AllPro: A Simple Beginner's Routine part III

[raxorsharp]

You won't need to add pull-ups to this routine until a few cycles in. If you are consistent with the weights and keep adding weight to the bar, getting adequate nutrition and rest, then you'll make strength gains. If after 3 cycles you feel that anything is lacking in the routine, then you can make intelligent additions to the routine. But if you're a complete beginner, you really should just do the routine as written and focus on doing it right. Look again after 3 cycles and add pull-ups if you still want to because they're a great exercise, but adding push-ups is probably a waste of time.

Adding more and more stuff makes people think they're going to get better, faster, results. With training, however, "less is more". You should focus 110% on what you're actually doing and do it to your utmost ability, forget about anything else. Then you'll progress. Tinker unnecessarily by making unwise additions and you'll likely end up stalling your progress. Trust me, there's more than enough to be going on with trying to perfect the form and increase the weight on the included lifts.

Ok thx a lot mate!! I think i'll just leave out any additions at least for the first couple of cycles... glad you could clarify it for me

[jampot1]

Has anyone had to drop weight while cutting? E.g. if by the end of a cycle you can't even manage 2*8 reps, should you drop the weight by 10%?

[RBZen]

I'm on Cycle 1 Week 3 now. Week 3 heavy day is going to be on Sunday. Oh man, oh man I'm in trouble. Ohhhh in so much trouble.

I started this program without really knowing how to figure out my starting weight. The link was dead, and I didn't have time to look around before going to the gym. So I just went with my 8 rep max. Turns out it needs to be my 10 rep max.

Ohhh. I'm so f*****. Ha ha. Week 4 and 5 will be painful. But screw it. I'm going to push through this. At the moment I think the only one I will fail is OHP. SLDL is iffy, depends on how Week 3 goes.

But I'm loving this workout. And my mistake will just make me stronger!

[makeitright]

I'm on Cycle 1 Week 3 now. Week 3 heavy day is going to be on Sunday. Oh man, oh man I'm in trouble. Ohhhh in so much trouble.

I started this program without really knowing how to figure out my starting weight. The link was dead, and I didn't have time to look around before going to the gym. So I just went with my 8 rep max. Turns out it needs to be my 10 rep max.

Ohhh. I'm so f*****. Ha ha. Week 4 and 5 will be painful. But screw it. I'm going to push through this. At the moment I think the only one I will fail is OHP. SLDL is iffy, depends on how Week 3 goes.

But I'm loving this workout. And my mistake will just make me stronger!

You could always just plug in your 8 reps here http://www.ivannikolov.com/calculato...ax-calculator/ and take it from there if you wanted?

[bongfong]

Has anyone had to drop weight while cutting? E.g. if by the end of a cycle you can't even manage 2*8 reps, should you drop the weight by 10%?

I wouldn't drop by a set percentage. Retest your 10RM.

[RBZen]

I'm not too worried about it right now. I'm just going to finish out this cycle without adjusting weights, if it ends up being a problem I'll re-evaluate but for the time being, I've met every rep for the first 2 weeks. I was just laughing at my own mistake in that post.

[Olegru]

So I'm on Cycle 1 Week 3 - Have my 2nd Heavy day on Friday. I've been doing the 2 Heavy day a week - Tuesday and Friday schedule, since it's a bit difficult for me to make it to them gym 3x a week for workouts, at least for the near future. The workouts are intense but feel pretty good (though I get some anxiety a couple of hours after). I've been sleeping on a good schedule and getting my nutrition.
Am I losing any benefit from not having a deload and just doing the 2 heavy days a week schedule?

Vaylor Thanks for the link on Deloading basics, but I'd like to know if by doing 2 heavy days instead of the 3 - heavy medium light, am I losing a lot or is it pretty much just as effective.
I complete each workout, I get a couple of days of rest in between, I eat properly, I take creatine.a

Also, I could even include in a deload week (2 light workouts instead of 2 heavy) after week 5 of my first cycle before starting my 2nd cycle

[ocamorongan]

I just finished my first cycle but was forced to take about a week off. Do you guys think I should continue with the normal weight progression for cycle 2 or should I find my new 10 rep maxes and use those for cycle 2 instead? Any suggestions would be great

[banjoman23]

I'd like to know if by doing 2 heavy days instead of the 3 - heavy medium light, am I losing a lot or is it pretty much just as effective.

Beginners typically don't have the work capacity to handle 2 day a week heavy and would end up overtrained in a few months. But as you progress, there's nothing wrong with the 2 heavies a week, in fact All Pro often pointed people towards that direction as they came closer to intermediate status, as 2 heavies per week with these exercises is closer to an intermediate workout.

Recovery. After a while that wont be an issue. That's when you reduce to twice per week and increase the volume per work out. That's one part of it. The other part is that the high frequency helps the CNS learn the firing pattern faster. Like playing the scales when learning to play the piano. But after a while that wont be an issue either. Twice per week when both work outs are heavy is tougher on the CNS but easier on the muscles recovery wise. This is when dual factor programing really shows it's stuff.

The other major difference is the loss of volume per week when the frequency is reduced. Both work outs are heavy in an effort to regain some of that lost volume. As one becomes stronger that wont be an issue because you're lifting heavier and that will bring the volume up also.

Edit: Another good All Pro quote on "What would I be giving up by going to 2 times per week heavy?":

1) You would be giving up volume. But as you get stronger you will need the extra recovery time that twice per week affords and the fact that you are stronger will increase the volume that you're doing. You will be capable of inflicting a lot more damage than you were capable of when you first started. And your CNS will be a lot more efficient. Unfortunately that isn't a good thing when it comes to recovery. It will burn itself out going 3x per week even if you do fewer reps. I've tested that before on myself and several others. It doesn't work. That's why the soviets used mixed qualities training. My intermediate programs are a very simple mixed qualities, dual factor format. They avoid the problems for as long as possible, then deload and start back up the ladder again.

[Morti]

What to do for front deltoids, been on this routine for a long time, can you add a exercise for front deltoids?

[Vaylor]

So can I expect greater hypertrophic gains from All Pros than I got from Strong Lifts, granted diet is in order?

They would both be about the same.

[jampot1]

I wouldn't drop by a set percentage. Retest your 10RM.

Is it worth doing that now (week 3) or at the end of this cycle?

[Vaylor]

Is it worth doing that now (week 3) or at the end of this cycle?

End of the cycle.

Speaking of which, what cycle are you on anyway? If it is before cycle 3 then don't bother. The first two cycles are supposed to be easy.

[Vaylor]

What to do for front deltoids, been on this routine for a long time, can you add a exercise for front deltoids?

Probably something like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PTCaHBZ1X4

[aceedkins]

They would both be about the same.

Really? But doesn't the greater rep range increase hypertrophy?

[Vaylor]

Really? But doesn't the greater rep range increase hypertrophy?

No. The most important aspect of hypertrophy, besides diet, is Progressive Overload. Rep range isn't all that important.

[aceedkins]

No. The most important aspect of hypertrophy, besides diet, is Progressive Overload. Rep range isn't all that important.

Hmm, okay. My numbers till aren't all that great after 3.5 months of SL, so I should still see some good gains on this for a while before I move on to a hypertrophy oriented program.

[tontyx]

Hmm, okay. My numbers till aren't all that great after 3.5 months of SL, so I should still see some good gains on this for a while before I move on to a hypertrophy oriented program.

What is your number after 3.5 Months?
I also feel that you should first squeeze out or progress as much as possible from SS since you already started it. Inconsistency can be a biatch.

I plan to do this only after I reach a squat of 150 KG, at least.

I will be doing 110 tomorrow for 5X5 ( I am on 5X5 stronglift), but will be doing a deload cum reset on my Deadlift because of Bad form

[jampot1]

End of the cycle.

Speaking of which, what cycle are you on anyway? If it is before cycle 3 then don't bother. The first two cycles are supposed to be easy.

I'm currently on cycle 5. I bulked for 3 cycles, 2 of which I passed without any issues. Now I've been cutting for 2 cycles (including this one).

[FitnessFan76]

What is your number after 3.5 Months?
I also feel that you should first squeeze out or progress as much as possible from SS since you already started it. Inconsistency can be a biatch.

I plan to do this only after I reach a squat of 150 KG, at least.

I will be doing 110 tomorrow for 5X5 ( I am on 5X5 stronglift), but will be doing a deload cum reset on my Deadlift because of Bad form

Don't you mean 150lbs? 150kg is more than 300lbs...

[chris6575]

glad to see this topic is going strong. been too busy to post. For myself because i have stated before i love deadlifts, I decided to do them only once per week with this routine as other users have said, many people don't do them a lot.

Its been about 3 weeks now and yeah i admit i am not keeping track of the weights as much as just doing 10-12 reps. But on the final set of each exercise i go for 8. My only issue is because the gym i go to is i guess small compared to other gyms and i always can't do the exercises with my time frame.

It's why i have in the past asked so much about the smith machine. Even this week i did smith squats because i was short on time and couldn't wait for the 2 racks to open up. I guess to each his own, but sometimes i do like them to free squats and hell i still feel like bent over rows feel fine with the smith. Nice even rows right into my sternum and feels ok to me.

It's good to have a set routine, but i also like being flexible based on what is available at the times i go

[Dank16]

glad to see this topic is going strong. been too busy to post. For myself because i have stated before i love deadlifts, I decided to do them only once per week with this routine as other users have said, many people don't do them a lot.

Its been about 3 weeks now and yeah i admit i am not keeping track of the weights as much as just doing 10-12 reps. But on the final set of each exercise i go for 8. My only issue is because the gym i go to is i guess small compared to other gyms and i always can't do the exercises with my time frame.

It's why i have in the past asked so much about the smith machine. Even this week i did smith squats because i was short on time and couldn't wait for the 2 racks to open up. I guess to each his own, but sometimes i do like them to free squats and hell i still feel like bent over rows feel fine with the smith. Nice even rows right into my sternum and feels ok to me.

It's good to have a set routine, but i also like being flexible based on what is available at the times i go

wait what? people are only doing deadlifts once a week?

[makeitright]

wait what? people are only doing deadlifts once a week?

I think he's talking about replacing medium day squats with regular deadlifts as Jimmer had talked about on the last page. That's my best guess.

[makeitright]

Also, FML, I just remembered I totally forgot to weigh in this morning before heading to the gym. Now, to weigh in tomorrow or just wait until next week?

[blindspot13]

Has anyone had to drop weight while cutting? E.g. if by the end of a cycle you can't even manage 2*8 reps, should you drop the weight by 10%?

Been cutting on a 1000 calorie deficit and I'm heading into Cycle 2 test day and I'm confident I'll pass everything. Shrug.

[AustynS]

I'm only on cycle 1 week 1 and I did my light day today, but when I do my squats they just feel weak. Monday (heavy day) I was struggling even though I was only doing 8 reps. Is it supposed to feel that way? I haven't done squats other than testing my max (which I did 3 times). I don't feel the pump or explosiveness like I normally do. Thanks for any help.

[Olegru]

Beginners typically don't have the work capacity to handle 2 day a week heavy and would end up overtrained in a few months. But as you progress, there's nothing wrong with the 2 heavies a week, in fact All Pro often pointed people towards that direction as they came closer to intermediate status, as 2 heavies per week with these exercises is closer to an intermediate workout.



Edit: Another good All Pro quote on "What would I be giving up by going to 2 times per week heavy?":

Interesting.... I've been doing 2 heavies a week for last 4 weeks though. This is my first cycle, but I used to be pretty "jacked" like 5 years ago when I worked out (muscle memory maybe?). Anyway, I did 3 workout sessions to find my 10 rep max, then I had to repeat week 2 because I had a stomach virus when 2nd day came, so all in all it's been about 5 weeks of gym so far and I just finished my Cycle1Week3 today (2nd heavy day this week). I eat a lot - eggs, brown rice, buckwheat, chicken breast, meat, the occasional sandwich/burrito with whole wheat and protein sources etc. I've improved my sleep schedule and sleep around 7-9 hours a night and go to sleep before 2am. I have at least 2 days between each workout (Tuesday and Friday)
All Pro says the down side of no deload is missing out on volume - does he mean amount of times u exercise a week or mass?
Do you think I'm really losing out significantly with my 2 heavies a week? (Keep in mind I do it because I am back in college and do lots of studying and work on the other days)

What if I keep with this type of schedule, but do a fully light deload week between each cycle?

Banjoman is very helpful and I'd love to hear from you, but other knowledge people please chime in as well - I'm on this forum to learn!!!

[Jmjacomine]

I'm only on cycle 1 week 1 and I did my light day today, but when I do my squats they just feel weak. Monday (heavy day) I was struggling even though I was only doing 8 reps. Is it supposed to feel that way? I haven't done squats other than testing my max (which I did 3 times). I don't feel the pump or explosiveness like I normally do. Thanks for any help.

Your CNS could be worn out. Get plenty of rest on your off days and make sure that you are eating properly. I had the same problem my first two weeks and now that I changed my diet(not enough calories) and I rest more, I have been feeling good at the end of the week.

[TrickMaster95]

nice

[clouth]

Say I don't get all my reps on week 3. Do I start back at 1 with that same weight?