AllPro: A Simple Beginner's Routine part III

[krysix]

In the Q&A

Yes but that Q&A wasn't written by all pro. It was written by TheLBM i think.

[Flyman75]

I've read/heard in more than one place that upright rows are rough on the shoulders, which is why I've stayed away from them. Anyone have any shoulder issues doing upright rows?

[krysix]

I've read/heard in more than one place that upright rows are rough on the shoulders, which is why I've stayed away from them. Anyone have any shoulder issues doing upright rows?

I've heard that upright rows with straight barbell hurt wrists but using EZ bar is alright.

[ngtvenfnty]

I've read/heard in more than one place that upright rows are rough on the shoulders, which is why I've stayed away from them. Anyone have any shoulder issues doing upright rows?

My traps and shoulders love them. Its my elbows that protest.

[ngtvenfnty]

C1D1
Squat: 75 lbs
BP: 125 lbs
BOR: 105 lbs
OHBP: 95 lbs
SLDL: 95 lbs
SR: 75 lbs
CR: 95 lbs

I know these numbers are pathetic, but they are a dramatic increase since the first time I performed this routine two weeks ago. I pretty much started with a bar. The BP has grown the fastest, although I don't really give it any more attention than anything else. I preferred deallifts, in anything I over did those.

To get these numbers I started with a very easy weight and increased over two sets. If on the third I could not get 8 I dialed back a few lbs on the fourth. This is were I am starting for better or worse.

Don't understand why most see their squats so high over everything else. It is one of the toughest for me to do with weight. I can do dozens with body weight, but add a bar and I am pathetic.

[PGRAYMAN]

C1W1D2 in the books!

For those of you who have been on this program for a few cycles, what types of results have you noticed. Let's use a minimum of 3 cycles, as the starting point for this question. If you have before and after photos, those would be great too. Thanks

PR

[frenchy72]

That's better than 1600. Like I said, I'm eating 2000 a day on average. I'm sure some days fluctuate by a couple hundred or so.....

If he's only eating 1600 a day, there is no room for error imo

This is true.

[Dank16]

Is there any benefit to using the olympic bar with plates versus the premade barbells? using the same weight of course. the olympic bar with plates is longer than the premades so idk if that added an extra amount of work/worked more muscles. i have been using the premades for as long as i can with all the barbell exercises because its ready to go

[iamdetermined]

Wow! Why only 1600 cals a day!?! That's very low for your weight and size. I'm pretty close to your size and I'm running on 2000 cals a day max on average and that's running on a deficit. I'm losing roughly 1 - 1.5 lbs a week. Down from 175 to 162/163 right now.

On my heavy and medium days I eat right at the 2000 cal mark, other days I hit just under.

Well im actually 155lbs now, not sure about bf but i still have more than i want. I started out around 1800 calories then stopped losing weight so i've dropped down to 1650 a day. I was actually progressing very well on that amount up until this week......but thats probably cause my lifts are so low, im really fighting the urge to just jump from 115 to 135 so i won't look/feel so weak

[Flyman75]

I've heard that upright rows with straight barbell hurt wrists but using EZ bar is alright.

My traps and shoulders love them. Its my elbows that protest.

Hmmm...I may have to consider an adjustment for the next cycle. I care about overall upper-body strength, not what my biceps look like. I'm 37 with a wife of 12 years and three kids. I really don't give a crap if people are impressed by my biceps, LOL!

To those who have gone from curls to upright rows, did you have to use less weight, more, or about the same? I will need to do a 10-rep max to figure out what my weight should be.

[stevebeans]

Well, started cycle 1 today, had to do it today instead of Monday due to the hurricane. My numbers are lower than what I know I could do, but I am looking at the first cycle as more of a form-building cycle. I've been doing machines for the past 2 months, and neglected things like my lower back.

I plan on doing this cycle and see how easy/hard things are by my first test day and either increase the weight quite a bit to the expected level, or the 10% mark.

Here are my beginning:

Bench: 115lb (I expect 10% next cycle)
SL Dead Lift: 60lb (I expect 20%+ next cycle, was easy)
Back Row: 60lb (I expect 10-20% next cycle)
Military Press: 55lb (I expect 10% next cycle)
Curl: 40lb (I will push it up to 60 or so next cycle then go from there)

Squat and Calves tbd

Overall, despite doing 2 sets from each (plus the warmups) I have to say this is the most tired I've been after a workout. My numbers were easily doable, yet this wore me out which is a great sign. I can't wait for cycle 2 when my form is set and I can figure out my numbers better.

[syncmaster913n]

That's better than 1600. Like I said, I'm eating 2000 a day on average. I'm sure some days fluctuate by a couple hundred or so.....

If he's only eating 1600 a day, there is no room for error imo

That really depends. When I was 230 pounds @ 5'9'' (35% BF), my total energy expenditure was 2,300 / day. When I was on a 1800 diet I was losing 1 pound / week more or less.

People who have a sedentary life style have really low calorie requirements.

[DeltaCharlie75]

Well, started cycle 1 today, had to do it today instead of Monday due to the hurricane. My numbers are lower than what I know I could do, but I am looking at the first cycle as more of a form-building cycle. I've been doing machines for the past 2 months, and neglected things like my lower back.

I plan on doing this cycle and see how easy/hard things are by my first test day and either increase the weight quite a bit to the expected level, or the 10% mark.

Here are my beginning:

Bench: 115lb (I expect 10% next cycle)
SL Dead Lift: 60lb (I expect 20%+ next cycle, was easy)
Back Row: 60lb (I expect 10-20% next cycle)
Military Press: 55lb (I expect 10% next cycle)
Curl: 40lb (I will push it up to 60 or so next cycle then go from there)

Squat and Calves tbd

Overall, despite doing 2 sets from each (plus the warmups) I have to say this is the most tired I've been after a workout. My numbers were easily doable, yet this wore me out which is a great sign. I can't wait for cycle 2 when my form is set and I can figure out my numbers better.

Don't look to far ahead. Start considering increasing the weight after you pass week 5 heavy day. You will be surprised how hard it starts to get from week 3 onwards. Good luck

[Flyman75]

Well, started cycle 1 today, had to do it today instead of Monday due to the hurricane. My numbers are lower than what I know I could do, but I am looking at the first cycle as more of a form-building cycle. I've been doing machines for the past 2 months, and neglected things like my lower back.

I plan on doing this cycle and see how easy/hard things are by my first test day and either increase the weight quite a bit to the expected level, or the 10% mark.

Here are my beginning:

Bench: 115lb (I expect 10% next cycle)
SL Dead Lift: 60lb (I expect 20%+ next cycle, was easy)
Back Row: 60lb (I expect 10-20% next cycle)
Military Press: 55lb (I expect 10% next cycle)
Curl: 40lb (I will push it up to 60 or so next cycle then go from there)

Squat and Calves tbd

Overall, despite doing 2 sets from each (plus the warmups) I have to say this is the most tired I've been after a workout. My numbers were easily doable, yet this wore me out which is a great sign. I can't wait for cycle 2 when my form is set and I can figure out my numbers better.

Congrats on getting started. I'm only on Cycle 2, but I can already tell you that the ease of this routine shouldn't be determined until at least Cycle 3. Think about it this way...your heavy days in Cycle 1 will become your light days in Cycle 3. So just increase your weight 10 percent at the end of the cycle to stick to the routine.

One thing you can do to get back on target and have your heavy days on Monday is do another heavy day this week. All pro has said that if you can't do heavy, moderate, and light routines in a week to just do two heavy days. So maybe do a heavy day Friday and move to C1W2 heavy day next Monday. Just an idea.

[DeltaCharlie75]

Congrats on getting started. I'm only on Cycle 2, but I can already tell you that the ease of this routine shouldn't be determined until at least Cycle 3. Think about it this way...your heavy days in Cycle 1 will become your light days in Cycle 3. So just increase your weight 10 percent at the end of the cycle to stick to the routine.

One thing you can do to get back on target and have your heavy days on Monday is do another heavy day this week. All pro has said that if you can't do heavy, moderate, and light routines in a week to just do two heavy days. So maybe do a heavy day Friday and move to C1W2 heavy day next Monday. Just an idea.

Imo you really need two rest days between heavy days to get the full benefit of decent recovery.As it is only week 1 a med day on fri should work better for starting heavy again on Monday.

[stevebeans]

Congrats on getting started. I'm only on Cycle 2, but I can already tell you that the ease of this routine shouldn't be determined until at least Cycle 3. Think about it this way...your heavy days in Cycle 1 will become your light days in Cycle 3. So just increase your weight 10 percent at the end of the cycle to stick to the routine.

One thing you can do to get back on target and have your heavy days on Monday is do another heavy day this week. All pro has said that if you can't do heavy, moderate, and light routines in a week to just do two heavy days. So maybe do a heavy day Friday and move to C1W2 heavy day next Monday. Just an idea.

Thanks, I think it's just my defense mechanism trying to justify low weights lol. I started working out when I was 15 when I was about 130lbs (6'0".. very skinny) and it was in a gym with a bunch of meat-heads. I always felt so inferior putting 35lb plates on the weight bench I probably pushed harder than I should and had horrible form because of it.

Now, 18 years later I'm back working out, but now it's a health/fitness club yet still have a hard time shaking the 'weak' feeling despite a different environment. It's almost as tough mentally to put on 25 or 35lb plates as it is physically to work out with more. I'm doing better this time around though. I know I can rip curls with 70lbs or do 150lbs on the bench press machine, but it's time I did things proper to build strength and completely proper form.

[sdistasio2]

so my workout on monday was supposed to be my test day for cycle 1! I was pretty excited about it! But on sunday my girlfriend and i were f*cking around and she jumped on me and really tweaked my back up. So i have been holding off a couple days of lifting so that i dont mess my back up worse. I "think" I COULD go today and lift because I have no pain, but im choosing not to as i can still feel tension in the spot. So my question is should i jump right into test day after about a week off on friday? Or should i start the previous week over?

[Maullus]

Think I've got a bit of a shoulder impingement. Compared to some, my problem seems relatively minor, so I'm going to rest, take some NSAIDs, stretch, and cut out some exercises (definitely OHP and bench... maybe rows and curls?) for the next few weeks at least.

My question, however, is about the possibility that a lack of rear delt work might have contributed to the development of this problem. Is that a cause for concern with All Pro? This issue showed up during cycle 5, week 3 for me, and I'm really looking at any and every possible explanation.

[MNryan]

Is there a replacment thread for this (from the Q/A):

"Q2: How do I know what weight I should get started with for each exercise in the routine?
A: This is explained in detail here: (I cant post links yet)"

[Tupperwolf]

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...#post928710923

[MNryan]

Thnx

[Voxmusculus]

Thanks, I think it's just my defense mechanism trying to justify low weights lol. I started working out when I was 15 when I was about 130lbs (6'0".. very skinny) and it was in a gym with a bunch of meat-heads. I always felt so inferior putting 35lb plates on the weight bench I probably pushed harder than I should and had horrible form because of it.

Now, 18 years later I'm back working out, but now it's a health/fitness club yet still have a hard time shaking the 'weak' feeling despite a different environment. It's almost as tough mentally to put on 25 or 35lb plates as it is physically to work out with more. I'm doing better this time around though. I know I can rip curls with 70lbs or do 150lbs on the bench press machine, but it's time I did things proper to build strength and completely proper form.

Do not ever care what other people think. I mean, I still bench just the bar for my warmup and I'm sure some guys at the gym look at me and wonder what the hell is going on. And on my 80% days, I probably look like a complete wuss. But that doesn't mean I change my weights or how I work out because of them.

At my old gym, a certain group of guys would be jackasses about using the squat rack or the benches. It got to the point where they would hog all the machines, and leave large plates on the racks on purpose. Eventually, the place closed down and I moved to a bigger gym with a slightly different demographic. At my current gym, the crowd is pretty awesome. Lots of serious lifters, and people actually have given me great tips on my form etc.

So, don't worry about what people think. Just go out there and do your best. And you may be surprised -- as long as you are at it regularly, you may even become friends with experienced lifters who can give you valuable advice.

[Romano7]

^ Good words man. I do the same thing, warm up with just the barbell. Plain and simple, I'm not at the gym to impress anyone, nor am I at the gym to lift heavy weights. I'm at the gym for me, to build muscle, period.

[Voxmusculus]

^ Good words man. I do the same thing, warm up with just the barbell. Plain and simple, I'm not at the gym to impress anyone, nor am I at the gym to lift heavy weights. I'm at the gym for me, to build muscle, period.

Thanks - and welcome aboard!

[stevebeans]

Do not ever care what other people think. I mean, I still bench just the bar for my warmup and I'm sure some guys at the gym look at me and wonder what the hell is going on. And on my 80% days, I probably look like a complete wuss. But that doesn't mean I change my weights or how I work out because of them.

At my old gym, a certain group of guys would be jackasses about using the squat rack or the benches. It got to the point where they would hog all the machines, and leave large plates on the racks on purpose. Eventually, the place closed down and I moved to a bigger gym with a slightly different demographic. At my current gym, the crowd is pretty awesome. Lots of serious lifters, and people actually have given me great tips on my form etc.

So, don't worry about what people think. Just go out there and do your best. And you may be surprised -- as long as you are at it regularly, you may even become friends with experienced lifters who can give you valuable advice.

Thanks, yea it's taking a bit of mental adjustment but it's working. I mean I'm 33, practically married and just looking to gain strength. I need to drill it in my head that I'm not 15-16 trying to be a big shot, and I should be fine.

The funny part is, now and even back then, I've never judged anyone based on how much they lifted. It's weird I feel people judge me, despite logic telling me they most likely don't.

Anyway, random question about the routine....

I heard that the back rows work either lats or inner back based on grip. What is the recommended grip for this? I'd assume more shoulder width grip, which probably works my back more than my lats? I'd rather have a nice strong back than lats if I had to choose.

[ngtvenfnty]

Can someone explain the functional reason for high medium and low days in the beginning? Once the load gets high I can understand that you may not be able to perform at that top level for three consecutive workouts. But why in the beginning? Other than an exercise in discipline?

Why is it better from a strength increase standpoint to reduce the weight on consecutive workouts rather than keep the loads even for as long as you can keep up?. My intuition says the higher intensity will return faster gains given adequate rest between workouts. If this is wrong I want to understand why.

[whiskeysticks]

Can someone explain the functional reason for high medium and low days in the beginning? Once the load gets high I can understand that you may not be able to perform at that top level for three consecutive workouts. But why in the beginning? Other than an exercise in discipline?

Why is it better from a strength increase standpoint to reduce the weight on consecutive workouts rather than keep the loads even for as long as you can keep up?. My intuition says the higher intensity will return faster gains given adequate rest between workouts. If this is wrong I want to understand why.

Ok...it's like this. You work heavy...as you've already figured your rep max into the situation...you do your medium day...you do your light day. All in the span of one week. You start on cycle 1, week 1, it's easy! You feel good. You can destroy the world. Start at 8 reps, take it to 12 in the 5th week, domination. Great! Take it to week 2...a little harder. But, you get through it. Another 5 weeks of grinding, learning the form of each lift - after all, you're a beginner..you make it to the fifth week of cycle 2, 12 reps each. Now, you're on to week three. The easy day is the hard day of week 1. Granted, each week has been a gradual build, but you notice a struggle on pulling more reps each week into the third week of the cycle. Maybe a bad day, maybe your diet is garbage, maybe you started too high?

Let's say you pass. Now you're on cycle 4. Let's say you passed them all. You had a constant increase in squat, bench, bent over row, overhead press, stiff leg dead lift, curl and calves. Your light day is the heavy day of week 2.

Now on to cycle 5! The light day is now the heavy of the third week. - take a look at your figured third week heavy. Is that something you look forward on doing as a relief after pushing yourself to the max the previous two days of your workout week?



Can you jump on a bike and ride 1 mile perfect with no problem then be told to ride at that pace up hill for 5 miles?

Not so much. This is a beginners program. It's meant to not only build strength but endurance as well. I can honestly say, as a beginner, cycle 3 has been a bitch.

Marathon, not a race! Take it easy, read up on nutrition, master that first and you'll see the "gains" you want to see.

[whiskeysticks]

Also, deload is necessary. This program includes a natural delaod, hence the going down in weight heavy, medium, light days. You're giving your body time to recover. It's good for you!

[ngtvenfnty]

Ok...it's like this. You work heavy...as you've already figured your rep max into the situation...you do your medium day...you do your light day. All in the span of one week. You start on cycle 1, week 1, it's easy! You feel good. You can destroy the world. Start at 8 reps, take it to 12 in the 5th week, domination. Great! Take it to week 2...a little harder. But, you get through it. Another 5 weeks of grinding, learning the form of each lift - after all, you're a beginner..you make it to the fifth week of cycle 2, 12 reps each. Now, you're on to week three. The easy day is the hard day of week 1. Granted, each week has been a gradual build, but you notice a struggle on pulling more reps each week into the third week of the cycle. Maybe a bad day, maybe your diet is garbage, maybe you started too high?

Let's say you pass. Now you're on cycle 4. Let's say you passed them all. You had a constant increase in squat, bench, bent over row, overhead press, stiff leg dead lift, curl and calves. Your light day is the heavy day of week 2.

Now on to cycle 5! The light day is now the heavy of the third week. - take a look at your figured third week heavy. Is that something you look forward on doing as a relief after pushing yourself to the max the previous two days of your workout week?



Can you jump on a bike and ride 1 mile perfect with no problem then be told to ride at that pace up hill for 5 miles?

Not so much. This is a beginners program. It's meant to not only build strength but endurance as well. I can honestly say, as a beginner, cycle 3 has been a bitch.

Marathon, not a race! Take it easy, read up on nutrition, master that first and you'll see the "gains" you want to see.

I guess my question is, why not during week 1 use the same weight day 1, 2 and 3, <i>while it is easy</i>. Is there a physiological advantage to reducing the weight throughout the week? Why will using less weight on day 2 and 3 increase my strength more than using the same weight as I used on day one...<i>as long as I can handle that load</i>?

I get that in the later cycles when the max weight is much higher you will be pooped out by day 3. But if I fail I am just going to stay at the same weight anyway, but go way back down to far less reps than I am able to handle.

What does stepping down the weight do to my body from a biology standpoint that makes it superior to simply pounding the same weight three days a week until I can do 12 reps of it?

Sorry if I sound repetitive, i am just looking for the best way to express what I am asking.

[ngtvenfnty]

Also, deload is necessary. This program includes a natural delaod, hence the going down in weight heavy, medium, light days. You're giving your body time to recover. It's good for you!

Ah, "deload", now we are getting somewhere...I get what it is...what I am asking is why do I need it in this program?

My intuitions say working only every other day with a two day rest at the end of the week makes deloading somewhat superfluous.

Perhaps the best answer is "do a couple of cycles" and then I will see why it is necessary...but in the meantime, in the early phase, I feel like i have energy to burn.