Should I fear to cut? (Growth)

[KingAndreas]

I'm 18 and only 165 centimeters (about 5 feet 5 inches). My dad is 180 centimeters (about 5 feet 10 inches) while my mother being on the shorter side about 155 centimeters (5 feet 1 inch).

I have two brothers. The oldest (24 years) is about my height, maybe like a centimeter shorter. My other brother (20 years) is 175 centimeters (about 5 feet 9 inches).

Now that's the intro. So I have no idea if I'm done growing. Looking at my dad and one brother, maybe I can grow some more. Looking at my mom and other brother, maybe I can't.

Now I'm in a situation where I feel like I'm happy with my body muscle-wise, and want to cut down to a lower body fat, like 10%, and see how I stand. But then I was thinking; you can't build muscle in a deficit, so can you grow taller? This is of course, if I'm even still growing, which I can't say if I do. But as the possibility is there, I don't want to mess it up. So I googled around and found different answers. Some said it shouldn't matter being in a deficit, some said you shouldn't be. Some said only being on the verge of starvation could stunt growth.

My mother is a doctor, so I asked if growth could be hindered by being in a deficit, and she said yes... (she didn't really eleborate much on it though).

Can anyone confirm whether this is true or not? Has anyone here experienced growth while in a deficit, and if anyone generally remembers how their diet was like when growing (deficit or surplus), would they be so kind to share? Maybe you could even add in your families height, or at least your parents. Also, do you think I am even still growing, and is there a way to find out? Thank in advance!

[festeri]

You grow until you are about 21. Yes, you grow completely normal on a reasonable calorie deficit, no problem. Obese children are put on weight-loss programs all the time. Growth in non-adults is different from muscle growth or fat storage in adults. The important thing is to get protein and fats, plus micros of course. Growth is prioritized, so external nutrients will always be stored to fuel growth growth while stored fat will be used as energy. Posted some studies a while back, can't find them now but just look on PubMed. (I lost ~35 pounds fat when I was 15 and am taller than my ancestors)

[KingAndreas]

You grow until you are about 21. Yes, you grow completely normal on a reasonable calorie deficit, no problem. Obese children are put on weight-loss programs all the time. Growth in non-adults is different from muscle growth or fat storage in adults. The important thing is to get protein and fats, plus micros of course. Growth is prioritized, so external nutrients will always be stored to fuel growth growth while stored fat will be used as energy. Posted some studies a while back, can't find them now but just look on PubMed. (I lost ~35 pounds fat when I was 15 and am taller than my ancestors)

Thanks for response! : )
So diet can affect your growth. Also, what is a "reasonable" calorie deficit? I feel like I'm getting more and more worried about this growth and diet. My maintenance due to my age will probably also be different from what I can calculate and what I'm thinking. So I'm afraid to screw the cut up and loss potential height.

Are there any ways to know whether you're done growing for good? I mean, I've heard this with girls stop at about 18 and guys of 21, but that's probably just an average, and I'm thinking out of date. Like, "kids" today hit puberty at a younger age than previous. So wouldn't it make sense that growth stops earlier too?

[adean1989]

Not to put a downer on things but at the ripe ol' age of 18 you're unlikely to grow much taller.

[festeri]

So diet can affect your growth.

Well, of course it can, but the main gist of my post was that a calorie deficit will not stunt growth. A growing body prioritizes growth, so nutrients are stored even at a calorie deficit. Body fat is then used as an energy source at the same time. This is similar to what some illicit substances can do in adults. Growth is impaired if the body is presented with an insufficient diet (lacking protein, fats, micronutrients and enough energy to keep the deficit reasonable)

Also, what is a "reasonable" calorie deficit?

Depends on your BF%. 10% of maintenance is a good start, 15% if you're really overweight, anything else talk to a doctor.

I feel like I'm getting more and more worried about this growth and diet.

The only way a calorie deficit is going to negatively affect your growth is if you already have deficient growth-related parameters, or some sort of disease. You can ask a doctor for an evaluation of whether your growth will be affected for some unknown reason.

My maintenance due to my age will probably also be different from what I can calculate and what I'm thinking.

Maintenance is slightly higher when still growing, as nutrients are automatically stored. It is essentially a 21-year involuntary bulking cycle. You gain lean mass automatically, so your net weight loss should be less than that of an adult (as you are losing more fat than what it shows on the scale).

Are there any ways to know whether you're done growing for good?

No. 21 is the average. It doesn't matter because a calorie deficit won't affect your growth.

[WonderPug]

The only way a calorie deficit is going to negatively affect your growth is if you already have deficient growth-related parameters, or some sort of disease.

Malnutrition can negatively impact growth.

[adean1989]

Malnutrition can negatively impact growth.

Agree ^ and:

"A growing body prioritizes growth, so nutrients are stored even at a calorie deficit."

This is logically incorrect. One cannot store nutrients in a caloric deficit as by definition you are mismatching intake and expenditure (a surplus is a predicate for the storage of nutrients). Body fat may well provide a buffer but to what extent I'm not sure, I'd assume it's very small and therefore inconsequential.

You may also be confusing the popular notion that "growth" ceases at 21, but as for the lengthening of bones through mineralization and extension of cartilaginous end plates, most of this is done by 18. Of course there are exceptions.

[festeri]

Malnutrition can negatively impact growth.

Of course, but I don't think OP is aiming for malnutrition.

One cannot store nutrients in a caloric deficit as by definition you are mismatching intake and expenditure. Body fat may well provide a buffer but to what extent I'm not sure

You are contradicting yourself. Furthermore, body fat provides a significant source of sustained energy, it's not "inconsequential". This is the entire reason children and youth can gain lean mass while losing fat. As I pointed out before, obese children and youth can lose weight and turn out normal, this happens all the time, with and without the aid of professionals. Lean mass is gained until 21, on average.

[WonderPug]

Lean mass is gained until 21, on average.

Incorrect.

Lean mass can be gained by most healthy individuals throughout life.

Perhaps you're trying to state (very poorly) that the epiphyseal plate is still present, but it's usually replaced by an epiphyseal line before an individual turns 21.

[festeri]

^Your dick waving is generating quite a nice breeze in here

[WonderPug]

^Your dick waving is generating quite a nice breeze in here

Neg'ed for the quoted post and many other inappropriate and/or incorrect posts that you've made in the past.

[adean1989]

You are contradicting yourself. Furthermore, body fat provides a significant source of sustained energy, it's not "inconsequential". This is the entire reason children and youth can gain lean mass while losing fat. As I pointed out before, obese children and youth can lose weight and turn out normal, this happens all the time, with and without the aid of professionals. Lean mass is gained until 21, on average.

Significant source of sustained energy != freely manipulatable energy to be used for net anabolism. The reason children can gain mass, whilst losing body fat is a lot more complicated than you're making it out to be e.g. body fat --> lean body mass

[festeri]

Neg'ed for the quoted post and many other inappropriate and/or incorrect posts that you've made in the past.

That's funny because your previous post didn't even refute what I said. You need to pay more attention and read more closlier.

[madadi]

the reason why it's easier to stay lean when you are younger is because our body does use a lot of energy toward growth whether or not we want, growth hormone makes you grow and it is much higher during our teen years. as long as you eat a decent amount of calcium and you are not starving yourself I think you will reach your maximum height that genetically you are encoded to have. now if you want to grow in height and grow muscle mass at the same time, make sure you have enough calcium and also protein and a decent caloric intake over your maintenance. In my experience it could be as much as 500 extra calories or more. once you get closer to 30 years old your metabolism slows down and you don't have to eat that much over your maintenance to grow muscles. This of course differs from person to person depending on their body composition, metabolism, and their personal goals.

[festeri]

Significant source of sustained energy != freely manipulatable energy to be used for net anabolism. The reason children can gain mass, whilst losing body fat is a lot more complicated than you're making it out to be e.g. body fat --> lean body mass

I never implied that body fat is converted into lean body mass.