Is there really a wrong time to consume carbs?

[BlueBison17]

I understand that when bulking, carbs are important just as much as protien, but when should I be eating them?

Sounds like a silly question, but I read a bit about insulin spikes, and that (from what I got out of this) Spikes weren't good unless it was after a workout or in the morning for breakfast. In that sense, it makes me believe that I shouldn't be having any carbs throughout the day (besides those times) or i'll get horribly fat or something while I bulk.
I know that I will gain fat as I bulk, but I want to keep the bulk as clean/lean as possible.

Is there different exceptions for complex and simple carbs?

Is it bad if I eat a pop tart, or some breaded fish sticks or a burrito at 3 in the afternoon, vs having it later in the day? Does something bad happen to my body if I do? etc.

My current impression is that of all 6 of my daily meals in a day, four of the six should only be protein based meals, while the remaining two, is a blend of protien/carbs. ( don' worry, I have fats included in all my meals)

I'm just confused. I want to bulk and as long as I eat within 200-500 calories over my daily maintenance, I should be fine. But reading some things on these boards makes me think that I should only eat certain types of foods at certain times of the day.

[ThousandEyes]

makes no difference some guys here eat their entire days meals and then go to bed.

The stickies will answer any more of these types of questions you have.

[Iceman1800]

Theoretically no. The only issues would be if it gave you heartburn at night or you've found high amounts of carbs tend to make you sleepy and you are going on a long drive, stuff like that. Base it off personal experience.

[Auron89]

Theoretically no. The only issues would be if it gave you heartburn at night or you've found high amounts of carbs tend to make you sleepy and you are going on a long drive, stuff like that. Base it off personal experience.

This ^

Only thing to worry about is personal effects such as the above.

[rand18m]

Virtually everything you eat, particularly in the context of a varied diet, will result in a release of insulin, the fear of insulin is completely unfounded imo.

As far as your carbohydrate intake it doesn't matter. The concept of carb timing having a substantial effect for someone who is not engaged in very advanced body composition strategies is unfounded. As a matter of fact there is more literature coming forward to suggest that the average person does better in the opposite manner of what has been proposed in the workout crowd. In other words carbs at night may end up being better than in the morning as traditionally thought. Anyway here is a good article from Layne Norton that might be helpful!

http://www.biolayne.com/nutrition/ca...ary-boogeyman/

[Rayzor84]

I'm sure i'm setting myself up for issues, but here goes:

According to Michael Matthews (Bigger, Leaner, Stronger), which was recommended highly to me along with Starting Strength, claims that eating significant carbs several hours before bed isn't the best idea because according to him, the insulin response to the carbs set you up for a lower level of growth hormone release throughout much of your sleep. Now I know this will cause problems with people in here, however, since the same crowd recommended this book and everything else in the book (besides the many meals a day concept) has been pretty good, i'm going to go ahead and post this.

Experience wise, I have found that for me, eating carbs (more than a serving or two of peanuts, or a piece of fruit or some tomatoes or something) near bedtime causes me to gain weight or at the very least not lose it. Whatever broscience says about it, this is my personal experience and I stand by it. I'm doing great not eating carbs late at night now.

EDIT: After reading that article, i'm again self-referred to the above experience. All else was equal - carb and other nutrient intake, caloric intake, activity level, EVERYTHING, yet that still holds true. So whatever studies the author wants to cite and throw around, I can tell you for a fact that consuming carbs, not even alot just a moderate amount, certainly did NOT increase my weight loss. Again, it did the opposite. So I would be at least as careful with these "broscience debunkers" as the people who put out the broscience in the first place, because he can quote all the studies he wants, but my personal experience is not in agreement with his "broscience busting". Let that be a lesson that both sides require great scrutiny and a significant amount of personal experience to back this **** up. Maybe I dont have enough muscle to ramp up my "REM metabolism", but i'm certainly not obese so theoretically his claims should stand up to scrutiny, but personal experience, for ME, causes me to believe that this guy is at least as far off as the broscience he claims to be debunking.

[BlueBison17]

@ThousandEyes
@ Iceman1800
@Auron89
@rand18m

Many thanks guys, really appreciate it.

so really I'm just thinking too much. just eat alot, and eat smart is probably what it all boils down to.

I'm sure i'm setting myself up for issues, but here goes:

According to Michael Matthews (Bigger, Leaner, Stronger), which was recommended highly to me along with Starting Strength, claims that eating significant carbs several hours before bed isn't the best idea because according to him, the insulin response to the carbs set you up for a lower level of growth hormone release throughout much of your sleep. Now I know this will cause problems with people in here, however, since the same crowd recommended this book and everything else in the book (besides the many meals a day concept) has been pretty good, i'm going to go ahead and post this.

Experience wise, I have found that for me, eating carbs (more than a serving or two of peanuts, or a piece of fruit or some tomatoes or something) near bedtime causes me to gain weight or at the very least not lose it. Whatever broscience says about it, this is my personal experience and I stand by it. I'm doing great not eating carbs late at night now.

EDIT: After reading that article, i'm again self-referred to the above experience. All else was equal - carb and other nutrient intake, caloric intake, activity level, EVERYTHING, yet that still holds true. So whatever studies the author wants to cite and throw around, I can tell you for a fact that consuming carbs, not even alot just a moderate amount, certainly did NOT increase my weight loss. Again, it did the opposite. So I would be at least as careful with these "broscience debunkers" as the people who put out the broscience in the first place, because he can quote all the studies he wants, but my personal experience is not in agreement with his "broscience busting". Let that be a lesson that both sides require great scrutiny and a significant amount of personal experience to back this **** up. Maybe I dont have enough muscle to ramp up my "REM metabolism", but i'm certainly not obese so theoretically his claims should stand up to scrutiny, but personal experience, for ME, causes me to believe that this guy is at least as far off as the broscience he claims to be debunking.

your goal however was to lose weight correct?

that's interesting, about his idea that high amounts of carbs before bed = less growth hormones during the night.
is he the only one that suggested such a idea?

Virtually everything you eat, particularly in the context of a varied diet, will result in a release of insulin, the fear of insulin is completely unfounded imo.

As far as your carbohydrate intake it doesn't matter. The concept of carb timing having a substantial effect for someone who is not engaged in very advanced body composition strategies is unfounded. As a matter of fact there is more literature coming forward to suggest that the average person does better in the opposite manner of what has been proposed in the workout crowd. In other words carbs at night may end up being better than in the morning as traditionally thought. Anyway here is a good article from Layne Norton that might be helpful!

http://www.biolayne.com/nutrition/ca...ary-boogeyman/

thanks!

you know, that brings another issure to mind, of all the articles published on this site, how many are legitamite? how many are simply broscience/theories?
such as this.

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/9-th...after-9pm.html

[SuffolkPunch]

Here are some bad times to consume carbs:
- whilst bungee jumping
- during a wrestling match
- during a job interview (unless you offer them round)
- during a funeral service (especially loud carbs such as potato chips)

[stealth50k]

I noticed the same thing as Rayzor84. I tried eating a few fruit or some high carb items before bed and i gained more fat compared to eating low carb/no carbs at night. Its not water either. I noticed more lean mass gains with low/no carbs at night. Stuff like cheese and stuff high in fat/protein is what i eat at night to keep me satiated. Thats just my experience mostly.

[Rayzor84]

I noticed the same thing as Rayzor84. I tried eating a few fruit or some high carb items before bed and i gained more fat compared to eating low carb/no carbs at night. Its not water either. I noticed more lean mass gains with low/no carbs at night. Stuff like cheese and stuff high in fat/protein is what i eat at night to keep me satiated. Thats just my experience mostly.

Same here. I will usually have a serving of peanuts, or a few cherry tomatoes, one or two big tomatoes, or some sliced cucumber at night. I dont always need to snack at night (usually do if I stay up late, of course), but when I do I just take the edge off with low cal, low carb items. There have been a couple instances, however, where I didn't meet my calories (deficit, but dont want to be TOO low), and made it up with something high protein, low carb like a protein shake.

EDIT: I realized that one of the above sentences sounds oddly familiar. "I dont always drink at night, but when I do, I don't choose Dos Equis".

[ironwill2008]

According to Michael Matthews (Bigger, Leaner, Stronger), which was recommended highly to me along with Starting Strength, claims that eating significant carbs several hours before bed isn't the best idea because according to him, the insulin response to the carbs set you up for a lower level of growth hormone release throughout much of your sleep.

This is what science says about nighttime carb intake and HGH output:

http://jcem.endojournals.org/content/32/1/65.abstract

After 2 base line study nights, hyperglycemia of 43–348% above base line was achieved during early sleep on a third night by constant glucose infusion in 6 normal young men. No significant difference in human growth hormone (HGH) release in sleep occurred between base line (mean peak HGH ±se 17.1±2.9 ng/ml) and infusion nights (13.9±4.2 ng/ml). Thus, release of HGH in sleep is not suppressed by acute hyperglycemia.

[Rayzor84]

Thank you for the study citing. However, 17.1 and 13.9 (even with the error margin) seems like it would be a big difference. Maybe not enough of one to affect muscle growth, but it's still a 23% drop in HGH. In any lab class i've ever been in, that would be a highly significant result. Whether it is enough to change muscle growth, i don't know.

EDIT: It's a 19% drop. Leaving the error to show fallibility =/ Still significant, though.

[xXTeezanxX]

Yes carbs in the morning protein at night

[ironwill2008]

Thank you for the study citing. However, 17.1 and 13.9 (even with the error margin) seems like it would be a big difference. Maybe not enough of one to affect muscle growth, but it's still a 23% drop in HGH. In any lab class i've ever been in, that would be a highly significant result. Whether it is enough to change muscle growth, i don't know.

EDIT: It's a 19% drop. Leaving the error to show fallibility =/

I had a link to something that Alan Aragon posted in this forum on this specific topic, but I can't find it.

Anyway, he stated something to the effect that the difference in HGH production was insignificant relative to any possible muscle gain/loss.


Maybe his AA Radar will kick in, and if he's not too busy elsewhere will post a response ITT.

[ssteinberg]

Growth hormone affects collagen synthesis and lipolysis, however it is not anabolic toward the muscle tissue.

[ssteinberg]

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21475137
Eating before bed doesn't make you fat or stops your muscle growth.

[deebee83]

Here are some bad times to consume carbs:
- whilst bungee jumping
- during a wrestling match
- during a job interview (unless you offer them round)
- during a funeral service (especially loud carbs such as potato chips)

Repped for making me laugh

[rand18m]

Growth hormone affects collagen synthesis and lipolysis, however it is not anabolic toward the muscle tissue.

This ^^ is for the most part correct as growth hormone does support muscle protein production primarily through connective tissue. It does support fat breakdown and the maintenance of blood glucose.

[cjamerlan]

I think once your body adjust's to your eating patterns, there is no real difference as to when to consume carbs. Ever since I went IF/IIFYM, I've been consuming at least a pint of ice cream right before bed. The only time I ever experience significant bloat was when I first started doing it (my body hasn't adjusted yet) or if I go way over my maintenance calories.

[MikeKK]

If you eat 200g carbs in 1 sitting your glucose will get really high. Then it will drop for the rest of the day and won't affect total daily cal in/out. All that talk about getting fat due to insulin spike is nonsense. What matters is the calories consumed.