Let me start out by saying this has been a problem for 3-4 years now, and now that I am finally oping in for surgery, I am 90% glad to get it over with, but 10% sad that I might atrophy. I am sick of being in pain all the time, and ready to give my first official surgery of my life a full go.
History (right shoulder):
(first pain felt in this region) About 4ish years ago, I found myself on a bus to a hockey game (played juniors back then 07-11), and after waking up from sleeping for a few hours, I found that BOTH of my shoulders were KILLING me. Now, this pain was bad because I had never had it before and IMO, this is where I first started tearing up my labrums.
February 2011, I said enough was enough, left my team before the season ended, got XRAYS, and an MRI arthrogram, and in the end decided to do Rehab from March1-June1 after not really finding anything conclusive to a tear, but the doc said it was a good possibility that it was torn (Right shoulder) and rehab would probably help, but not permanently fix it. I took the bait as I was trying to make a new Junior A club in 2 months. I made the team fyi.
October 2011, I felt my team because of money and politics, and have only skated once since. Since I don't plan on walking on to a college next fall (plan on getting a PTC from NASM for some other place), my parents urged me to retake the MRIA and get the surgery.
December 2011, Got the MRIA and Doc told me this....(this is what is on the final report paper)
Findings:
There is a contrast imbibition into superior labrum extending to at least the 10:00 position posterosuperiorly. The anterior/inferior labrum is intact.
There is a intermediate signal within and slightly thickening of the supraspinatus tendon and anterior portion of the infraspinatus tendon. The teres minor and subscapularis tendons are intact. There is not atrophy of the rotator cuff musculature.
The biceps tendon is intact.
There is not significant acromioclavicular join arthropathy.
The coracohumeral, superior glenohumeral, middle glenohumeral, and inferior glenohumeral ligaments are intact.
No muscular abnormality is identified.
A small amount of fluid seen within the subacromial/subdeltoid bursa. This is not hyperintense on the T1 sequences.
If you guys need anything more on the history or final report, let me know, I will be more than happy to give it to you.
Okay, so now on to,
Future:
I plan on having the surgery tentivitely around March 15th. Mainly because I will be done bulking, going to start cutting around April 15th I think.
Questions (Post my own detailed research):
I was given 4 months to rehab. I feel that through my meticulous diet and healthy lifestyle I can knock that down to around 3 months. But after looking around the forums for the past 3 weeks, I feel that maybe I should supplement during the rehab time also.
I was thinking of stacking Super Cissus and hGH. I don't know much on the subject of supplements with respect to the joint repair. I have also seen some others taking....Glucosamine HCI, Chondroiton, MSM, and some even taking AAS's. I would be willing to take pretty much anything (during the 6 months after surgery) as long as side effects aren't that bad, money isn't much of an object. I would like to stay clean and natural my entire life, but if I can 'bulletproof' my shoulder for hopefully my entire life by taking something like what I said above, then I will be glad to. Decreasing rehab time would be nice, but isn't a priority. 'Bulletproofing' is. If so, in later posts, I would like to discuss how to talk to my MD and/or RD, bringing up the hGH, AAS's and anything else, might be sort of strange.
I will be implementing my own techniques, such as meditation and a few weird things I have picked up through my hockey psychology coaches too.
I was also wondering if Hyberbaric Oxygen Therapy time would be really helpful?
Lastly, I know this may sound childish and wimpy, but will I be able to play xbox or use my computer (mouse) when in my first month out of surgery (still in sling)?
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Thread: My Labrum Tear Discussion
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01-05-2012, 10:14 PM #1
My Labrum Tear Discussion
Caz Smash
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01-06-2012, 10:37 PM #2
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01-08-2012, 10:44 PM #3
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01-11-2012, 03:52 PM #4
I have an appointment with my Orthopedic Surgeon tomorrow. Going to ask him a lot of questions.
Supplementing with hGH, Cissus, and/or AAS? Any others?
Hyberbaric Oxygen Therapy and/or Active Release Therapy
What will my mobility be?
What will the rehab process be?
Tell him about my diet. And that I want to cut from March 1st-Whenever, but I will put it on hold for a while if need be after surgery.Caz Smash
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01-15-2012, 09:02 PM #5
So, after going to the doc to ask more quesitons, here is what I got.
First, he said no go on hGH, or AAS, as they will only hinder me later in life. Which is right, so whatever, I guess I will indeed stick to being natty my whole life (was the plan all along, but I'd like to see what a HGH or AAS would help me with post op).
He said, no go on Hyberbaric Oxygen Chambers unless you have lots of money to throw away (which I don't). A.R.T. he said I could do, only after a month after the op.
So, I guess I will have to stick to Cissus, MSM, and the others that people have recommended in terms of supplementing.
As far as my diet, it will vary. For the 2 weeks post OP, I think I will need to stick to my bulking diet, so I make sure not to halt any important progress. I will probably be eating 2500-3000cals, most of my energy coming from fats hopefully. Trying to get in 200g of protein/day, for a while after the 4 week mark. And after the 3 month mark, I will be cutting hard, as long as the repair process is going better than planned.
Here comes some of the bad news. He said for 2 weeks post OP, I will be doing NOTHING. The next 2 weeks after that, probably barely getting back into walking around and doing things (still in sling). Then I will start therapy, where THEY will be moving it. After 2 months I think he said I will get back to moving it on my own. After 4 months I will get back to light, light, light, light weights. I guess 3-4 months of atrophy won't be that bad if I use a tens unit to keep my muscles somewhat active. He said 9-12 months until back to lifting REALLY heavy again. Which, I think I can knock down to 6 months, and be back to lifting heavy by the start of Fall Bulk.Caz Smash
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01-16-2012, 09:26 AM #6
I'm glad your surgeon gave you a realistic perspective. I'm 5.5 months out of surgery for a Type II SLAP and I'm still confined to light weights. I don't even have the ROM to hold the bar properly for squats yet. Your doctor's timetable is really where your expectations should be.
I think the hardest part of the process for you is going to be the waiting, as it's been for me. Aside from your stretching routine, there's very little you can do to speed up or even control the recovery patience. And being primarily inactive and limited in your activities is very frustrating.
My advice to you would be to skip the bulking and cutting. You can definitely bulk up until surgery if you feel like it, but realize that for the two weeks right after surgery, you're properly going to have a reduced appetite and feel a bit rough. And if you bulk after that, you're going to be almost entirely sedentary at that point, so it'll almost all be going to bloat. On the flip side, if you do a hard cut while in recovery, you're going to atrophy like mad. I would plan on a steady maintenance diet after surgery if I were you, and skip bulking and cutting until after you're back in the gym.
Good luck with your surgery.
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01-16-2012, 12:20 PM #7
Thanks so much for the help, and words. I am in desperate need of some actual feedback. Wish I could rep you WAY more. I will probably take your point, and stick to maintenance until after May-ish. I plan on making EVERY effort to recover this thing as fast and as wholly as possible. I can't stand looking at my body at 12-15% BF. Single digits are so much better. I learned my lesson though, I need to bulk as clean as possible next time around.
Caz Smash
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01-18-2012, 09:13 PM #8
hey man, sorry to hear about your injury!
I too tore my labrum, currently a month an a half post op (also had to stabilize shoulder joint)
i agree with tfk, bulking and cutting will be pointless on account of you wont be doing much of anything.
after a two weeks i was out of my sling part time and able to ride a stationary bicycle.
after a month i was out of sling for good and able to work abs and legs as well as run.
to date, i go to the gym three times a week and do the aforementioned.
again as tfk said, cant quite get the ROM to do squats so most of my work is on the machines.
my doc does not want me doing therapy and i think my progress has been coming along phenomenally, but thats a problem because i feel like i can do much more than what i should be doing.
it will be a long process, but you will be fine man. ill be happy to answer any specific questions you have, although it is important to remember that every patient is different and every procedure is different. the doc wont know for sure what really good until he is in your shoulder looking around.
PS buy a couple firm pillows if you dont have any because youre going to be sleeping upright for a week at least lol
good luck man
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01-18-2012, 10:28 PM #9
For that 2 week period after OP, were you able to go on the computer or play xbox or anything? I know it might sound like a dumb question, but I do a lot of work on the computer and I'm starting a business so, what kind of mobility for those two weeks, or rather, when will I be able to get back to that.
Caz Smash
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01-19-2012, 08:58 AM #10
- Join Date: Apr 2011
- Location: New Bern, North Carolina, United States
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01-19-2012, 01:01 PM #11
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01-19-2012, 03:27 PM #12
The sleeping upright bit that dmitch mentioned is key and I'd forgotten about that. If you have a reclining chair, you'll find it's much more comfortable to sleep in that than a bed for at least a week for so. And you probably won't be sleeping very well or very much for at least the first week after surgery.
And be ready for some really weird annoyances. You won't be allowed to shower for a week after surgery, and then when you shower, you'll need to wrap your shoulder in saran wrap beforehand. And putting on clothes is annoying, but you'll get the hang of the process pretty quickly.
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01-19-2012, 04:11 PM #13
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01-26-2012, 04:53 PM #14
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01-26-2012, 08:55 PM #15
Not sure what you're wanting to hear, but I can tell you most anything you'll want to know. I did rehab protocols for at least 60 shoulders last year alone ranging from bone spurs to reverse shoulder replacements.
Your surgery is a pretty routine deal, not going to take long under the knife, and won't be anything difficult for your surgeon if he or she has any experience. Post surgery, you will hurt quite a bit; don't want to sugar coat that. You'll also notice around then how crucial your arms are to daily life as you won't be using it; at all. As mentioned above, a lot of patients have stories complaining of the inability to sleep well since you can't sprawl out and lay down. Others sleep like a baby with the pain meds, just depends on your reaction to the drug classes.
When you get into doing rehab, its going to be extremely frustrating. Depending on how the surgery itself goes, whether any complications arise and other things need to be repaired, you're going to find your strength is shot. This is normal and will return in time. The main goal for the physio is to minimize pain and return range of motion to the joints initially. Once normal ROM is achieved, youll then begin to work on more strengthening based protocols, ultimately leading into proprioception exercises (throwing a ball at the wall or against a trampoline, etc).
Glad to hear you're listening to the doc about your supplements mentioned in OP. Bulking is really not the best idea at this point. You're going to get out of shape to an extent... but don't let that put you down, pain free post surgery you'll be able to make the gains back moderately fast. Bulking would be bad though for the weight being put on will likely turn mostly to fat with the inactivity.
Bottom line, you want to get back faster: DO what the physio says for home exercises. 90% don't and prolong their rehab times. They're given to help you, not just to annoy you. Work hard in the rehab, and ask to go 3x a week rather than 2 unless you do a lot of it at home.
Keep updated on exercises you can do etc, might be able to give you some additional ones specific to your injury you can ask your physio about doing.To answer most training questions-
Strength: >85% 1RM <6reps 2-6sets
Power
- Single effort: 80-90% 1RM, 1-2reps 3-5sets
- Multi effort: 75-85% 1RM, 3-5reps 3-5sets
Hypertrophy: 67-85% 1RM, 6-12reps 3-6sets
Endurance: <67% 1RM, >12 reps 2-3sets
--GCSU Athletic Training--
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01-26-2012, 09:46 PM #16
LOVE it. THANKS SO MUCH. I'm like a sponge to this stuff. Biggest things I will probably take away or comment on are this;
I knock the frock out when I'm on pain meds. I will try to get them to go to the PT 3-4 times/week (which I have done before and like doing). As far as bulking goes, I have been bulking since Oct 1st, and I will continue to until probably February 15th ish (I don't want to be sore, therefore healing muscles, and hurting in my shoulder). I am going to buy a recliner either way. And I think I will keep a VERY detailed journal of everything including the exercises they give me for future reference.
Repped.Caz Smash
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01-27-2012, 07:56 AM #17
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- Location: Texarkana, Texas, United States
- Posts: 2,557
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I am 3 weeks post op from a posterior labrum tear operation as well as a distal clavicle resection. I wouldn't worry to much about the surgery as you are in good health and should be fine. I did tons of research before hand which made me extrememly nervous. I just posted a new thread in this section if you would like to get all the details. My problem is I am in such little pain I am concerned something isn't normal. I pretty much have full range of motion and am able to do everyday activities with zero pain. 3 days post op I was out of the sling sweeping the kitchen, 2 weeks post op I raked the yard. The pain was so manageable that pain meds werent really needed shortly after the surgery, although I did continue to take them cause I like to feel jacked up. My operation was a scope/open incision in one. They had to take off a small portion of my collar bone and some arthritis build up on the top of my ac joint. I wore my sling for maybe 3 days, took the bandages off in about 4. Although it probably wasnt smart, I did some light curls and tricep pushdowns with zero pain. I'm definitely not advising doing that so shortly after surgery, thats just how minimal my pain was. Hit me up with any questions and good luck.
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01-27-2012, 10:18 PM #18
I currently have a shoulder problem and have been gp and physio for 3 months without them even being able to diagnose the problem. i came across labrum tears on the internet and the symptoms sound quite similar to mine. Caz, were your symptoms simlilar to these...
-shoulder visably hanging forward.
-pain in the shoulder when holding a bar on ur back (like when squating)
-poor range of motion
i have been streching for months, doing rotator cuff strength exercises. however my range of motion is poor and i have pain on what feels on the head of the humerus whenever i do pulllups military press etc. also i find when i did bench press the bar slanted (as if my arms were doing completley different ranges of motion. it would be great if you could help
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01-28-2012, 02:44 PM #19
Labrum tear in both shoulders brah here....
rest the fukking the **** out of that thing once you get surgery (srs)
sucess rates for shoulder surgery are often 80-95%...never 100%...I only had surgery on my right shoulder (bothered me for 5 years...since I was 12 pitching in baseball) and it still hurts now, but MUCH less pain. definitely noticeable though that there is pain...
remember to massage the scar tissue a little bit to get it mobile.
and yes I think in about 2 weeks (1 week maybe..) post surgery you can play xboxDallas Cowboys Crew
Dirty South Crew
Misc Cigar Crew
Competition Lifts - 590D/345B/525S
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01-28-2012, 06:04 PM #20
Thanks for the input man, I think your have something very strange going on obviously. Most people don't do ANYTHING for the 1-2 week period post op. Let alone racking he yard. +1 on taking pain meds when you don't need them btw.
Thats nothing like what I have. My shoulder doesn't hang forward, my shoulder only hurts when I do LOTS of heavy bench and dips. I now know what exercises hurt and what don't so I stick to that. Go to see an orthopedic surgeon, he will do some tests like pressuring your arms at certain push/pull areas, and he will be able to tell based on your body composition on if anything needs to be checked out. If all else fails tell him you need an MRI or MRI Arthrogram.
I plan on resting non-stop for the 2 weeks post op. I will only start cutting probably once I feel that my pain level has completely subsided and/or I feel that my body can cut while healing this thing up. Forturnately, I am having he surgery 2/21, so I think no later than 4/21 I can start cutting and be at 6% BF for summer!
The xbox thing was sort of a joke, but sort of not. I don't want to be too bored post op. But I have a few things that I hope will keep me busy in that time. Movies, Books, etc.Caz Smash
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01-28-2012, 06:30 PM #21
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01-29-2012, 07:50 AM #22
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02-02-2012, 10:22 AM #23
You've gotten a lot of really great advice here already, but I thought I would go ahead and add my two cents anyways.
I had anterior and posterior tears in my right labrum that took 5 anchors to repair. I injured myself training BJJ/MMA about a year ago and had my surgery in May. I'm 8 months out from surgery and I've been lifting since October. The progress has been slow, but steady, not something you want to push though. I've also started doing light grappling and my shoulder has been taking it surprisingly well.
You're already in good shape, but pre-op the biggest thing you can focus on is shoulder and upper back strength. It's what's going to help you the most when it comes to rehab.
Find the best Physical Therapist you can, and try to get one with experience with labrum rehab. Anyone can read you the set rehab programs off the internet, but you're going to want someone who can look at how you're progressing and give you an experienced assessment. Someone who has a good relationship with your surgeon is also good.
Another thing is to listen to your PT and surgeon like your life depends on it, because at least the successful rehabilitation of your shoulder does. Being in good shape before surgery will mean that you will progress faster afterwards, but that doesn't mean that your PT will want to push it, and you shouldn't either. Trying to do something before your shoulder is ready could prolong your rehab, or even increase the chance that you need a second surgery, definitely something you don't want.
The best piece of advice I got before my surgery was to get a recliner. I rented one from Rent-A-Center and slept in it for a month. Without it I don't know what I would have done.
The best thing to remember is that during recovery you are your own worst enemy. You'll be chomping at the bit to get back to where you were before, but the biggest thing you can do for yourself is to be patient. I know all of this sounds a bit dramatic, but it's exactly what I needed to be told, repeatedly, both before and after surgery.
Good luck and keep us updated on how things turn out!
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02-02-2012, 01:12 PM #24
I had a bankart repair done for my labrum tear in June of 11', although the larger pains are gone and i can do more exercises, there is still a lot of crackling, minor pains, some days my shoulder hurts for days on end, I've lost all symmetry on my entire left side of my body and I am still very weak when it comes to pushes and even pulls.
I'm going to be doing a lot of research and getting lots of advice/professional opinions so whatever I find I will be sure to pass on to you to help you make as fast of a recovery as your body will allow.
I still have to get my right labrum repaired as well, it has been a tough two years to say the least. I was around 225LBs at 6-7% bodyfat about to do my first natural show (I would've easily won my class for my first level) with the intention of attaining a WNBF procard. Life throws you curveballs sometimes.
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02-02-2012, 05:18 PM #25
also - this may not hold true in your case, but for me, my right shoulder (the one i had procedure done on) is slightly higher than my left. again, im only two months post-op and it has slowly been coming into the correct alignment but i was wondering if anyone else in this thread had a similar problem?
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02-02-2012, 06:09 PM #26
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02-03-2012, 08:47 AM #27
I was pretty much fine before surgery, but I had the same thing after surgery and still have it six months out. It's improved and still improving, but it's still not normal yet either. My whole upper body is still incredibly tight and limited though. I'm doing a ROM and flexibility program to try to get those back to normal.
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02-03-2012, 10:43 AM #28
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02-06-2012, 06:22 PM #29
Good luck with the surgery OP! Mostly everyone here has given you good advise and a reasonable timetable for recovery. The only thing I want to add is you should prepare yourself for probably the worst pain you are ever going to feel. If you get the chance definitely take the nerve block! Also, do not under any circumstances keep your arm out of the sling until the doc gives you the okay. You might start getting chippy after 2 weeks but take the rehab slow and purposefully! Your mission is to get 100% range of motion back and recover to full strength. Don't overdue it thinking that you will be speeding up the recovery time, this procedure is just going to take time
Good luck again and keep us updated!
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02-06-2012, 06:29 PM #30
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