Question - Carb load on CKD

[Rigzert]

Hi everyone.

My main concern is about the carb load, the book states i should start eating carbs 5 hours previous to the last trainning on Friday .. so, if i train at 7pm i should start eating at 2pm .. is that the moment when the "carb load" begins? because i'm getting confused if it begins at 2pm FRIDAY it should end at 2pm SATURDAY. or should i eat like a normal keto diet the whole friday and start the carb load on saturday morning?

also, should i be doing 24 hs of carb load or should i put some carbs also on sunday?

thanks in advance.

cheers

[Eileen]

Personally, I reckon that a one day carb-up works best until you know what you are doing. Have a couple of pieces of fruit an hour or so before your workout, then do the workout, have a big PWO shake, then eat carbs until bedtime.

Always finish your carb-up at bedtime. You can't go from eating carbs back to keto without a long gap in between.

[hidhid]

Hey man, just have something like two bananas 2 hours prior to your depletion workout. Then have around 100 grams of carbs and 50 grams of protein (PWO shake) immediately following your workout. Your "carb up" and carb count starts from that PWO shake.

That's how I did it, and it seemed to work fine for me. As far as I understood, with those 2 bananas (being half fructose half glucose), only half the carbs were going to my liver to get me ready and 'out of ketosis', but were also easily used up during my depletion workout, which allowed me to turn to stored glycogen quicker. (I am no expert at this so feel free to correct me if I am wrong)

I usually did this on a saturday, for 24 hours - this was a personal preference of doing a whole day of carbing, rather than half keto and then switching - made my counts a little easier lol.

As for the carb up period, try 24 hours at first (try not to drink TOO much water as carbs tend to hold onto it) - see how bloated and 'flat' you start looking. Generally though go by the way you feel (hunger wise) and spread your meals out so that you're not forcing carbs down!

Hope this helps, and good luck!

[bbrock293]

Personally, I reckon that a one day carb-up works best until you know what you are doing. Have a couple of pieces of fruit an hour or so before your workout, then do the workout, have a big PWO shake, then eat carbs until bedtime.

Always finish your carb-up at bedtime. You can't go from eating carbs back to keto without a long gap in between.

I mostly agree with this, other than the PWO shake. Why not have your 1st carb-up meal after the workout instead?

Hey man, just have something like two bananas 2 hours prior to your depletion workout. Then have around 100 grams of carbs and 50 grams of protein (PWO shake) immediately following your workout. Your "carb up" and carb count starts from that PWO shake.

That's how I did it, and it seemed to work fine for me. As far as I understood, with those 2 bananas (being half fructose half glucose), only half the carbs were going to my liver to get me ready and 'out of ketosis', but were also easily used up during my depletion workout, which allowed me to turn to stored glycogen quicker. (I am no expert at this so feel free to correct me if I am wrong)

I usually did this on a saturday, for 24 hours - this was a personal preference of doing a whole day of carbing, rather than half keto and then switching - made my counts a little easier lol.

As for the carb up period, try 24 hours at first (try not to drink TOO much water as carbs tend to hold onto it) - see how bloated and 'flat' you start looking. Generally though go by the way you feel (hunger wise) and spread your meals out so that you're not forcing carbs down!

Hope this helps, and good luck!

Again, why the PWO shake? Why not just eat a carb-up meal instead? Also, I have never heard of anyone that had to "force carbs down." Especially during the carb-up.

[hidhid]

Well the idea is to get some fast acting carbs right after the gym with some protein to take advantage of the window where your muscles are primed for protein synthesis. The liquid carbs are fastest to absorb. You don't HAVE to do this if you really dont wish to have the shake. Go ahead and eat.

As for the forcing carbs down, it is quite possible. Say you are aiming for 600grams in 24 hours and only reach 500 - the point i was making is that if u feel full it isnt neccessary to have that last 100 grams (i.e. Force it down - p.s. im just tryna help here...)

[Eileen]

I mostly agree with this, other than the PWO shake. Why not have your 1st carb-up meal after the workout instead?



Again, why the PWO shake? Why not just eat a carb-up meal instead? Also, I have never heard of anyone that had to "force carbs down." Especially during the carb-up.

Because the PWO shake with a lot of simple carbs like dextrose can be absorbed faster than anything else. Dextrose bypasses the liver completely and will go straight to replenish glycogen in your starving smucles.

So you do your depletion workout until your muscles are tortured, have a shake that will start the repair process, and then eat solid food.

[bbrock293]

Well the idea is to get some fast acting carbs right after the gym with some protein to take advantage of the window where your muscles are primed for protein synthesis. The liquid carbs are fastest to absorb. You don't HAVE to do this if you really dont wish to have the shake. Go ahead and eat.

As for the forcing carbs down, it is quite possible. Say you are aiming for 600grams in 24 hours and only reach 500 - the point i was making is that if u feel full it isnt neccessary to have that last 100 grams (i.e. Force it down - p.s. im just tryna help here...)

There is no window, this was broscience from the 90's that has been debunked several times. Your body does not know what time is is and would not have an "anabolic window."

[bbrock293]

Because the PWO shake with a lot of simple carbs like dextrose can be absorbed faster than anything else. Dextrose bypasses the liver completely and will go straight to replenish glycogen in your starving smucles.

So you do your depletion workout until your muscles are tortured, have a shake that will start the repair process, and then eat solid food.

So what would the difference be in eating a whole food meal immediately following the depletion workout or having a shake? Its the same thing.

[bbrock293]

Well the idea is to get some fast acting carbs right after the gym with some protein to take advantage of the window where your muscles are primed for protein synthesis. The liquid carbs are fastest to absorb. You don't HAVE to do this if you really dont wish to have the shake. Go ahead and eat.

As for the forcing carbs down, it is quite possible. Say you are aiming for 600grams in 24 hours and only reach 500 - the point i was making is that if u feel full it isnt neccessary to have that last 100 grams (i.e. Force it down - p.s. im just tryna help here...)

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21289204

[hidhid]

Well you've got me stumped. Go for real food then. It comes down to personal preference i guess - I am yet to try the whole food meal alternative, and might just give it a go.

[Rigzert]

Thank you very much guys for the help ..

I will start the carb load as soon as i finish the last workout with a meal high in carbs, and i think i will wait at least 1 week before the first carb load .. and once i start with the carb load it will be only for 24hs (ending on saturday night).

On sunday i should be eating like the rest of the days , right?

[Eileen]

So what would the difference be in eating a whole food meal immediately following the depletion workout or having a shake? Its the same thing.

If you can find a meal that's as quick to absorb as the PWO shake, go right ahead.

[hidhid]

Thank you very much guys for the help ..

I will start the carb load as soon as i finish the last workout with a meal high in carbs, and i think i will wait at least 1 week before the first carb load .. and once i start with the carb load it will be only for 24hs (ending on saturday night).

On sunday i should be eating like the rest of the days , right?

It is usually suggested to take about 2 weeks before the first carb up to allow your body to become properly fat-adapted so I would wait the 14 day period to be safe.

What I used to do to ensure that I am back in ketosis sooner was to fast for about 12-16 hours and use Sunday for a good workout (since I was pumped with the carbs)

You DON'T have to do that, and you are generally fasted upon waking the next morning anyway.
Maybe try some low intensity cardio in the morning before eating if you want, but either ways, yes carry on eating like the rest of your low carb days.

[Adzy249]

Is it necessary to have these 2 pieces of fruit pre workout?

[hidhid]

Wellas far as i understand the idea is to knock urself out of ketosis and ensure u r running off glycogen for the depletion workout, so that you can effectively use up the glycogen in ur muscles hence depleting ur glycogen stores, and get your muscles ready for the intake of the carbs.

[bbrock293]

If you can find a meal that's as quick to absorb as the PWO shake, go right ahead.

That is my point, there is simply no need to speed up the absorbtion process. Whether I take PWO shake, or go home and eat, it will make no difference. There is no anabolic window. (Refer to link above)