Trying to bulk with Leangains (feel free to critique)

[tatherton23]

Had no clue where to put this. Still a greenhorn and I just wanted to create a thread to keep me honest and hopefully get some feedback. A little background. I ate like crap my whole life and though I had brief periods where I "worked out", it was a real joke and I saw no changes in body comp. cause I had no diet to back it up. When I got home from school in June, one of my friends pointed out I'd gotten a little pudgy. So I decided to lose some weight and I started doing research into the best way to accomplish that. I started lifting weights and cut down my cals about 500 below maintenance and lost 20 lbs. in about 3 months. Gained a little muscle too and a lot of strength. Feeling really good. However I'm down to 132 lbs now and though I'm not fully cut, I'm used to being 150 and I feel freakishly small so I'd like to bulk up. Unfortunately I'm pussing out on the whole bulking thing cause I don't want to gain the fat back along with new muscle when I worked so hard to get the fat off.

I came across Martin Berkhan's Leangains site and it really piqued my interest. This is mostly because holy crap I can eat 1500 cals in one meal? I love food and the thought of this is very enticing. Also, leangains is designed to minimize fat gain and that's what I'd like to do while I bulk up, even if it's not the most efficient way to bulk.

I'm going to get started tomorrow. Unfortunately my gym is closed for Thanksgiving so I'll be doing a home gym workout but come Tuesday I'll be back at it. I'm just curious as to others opinions of Leangains. The 16 hours fasting makes me fear muscle loss during that time. Anyways my plan is to post pics aswell as my diet and lifting progress, partly because I'm OCD and maybe my experience with this IF thing can help others. I'm going to Florida for Christmas which is why I'm not doing just a regular bulk. I don't think 2.5 months is enough time for a bulking and cutting phase right?

So my plan for tomorrow is to try to wake up around 7 or 8, try to stay sane until noon, then take 10g BCAA, train, then eat a huge meal around 1pm consisting of:
P C F Cal
whey protein 25 2 0.5 120
apple 0 22 0 80
1.5 cup oats 18 90 9 540
2 slices ww bread 7 33 2 180
1/2 can tuna 15 0 0.5 60
2 tbsp salsa 0 2 0 20

Totals 133 149 19.5 1376

Being used to 6 or 7 300-400 cal meals, these numbers kinda freak me. Anyway at about 4pm I'll have my second meal.

whey protein 25 2 0.5 120
2 eggs 12 0 10 160
tuna 15 0 0 60
salsa 0 2 0 20
1/2 cup oats 6 30 6 180
2 slices ww bread 7 33 2 180

Totals 64 67 18.5 720

And finally around 8pm I'll have

8 oz chicken breast 68 0 8 376



So daily totals would be 265 216 47.5 2472


On non-workout days, total cals are lowered below maintenance to 1900, carbs are reduced by about 1/3 and fats are increased by 20 grams. Does this sound like a decent plan?

[tatherton23]

Darn had everything set up like a chart. Now it's just a mess. Sorry.

[WonderPug]

How tall are you?

[Yodums]

Had no clue where to put this. Still a greenhorn and I just wanted to create a thread to keep me honest and hopefully get some feedback. A little background. I ate like crap my whole life and though I had brief periods where I "worked out", it was a real joke and I saw no changes in body comp. cause I had no diet to back it up. When I got home from school in June, one of my friends pointed out I'd gotten a little pudgy. So I decided to lose some weight and I started doing research into the best way to accomplish that. I started lifting weights and cut down my cals about 500 below maintenance and lost 20 lbs. in about 3 months. Gained a little muscle too and a lot of strength. Feeling really good. However I'm down to 132 lbs now and though I'm not fully cut, I'm used to being 150 and I feel freakishly small so I'd like to bulk up. Unfortunately I'm pussing out on the whole bulking thing cause I don't want to gain the fat back along with new muscle when I worked so hard to get the fat off.

I came across Martin Berkhan's Leangains site and it really piqued my interest. This is mostly because holy crap I can eat 1500 cals in one meal? I love food and the thought of this is very enticing. Also, leangains is designed to minimize fat gain and that's what I'd like to do while I bulk up, even if it's not the most efficient way to bulk.

I'm going to get started tomorrow. Unfortunately my gym is closed for Thanksgiving so I'll be doing a home gym workout but come Tuesday I'll be back at it. I'm just curious as to others opinions of Leangains. The 16 hours fasting makes me fear muscle loss during that time. Anyways my plan is to post pics aswell as my diet and lifting progress, partly because I'm OCD and maybe my experience with this IF thing can help others. I'm going to Florida for Christmas which is why I'm not doing just a regular bulk. I don't think 2.5 months is enough time for a bulking and cutting phase right?

So my plan for tomorrow is to try to wake up around 7 or 8, try to stay sane until noon, then take 10g BCAA, train, then eat a huge meal around 1pm consisting of:
P C F Cal
whey protein 25 2 0.5 120
apple 0 22 0 80
1.5 cup oats 18 90 9 540
2 slices ww bread 7 33 2 180
1/2 can tuna 15 0 0.5 60
2 tbsp salsa 0 2 0 20

Totals 133 149 19.5 1376

Being used to 6 or 7 300-400 cal meals, these numbers kinda freak me. Anyway at about 4pm I'll have my second meal.

whey protein 25 2 0.5 120
2 eggs 12 0 10 160
tuna 15 0 0 60
salsa 0 2 0 20
1/2 cup oats 6 30 6 180
2 slices ww bread 7 33 2 180

Totals 64 67 18.5 720

And finally around 8pm I'll have

8 oz chicken breast 68 0 8 376



So daily totals would be 265 216 47.5 2472


On non-workout days, total cals are lowered below maintenance to 1900, carbs are reduced by about 1/3 and fats are increased by 20 grams. Does this sound like a decent plan?

1. You're not going to muscle mass by fasting for 16 hours. If that was the case, no one would be following LG.

2. Your meals sound incredibly boring. You do realize that you can basically eat anything you want to hit your cals and macros, right? It doesn't have to be oats, chicken breast, eggs, tuna, etc. Throw some steak, ice cream or whatever you enjoy.

3. Where did you get the idea to eat below maintenance on a bulk on off-days? If you're THAT concerned with fat gain, then I'd start with maintenance, but I would not be surprised if that scale doesn't move.

[tatherton23]

I'm 5'8. Eating slightly below maintenance on rest days is one of Martin's suggestions.

[Yodums]

I'm 5'8. Eating slightly below maintenance on rest days is one of Martin's suggestions.

If I'm not mistaken, the protocol was originally targeted at people trying to lose weight. I don't see it applying for people that are bulking.

[tatherton23]

This is true. I'll just eat maintenance or slightly above on rest days then.

So the fast is almost over. Woke up at 7. It hasn't been that bad actually. I find my cravings and desire to go against my diet usually follow one of the small 300-400 cal meals I'm used to. I think it's easier to just not eat right till 12, especially when you know there's a huge meal waiting for you. Almost time for the workout. Thank god for coffee cause I feel pretty low energy...

[WonderPug]

I'm 5'8. Eating slightly below maintenance on rest days is one of Martin's suggestions.

You're 5'8" tall, weigh 132 pounds and you're eating (way) below maintenance on rest days...why???

[vitornoob]

no veggies were eaten that day...

[asianstyles]

P C F Cal
whey protein 25 2 0.5 120
apple 0 22 0 80
1.5 cup oats 18 90 9 540
2 slices ww bread 7 33 2 180
1/2 can tuna 15 0 0.5 60
2 tbsp salsa 0 2 0 20

Totals 133 149 19.5 1376

120 + 80 + 540 + 180+ 60 + 20 <> 1376

[matsve]

I am currently bunking on IF and i think that it is kinde awesome ! atleast i get to eat some huge meals ! =)

my maintenance is abou 3100 and i eat approximately 3400cals every day

[tatherton23]

120 + 80 + 540 + 180+ 60 + 20 <> 1376

Oops left out 8 ounces of chicken breast for that meal.

Pro: 68 Fat:8 376 cal

I'm eating veggie snacks between meals. Cucumber, broccoli, spinach, etc. Guess I should count those as calories though eh? Perhaps I'll take out that extra half cup of oats in my first meal and replace it with fibrous carbs. Maybe the same deal with the 1/2 cup oats in the second meal.

[vitornoob]

count everything, even the calories from water..

[tatherton23]

So I was actually able to do a pretty decent ghetto workout with a couple dumbells. And for the first time in like 5 months, I'm...full. I don't get how eating meals like that is possible without fat gain but if this works, I could do it every workout day easily. My next meal is the furthest thing from my mind right now. Feels good and allows me to focus on my work more. And the fasted training wasn't as bad as it was when I tried it first thing in the morning during the summer. Of course I was eating at a deficit then and it was without coffee pre-workout. Hope this works.

For training, I've worked out a 3 day split which for all I know could suck but I'll try it for a bit and start recording what my lifts are so I can track improvements. I'd really like some advice on the workout cause I've only just started with compound movements cause I have access to a decent gym now. The split goes like:

1. Upper Back/bis

Chinups
Rows
Lat Pulldowns
Preacher Curls

2. Shoulders/tris/chest

Bench Press
Flies
Pushups
Military Press
Tricep Extensions
Lateral Raises

3. Lower Back/Legs

Squats
Deadlifts
Leg Press
Calf Press
Hamstring Curls

It's lacking something for traps so I might throw in shrugs on the upper back/bis day. I do abs every other day. Rest days are going to be sprinkled in as needed because I have a hectic, changing schedule with school (another reason why 3 meals works better for me than planning 6).

[tatherton23]

Got a little more creative with my PWO meal today. It's tough cause I'm trying to eat clean and I live in college residence so it's kind of hard to cook good meals. My meal plan for today is..

Meal 1: Pro Carb Fat Cal

protein shake 27 0 0.3 110
apple 0 22 0 80
6 slices french toast 66 102 16 952


Meal 2:

1 cup oats 12 60 6 360
4 oz chicken breast 34 0 4 188
1 cup 0%mf cottage cheese 28 20 0 190


Meal 3:

4 oz chicken breast 34 0 4 188
30g Almond Butter 5 6 18 190

Totals: 234.5 231 48.5 2448

[WonderPug]

Why do you insist on consuming insufficient dietary fat?

[vitornoob]

Got a little more creative with my PWO meal today.

Sorry, i am not seeing any creativity, only lack of knowledge, boring food and no veggies....

[lovingit]

Totals: 234.5 231 48.5 2448

These macros do not equal 2448

[tatherton23]

Why do you insist on consuming insufficient dietary fat?

You're right, I'm 6.5g short but I'm going to be like 11g over on my off days.

Sorry, i am not seeing any creativity, only lack of knowledge, boring food and no veggies....

I forgot to factor in the veggies again. I do eat them. I'm just not used to counting the calories and carbs from another diet I was on where they were free. I'll start counting them now though. I eat about a cup of brocc, two cups of spinach, half a tomato, some onion, and a whole cucumber every day. As for the creativity, I don't have time, money, or resources to be creative. Also, I really like oats and chicken breast. It sounds crazy to everyone I know but if I could eat an infinite amount of anything, oats would be in the top 10 easily.

These macros do not equal 2448

Don't know what to tell you. I'm just reading labels and entering in the data. Also, I left out a cup of cottage cheese in the first meal but its the same totals cause I was just copying from a spread sheet.

I'm sensing a pattern here. Does anyone want to give me some advice on how to correct what I'm doing wrong? Victornoob just seems content on hazing me as a noob which would be fine if his criticisms had applicable advice and weren't meant to just make him feel better about himself.. I have been reading a lot. I've spent like 5 months reading these forums and sorting through a lot of conflicting advice trying to figure it all out.

So more fat? Got it. I'll go have a tbsp of olive oil.

[lovingit]

Don't know what to tell you. I'm just reading labels and entering in the data. Also, I left out a cup of cottage cheese in the first meal but its the same totals cause I was just copying from a spread sheet.

No need to tell me anything. Just pointing out that this math is incorrect. The macros equal ~2292. You are bulking so I would think this would matter to you is all.

[tatherton23]

No need to tell me anything. Just pointing out that this math is incorrect. The macros equal ~2292. You are bulking so I would think this would matter to you is all.

haha thanks. I'll double check the numbers and try to find where this problem's coming from.

[lovingit]

haha thanks. I'll double check the numbers and try to find where this problem's coming from.

They might adjust for fiber or something, I'm not sure. I use a pencil and paper because I'm old school. =)

[itasquo]

My leangains macros for bulking:

Work out days: 3305
P: 210 C: 540 F: 30

Rest Day: 2000
P:210 C:110 F: 80

3 times a week training day and 4 rest day.

Currently 180 lbs with 6,4% body fat.

Doing this for about a month and a half will see and then switching to cut. **** bulk up to much because of modeling.
But i been using leangains for about year worked pretty good for cutting and bulking! So i am just sharing ; )

I will post some great meals i invented as well, including my favorite RAW CAKE

[kids.got.soul]

your calculations also seem a little off. use this calculator:

http://www.1percentedge.com/ifcalc/

the standard recomp is what you want for bulking if you're concerned about fat gain.

[cmurray]

your calculations also seem a little off. use this calculator:

http://www.1percentedge.com/ifcalc/

the standard recomp is what you want for bulking if you're concerned about fat gain.

great calculator.

[itasquo]

your calculations also seem a little off. use this calculator:



the standard recomp is what you want for bulking if you're concerned about fat gain.

That calculator is not the best... It doesnt really calculates it right.

Mine yes off just a little because i know my body and customized it for myself : ) I been using this for about a year it worked really good!
As you can see it on my pictures.

[AlwaysTryin]

old thread is old

[Mswiss]

your calculations also seem a little off. use this calculator:

http://www.1percentedge.com/ifcalc/

the standard recomp is what you want for bulking if you're concerned about fat gain.

I love that calculator, that's the one I usually use, and then macros based off the stickies on this site