Lower back pain after deads and squats

[aklap]

Hello!
Anyone else experience this? It's not so much pain as a nagging discomfort that lasts for a few minutes after sets.
Is this normal or is it likely that my form is poor?
I was thinking of trying Sumo Deadlifts and a wider stance for the Squat to see if that helps at all.
Any constructive feedback is appreciated. Thanks

[amusclehead]

for squatting you may be leaning forward and letting the bar push you down. you shouldn't be bent over in half when squatting (as you see most are)...keep back as straight as possible

for deadlifting, you may be pulling with your back too early (i.e., as you lift the bar off the floor you may be, instead of driving with your legs first and straightening them, be yanking back with your back)

both very common mistakes, both can be very deadly for your back

my advice- take a lighter weight and work on a slow, precise form. don't take a weight that'll plaster you after 4reps, knock off like 100+pds and work ont he form until you got it down.

[Joaorv]

Be very carfull never to round the lower back. lower back pain, when not the good type of pain, generaly means bad posture.

[aklap]

Thanks for the advice people.
It's very frustrating; I've been working at it and originally thought it may be flexibility but if it is then it certainly hasn't improved.
I think your suspicions about me curving my lower back (however slightly) is correct and I can't seem to get past it. (I have extra long shins and extra short arms which seems to cause the problem).
Maybe I should bite the bullet and stick to Half Squats and Partial Deads? I don't know, but I've never had a back problem in my life and don't want to inflict one upon myself. Thanks again.

[amusclehead]

no- half squats are more damaging ot the knees than full squats. just lower the weight and work on perfecting your form. may take time, but it'll be worth it

[aklap]

Thanks for the encouragement. I'll keep working at getting it right.

Great board, BTW!

[D&G]

Originally posted by amusclehead
for squatting you may be leaning forward and letting the bar push you down. you shouldn't be bent over in half when squatting (as you see most are)...keep back as straight as possible

............squeeze your shoulder blades together and keep your chin up, try focusing on a spot in front of you and keep your eyes there.

[CyberGod]

aklap,


The way I see it, if your lower back is rounding in the end of the rep (rounding= your lower back loses the natural arch in it), then you will feel that kind of discomfort...

If your back is rounding during squats, you could check if :
1-) You have enough flexibility
2-) Change your stance (where your heels are placed) and toe flare (the way your toes point). A good starting point is a shoulder width- stance with a 35-40 degree toe flare. Play with your stance and toe flare until you feel comfortable.
3-) Have someone COMPETENT look at you from the side and tell you when your lower back rounds.

Load a 95 pounds (light) and try it out. Don't take a VERY wide stance...places a huge stress on the hip. Don't take a VERY close stance, your lower back will round.

[aklap]

Thanks for the tips.
I just can't seem to stop my butt from drooping about 3/4 of the way down on squats. Sort of a funny looking thing; it's sticking out, out, out, and then just drops (hence, ruining the curve at the very bottom of my back).
I can fix it w/ a very wide stance but, as you say, I feel like I'm going to wrench my hips out.
I'll just have to keep working at it w/ a semi wide stance. And I'm seriously considering having a good trainer help me out.

[amusclehead]

Originally posted by D&G
............squeeze your shoulder blades together and keep your chin up, try focusing on a spot in front of you and keep your eyes there.

oooh yea, forgot about that (that most people keep their head down looking at the ground, instead of forward)

[CyberGod]

Originally posted by aklap
Thanks for the tips.
I just can't seem to stop my butt from drooping about 3/4 of the way down on squats. Sort of a funny looking thing; it's sticking out, out, out, and then just drops (hence, ruining the curve at the very bottom of my back).
I can fix it w/ a very wide stance but, as you say, I feel like I'm going to wrench my hips out.
I'll just have to keep working at it w/ a semi wide stance. And I'm seriously considering having a good trainer help me out.

How tall are you?? When you say 3/4 of the way down, where does your hip joint placed compared to your knee joint?? Lower, higher, exactly at the same point??

If your hip joint is at the same position than your knee joint, it's called a parallel squat. A tiny bit lower is called a below parallel squat. If you get to just below parallel, then you're okay. You don't need a full squat, unless you plan on doing olympic lifts.

You can try working on your flexibility, usually the hamstrings. A good stretching protocol for the squats inclue the hams, the achilles tendon, glutes, shoulders. Try to stretch SLIGHTLY just before squatting and tell us how it went.

[UNCA-Player]

What up!
It could be your genetics also.....some people just cant squat or deadlift like others. I powerlifted for a year with a fracture in my back....no real pain....but much like the symptoms you seem to have. Now I cant do any spine loaded exercises for 6 months...so leg presses and stuff. I also have a huge lower back routine and posture rountine. Very important.
But you might want to switch to a lighter weight and higher reps or lighter weight and slower movements. I squated my best using higher reps. I used to do 315lbs for a set of 35 reps. At my next contest I squated much higher than I ever expected.Good Luck!

[ItalGym]

The longer your legs, the more you lean forward during a squat. This does not mean bad form. As long as your back is straight and your head is up, you should be ok. Tall people with long legs cannot avoid leaning forward from what I have seen, me included.

[aklap]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by CyberGod
[B]How tall are you?? When you say 3/4 of the way down, where does your hip joint placed compared to your knee joint?? Lower, higher, exactly at the same point??
--------------------------------

I'm 5' 10". I'd say my hip joints are about 3" above my knees when my butt drops so I can't get a good parallel squat w/o my form going out of whack. My flexibility is good except for maybe my ankles.
I'm not new to lifting, just squatting so if I continue them w/ good form hopefully they'll get better.

[D&G]

When you finish squats/deads - go to the chin up bar and hang from it - this will stretch your spine back out to its natural position

[CyberGod]

Originally posted by aklap
I'm 5' 10". I'd say my hip joints are about 3" above my knees when my butt drops so I can't get a good parallel squat w/o my form going out of whack. My flexibility is good except for maybe my ankles.
I'm not new to lifting, just squatting so if I continue them w/ good form hopefully they'll get better.

Okay you're of average height, so the most probable reason why your lower back rounds must be a flexibility issure. Work on that ankle flexibility. If your ankle ISNT flexible enough, your lower back will have no choice but to round when you squat deep, to keep your center of gravity. If your ankle is MORE flexibility, then your knees will travel a tad further infront and lower back will stay flat.

Good luck.
P.S.: Stretch those ankles! DON'T Put a board under your heels to compensate.

[aklap]

Hey, once again, thanks all for the ecouragement and good advice!
I'm definitely going to work on my ankle flexibility.
Hanging from the chin bar...good idea

[BennyDHS]

i seem to have the same problem...and it feels like i DO need to stretch my ankles...but i'm not sure how....similar stretching style as if stretching the calf?

[TheHumungus]

Originally posted by ItalGym
The longer your legs, the more you lean forward during a squat. This does not mean bad form. As long as your back is straight and your head is up, you should be ok. Tall people with long legs cannot avoid leaning forward from what I have seen, me included.

Yep, I'll second that. There is no possible way for me to get really low without leaning forward. I'm 6ft tall.

[Dawson1995]

What if your lower back is bending inwards ?