Please explain why student loan debt should be forgiven. Srs, I'm missing something.

[Trapstar4.4]

Has government EVER made anything more efficient?

People keep bitching about not being able to find a job with their useless degrees - and about how so many people are taking on 100k+ loans for underwater basket weaving degrees.

If we operated in a free market system a bank wouldn't loan a poor kid 100 grand so they can get that degree because there would be little expectation that it could be repaid!


The banks would be more likely to lend to scientists, engineers, computer technicians, accountants, doctors, etc. And then more people would go down that path until America's shortage of engineers and the like are smaller.

hmm this is an interesting idea. i would agree to some sort of student loan underwriting program because in truth there are students who take out a fortune of loans for degrees that quite frankly, shouldnt be degrees.

at the end of the day, you cant get a $75k loan for art sculpting. it is quite ridiculous. you dont know it yet, but you dont want to do that to yourself, or the country

[onebobby5]

The idea is that they didn't take on that loan to buy a new bmw. In order to achieve higher education it was necessary to bury themselves in debt. The argument is that this isn't fair. Some people feel education is a right and should be free from kindergarten all the way through PhD. Other feel that at the very least it should not be nearly as expensive as it is now.

You're basically saying that no one forced them to take on this debt. However, not taking on the debt results in the price of not having a college degree which can be pretty detrimental today. So you're argument is kind of saying, yeah it sucks, so just avoid it. Well if something in society is broken, do we want to ignore it or work to fix it?

Then of course you can say okay who's paying for this? Do my tax dollars pay for everyone's loans? Basically like almost everything in politics it's not black and white. There's drawbacks to whatever you decide to do.

these people feel they have the right to a higher education, they had the choice... they could have not chosen such an expensive fukking school, or these people could have busted their asses off in high school and gotten scholarships.

[IKanHasVTaper]

This problem is a symptom of the Federal Reserve and malinvestment.

This is why we need to rid ourselves of central banking.

[PattyOLantern]

technically the recession ended in June 2009

Technically, we've been on the verge of dropping back into a double-dip recession for the past 14 months.

Foreclosures are just now beginning to drop in most places - tell somebody who's in the foreclosure process that the recession ended 3 years ago.

[NWDub]

Fukc that. Student loans should not be forgiven.


Show's how terribly stupid some people are that go to college. I would not be going to college if I had to accumulate debt


How is it fair for one person (myself) to pay cash for tuition, and someone else to take out loans and get them forgiven?

Also who payed for the faculty at the school if those debts were forgiven?

[BuckWyld]

This problem is a symptom of the Federal Reserve and malinvestment.

This is why we need to rid ourselves of central banking.

How does this have anything to do with the Fed?

[jasonjb]

they shouldn't, you willingly take out the debt so you should be fine with paying it back. What really rustles my jimmies is those students in Quebec protesting to keep their tuition at a ridiculously low rate even with the tuition increase they will have the lowest rate in all of Canada

[BuckWyld]

tell somebody who's in the foreclosure process that the recession ended 3 years ago.

The word recession has a specific meaning when it comes to the economy, it does not matter how anyone FEELS about it.

[brianphi]

it pays off for the economy in the long run to subsidize student loans than to have less educated people or people burdened with the extra debt.

Yah, cause where would we be without all of these liberal arts majors... who would make our coffee?

[CreoleFever]

I agree with you OP, been seeing phuckers on my FB feed saying how they should be forgiven for loans THEY themselves took out. If you can't afford it then don't ask for it. There's successful doctors and dentists 4+ yrs deep into their profession who are still paying off their loans, there's no excuse for any body else.

[IKanHasVTaper]

How does this have anything to do with the Fed?

If you did not have the Fed, you would have to have the capital/wealth to be able to go to college.

People would then choose degrees where the market needs workers, because they would not spend out of pocket 100k for a degree in sociology.

Also if the fed didn't exist, the government could not afford to give these loans because they would have to actually tax the people (instead of adding it to our "debt" aka destroying the currency)

So the malinvestment stems from individuals using wealth incorrectly getting degrees that will not pay.

EDIT: Also, the only reason we get away with so much subsidy, such as student loans, is because of the central bank.

So the bubbles created by malinvestment (bad subsidy) are merely symptoms of the problems with central banking.

[DJKhaled]

Has government EVER made anything more efficient?

People keep bitching about not being able to find a job with their useless degrees - and about how so many people are taking on 100k+ loans for underwater basket weaving degrees.

If we operated in a free market system a bank wouldn't loan a poor kid 100 grand so they can get that degree because there would be little expectation that it could be repaid!


The banks would be more likely to lend to scientists, engineers, computer technicians, accountants, doctors, etc. And then more people would go down that path until America's shortage of engineers and the like are smaller.

Most accurate post in this thread. All liberals should be required to read this before they post again

[YUL]

-When student loans were forgivable, Dr's and Lawyers especially, would file bankruptcy right out of school

-THEN open thier own practice

declare bankruptcy then go to a bank for a loan to start a business?

not sure if retired. and they say liberals are the emotional ones

[Trigger543]

lol @ everyone in this thread that thinks that paying anywhere from 50-100k for school is justified and not a scam

Nobody's arguing that it's not over priced, but overcharging someone is NOT a scam. However, agreeing to pay for something you know if overpriced and trying to get out of it afterwards IS a scam.

[Fitzwell]

The Federal government never should have stuck their nose in student loans. As mentioned above, if it was handled more privately, future students would have to make a case for why they deserve an excessive loan based on their high school grades, scores, and achievements as well as the major they plan on studying. This would likely help eliminate many of the completely useless majors that exist right now and at the same time help to give better interest rates and loan options to those of us who actually pursued economically beneficial degrees.

[PattyOLantern]

The word recession has a specific meaning when it comes to the economy, it does not matter how anyone FEELS about it.

So you take something out of context to tell me I'm wrong?

Intradasting...

[Trapstar4.4]

i know i have played devils advocate here, but i will say that if i was a former student who couldnt get a job and had student loans, then the answer for me is simple. i dont pay it back and not a single fuk would be given. the idea behind this is to make sure all of your other bills stay paid. take the credit hit for the student loan default, and keep everything else current. boom call it a day.

call me a deadbeat, but no i wouldnt demand for forgiveness, but i sure as hell wouldnt pay up for an "investment" that hasnt paid off. but herein lies the problem. the fact of the matter is, these loans wont get paid, and the country continues this festering problem. now for the art students, meh... but for people who get legit degrees, it is kind of messed up, although it is assummed that they will eventually land something. not sure what it is like to be a finance student coming out of college these days, but i can imagine that it sucks ass. I have transitioned jobs and they all require good experience. experience that in a GOOD economy, would not be required, and thus open for possible new grads.

[xVERITAS]

I want to go to Yale, pay for it for me.
I want a Maserati, not fair that I should have to pay for it.
I want to eat at 5 star restaurants every night, others should pay for it.
I want a 38 bedroom house with gold plated toilet seats, why should I have to pay for it?
How come the guy with the college degree, who paid for it out of his own pocket, gets to have all those things? Why shouldn't working hard and not working be the same thing?

[Da_Jtac_0]

Because in this day and age everyone is blaming everyone else for their own problems and doesn't want to take responsibility

this. dont get me wrong, i personally woudl love it if my loans were forgiven, but i still dont agree with it.

one major issue is that tuition rates were able to skyrocket at an unnatural rate, which i dont think we can do anything about now. this lead to people needing to take out huge loans. add in the immaturity of most teenagers, the persistance of society that college is a necessity for a good life, and the availability of loans, and you have a huge disaster. do i think complete loan forgiveness is the solution....not really. maybe a partial could be beneficial. without even considering the benefits i would receive i think a partial forgiveness could help because most people who graduate will be paying loans for AGES. did they get themselves into the mess...yes! but that doesn't make it any less burdensome on the economy. by forgiving parts of the debt people who would otherwise be waiting longer to settle down and start a family, will be doing so sooner, spending more money, and stimulating the economy more. is this the best solution? maybe, maybe not. something must be done though and for obvious reasons this solution will get a lot of support from college kids.

cliffs: i dont agree that forgiving student loans is fair or the best option, but with our economy in such a dire situation fair should not be considered as much. what is best for our economy in the long term is most important and unless a better solution comes along we should do this.

[im2manly]

Because it will cripple society for decades. It doesn't matter if "you paid for your education". Every form of government aid will result in those who "did what they were supposed to" technically getting screwed over.

[DJKhaled]

I want to go to Yale, pay for it for me.
I want a Maserati, not fair that I should have to pay for it.
I want to eat at 5 star restaurants every night, others should pay for it.
I want a 38 bedroom house with gold plated toilet seats, why should I have to pay for it?
How come the guy with the college degree, who paid for it out of his own pocket, gets to have all those things? Why shouldn't working hard and not working be the same thing?

Liberal wet dream right here

I WANT MY FREE STUFF AND I WANT IT NOW!!!!!!! (as long as I don't have to pay for it)

[hublife]

This problem is a symptom of the Federal Reserve and malinvestment.

This is why we need to rid ourselves of central banking.

BINGO!!!!!

Technically, we've been on the verge of dropping back into a double-dip recession for the past 14 months.

Foreclosures are just now beginning to drop in most places - tell somebody who's in the foreclosure process that the recession ended 3 years ago.

Haha... Soooo true. QE 1 and 2 were just a nice way of breaking the fall to the bottom... which we haven't reached yet. LMFAO

If you did not have the Fed, you would have to have the capital/wealth to be able to go to college.

People would then choose degrees where the market needs workers, because they would not spend out of pocket 100k for a degree in sociology.

Also if the fed didn't exist, the government could not afford to give these loans because they would have to actually tax the people (instead of adding it to our "debt" aka destroying the currency)

So the malinvestment stems from individuals using wealth incorrectly getting degrees that will not pay.

EDIT: Also, the only reason we get away with so much subsidy, such as student loans, is because of the central bank.

So the bubbles created by malinvestment (bad subsidy) are merely symptoms of the problems with central banking.

This man understands economics.

Most accurate post in this thread. All liberals should be required to read this before they post again

Agreed.

Nobody's arguing that it's not over priced, but overcharging someone is NOT a scam. However, agreeing to pay for something you know if overpriced and trying to get out of it afterwards IS a scam.

It's your right as a CAPITALIST to over charge someone... the free market dictates price. When the government steps in and GUARANTEES LOANS it directly effects PRICE. As the institutions now have no incentive to keep tuitions down... they can jack up the price and students now have no incentive to WORK to pay for college since they can just get a huge loan for it.

You cannot operate this way without moral hazard. In the end... everyone ends up totally fukked except the banks and goverment.

[BuckWyld]

If you did not have the Fed, you would have to have the capital/wealth to be able to go to college.

The Federal Reserve has absolutely nothing to do with federal student loans.

Also if the fed didn't exist, the government could not afford to give these loans because they would have to actually tax the people (instead of adding it to our "debt" aka destroying the currency)

I am not sure that there is very much evidence that US debt is really a problem for currency rates, inflation has not been particularly high recently.

[datboigene]

what's a trillion more to the debt?

:rollseyes:


in b4 negged

[Trapstar4.4]

this. dont get me wrong, i personally woudl love it if my loans were forgiven, but i still dont agree with it.

one major issue is that tuition rates were able to skyrocket at an unnatural rate, which i dont think we can do anything about now. this lead to people needing to take out huge loans. add in the immaturity of most teenagers, the persistance of society that college is a necessity for a good life, and the availability of loans, and you have a huge disaster. do i think complete loan forgiveness is the solution....not really. maybe a partial could be beneficial. without even considering the benefits i would receive i think a partial forgiveness could help because most people who graduate will be paying loans for AGES. did they get themselves into the mess...yes! but that doesn't make it any less burdensome on the economy. by forgiving parts of the debt people who would otherwise be waiting longer to settle down and start a family, will be doing so sooner, spending more money, and stimulating the economy more. is this the best solution? maybe, maybe not. something must be done though and for obvious reasons this solution will get a lot of support from college kids.

cliffs: i dont agree that forgiving student loans is fair or the best option, but with our economy in such a dire situation fair should not be considered as much. what is best for our economy in the long term is most important and unless a better solution comes along we should do this.

would rep if I wasnt on recharge.
well said. and it is true. we yell "fck these deadbeat students, dont give them sht" but the problem is bigger than the "dead beat" students. if we truly care about the direction of this country, then we have to think past the selfishness and find a solution that coincides with our supposed high hopes for the country. it makes perfect sense. as i have stated before, i dont necessarily agree with complete forgiveness, but it is a HUGE topic that definitely has to be addressed, or it does nothing but help the country continue its death spiral.

we do care more about the country, than we do about the demise of dead beat students right? sometimes i think this is not the case

[IKanHasVTaper]

The Federal Reserve has absolutely nothing to do with federal student loans.



I am not sure that there is very much evidence that US debt is really a problem for currency rates, inflation has not been particularly high recently.

Did you even read my post?

Without the fed useless subsidy becomes impossible, one of those being student loans so yes it DOES have something to do with student loans.

Again if you measure inflation by the old standards it is around 9%.

[NWDub]

lol @ everyone in this thread that thinks that paying anywhere from 50-100k for school is justified and not a scam

Just because a ton of idiots took our 50-100k in debt to get a sociology degree, doesn't mean it's unfair.

It's also justified by the ability to use the internet, see that getting x degree is pointless, so maybe they shouldn't do it.

Fukcing lazy people make me so angry.

If they forgive student debt, I think i'll broadcast my suicide in protest of how fukcing gay this world has become (not srs Mods don't prepare my angus)

[Trigger543]

this reminds me of another thread...

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...133583&page=12

For those interested.

Petition: http://signon.org/sign/support-the-s...ailing_id=2616

Quick synopsis: http://www.loansafe.org/the-student-...ressman-clarke

[Da_Jtac_0]

would rep if I wasnt on recharge.
well said. and it is true. we yell "fck these deadbeat students, dont give them sht" but the problem is bigger than the "dead beat" students. if we truly care about the direction of this country, then we have to think past the selfishness and find a solution that coincides with our supposed high hopes for the country. it makes perfect sense. as i have stated before, i dont necessarily agree with complete forgiveness, but it is a HUGE topic that definitely has to be addressed, or it does nothing but help the country continue its death spiral.

we do care more about the country, than we do about the demise of dead beat students right? sometimes i think this is not the case

saw rep....feelsbadman.jpg

[IKanHasVTaper]

Just because a ton of idiots took our 50-100k in debt to get a sociology degree, doesn't mean it's unfair.

It's also justified by the ability to use the internet, see that getting x degree is pointless, so maybe they shouldn't do it.

Fukcing lazy people make me so angry.

If they forgive student debt, I think i'll broadcast my suicide in protest of how fukcing gay this world has become (not srs Mods don't prepare my angus)

I really think it would not fly for the government to pass that.

The people's already dwindling faith in the US Dollar would crash and burn if they figured out the government is handing monopoly money out for real goods and services.