Help needed with post workout meal

[WonderPug]

I hate to question the almighty wonderpug but why do you say he is too high in protein if his weight is 167 and his intake is 119g? less than a gram per pound of body weight?

He asserts that his protein intake is 239 grams per day, not 119 grams (per his OP).

[x-ray vision]

you take me for being new to diet and nutrition, i do know my shiz.

I take you as someone that doesn't want to read information based on evidence that will answer your questions and would rather be spoon fed answers to irrelevant questions. Someone who knows their shiz doesn't ask if they can eat brown rice instead of an avocado at 11am.

[MichaelIsBuff]

nice meal plan

[antikk]

ISomeone who knows their shiz doesn't ask if they can eat brown rice instead of an avocado at 11am.

I didn't ask If I can or can't have it, I wanted some advice as to how much would be good.

[WonderPug]

I didn't ask If I can or can't have it, I wanted some advice as to how much would be good.

You desperately need to read the stickies and learn the basics about nutrition.

[AlwaysTryin]

You desperately need to read the stickies and learn the basics about nutrition.

But he knows his 'shiz'...

[antikk]

You desperately need to read the stickies and learn the basics about nutrition.

Mate i know the basics.

Good forums is good

[WonderPug]

Mate i know the basics.

If you knew the basics about nutrition, then you would understand the problem with your question, which is that you don't have to eat specific foods in specific amounts. Rather, you need your total daily intake to match your energy needs (adjusted for goals) while meeting micro/macronutrient sufficiency.

Anyway, if you want help, then take the first step and read the stickies.

[antikk]

you need your total daily intake to match your energy needs (adjusted for goals) while meeting micro/macronutrient sufficiency.

I'm on roughly an 800cal deficit from my tdee as i'm still trying to cut bf while trying to maintain or even build lean muscle. This is why my my protein intake is relatively higher than normal.

[WonderPug]

I'm on roughly an 800cal deficit from my tdee as i'm still trying to cut bf while trying to maintain or even build lean muscle. This is why my my protein intake is relatively higher than normal.

Protein intake above about 1 gram per pound of bodyweight will provide no special benefit in terms of muscle preservation.

Anyway, I don't know why you're so resistant to reading the stickies and learning.

[antikk]

Protein intake above about 1 gram per pound of bodyweight will provide no special benefit in terms of muscle preservation.

Anyway, I don't know why you're so resistant to reading the stickies and learning.

I have read the stickies, and I already knew what was said and I follow some of what they say, in particular what they say about protein consumption.

"If you are VERY LEAN or on a VERY LOW CALORIE INTAKE then protein should be higher:
- Average bodyfat, lower calorie intake = 1.25-1.5 per pound total mass
- Very lean, lower calorie intake = 1.33-2 per pounds lean mass"

"Anecdotally, most find the HIGHER protein intake better for satiety, partitioning, and blood sugar control."

I am on a lower calorie intake and I am consuming 1.7g per pound lean mass.

What you say is contrary to what is said in the stickies.

[WonderPug]

^ The stickies recommend 1.0 to 1.25 grams of protein per pound of bodyweight. You're consuming 1.43 grams per pound of bodyweight, which is fine but it will afford you no special benefits in terms of muscle preservation per my prior post.

More importantly, nitrogen balance techniques suggest that the protein requirements to attain zero nitrogen balance in those that engage in resistance training range from 1.2–2.2 grams of protein per kg of bodyweight [1-6].

Anyway, how does this relate to your question about if it's ok to eat a bit of avocado?


--------------------
1. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14971434
2. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15798080
3. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1763249
4. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11023001
5. http://sportsci.org/jour/9901/rbk.html
6. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15212752

[antikk]

^ The stickies recommend 1.0 to 1.25 grams of protein per pound of bodyweight.

Yes but "If you are VERY LEAN or on a VERY LOW CALORIE INTAKE then protein should be higher" which is my situation.

Anyway, how does this relate to your question about if it's ok to eat a bit of avocado?

You please tell me. I started a thread asking for opinions on how many grams of carbs in my post workout meal would be good (not "if it's ok to eat a bit of avocado?") and the rest of my diet get critiqued like it's terrible and basically get told I have no knowledge what so ever. Just because someone has a low post count, it doesn't mean they don't have any prior knowledge.

I'm new to these forums but I've already lost respect for it and its members.

[WonderPug]

^ Actually, you asked:

Everything aside, I swapped the avocado for 125g brown rice for my 11.00am meal which equates to 30g complex carbs. good 2 go?

Anyway, I wish the best of luck.

[BBqChicken1]

I started a thread asking for opinions on how many grams of carbs in my post workout meal would be good

If you knew your shiz, you'd know it makes no fkin difference when you eat and it's personal preference.

[snorkelman]

I'm new to these forums but I've already lost respect for it and its members.

When one asks a question, if they sincerely desire to learn, they should have an open mind. How open? So open that they accept the possibility that some of their current beliefs may be incorrect.

[aussieboi901]

Hi guys, here's my current diet:

8.00am - 60g oats 6/37/5/230 + whey 24/3/1/120 + 10g glutamine 30/40/6/350
8.45am - 10g modern bcaa's + 300mg caffeine
9.00am - 60 minutes lifting
10.00am - 1.5 scoops vitargo 0/55/0/140 + whey 36/5/2/180 36/60/2/320
11.00am - 135g chicken breast 42/0/5/223, 1 cup cos lettuce 1/2/0/8, 1/2 avocado 2/6/10/114 45/8/15/345
2.00pm - 140g tuna 30/0/3/149, 14g almonds 3/3/7/81 33/3/10/230
5.00pm - 135g chicken breast 42/0/5/223, 1 cup cos lettuce 1/2/0/8, 1/2 avocado 2/6/10/114 45/8/15/345
8.00pm - 200g 95/5 ground beef 43/0/10/260, 1 cup broccoli 7/12/0/54 50/12/10/314

total - 239/119/58/1904

I wanted to substitute the lettuce and avocado in my 11am post workout meal for brown rice. How many grams of carbs would be good here? I'm not trying to bulk either, trying to build lean muscle.

Hey man have u thought of giving lean gains a go, its a way of losing BF% whilst adding muscle leangains.com i been doin it for a bit and u can see that in my pics u commented i was leaner in the second than in the first

Also, if u want to take carbs post workout, take em straight after in the form of simple carbs within a half hour window of your workout, this creates an insulin spike, protein binds to the insulin in the blood stream and is more efficiently carried throughout the body, only about 30grams of simple carbs str8 after, then in ur 11am go for bout 40-70grams carbs depending on how intense ur workout was, more if it was more intense less if it was light, this will help replenish glycogen stores in the body

[BBqChicken1]

Also, if u want to take carbs post workout, take em straight after in the form of simple carbs within a half hour window of your workout, this creates an insulin spike, protein binds to the insulin in the blood stream and is more efficiently carried throughout the body, only about 30grams of simple carbs str8 after, then in ur 11am go for bout 40-70grams carbs depending on how intense ur workout was, more if it was more intense less if it was light, this will help replenish glycogen stores in the body

Exactly how do you deplete your glycogen stores in a workout where you lift for 5-10 minutes only?

Read below..

The postexercise "anabolic window" is a highly misused & abused concept. Preworkout nutrition all but cancels the urgency, unless you're an endurance athlete with multiple glycogen-depleting events in a single day. Getting down to brass tacks, a relatively recent study (Power et al. 2009) showed that a 45g dose of whey protein isolate takes appx 50 minutes to cause blood AA levels to peak. Resulting insulin levels, which peaked at 40 minutes after ingestion, remained at elevations known to max out the inhibition of muscle protein breakdown (15-30 mU/L) for 120 minutes after ingestion. This dose takes 3 hours for insulin & AA levels to return to baseline from the point of ingestion. The inclusion of carbs to this dose would cause AA & insulin levels to peak higher & stay elevated above baseline even longer.

So much for the anabolic peephole & the urgency to down AAs during your weight training workout; they are already seeping into circulation (& will continue to do so after your training bout is done). Even in the event that a preworkout meal is skipped, the anabolic effect of the postworkout meal is increased as a supercompensatory response (Deldicque et al, 2010). Moving on, another recent study (Staples et al, 2010) found that a substantial dose of carbohydrate (50g maltodextrin) added to 25g whey protein was unable to further increase postexercise net muscle protein balance compared to the protein dose without carbs. Again, this is not to say that adding carbs at this point is counterproductive, but it certainly doesn't support the idea that you must get your lightning-fast postexercise carb orgy for optimal results.

To add to this... Why has the majority of longer-term research failed to show any meaningful differences in nutrient timing relative to the resistance training bout? It's likely because the body is smarter than we give it credit for. Most people don't know that as a result of a single training bout, the receptivity of muscle to protein dosing can persist for at least 24 hours:http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21289204

More from earlier in the thread:

Here's what you're not seeming to grasp: the "windows" for taking advantage of nutrient timing are not little peepholes. They're more like bay windows of a mansion. You're ignoring just how long the anabolic effects are of a typical mixed meal. Depending on the size of a meal, it takes a good 1-2 hours for circulating substrate levels to peak, and it takes a good 3-6 hours (or more) for everythng to drop back down to baseline.

You're also ignoring the fact that the anabolic effects of a meal are maxed out at much lower levels than typical meals drive insulin & amino acids up to. Furthermore, you're also ignoring the body's ability of anabolic (& fat-oxidative) supercompensation when forced to work in the absence of fuels. So, metaphorically speaking, our physiology basically has the universe mapped out and you're thinking it needs to be taught addition & subtraction.

Properly done preworkout nutrition EASILY elevates insulin above and beyond the maximal threshold seen to inhibit muscle protein breakdown. This insulin elevation resulting from the preworkout meal can persist long after your resistance training bout is done. Therefore, thinking you need to spike anything is only the result of neglecting your preworkout nutrition"

There's no need for quickly absorbed carbs postworkout unless you fulfill all of the following 3 criteria: 1) you have NOT ingested any pre or mid-training carbs, 2) you train to complete glycogen depletion, 3) you're forced to exhustively train those same glycogen-depleted muscles again within the same day.

[antikk]

Hey man have u thought of giving lean gains a go, its a way of losing BF% whilst adding muscle leangains.com i been doin it for a bit and u can see that in my pics u commented i was leaner in the second than in the first

Yeah I did an intermittent fasting diet a go for a couple months but it just didn't work for me. I have found that smaller meals throughout the day works best for me

[aussieboi901]

No worries, stick at it ur makin good progress, wish i was goin as well
If u need any help nutrition wise give us a yell i have done cert3 in retail pharmacy with a huge unit on nutrition and am doin nutrition as part of my bachelor of pharmacy anyway

[AlwaysTryin]

No worries, stick at it ur makin good progress, wish i was goin as well
If u need any help nutrition wise give us a yell i have done cert3 in retail pharmacy with a huge unit on nutrition and am doin nutrition as part of my bachelor of pharmacy anyway

oh dear

[aussieboi901]

So alwaystryin, did u change my ranking after my last post? real mature

[AlwaysTryin]

So alwaystryin, did u change my ranking after my last post? real mature

did I? I don't believe I did...

EDIT - I just tried to give you rep and turns out I can, so obviously I didn't neg you, but I will now