Full Body vs. Split Routines - Which to Choose?

[RockCrab]

Ive made very good progress doing 3 day split

Subjective metrics are subjective. Look it up. At 15, I'm sure your vast experience has given you a clear frame of reference for what 'good progress' is. Thanks for the input.

[hardenheavy]

If it's working for you, and meeting your goals, then that's all that matters.

However, I'd try to lift 3x per week instead of just 2. If you don't feel you have the recovery on some of the "big" lifts, then do those 2x a week and save the supplementary isolation lifts for the third day. Also, I know you're running, but I'd try to hit legs better on your second day. Deadlifts are not a leg exercise, so you basically are only working calves that day.

Well I might have added that those are Romanian deadlifts hence a hamstrings workout. However, I feel this exercise pretty much everywhere in my lower body so it's OK. Over time, if it's not enough I'll add/change something. Thanks for the opinion though!

[tmiddled]

Has there been any peer reviewed studies on full-body vs splits for beginner's looking for mass/strength gains?

Don't get me wrong, I don't doubt this thread at all. I am a novice and have been on JasonDB 5x5 for nearly a month (after 2 months of my own similar full body), and am very very happy with my strength and muscle gain (weight is around the same, but I have lost fat). I just cracked through 100kg squat last workout!

But all the broscience nutrition crap out there can always be debunked by pointing to the peer reviewed scientific evidence, it makes me wonder if there are similar studies done on full bodys vs. bro splits with conclusive results.

[FrontSquatBrah]

Great read OP. I have been lifting for 1.5 years and when I first started I did fullbody workouts. I then started split training, but what I did wrong was focus too much on isolations. I now have been doing fullbody workouts and mainly comprising of compound lifts - squats, deadlift, overhead press etc.. and add 1-2 isolations for calves and arms and I have gotten a lot stronger and gained in the last month.

Repped.

[bambrola8586]

I feel 4 day split workout is good for me....................

[Salamnder]

Great info for a beginner like myself. Thanks.

[hysterikz]

Going to start full body as I prefer it over a split. Going to do the following.


Full Body A (18 sets)
Squats – 5x5
Flat Bench – 3x5
Incline – 2x5
DB Shoulder press – 5x5
Dips – 3x5

Full Body B (17 sets)
Dead lift – 3x5
Bent Over Rows – 5x5
Upright BB Rows – 3x5
CGBP – 3x8
Pull ups – 3x5

ABA BAB etc

Any suggestions to add?

[tmiddled]

Going to start full body as I prefer it over a split. Going to do the following.


Full Body A (18 sets)
Squats – 5x5
Flat Bench – 3x5
Incline – 2x5
DB Shoulder press – 5x5
Dips – 3x5

Full Body B (17 sets)
Dead lift – 3x5
Bent Over Rows – 5x5
Upright BB Rows – 3x5
CGBP – 3x8
Pull ups – 3x5

ABA BAB etc

Any suggestions to add?

Coming from a novice, so take it with a grain of salt. Please ignore my comment if you are not a novice, you didn't state your experience so I am just assuming.

Is this a designed program by an expert, or something you made up?

If you made this up, I would recommend choosing a proven program designed by an expert such as SS, SL5x5, ICF or AllPros. If this is already a proven program, go for it. Ensure it has progressive overloading and resetting so that you don't have to do any of the thinking and can just focus on lifting the weight as the program specifies.

My two cents worth - I really enjoy ICF 5x5, but it is a lot of volume when you get to your weight limits and takes me over 1.5 hours, some people take more. If you don't want to work out that long, then choose one of the other shorter programs.

[ohiosmitty]

This is an awesome thread, I currently do a 4 day split, have done 3 in the past. So much of it depends on how much time you have to devote to training and what your personal goals are.

[bushr0d]

I usually switch up between a 4 day bodybuilding split comprised of mon-chest/tris, tues-back/bis, thurs-shoulders, fri-legs and the full body 4 day per week circuit training program I am currently on. Check out my results in the last few weeks and if you want more information on it I can email you the program.

[GetBigs]

That is a very informative post there, good job. I'm doing full-body workouts 3-4 times a week, too, given I'm a beginner. :P

[natebegood]

What about for fat loss? Should i be looking at an upper body/lower body split so that i am activating more muscle groups more often? as opposed to a 5 day muscle group split.

[VoxExMachina]

What about for fat loss? Should i be looking at an upper body/lower body split so that i am activating more muscle groups more often? as opposed to a 5 day muscle group split.

It's irrelevant.

[love2bulk]

3 day splits for the most part of the year with 4 day upper/lower or push/pull routines for contest prep if your natural. If your natural your 2 best friends are frequency and rest. If you dont believe me check out anything posted by Casey Butt or his website. BBing dot com is nice enough not to let me post links so good luck finding them on your own.

[deanjcrawford]

Read through this whole thread, some great advice! The one thing i can't see is a link to a good upper/lower split routine but i know of at least three full body routine that are linked on these boards. I'm currently sitting at around 100kgs and want to continue to lose fat...any suggestions?

I have been doing full body routine three times week for the last 4 months and it's worked well. I do squats, deadlifts, military press, bench press (or db bench press depending on my shoulder) Bent over barbell rows and lat pull downs three times a week. I'm down 16kg and as long as i eat in a deficit i will continue to lose. I think it's just that a mixture of not being able to increase the weight every week, and the repetition that is leaving me wanting to try something new. I find i feel great and feel that i've had a really good workout whenever i do the full body routine, i just would like to mix it up for a bit.

[RockCrab]

Read through this whole thread, some great advice! The one thing i can't see is a link to a good upper/lower split routine but i know of at least three full body routine that are linked on these boards. I'm currently sitting at around 100kgs and want to continue to lose fat...any suggestions?

Keep lifting and get your diet in order . . .

Calories IN < Calories OUT = Weight Loss. In order to lose more fat then muscle, give your body a reason to hang onto the muscle, i.e. lift heavy.

[deanjcrawford]

For sure, that's definitely how simple it can be. My point was more inquiring about a split routine as i'm getting a little bored after doing a full body for 4-5 months. Being on a cut for so long, i feel like i'm stalling on the weights and the worst thing i can do is go into the gym unprepared!

[SkydogGinsberg]

My point was more inquiring about a split routine as i'm getting a little bored after doing a full body for 4-5 months.

There are a few ways to skin that cat:

a). Make 2 separate FB lists w/ variations of similar exercises (Back Squat/Front Squat, Bench Press/Incline Press, etc...). Alternate them in A-B-A, B-A-B fashion each week.

b). Periodize training such as 4-6 months on a basic low-volume "Big 3" strength program, then 4-6 months on a higher volume, 2x Upper/Lower "growth" program. You can use the same 2 routines over and over (if they're good ones) for a few years till you feel a need for more intricate splits.

c). Find a couple "pre-packaged" programs like Starr "Madcow" (Beginner/Intermediate), and Norton's PHAT (a U/L + P/P/L hybrid), run those sequentially, similar to "b)."...

[neplainjanepas]

It seems sort of like this was a post to educate, but its not completely true that full body work outs should be for beginners. I have been working out for a few years, and have tried a few different programs. Its good to change things up- it keeps you motivated and keeps your body from adapting to the stress. I have done different splits, and just recently started HST program which I am finding to be very challenging. Granted its only 8 weeks, and after I plan to go back to some sort of split. The science behind doing a hst program(full body workout) if done right can be very effective in gaining mass. It is also not usually recommended to beginners.

If anyone wants to learn more about it just google/bing HST, and there should be resources available to explain how it works.

[rise1]

If people will read stickies, we should sticky it. But we all know what happens to sticky threads... These are definitely very informative!

[SethCoyne]

I would agree that full body routines are ideal for beginners and that splits should generally be used more by intermediate to advanced lifters. But I would say that full body routines can still be good to be cycled in by more advanced lifters i.e. I think they should consider switching off between splits and full body routines.

[ABallah]

Quick question..
When are you no longer considered a beginner?
I weigh 130 and here are my lifts
BP- 185 and squats-255.

Should I do full body? I've actually never done it. My school taught us to do splits(probably cause of equipment to lifter ratio?) and my first 9 weeks is where I saw most of my gains on my lifts

[WaffleMan11]

Very good advice. I've been working out for about four years now, and lifting for three, so I'm fairly experienced with these program variations. This past spring I was working out with my buddy who wants to get big (I believe he's about 140 and 6'2"), and we were doing more of a bodybuilding program, Mike Westerdahl's 10 week Critical Bench program. I intend to revisit this program, it definitely has it's value, but it was a mistake to start my friend with such a program. The 5 day's a week thing wasn't manageable, and the targeting of individual bodygroups didn't work out that well for him.

This winter after football season is over, I will be doing a much more beginner suited program with this same friend to give him a comprehensive but manageable system to work with. It only requires three gym days a week, one targeting strength gains, one targeting mass gains, and one targeting endurance gains, with two days of HIIT training for cardio and conditioning. It's my own program based around the staples of squat, bench, deadlift, dips, pullups, and pushups, with isolation as a supplement but not a focal point. I'm open for suggestions though. I've considered making the strength workout just another mass workout for my buddy, as the low reps with high weights might be too hard on his body

[WaffleMan11]

Quick question..
When are you no longer considered a beginner?
I weigh 130 and here are my lifts
BP- 185 and squats-255.

Should I do full body? I've actually never done it. My school taught us to do splits(probably cause of equipment to lifter ratio?) and my first 9 weeks is where I saw most of my gains on my lifts

I recommend either 3 day/week full body or 2day splits. If you go hard and put effort into whatever you want to pursue you'll make gains either way

[Insilicio]

I train full body on monday, wednesday, friday, and now in a few hours I am gonna train again but still feel my muscles "hurt" from last training. Should I go heavy again or take it easy today?

[zubbers]

Would I be right in saying that if I begin full body 3x/week and I am not progressing week by week doing something like heavy/light/heavy then I should move to a routine that incorporates more volume?

[Mdenatale]

Would I be right in saying that if I begin full body 3x/week and I am not progressing week by week doing something like heavy/light/heavy then I should move to a routine that incorporates more volume?

Its not that cut and dry. There could be other factors to explain a lack of progress other than the fact that you are doing a FB routine vs. a split.

[SkydogGinsberg]

Would I be right in saying that if I begin full body 3x/week and I am not progressing week by week doing something like heavy/light/heavy then I should move to a routine that incorporates more volume?

Volume alone would be far down the list of "usual suspects". If it were the culprit, it'd be simple enough to just add some extra sets. Post a thread in the forum rather than clutter up the stickie ... but on the outset, 9/10 times it's adequate and consistent calories.

[jdjprimer19]

I train full body on monday, wednesday, friday, and now in a few hours I am gonna train again but still feel my muscles "hurt" from last training. Should I go heavy again or take it easy today?

Ice your vag, then hit the gym.

[VoxExMachina]

Ice your vag, then hit the gym.

H^Rdk0ar answer, bro. Very impressive.