Intermediate/Advanced Routine

[dkvill23]

Just woke up on day five... feels like someone has implanted golf balls in my calves and thighs... tomorrows legs workout will be interesting.

Let us know how much if, if at all, it holds you back?

Damn, not sure if really bad DOMS or pulled hammies. My right hamstring really hurts when I walk, but there are no swelling, it just hurts to bend but I can still bend it. My left hamstring is a lil better but it also hurts D:<



holy sht, walking up 3 flights of stairs and back down was painful

brb first class 3rd floor building A
2nd class 1st floor building B
3rd class 3rd Floor building A

-_-

[AD1984]

I'm not very accurate in counting calories. I figure i don't need to be as precise since my body fat is high right now. I'm positive that i'm always at a deficit especially since this program is so intense and burns a ton of cals. I'm starting to think that maybe i'm not eating enough? Not sure what deficit is big enough that it would start to have negative effects

Start counting calories and get a food scale. Chances are you're eating too much, despite your perception. Even if routine is more intense than your average workout, it still doesn't burn a whole lot. If you're not losing weight, you're eating too much, it's that simple. The last thing you want is to add more calories lol.

[KrepE]

I guess I'll invest in a food scale to be more precise. It's hard to keep the diet in check on this program I get crazy cravings lol today i messed up and got too many carbs tomorrow I'll be back on track.

Today I completed D1 for the second time and something weird happened I incressed the weight only by 5 pounds on the flat bench press since it felt a little light last time (I do incline first), and by rep 28 I could't get the bar up even for 1 rep after resting 45 seconds, even after resting 1 1/2 minutes I could only get the bar up 1 time and the negative of the second, never felt anything like this before, it was like I had no control over my muscles.... I only managed to get 30 reps.... Should I rest whatever it takes me to get the 3 reps even if this means resting for 2 or 2 1/2 minutes?? or should I drop the weight down???

This is the only exercise that gives me trouble everything else is going great apart from getting hungry as hell and not been able to eat

[Kelei]

Kelei,

Deloading for the first time next week after 3 weeks. Is it ok to take 10 rep only deload approach for the week and then return to loading?

I'm going to go nuts if I don't do something at the gym, I can't just take the week off.

That's fine.

I guess I'll invest in a food scale to be more precise. It's hard to keep the diet in check on this program I get crazy cravings lol today i messed up and got too many carbs tomorrow I'll be back on track.

Today I completed D1 for the second time and something weird happened I incressed the weight only by 5 pounds on the flat bench press since it felt a little light last time (I do incline first), and by rep 28 I could't get the bar up even for 1 rep after resting 45 seconds, even after resting 1 1/2 minutes I could only get the bar up 1 time and the negative of the second, never felt anything like this before, it was like I had no control over my muscles.... I only managed to get 30 reps.... Should I rest whatever it takes me to get the 3 reps even if this means resting for 2 or 2 1/2 minutes?? or should I drop the weight down???

This is the only exercise that gives me trouble everything else is going great apart from getting hungry as hell and not been able to eat

Usually when this happens it's a sign of glycogen depletion, how many grams of carbs are you eating per day?

[KrepE]

That's fine.

Usually when this happens it's a sign of glycogen depletion, how many grams of carbs are you eating per day?

Appart from today that I gave in to the cravings I'm getting arround 200g of Carbs a day mainly rice beans and oatmeal..... What I found weird is that only affects the bench press. (I'm doing 40 reps instead of 50 since you sugested that for a cut and 30 seemed too little to me)

[Kusie]

Start counting calories and get a food scale. Chances are you're eating too much, despite your perception. Even if routine is more intense than your average workout, it still doesn't burn a whole lot. If you're not losing weight, you're eating too much, it's that simple. The last thing you want is to add more calories lol.

I'll give it a try. Maybe i've overestimated my requirements? 2200 is what I came up with and that's with setting my activity level at 1.7 i believe. Other than this program i'm not really active so maybe i set the activity level too high?

[Alyion]

Kelei, I have a question regarding squats (probably more so for back squats). When the squats becoming 'breathing' ones just how much could you get away with to call it a single set? I've probably phrased this in a terrible way, but I got my top set of 12 today and reps 7 onwards took about 10 seconds each while still holding onto the bar. Brutal as f*ck but it wasn't exactly a seamless set.

[Kelei]

Kelei, I have a question regarding squats (probably more so for back squats). When the squats becoming 'breathing' ones just how much could you get away with to call it a single set? I've probably phrased this in a terrible way, but I got my top set of 12 today and reps 7 onwards took about 10 seconds each while still holding onto the bar. Brutal as f*ck but it wasn't exactly a seamless set.

3 seconds maximum, anything more than that and you're no longer performing the same set, you're rest-pausing single reps.

There's nothing wrong with doing this, rest-pausing single reps works very well. The reason why I prefer 3 rep rest-pause sets is because if you rest-pause singles or doubles you have to rack/unrack your weights too often which wastes a lot of energy (I'm not only talking about squats here). Using 3 rep rest-pause sets keeps the average effort per rep very high while reducing the number of times you need to rack/unrack your weights. A reasonable compromise if you ask me.

[wwazza]

I'll give it a try. Maybe i've overestimated my requirements? 2200 is what I came up with and that's with setting my activity level at 1.7 i believe. Other than this program i'm not really active so maybe i set the activity level too high?

1.7 is far too high then. Try 1.4 or add some cardio but if you're not tracking calories as closely as possible how can you make the necessary adjustments. You need to track everything, salad, sauces, fruit, veg, juice, they all add up and will give you your true daily calorie intake. 2200 isn't particularly high but if you underestimating the foods you eat this could be closer to 2500.

[wwazza]

kelei,

the pain in my right forearm is still giving me a bit of grief. I can train through it though, but pullups and ez bar preacher curls are the worst culprits. I'll stick with the pullups, but I prefer hammer curls with the rope attachment whilst standing which causes no pain and actually seems to reduce the soreness. I assume this is a good alternative then?

[Kelei]

Appart from today that I gave in to the cravings I'm getting arround 200g of Carbs a day mainly rice beans and oatmeal..... What I found weird is that only affects the bench press. (I'm doing 40 reps instead of 50 since you sugested that for a cut and 30 seemed too little to me)

Increase your carbohydrate intake to 250 grams and see if that prevents it from happening again. Reducing your total reps a little bit should help as well.

kelei,

the pain in my right forearm is still giving me a bit of grief. I can train through it though, but pullups and ez bar preacher curls are the worst culprits. I'll stick with the pullups, but I prefer hammer curls with the rope attachment whilst standing which causes no pain and actually seems to reduce the soreness. I assume this is a good alternative then?

Don't perform any exercise which causes pain/discomfort. If I feel that something isn't right during a particular exercise I stop performing that exercise for a few workouts just to be safe. If an exercise becomes a regular/repeat offender it would be wise to stop performing that exercise permanently and switch to something else instead.

[VicRattlehead]

You can combine D1, D2 and D3 into a full body workout, there are two ways to go about it.

- 3 times per week (MWF etc), reduce total number of reps from 50 to 20 for each exercise (perform your first set and then rest-pause your way to 20 total reps).
- 7 days per week (taking rest days whenever you need them), only perform the first set of each exercise (skip all your rest-pause sets).

How would you go about full body while cutting? 3 x week + no rest pause?

Or maybe do half the exercises each session and rest pause to 20 total reps? For example:

Mon- Front Squat - Leg curl - Chin up - Bench - Lat Raise - curl - OH ext - standing Calves
Wed- Leg Extension - RDL - Row - Incline Bench - Reverse lat raise - Pushdown - seated calves
Fri- repeat Mon etc.

[MichaelCJ]

Hm. Interesting program there. Kinda tempting, actually - time to turn to the dark side?

Sorry, I know the answer's probably somewhere in these 120+ pages, but...

About deloads: are these typical/recommended/mandatory? And if so, exactly (or roughly) how and when?

[tazmanpa]

Increase your carbohydrate intake to 250 grams and see if that prevents it from happening again. Reducing your total reps a little bit should help as well.

I have a similar feeling that KrepE is describing on the incline dumbell curls. I find I can usually finish off with sets of 2 I just have to be carefull not to hit that failure point and it is the only exercise I have that problem with. I am at around 300 grams of carbs now that I have increased my calories to 2500 per day.

[adamxbomb]

Hm. Interesting program there. Kinda tempting, actually - time to turn to the dark side?

Sorry, I know the answer's probably somewhere in these 120+ pages, but...

About deloads: are these typical/recommended/mandatory? And if so, exactly (or roughly) how and when?

3/1 or 6/2 meaning 3 weeks training, 1 week deload, ect, ect , ect...I just listen to my body, when I feel its ready for a deload, do it, very simple.

[loukiss]

Kelei i did pull today.. I have my doubts about the chin up-pull up combination since i am very weak..Workout on these went like this:

Chin Ups : BW x 10/3/3/3/3/2/2/2/2 (30 total reps but not all perfect if you get what i mean)

Pull Ups : BW x 4/2/2/1/1/1 lol

could i just focus on chin ups and do pull down instead of pull ups ? Cause i cant feel my back working so well in pull ups ..I know its not the same but chin ups drain me and i cant be assed to make it with pull too u know ? :/

Also I added hammer curls before preacher curls. Is that wrong ? Want some more biceps work

[j0ey9812]

I just have to report this. Started on this program this Monday. And combined with the new diet with lots of eggs, cottage cheese/peanut butter and more. And also because my appetite just went through the roof these few days. I weighed in Monday morning and just weighed again.
And I gained a whole 5 lbs from 147 to 152! And assuming its all muscle as I cant possible put on fat with this kind of workout going on, and my body looks more fit as well.
Really 5 pounds gain already and it's just Friday, it's nuts!

[OGstrength]

I just have to report this. Started on this program this Monday. And combined with the new diet with lots of eggs, cottage cheese/peanut butter and more. And also because my appetite just went through the roof these few days. I weighed in Monday morning and just weighed again.
And I gained a whole 5 lbs from 147 to 152! And assuming its all muscle as I cant possible put on fat with this kind of workout going on, and my body looks more fit as well.
Really 5 pounds gain already and it's just Friday, it's nuts!

sry bro, i really wish we could gain 5lbs of muscle in 5 days but highly impossible even with gear and nooby gains combined.

[Kusie]

1.7 is far too high then. Try 1.4 or add some cardio but if you're not tracking calories as closely as possible how can you make the necessary adjustments. You need to track everything, salad, sauces, fruit, veg, juice, they all add up and will give you your true daily calorie intake. 2200 isn't particularly high but if you underestimating the foods you eat this could be closer to 2500.

Thanks for the input. Will start counting calories again and see how it goes.


As a side note, I measured my waist yesterday and am down to 37" from 39.5" in about 2 months, so I guess the increase in muscle mass is offsetting the weight loss to some degree

[Kusie]

sry bro, i really wish we could gain 5lbs of muscle in 5 days but highly impossible even with gear and nooby gains combined.

lol agreed. OP what you're seeing is water weight mostly since you're new to training at such high volume. Once your body adjusts, you'll begin retaining less water

[reluded]

Hi, Keley. Want to ask you if your workout routine is suitable for me.
I'm natural trainee, ectomorph, have few years of experience in bodybuilding. I was pretty skinny when I started(120 lbs), now I'm around 170 lbs, 10% bodyfat 6 foot tall, and am looking for bulking routine.
Last routine I used was MAX OT(HIT, pretty low reps), got some increase in strength, but not so much in muscle. My primary goal is to gain muscle.
Is your routine a good suggestion for an intermediate builder, who's looking to pack more muscle? If not, can you suggest another routine?

[j0ey9812]

lol agreed. OP what you're seeing is water weight mostly since you're new to training at such high volume. Once your body adjusts, you'll begin retaining less water

probably right. I was so amazed. Now I remember I weighted in on Monday right after I got out of bed. While I weighted in today after a full stomach of dinner..

I will weight once again tomorrow after I get out of bed.

[Kelei]

Kelei i did pull today.. I have my doubts about the chin up-pull up combination since i am very weak..Workout on these went like this:

Chin Ups : BW x 10/3/3/3/3/2/2/2/2 (30 total reps but not all perfect if you get what i mean)

Pull Ups : BW x 4/2/2/1/1/1 lol

could i just focus on chin ups and do pull down instead of pull ups ? Cause i cant feel my back working so well in pull ups ..I know its not the same but chin ups drain me and i cant be assed to make it with pull too u know ? :/

Also I added hammer curls before preacher curls. Is that wrong ? Want some more biceps work

Stick with pull-ups, just do less of them for the time being. You can also seperate chin-ups and pull-ups with another exercise in-between, perhaps rear delt flyes.

Hi, Keley. Want to ask you if your workout routine is suitable for me.
I'm natural trainee, ectomorph, have few years of experience in bodybuilding. I was pretty skinny when I started(120 lbs), now I'm around 170 lbs, 10% bodyfat 6 foot tall, and am looking for bulking routine.
Last routine I used was MAX OT(HIT, pretty low reps), got some increase in strength, but not so much in muscle. My primary goal is to gain muscle.
Is your routine a good suggestion for an intermediate builder, who's looking to pack more muscle? If not, can you suggest another routine?

Increasing your 10 rep maxes with a large variety of exercises is the best way to promote hypertrophy, there's no reason why you can't use this routine.

[ababab]

probably right. I was so amazed. Now I remember I weighted in on Monday right after I got out of bed. While I weighted in today after a full stomach of dinner..

I will weight once again tomorrow after I get out of bed.

That's why. Gotta make sure you're consistent with when you weigh yourself. Personally, I do so in the morning after taking a piss lol.

[Kusie]

probably right. I was so amazed. Now I remember I weighted in on Monday right after I got out of bed. While I weighted in today after a full stomach of dinner..

I will weight once again tomorrow after I get out of bed.

Or just don't obsess over scale numbers because they're generally useless unless you're obese. The mirror and a tape measure are your friends.

[Joshyb90]

Hi there Kelei,

I've been training for about 3 months now on a 3 x day per week full body workout. In this time frame i have got my diet quite well and have trained consistently. My question to you is would i get results out of doing your program, i realize it says for intermediate - advanced but i feel it is geared slightly more towards what my goals are (And i like the look of it lol). Im sure you've had beginners start on this program before and have they benefited?

[ababab]

Kelei,

What's your take on doing overreach/deloads for a body part on a calorie deficit? I need to cut now, I've let my bodyfat steadily rise since November despite muscle gains, but at the same time I am not happy with my arms at all. Honestly, I''ve always wanted to increase arm mass but just cant seem too.

You may suggest a slow and steady recomp, but I'd rather go with a traditional cut cycle. Should I continue overreach/deloads for my arms? And what should be my minimum CHO intake? I'm thinking 200g

[KrepE]

Increase your carbohydrate intake to 250 grams and see if that prevents it from happening again. Reducing your total reps a little bit should help as well.

Hi Kelei do you mean increase my carbs to 250g without reducing my protein and fat?? I'm cutting and from my calculations I got a 2200 calories to loose weight I weight 194 and getting 200g of carbs, 80g fat, 170g protein.... If i do what you said I'll be at 2400 calories a day, don't think I could loose weight with that calories I'm 5'9 age 25 little activitie besides the gym and 2 sessions of 30 min of slow cardio a week

I have a similar feeling that KrepE is describing on the incline dumbell curls. I find I can usually finish off with sets of 2 I just have to be carefull not to hit that failure point and it is the only exercise I have that problem with. I am at around 300 grams of carbs now that I have increased my calories to 2500 per day.

How long do you rest before you can perform the 2 reps?? I'll have to rest at least 3 minutes if i wanted to be able to perform 2 or 3 reps

[roberto487]

3/1 or 6/2 meaning 3 weeks training, 1 week deload, ect, ect , ect...I just listen to my body, when I feel its ready for a deload, do it, very simple.

Can you go into detail what a 'deload' is?

[tazmanpa]

[b]
How long do you rest before you can perform the 2 reps?? I'll have to rest at least 3 minutes if i wanted to be able to perform 2 or 3 reps

If I hit the failure point I have to wait 2 minutes before I can do 1 rep but if I stay away from the full failure point and don't push to hard I can keep doing the 2 reps with 30 to 40 seconds rest. The key for me was leaning the signs of when failure was approaching. I have still made mistakes and had to some 1 reps sets.