.gencorpacific.com/index.p...ients/testofen

    ... then you could only make your conclusion from this. As both NO HYPE and myself have said, as well as others, it will be nice to see third party testing on this down the road. Hopefully sooner than later so we can close the doors on this discussion.
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    Originally Posted by Daycrawler View Post
    IIRC, I recall some blood work showing a decrease in T, and an increase in E over a 35 day use of Testofen.
    Nice. I think I remember Bane talking about Fenugreek/lactation/and reduced sperm count too.
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    Originally Posted by Gym God View Post
    Hopefully sooner than later so we can close the doors on this discussion.
    At 8-years out.... I wouldn't expect much, but I dunno.
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    Originally Posted by NO HYPE View Post
    At 8-years out.... I wouldn't expect much, but I dunno.
    LOL!... yeah.
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    Originally Posted by NO HYPE View Post
    and reduced sperm count too.
    Just keeps getting better.
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    Originally Posted by zemzin View Post
    Just keeps getting better.
    Yeah, the study was done on rabbits however, the findings are interesting nonetheless.


    Contraception. 2006 Mar;73(3):301-6. Epub 2005 Nov 2.
    Kassem A, Al-Aghbari A, AL-Habori M, Al-Mamary M.
    Evaluation of the potential antifertility effect of fenugreek seeds in male and female rabbits.

    OBJECTIVE: The objective of this study was to evaluate the potential antifertility activity of feeding diets containing 30% fenugreek seeds to male and female white New Zealand rabbits. RESULTS: The data presented in this study clearly demonstrate an antifertility effect of fenugreek seeds in the female rabbits and more of a toxicity effect in the male rabbits. In males, testis weight was reduced, with evident damage to the seminiferous tubules and interstitial tissues as shown by the histopathology of testis tissue sections. In addition, the plasma concentration of the androgen hormone and sperm concentrations were halved in the treated animals. In the case of the females, there was evidence of a significant reduction of developing fetuses as observed by reductions of both fetal and placental weights at 20 days of gestation and of the litter size. This was further supported histopathologically by the observed proliferative changes of the endometrial glands. The circulating plasma progesterone concentrations at 10 and 20 days of gestation significantly increased with no significant effect on the prebreeding estrogen concentrations in the treated animals.
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