Hi, i'm on a cutting phase after letting myself get a bit out of shape. I'm 36 years old, currently weigh 207lbs, body fat at a guess 20%. I'm 6'2". Training pretty much 7 days a week at the moment, but also not working (usually have a fairly active non office based job). I'm on a split weight weight training regime. Lifting as heavy as I can to failure for 3x8 on most exercises. Keeping a journal and always trying to improve weight lifted on the next session. Also doing a fasted cardio 60 min fast walk every other morning, to aid fat loss. I've been training on and off for 10 years, so pretty comfortable that I know what I'm doing, always willing to learn though.
I've been on 2000 calories, but only lost a pound last week, so was looking to drop my calories even more. I was just looking for advice and opinion on what the lowest calorie deficit someone of my age and size could go on before it starts having a negative effect i.e losing muscle.
In and ideal world I'd like to get down to 10% body fat, for probably the first time in my adult life. So I assume I need to lose another 20lbs, which is a big ask. But willing to give it a go.
Really interested to how far i can push my deficit, obviously without making in have a negative effect or make training unenjoyable.
Thanks for your help and advice in advance.
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Thread: Maximum safe calorie deficit?
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02-06-2012, 04:05 AM #1
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Maximum safe calorie deficit?
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02-06-2012, 04:17 AM #2
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02-06-2012, 04:19 AM #3
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02-06-2012, 04:28 AM #4
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02-06-2012, 04:38 AM #5
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Its not just about calories, you need to find your macronutrient requirements and go from there. Start here
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hp?t=121703981
I would figure out how many calories you burn in a day and shoot for 20 percent under that. Try that for a couple weeks and then adjust based on the results you are getting.
Keep in mind if you cut your caloric intake too much you are not just going to be losing fat but losing the muscle that you have.
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02-06-2012, 04:39 AM #6
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02-06-2012, 04:42 AM #7
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02-06-2012, 04:54 AM #8
When you are losing more than an average of 2 pounds a week. Everyone is different in regards to how their body will respond to certain calories. I am 210 now and in low 20s in terms of BF and I'm on a cut eating 1800 calories with around 175 g protein, 125 g carbs, and 65 g fat, give or take a few grams. I've only been doing it for a few weeks but dropped a little too much weight last week so I'm upping the calories another 200 for this week and we'll see what happens.
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02-06-2012, 04:56 AM #9
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an average days diet is
9am breakfast - self made smoothie (protein powder, blue berries, blackberries, milk and natural yoghurt + flaxseed oil = 410
12pm lunch - 200g brown basmati rice, 200g chicken and broccoli = 500c
1pm weight train
2pm post gym shake - myprotien whey isolate and instant oats mix = 200c
5pm snack - 20 almonds = 140c
8pm dinner stir fried veg and 300g of chicken, plus a low fat/calorie sauce = 500c
11pm post bed shake = 164c
total 1914 calories
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02-06-2012, 04:59 AM #10
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02-06-2012, 05:25 AM #11
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Why would someone else work it out? You're putting it in your body, you keep track. Just a quick look over it makes me think you are not getting anywhere the amount of fat you need.
BTW meal timing is irrelevant. You don't need a post workout shake or a shake before bed.
"hitting your daily macronutrient targets is FAR more important than nutrient timing."
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hp?t=123915821
Find out what you need, then find out what you are taking in on a daily basis. Adjust from there.
Also 2lb a week is a rough approximation... for someone 130lbs it might be way to much, for someone 400lbs its might not be even close to enough. Don't think just because you are dropping 1.9lbs a week you are keeping muscle.
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02-06-2012, 05:40 AM #12
its really hard to put a number on it. someone that is smaller or has a very low body fat percentage has to lose it slower then someone who is larger or is obese...
theres going to be alot of people that tell you stay around 2000 because its a safe number.. and an even larger amount of people that will act like you'll die if you're under 1200... the only advice i can give you is to ignore anyone that tells you advice based on a number.
you're lifting to failure, so you're going to see if your lifts are suffering.. just try cutting back and seeing how your body reacts after doing that for a week.. you said you're at 2000 so try 1700.. although to be honest, im impatient and if it was me id drop it down to 1400 and go back up in cals if i had too.. otherwise id stay there until i lost a few or the lifts suffered too much. that last bit is "what i would do" not the "safe advice id give others"...
btw, the big calorie deficit cant last forever to get you to low bodyfat.. at some point you have to bring the calories back up, and lean out much slower.
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02-06-2012, 05:41 AM #13
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reply
Fair enough. I just thought that some one could look at my diet and know straight off what the contents are. My bad.
In the 10 years I have been training and reading up on it. You are the first person ever so say that your don't need to get protein straight after training. I thought it was a must to get protein straight in to your body after training?
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02-06-2012, 05:42 AM #14
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02-06-2012, 05:45 AM #15
I believe that you have already been advised to do so. However, if not, I'll give it a go.
Go into the nutrition section of this site & calculate your macros @ maintenance caloric intake using the calculators in the IIFYM writeup. This will give you a ballpark idea of how many calories, fat, protein & carbs to ingest daily to maintain your current weight. Build a diet based on this info and give it a go while consistently monitoring your weight, and make adjustments so that you can ACTUALLY maintain your weight (this step is critical).
After determining your REAL caloric / macro intake maintenance levels then reduce your caloric intake by about 15% to cut (add 15% to bulk). It is my understanding that the +/- 15% is optimum for cutting (bulking) in order for a natty to cut or bulk without wrecking their physique.
I personally wish I would have known this about 5 months ago. Good luck OP.brb eating...
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02-06-2012, 05:50 AM #16
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I've probably missed it and I apologise, is there a link to a page, where I can find all of this info out and work out my macro needs. At the moment I only really make sure I'm getting enough protein and probably neglect the fats and carbs ratios. I must add that I tend to keep carbs to a minimum and only really eat them pre and post workout, as I'm pretty carb sensitive and it has worked for me in the past to be on low carbs while cutting/losing fat.
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02-06-2012, 06:03 AM #17
It takes about 8 hours for you to fully digest a steak or a large chicken breast... it still takes time, even to digest "fast" sources like whey protein. Your body WILL adapt and use protein you eat, when it gets it... regardless of timing. If humans needed their protein immediately after a workout, we wouldnt have survived this long.
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02-06-2012, 06:15 AM #18
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02-06-2012, 06:18 AM #19
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Definitely this....ze great Lyle debunked supplement protein delivery awhile back, don't have the link to it handy but I'm sure someone does. Those supplement studies were conducted on empty stomachs (re: nothing to eat for 10 hours or more), and the whey protein still took 3 to 4 hours to fully digest. Which means that if you lift heavy for an hour, you would need to drink your whey shake 2 hours BEFORE lifting to maximize the flow of protein hitting the blood stream, not 30 min after, -if- the timing of protein delivery was that important. Which its not. The bulk of muscle recovery/repair still takes place when you're sleeping, not right after because you drank your shake.
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02-06-2012, 06:49 AM #20
yea, i know the article you're talking about, but I cant find the link either...
The nice thing about the sleep/recovery thing is it makes me feel good to stuff myself with a late steak\chicken\etc dinner... knowing its GOOD for me to eat late at night... that way im full before going to sleep... I dont mind sleeping on an empty stomach, but i have a loud stomach and its grumbling noise annoys someone else in bed.
the whole "dont eat late at night" myth is one im really glad is BS.
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02-06-2012, 06:54 AM #21
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02-06-2012, 07:05 AM #22
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You answered your own question, yes that myth is nonsense. You know how many fat Muslims there would be running around after Ramadan if that were true? They fast from 4am-8pm having nothing but coffee or tea, then feast between 8pm-4am, hell Ramadan fasting is the groundwork for Intermittent Fasting that many people here follow successfully.
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Personal
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Apr-2012: 263 lbs. ~32% BF
Oct-2012: 215 lbs. ~23% BF End 1st Cut, Start 1st Bulk
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02-06-2012, 07:24 AM #23
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02-06-2012, 07:33 AM #24
yes. its pretty much nonsense. your body is CONSTANTLY storing energy as fat and pulling it back out. sometimes simultaneously.
Since Im aiming for my macros, and my lunch usually has an abundance of carbs (bread for sandwich, sometimes potatoes, etc) my dinner is usually pretty meat heavy.. but as long as you're eating within your macros.. yeah.. doesnt matter if theres carbs or whatever.
obviously theres other things to think of too.. i dont eat anything with a ton of sugar or caffeine before bed.. but thats only so i sleep.. I dont get heartburn, but some people cant have some stuff before they lie down. etc.. and of course some people cant eat a pound of meat and sleep well...
just know your body, eat when it works for you, hit your macros and dont stress about it.
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02-06-2012, 07:44 AM #25
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02-06-2012, 07:45 AM #26
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02-06-2012, 07:49 AM #27
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11-26-2012, 03:31 PM #28
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11-26-2012, 03:44 PM #29
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This is a difficult question to answer because nobody really knows and anything we tell you could only be a best guess.
However, the logic is that the more fat you have the bigger the deficit you can have an not worry about losing too much lean mass. Anything over 750 calories per day is considered a large deficit and probably should avoided unless you are obese. You seem fairly lean already so I'd probably suggest not more than 750 per day and maybe best at 500.Vikings--Wolves-Gophers
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11-26-2012, 04:15 PM #30
Hard to say what is safe. It would be different for each person. I've run as high a 1700 or so of a deficit for months. Just raised calories 200-250 was at about 1100. That is 2 months of 8.8 pounds lost two months in a row. So I should be 800-900 now. Probably going up again shortly. Still got some fat though. TDEE is obviously lower as I don't do cardio currently and I've lost 85+ pounds already. Still my TDEE is approaching 2900-3000. I guess I have a "fast" metabolism... I basically sit on my ass other then lifting 3-6 times a week for an hour or so a session. Jelly?
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