Help me understand this

[000350]

The Republicans are supposed to be the party that follows Jesus, yet they advocate social Darwinism

And the Democrats don't believe in God yet they want to help the poor




Something's ****ed up here

[A-GAME]

I was going to start a thread similar regarding Christians against universal health care. Jesus would have gladly given anyone the shirt off his back. He also taught that his followers should do the same. Some how, Christians have forgotten this fact and turned into a bunch of selfish *******s. Sure the majority of the country is the same, however the rest of the country are not hypocrites because they don't have a rulebook they are supposed to follow.

[000350]

I was going to start a thread similar regarding Christians against universal health care. Jesus would have gladly given anyone the shirt off his back. He also taught that his followers should do the same. Some how, Christians have forgotten this fact and turned into a bunch of selfish *******s. Sure the majority of the country is the same, however the rest of the country are not hypocrites because they don't have a rulebook they are supposed to follow.

The hypocrisy really is mind-blowing. I hardly ever hear a CHRISTian quote Jesus, yet they sure can quote Deuteronomy where it says homosexuality is a sin. And they sure can quote the story of creation. ****ing despicable and they wonder why they're the laughing stock of the educated class.

[trailwarrior]

Help me understand this

http://www.liberalslikechrist.org/Christlike.html

[PaulG]

People who are raised to not engage in critical thinking tend to be easily manipulated. This is due to damaged or stunted frontal lobes, which involves decision making.

Not all Christians are incapable of critical thinking. But, some sects of Christianity, have basically been brainwashed with full control.


Yesterday, I had a conversation with a republican christian, where I basically told her if she only votes on Abortion issues, then why does she vote for liars since the Republicans could of put together an anti abortion bill many times but never did. Of course the usual rage, and name calling ensued, a sign that they didn't have a logical argument, they're just stupid.

[US_Ranger]

I was going to start a thread similar regarding Christians against universal health care. Jesus would have gladly given anyone the shirt off his back. He also taught that his followers should do the same. Some how, Christians have forgotten this fact and turned into a bunch of selfish *******s. Sure the majority of the country is the same, however the rest of the country are not hypocrites because they don't have a rulebook they are supposed to follow.

Not sure if serious...........

[A-GAME]

Not sure if serious...........

Deadly serious. Do you even Jesus?

[US_Ranger]

Deadly serious. Do you even Jesus?

How can you be serious?

So Christians are supposed to support a health-care system where the government takes money and redistributes it as they see fit for medical costs? A government in charge of this that is full of corruption. Christians are supposed to support that?

This makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

[A-GAME]

How can you be serious?

So Christians are supposed to support a health-care system where the government takes money and redistributes it as they see fit for medical costs? A government in charge of this that is full of corruption. Christians are supposed to support that?

This makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

Then don't be a Christian. Jesus was selfless and Christians are striving to be like him. They also have a tendency to pick and choose which parts of the bible the adhere to. Either you are serious about your beliefs or you are a hypocrite.

[US_Ranger]

Then don't be a Christian. Jesus was selfless and Christians are striving to be like him. They also have a tendency to pick and choose which parts of the bible the adhere to. Either you are serious about your beliefs or you are a hypocrite.

Perhaps you have a brain tumor and can't fathom basic logic.

Being selfless =/= supporting government institutionalized health care

Being selfless = giving out of charity, helping those in need and using your skills (whatever they may be) to help those when possible

It's the same philosophy Ron Paul used when he practiced medicine. That's charitable health care. Having the government (which is corrupt to the core) take your money and use it for all sorts of purposes isn't selfless. This is the most asinine argument I've ever seen on the R&P. (srs)

PS - I'm not Christian, not that it matters when your argument sucks anyway.

[A-GAME]

Perhaps you have a brain tumor and can't fathom basic logic.

Being selfless =/= supporting government institutionalized health care

Being selfless = giving out of charity, helping those in need and using your skills (whatever they may be) to help those when possible

It's the same philosophy Ron Paul used when he practiced medicine. That's charitable health care. Having the government (which is corrupt to the core) take your money and use it for all sorts of purposes isn't selfless. This is the most asinine argument I've ever seen on the R&P. (srs)

PS - I'm not Christian, not that it matters when your argument sucks anyway.

Resorting to insults. Intredasting. Your just mad because you are selfish and are being forced to pay for health care for others less fortunate than yourself. lol @ you paying for the sick, lazy, fat and unemployable and taking out your frustration on the internet. Cry all you want just remember to cut the cheque *******. The fact is, Jesus would support helping those in society who cannot or will not help themselves and Christians who fail to do this are hypocrites. Christian or not, you are a massive cry baby *******.

[US_Ranger]

Resorting to insults. Intredasting. Your just mad because you are selfish and are being forced to pay for health care for others less fortunate than yourself. lol @ you paying for the sick, lazy, fat and unemployable and taking out your frustration on the internet. Cry all you want just remember to cut the cheque *******. The fact is, Jesus would support helping those in society who cannot or will not help themselves and Christians who fail to do this are hypocrites. Christian or not, you are a massive cry baby *******.

Lol, you're mad. You're also wrong but you knew that when posting in here so this is your way of trying to deflect from that. Good argument though (not srs) about Jesus being all for corrupt government taking money and re-distributing it as they please instead of people giving out of charity. Hey, you know what's funny, Jesus used violence against tax collectors in the church. So, not only are you wrong (and stupid) but the only time Jesus used violence was against those who came to collect taxes, the same ones you're saying all Christians should support because it fits your pre-conceived agenda.

Keep digging yourself a hole though. No one really cares if you support government run health care. The only thing anyone cares about is how terrible your argument is....and this is coming from someone who isn't Christian. Massive fail on your part.

[A-GAME]

Lol, you're mad. You're also wrong but you knew that when posting in here so this is your way of trying to deflect from that. Good argument though (not srs) about Jesus being all for corrupt government taking money and re-distributing it as they please instead of people giving out of charity. Hey, you know what's funny, Jesus used violence against tax collectors in the church. So, not only are you wrong (and stupid) but the only time Jesus used violence was against those who came to collect taxes, the same ones you're saying all Christians should support because it fits your pre-conceived agenda.

Keep digging yourself a hole though. No one really cares if you support government run health care. The only thing anyone cares about is how terrible your argument is....and this is coming from someone who isn't Christian. Massive fail on your part.

Cut the cheque *******.

[DanNZ]

Isn't there some relevant Ghandi quote along the lines of "I like your christ but not your christians" or something?

Most christians are hypocrites.

Also, the democrats that don't believe in God yet want healthcare (as per OP) aren't hypocrites. You can care about the health of other people without believing in a god.

[BigTrojan]

Jesus would have been for a corrupt government who lines their pockets with tax money and then redistributes it how they see fit? As Ranger posted, Jesus was a big advocate on "willfully giving" to those less fortunate, not a government (or church) mandate. From what I remember (haven't been to church in years), if you don't give with a humble and gracious heart, why even give at all. Are many religious people in general hypocrites? Sure. They also tend to vote on 1 or 2 social issues. (As do certain groups of liberals)

[WesMontgomery]

If you do not like universal healthcare or you do not want it does that mean you are selfish? or that you dont want to help the poor and needy? Is it the only way to help out others?

I'm not a Christian. I am against Universal Healthcare (I live in the UK). I still want to help people though. I give away over 10% of my post tax income to charity, I volunteer for 4 hours a week and I donate any old clothes etc to charity. This is because I feel a responsibility to help those who are less fortunate than me. I think everyone should feel a responsibility.

I pay over 3,000GBP (over 4,700USD) every year for healthcare (NHS). This is going to go up in the future for a few reasons. Obviously this is well over the amount necessary to cover myself. I don't mind helping people out. However I see the NHS abused everyday, I see the money wasted, I see inefficiencies all the time. I dont have control over where this money is spent. For example, you can get fertility treatment on the NHS. This is bull**** in my opinion, I do not want my tax money contributing to fertility treatment. It isnt essential, if you cannot have a kid then do this privately or adopt. There are plenty of kids after a home and plenty of unwanted pregnancies. I would support the NHS more if they fixed these things but in reality they cannot fix these things.

Of course there is nothing I can do about it and I accepted it would be something I payed for when I moved to the UK. I don't like the system though. I think America has the opportunity to create a really good healthcare system but it seems like they are going the wrong way (in my opinion).

[lasher]

I was going to start a thread similar regarding Christians against universal health care. Jesus would have gladly given anyone the shirt off his back. He also taught that his followers should do the same. Some how, Christians have forgotten this fact and turned into a bunch of selfish *******s. Sure the majority of the country is the same, however the rest of the country are not hypocrites because they don't have a rulebook they are supposed to follow.

I think you should make that thread. My body is ready.


Is yours?

[Meatros]

Jesus would have been for a corrupt government who lines their pockets with tax money and then redistributes it how they see fit? As Ranger posted, Jesus was a big advocate on "willfully giving" to those less fortunate, not a government (or church) mandate. From what I remember (haven't been to church in years), if you don't give with a humble and gracious heart, why even give at all. Are many religious people in general hypocrites? Sure. They also tend to vote on 1 or 2 social issues. (As do certain groups of liberals)

Render unto Cesaer and all that. Jesus would not be in favor of cherishing your money at the expense of other people. Give to all those who ask and all that. Now does that mean that Jesus would want universal HC? In principle I do not think that he'd be opposed to it - however I think he'd be concerned if it worked. So in one sense Ranger could be right - in that if HC doesn't do what it's purporting to do, then no Jesus probably wouldn't be for it. On the other hand, if it's simply a matter of redistributing wealth to help the poor, then I'd think that the Jesus of the Bible would be all for that - Jesus was not a capitalist, he didn't advocate accumulating wealth.

Luke:
6:23 Rejoice ye in that day, and leap for joy: for, behold, your reward is great in heaven: for in the like manner did their fathers unto the prophets.
6:24 But woe unto you that are rich! for ye have received your consolation.
6:25 Woe unto you that are full! for ye shall hunger. Woe unto you that laugh now! for ye shall mourn and weep.
6:26 Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you! for so did their fathers to the false prophets.
6:27 But I say unto you which hear, Love your enemies, do good to them which hate you,
6:28 Bless them that curse you, and pray for them which despitefully use you.
6:29 And unto him that smiteth thee on the one cheek offer also the other; and him that taketh away thy cloak forbid not to take thy coat also.
6:30 Give to every man that asketh of thee; and of him that taketh away thy goods ask them not again.
6:31 And as ye would that men should do to you, do ye also to them likewise.
6:32 For if ye love them which love you, what thank have ye? for sinners also love those that love them.
6:33 And if ye do good to them which do good to you, what thank have ye? for sinners also do even the same.
6:34 And if ye lend to them of whom ye hope to receive, what thank have ye? for sinners also lend to sinners, to receive as much again.
6:35 But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil.
6:36 Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful.
6:37 Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven:
6:38 Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.
6:39 And he spake a parable unto them, Can the blind lead the blind? shall they not both fall into the ditch?
6:40 The disciple is not above his master: but every one that is perfect shall be as his master.
6:41 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but perceivest not the beam that is in thine own eye?
6:42 Either how canst thou say to thy brother, Brother, let me pull out the mote that is in thine eye, when thou thyself beholdest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, cast out first the beam out of thine own eye, and then shalt thou see clearly to pull out the mote that is in thy brother's eye.
6:43 For a good tree bringeth not forth corrupt fruit; neither doth a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
6:44 For every tree is known by his own fruit. For of thorns men do not gather figs, nor of a bramble bush gather they grapes.
6:45 A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good; and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil: for of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaketh.
6:46 And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?
6:47 Whosoever cometh to me, and heareth my sayings, and doeth them, I will shew you to whom he is like:
6:48 He is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock.
6:49 But he that heareth, and doeth not, is like a man that without a foundation built an house upon the earth; against which the stream did beat vehemently, and immediately it fell; and the ruin of that house was great.

[US_Ranger]

Cut the cheque *******.

Thank you for admitting I was correct. It's alright, I've made stupid arguments before as well. (nothing quite as bad as yours but still pretty bad)

[Stizzel]

Democrats don't want to help the poor.

[GoJu]

Democrats don't want to help the poor.

Neither do anarchists

[GoJu]

What if Jesus was a conservative:

[BFast55]

The Republicans are supposed to be the party that follows Jesus, yet they advocate social Darwinism

And the Democrats don't believe in God yet they want to help the poor




Something's ****ed up here

I was unaware that one party had a monopoly on Christianity. Thanks for the info, OP.

[BigTrojan]

I was unaware that one party had a monopoly on Christianity. Thanks for the info, OP.

Also this, have we forgotten how many blacks (some of the strongest christians) and mexicans (strong catholics) vote democrat every election? There are crazies on both sides.

[000350]

How can you be serious?

So Christians are supposed to support a health-care system where the government takes money and redistributes it as they see fit for medical costs? A government in charge of this that is full of corruption. Christians are supposed to support that?

This makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

The first church in the book of acts shared all their possessions evenly with one another.

Acts 4:32 "And the congregation of those who believed were of one heart and soul; and not one of them claimed that anything belonging to him was his own, but all things were common property to them. And with great power the apostles were giving testimony to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus, and abundant grace was upon them all. For there was not a needy person among them, for all who were owners of land or houses would sell them and bring the proceeds of the sales and lay them at the apostles’ feet, and they would be distributed to each as any had need."


Acts 2:45 "And all those who had believed were together and had all things in common; and they began selling their property and possessions and were sharing them with all, as anyone might have need."


If you were to tell a modern American christian that Jesus was a liberal they would spit in your face.

[000350]

Jesus would have been for a corrupt government who lines their pockets with tax money and then redistributes it how they see fit? As Ranger posted, Jesus was a big advocate on "willfully giving" to those less fortunate, not a government (or church) mandate. From what I remember (haven't been to church in years), if you don't give with a humble and gracious heart, why even give at all. Are many religious people in general hypocrites? Sure. They also tend to vote on 1 or 2 social issues. (As do certain groups of liberals)

Jesus never advocated "willful" giving.

"And someone came to Him and said, “Teacher, what good thing shall I do that I may obtain eternal life?” And He said to him, “Why are you asking Me about what is good? There is only One who is good; but if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.” Then he *said to Him, “Which ones?” And Jesus said, “ You shall not commit murder; You shall not commit adultery; You shall not steal; You shall not bear false witness; Honor your father and mother; and You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” The young man *said to Him, “All these things I have kept; what am I still lacking?” Jesus said to him, “If you wish to be complete, go and sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me.” But when the young man heard this statement, he went away grieving; for he was one who owned much property."


Jesus was an extremist.

[mistercollie]

So Christians are supposed to support a health-care system where the government takes money and redistributes it as they see fit for medical costs? A government in charge of this that is full of corruption. Christians are supposed to support that?

This is truth. The principle, itself, is morally right, but the individuals in charge of the operation, and many of those who partake of the benefits, are not worthy of them.

The multitude of those who had believed had one heart and soul, and not even one would say that any of the things he possessed was his own; but they had all things in common.

...and undeserved kindness was upon them all. In fact, there was not one in need among them; for all those who were possessors of fields or houses would sell them and bring the values of the things sold and they would, in turn, distribute to each one, just as he would have the need. (Acts 4:33-35)

When people are of "one heart and soul", such things actually can work. I would argue that the number of willing takers far outweighs the number of willing givers, though. People that are not willing to make sacrifices themselves are not worthy of the sacrifices of others.

Jesus never advocated "willful" giving.

This was spoken to a first-century man that had the opportunity to walk alongside the Christ personally.

Furthermore, he clearly differentiates obtaining eternal life from obtaining perfection. Many will enter into life, but few will enter in the kingdom of heaven. If you believe this has anything to do with OP, I am truly sympathetic.

[powerman2000]

I was going to start a thread similar regarding Christians against universal health care. Jesus would have gladly given anyone the shirt off his back. He also taught that his followers should do the same. Some how, Christians have forgotten this fact and turned into a bunch of selfish *******s. Sure the majority of the country is the same, however the rest of the country are not hypocrites because they don't have a rulebook they are supposed to follow.

Talk about an oversimplification. WOW!

[US_Ranger]

Jesus never advocated "willful" giving.

And how much of your "willful" giving that you hand over to the government goes towards helping the truly needy as opposed to if you went and gave it to them directly yourself.

I can't believe I'm even having this argument.

[lasher]

Talk about an oversimplification. WOW!

I'm still waiting on the thread.