Ok, I admit it (DS Craze)

[Krisco65]

I am a no-xplode and white flood fan myself but after reading so much hype I decided to give it a shot.

I admit, I am now a convert. The stuff really is crazy. Just like the reviews say the taste leaves something to be desired but I dont take a pre-workout for my taste buds.

Never felt anything like that before and I will be using this from now on.

Good stuff DS.

[ToughyIRE]

I don't get any real "buzz" off it so to say, definite not has much as when I used Jack3d, increased heart rate and skin tingling, guess from the 1.3. But the energy and focus is great, not complaints there. Keeps me going when training fasted on my cut.

[Krisco65]

I don't get any real "buzz" off it so to say, definite not has much as when I used Jack3d, increased heart rate and skin tingling, guess from the 1.3. But the energy and focus is great, not complaints there. Keeps me going when training fasted on my cut.

I will agree that the "buzz" isnt the same but it definately had me focused and motivated.

[Robboe]

I am a no-xplode and white flood fan myself but after reading so much hype I decided to give it a shot.

I admit, I am now a convert. The stuff really is crazy. Just like the reviews say the taste leaves something to be desired but I dont take a pre-workout for my taste buds.

Never felt anything like that before and I will be using this from now on.

Good stuff DS.

Good stuff. Be sure to check out the Crazolade flavor.

[musclepredator1]

Good stuff. Be sure to check out the Crazolade flavor.

if i was you i would watch your wording here rep. 1,3 is dangerous and you are promoting it. when you see the side effects including "death"
im not sure why you seem so excited.

The line between “dietary supplement” and “drug” is a fine one. Drugs
are subject to FDA approval and regulations; dietary supplements are not.
That’s an important distinction when it comes to the health and safety of
individuals who opt to take a given substance. And it’s a distinction that
often is blurred when it comes to performance enhancing substances that
are so appealing to athletes or anyone trying to get in shape. Two of those
substances—Jack3d and OxyELITE Pro—have recently come under close
scrutiny, bringing to light the inadequacy of the Dietary Supplement Health
and Education Act (DSHEA) as well as FDA oversight

Aside
from those two deaths, there are also reports of liver and kidney failures,
seizures, loss of consciousness and rapid heartbeat from users of
DMAA

DMAA (dimethylamylamine) is promoted to
increase workout energy and efficiency. DMAA has been banned by
numerous sports organizations, including the international body that
regulates Olympic athletes and several professional sports.
DMAA / Jack3d negative side effects include:
Death
Heart attack
Seizure
Kidney failure
Liver failure
Loss of consciousness
Heart palpitations

[jwelias7]

if i was you i would watch your wording here rep. 1,3 is dangerous and you are promoting it. when you see the side effects including "death"
im not sure why you seem so excited.

The line between “dietary supplement” and “drug” is a fine one. Drugs
are subject to FDA approval and regulations; dietary supplements are not.
That’s an important distinction when it comes to the health and safety of
individuals who opt to take a given substance. And it’s a distinction that
often is blurred when it comes to performance enhancing substances that
are so appealing to athletes or anyone trying to get in shape. Two of those
substances—Jack3d and OxyELITE Pro—have recently come under close
scrutiny, bringing to light the inadequacy of the Dietary Supplement Health
and Education Act (DSHEA) as well as FDA oversight

Aside
from those two deaths, there are also reports of liver and kidney failures,
seizures, loss of consciousness and rapid heartbeat from users of
DMAA

DMAA (dimethylamylamine) is promoted to
increase workout energy and efficiency. DMAA has been banned by
numerous sports organizations, including the international body that
regulates Olympic athletes and several professional sports.
DMAA / Jack3d negative side effects include:
Death
Heart attack
Seizure
Kidney failure
Liver failure
Loss of consciousness
Heart palpitations

ummmm what? Jack3d is the pre with 1,3, craze is the supplement the rep is talking about. which does not contain 1,3. so your arguing with someone who has switched from a 1,3 product to a non containing product.

[musclepredator1]

you ever read up on these ingredients? i would do if i was you.its the same thing.theses companies are just changing the names thats all.they dont care if you die.they are covered by a warning.any so called concentrated pre workout will have a dangerous stim in it.just goes to show you have no idea what you are ingesting.

Dendrobex™ (Dendrobium Extract) (stem) (concentrated for alkaloid content including Dendrobine, Dendroxine, Dendramine

But another extract has emerged as a new contender in preworkout stimulant—Dendrobium nobile (or Dendrobium officinale), a type of orchid. One of the 50 fundamental herbs used in traditional Chinese medicine, Dendrobium stem extract appears in the popular preworkout Craze from Driven Sports. It appears on Craze’s ingredient list under the trademark Dendrobex. Interestingly, Craze also uses N-Methyltyramine—under the trademark Citramine—though it lists the source as Citrus reticulate, or mandarin orange.


The question, of course, is whether Dendrobex has been altered in any way to change its status as an ODI. (Geranimine, for example, was the trademark that chemist Patrick Arnold used to try to qualify synthetic DMAA as a geranium extract.) If Dendrobex is at all altered, it would theoretically require a New Dietary Ingredient (NDI) notification.

[Purge]

Just ordered some Craze. Hope I won't be disappoint.

And it would be nice if you posted some links/sources there, MP1.

[BloodySalad]

if i was you i would watch your wording here rep. 1,3 is dangerous and you are promoting it. when you see the side effects including "death"
im not sure why you seem so excited.

Two words. "Head" and "Dick".
Put them in order.

[ravenhall]

The main problem with 1,3 (IME) is that I built a tolerance to its effects rather quickly - after about half a container. Once you get up to the 3-4 four scoops, it is easy to consider just tossing another one in. I regarded the warning seriously though, and cycled off that stuff for a month when my tolerance got high. I've now gotten off all the 1,3 and I'm checking out pre's to see what I might replace it with. Tried C4 - it's a decent pre but I'm not liking paying for Arginine when most studies show it doesn't help with NO.

Gonna try Craze to check out the hype and White Flood.

I read that those army dudes that died took 7-8 scoops of jack3d and then went on a 5 mile run. I'm not surprised they had massive heart attacks - I bet just the caffeine content alone would be enough to cause that. I guess that goes to show that no matter how blatant a warning you might put on a container, someone will always ignore it and kill themselves with it somehow.

[eazy57]

The original FDA "Warning".. not a ban

http://www.fda.gov/NewsEvents/Newsro.../ucm302133.htm

The FDA letters noted that DMAA is known to narrow the blood vessels and arteries, which can elevate blood pressure and may lead to cardiovascular events ranging from shortness of breath and tightening in the chest to heart attack. The agency has received 42 adverse event reports on products containing DMAA. While the complaints do not establish that DMAA was the cause of the incidents, some of the reports have included cardiac disorders, nervous system disorders, psychiatric disorders, and death.

http://www.fyibehealthy.com/2012/06/...ent-dmaa-safe/

Industry Responds

Steve Mister is the president and CEO of the Council for Responsible Nutrition (CRN) in Washington, D.C. He says the jury is still out on whether any safety issues exist with DMAA. CRN is a trade group that represents supplement makers.

The FDA’s action is mild. “If they really thought there was a causal connection between reports of death and DMAA, they would use their recall authority and they’ve chosen not to use that,” he says.

He is waiting to see what the FDA says to draw any conclusions. “If the FDA says this is not a legitimate ingredient for supplements, then it’s game over.”

Until then, “If you are using DMAA, read the label and follow dosing instructions.”

SOURCES:Pieter Cohen, MD, internist, Cambridge Health Alliance; assistant professor of medicine, Harvard Medical School, Boston.Steve Mister, president and CEO,Council for Responsible Nutrition (CRN), Washington, D.C.Cohen, P. Archives of Internal Medicine, 2012, study received ahead of print.

Just some stuff I've been reading. Personally, I think people need to read, re-read, and read between the lines.

Ephedrine is perfectly legal in Canada, is banned to you Americans. Does essentially the same thing.

Anything, and I mean anything is bad for you if you neglect it.

[ChrisLS8]

you ever read up on these ingredients? i would do if i was you.its the same thing.theses companies are just changing the names thats all.they dont care if you die.they are covered by a warning.any so called concentrated pre workout will have a dangerous stim in it.just goes to show you have no idea what you are ingesting.

Dendrobex™ (Dendrobium Extract) (stem) (concentrated for alkaloid content including Dendrobine, Dendroxine, Dendramine

But another extract has emerged as a new contender in preworkout stimulant—Dendrobium nobile (or Dendrobium officinale), a type of orchid. One of the 50 fundamental herbs used in traditional Chinese medicine, Dendrobium stem extract appears in the popular preworkout Craze from Driven Sports. It appears on Craze’s ingredient list under the trademark Dendrobex. Interestingly, Craze also uses N-Methyltyramine—under the trademark Citramine—though it lists the source as Citrus reticulate, or mandarin orange.


The question, of course, is whether Dendrobex has been altered in any way to change its status as an ODI. (Geranimine, for example, was the trademark that chemist Patrick Arnold used to try to qualify synthetic DMAA as a geranium extract.) If Dendrobex is at all altered, it would theoretically require a New Dietary Ingredient (NDI) notification.

You're saying that DMAA causes death? Gtfo, you are a fear monger and there is no proof of that, and the two soldiers don't count as evidence since no one concluded that their deaths were caused by DMAA

DMAA is safe within the recommended dosage just like everything else

[feedmelies]

You're saying that DMAA causes death? Gtfo, you are a fear monger and there is no proof of that, and the two soldiers don't count as evidence since no one concluded that their deaths were caused by DMAA

DMAA is safe within the recommended dosage just like everything else

This.

[PinchTheBear]

Word, OP

[musclepredator1]

You're saying that DMAA causes death? Gtfo, you are a fear monger and there is no proof of that, and the two soldiers don't count as evidence since no one concluded that their deaths were caused by DMAA

DMAA is safe within the recommended dosage just like everything else

fear mongering? GTFO im stating it is as dangerous as ephedrine which is banned.look it up and see for yourself it uses the same pathways to your cns.
you idiots will take what you want so do it but dont blame the people who are trying to warn you.
i personally couldnt give a toss whether you die from it or not.
you wont learn will you

[jwelias7]

fear mongering? GTFO im stating it is as dangerous as ephedrine which is banned.look it up and see for yourself it uses the same pathways to your cns.
you idiots will take what you want so do it but dont blame the people who are trying to warn you.
i personally couldnt give a toss whether you die from it or not.
you wont learn will you

dude, just stfu.

[ChrisLS8]

fear mongering? GTFO im stating it is as dangerous as ephedrine which is banned.look it up and see for yourself it uses the same pathways to your cns.
you idiots will take what you want so do it but dont blame the people who are trying to warn you.
i personally couldnt give a toss whether you die from it or not.
you wont learn will you

And where is your proof that it is dangerous? Millions of people use it on a daily basis. Its far less dangerous than alcohol, tobacco, aspirin.
There hasnt been ONE DEATH directly attributed to DMAA. You just talk alot of bull****.

Provide legitimate proof that its dangerous. And no the FDA pulling it off shelves doesnt count.

[GetRippedInc]

For the record... 1,3 products will be coming back (at least for a little while)

[eazy57]

fear mongering? GTFO im stating it is as dangerous as ephedrine which is banned.look it up and see for yourself it uses the same pathways to your cns.
you idiots will take what you want so do it but dont blame the people who are trying to warn you.
i personally couldnt give a toss whether you die from it or not.
you wont learn will you

Many decongestants that are bought over the counter contain agents that "uses the same pathways"

The reason why 1,3 was pulled was because it is claimed that 1,3 is found in the geranium plant. Which a study released by the FDA in the past week or 2 from 3 separate labs has proved it is not. SO.. that being said, any company looking to continue using 1,3 in their products will have to file a new NDI application and get FDA approval as a drug.

As a person who works on a Health and Safety committee, we always err on the side of caution, where there is a necessity to protect people from themselves. a majority of injuries are not because of the job itself, but by the lack of attention paid by an employee to follow the rules for personal safety devices, and/or a blatant disregard for the proper use of machinery/items.material.

So in essence, a few bad apples spoil it for those who use things as directed.

Remember.. just because you don't like it, or don't want it, or won't use it, doesn't make you the chief of the moral police. Heck, you can't even VOTE at age 17!

So let adults do whatever they like with the information they have. It's their right. It certainly isn't mine to tell them what to do.

[eazy57]

For the record... 1,3 products will be coming back (at least for a little while)

They are already being sold on other sites.

[GetRippedInc]

They are already being sold on other sites.

That's the stock they had left. Manufacturers stopped shipping it.

[eazy57]

That's the stock they had left. Manufacturers stopped shipping it.

Ahh.. so they just stopped selling for awhile, and they're being allowed to sell the rest of their stock? Or are manufacturers going to be making sups with it in it again?

Must be new news... thanks.

[GetRippedInc]

Ahh.. so they just stopped selling for awhile, and they're being allowed to sell the rest of their stock? Or are manufacturers going to be making sups with it in it again?

Must be new news... thanks.

From the info I am getting they are continuing to make it.

[eazy57]

From the info I am getting they are continuing to make it.

WOW, I'm a little surprised actually. Milking it top the last drop.

[tryingtofocus]

Obvious troll is obvious.

Talking about a product without DMAA and goes off about one with.....talk about reading comprehension pwning.

Craze is some potent stuff and didn't sit well with me unfortunately,bt gave me the best workout to this day. Wish it didn't give me strange side effects. Must have been the DMAA.....LOL!

[Krisco65]

So, aside from the random guy trying to sound as smart as he can and "scare" me, I still love this stuff. Leg day was NUTS.

[Arch808]

just don't go biting any faces off OP

please stay safe

[Purge]

Took two scoops of it an hour ago, and the music I'm listening to right now sounds even better than usual.

I'll be off to the gym soon; I hope the pumps are as good as the mood.