Can I become a personal traner without being certified?

[smttysmth02gt]

I just had a simple question, "Can I become a personal traner without being certified?" Nothing else.

I feel like your question has been answered, but in a misleading way. The short answer is yes, but it is not advised. The misleading part is the part where people in this thread have equated obtaining a certification with knowledge. That isn't true at all and is complete nonsense. There are plenty of certified trainers who are completely clueless (and provide motivation for people out there to NOT be certified). Obtaining a certification does not mean you're smart, or even knowledgeable about any particular subject. It means you studied for a test and passed, regardless of the topic (technology, fitness, safety, school, etc). Folks in this thread may have valid points as far as insurance goes. I have the feeling you want to do stuff more or less off the record any way, and if that's the case I'd say go for it. If you want to do it professionally, you should probably go all out (LLC, cert, insurance, etc).

[Lopez27]

I feel like your question has been answered, but in a misleading way. The short answer is yes, but it is not advised. The misleading part is the part where people in this thread have equated obtaining a certification with knowledge. That isn't true at all and is complete nonsense. There are plenty of certified trainers who are completely clueless (and provide motivation for people out there to NOT be certified). Obtaining a certification does not mean you're smart, or even knowledgeable about any particular subject. It means you studied for a test and passed, regardless of the topic (technology, fitness, safety, school, etc). Folks in this thread may have valid points as far as insurance goes. I have the feeling you want to do stuff more or less off the record any way, and if that's the case I'd say go for it. If you want to do it professionally, you should probably go all out (LLC, cert, insurance, etc).

Holy ****. That must be the most genious comment I have read all year. 100% accurate. I'm glad there's atleast one person who understands me! For a second there I thought there was no hope. Thank you for posting and I'm glad I'm not the only one who understands that.

[carl.c]

smtty and lopez: The two of you are exsamples of whats wrong in this industry. I know no other profetion where people can hang a sign saying xxxx without having proven basic knowledge and skill levels. Please note I said basic levels of.
I understand that the two of you would go to a doctor or lawer who had not proven a basic understanding of the field but the rest of us would'nt risk it. The sad part with people like smtty and lopez are, they will force the state or fed to make a licencing program then the nightmare will begin.

[smttysmth02gt]

smtty and lopez: The two of you are exsamples of whats wrong in this industry. I know no other profetion where people can hang a sign saying xxxx without having proven basic knowledge and skill levels. Please note I said basic levels of.
I understand that the two of you would go to a doctor or lawer who had not proven a basic understanding of the field but the rest of us would'nt risk it. The sad part with people like smtty and lopez are, they will force the state or fed to make a licencing program then the nightmare will begin.

I have no idea what you're talking about. There's nothing wrong with someone learning something without the approval or sign off from an institution or organization and using said knowledge to assist people for monetary compensation. The only difference is a piece of paper from a group of people stating you passed an exam. If you're just wanting to do a small time gig helping people under the table, there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. Again, you are still equating the certification with some form of "proof" of knowledge or skill. That's a very foolish mistake. Of course the same could be said in reverse.

I don't know how to respond to the state/fed comment (or the dr/lawyer one), other than to laugh. You're making a mountain out of a mole hill. There's simply no sense for all this grief and presumption that someone has no skill or knowledge simply because they lack the piece of paper saying they passed an exam.

[KyleAaron]

There's simply no sense for all this grief and presumption that someone has no skill or knowledge simply because they lack the piece of paper saying they passed an exam.

This is why I distinguished between "book knowledge" and "experience."

A certificate shows that you at least have the knowledge required to get the certificate. This may not be much, but it's more than most people have. One of the best S&C coaches I know has no certificates, didn't even finish high school. But he's experienced. He's 47 or so, has years of lifting and injuries behind him, and never stops learning. And his clients get results, winning PL comps and setting records.

At 19 with no certificate a person has neither book knowledge nor experience. "I played high school football." That's nice, I played rugby and boxed for a few years in the Army back in the 1990s, doesn't make me a rugby or boxing coach. Doing it and coaching it are different things.

It's true that there are a lot of free resources for people to educate themselves. However, there are a few issues with that. One is that there's so much bullsht around, how is the learner to distinguish truth from bollocks? This is where the base of experience or formalised learning helps.

The other is that self-taught people in any field tend to have odd gaps in their knowledge. Something they didn't study because they didn't know it was important.

For example, knowledge of the personal training or strength and conditioning marketplace. The OP wants to work with young adult male athletes. The trouble is that young adult male athletes never hire trainers or coaches, because they know everything already - as demonstrated by the OP's posts to this thread. This is why most sports coaching positions are voluntary and unpaid. A 15-21 year old footballer simply will not pay money to learn how to get stronger or kick a football better.

The exception is if the trainer or coach is a hero of some kind. A bro from the Misc would pay for Arnold Squashenegger to train him, or for Zyzz to spot him on bench. But he'll never hire Coach Joe Blow however competent he is.

With some book knowledge or experience of training and coaching people, you get to know this about the market. Self-taught you wouldn't know it. It doesn't occur to the OP, "hey, if I refuse to pay for education because I think I know it all already, why will other young guys pay for me to educate them?"

These little gaps in learning are what formalised education is for. Certainly most certificates are not very good. But even the worst teacher is a better teacher than yourself. Big gaps. At gyms I've worked at we've had people show up with fake certificates. We've figured it out after ten minutes of job interview.

Others are worried about the OP and the consequences of his foolishness. I'm not. I believe in the free market. If he's as brilliant and experienced as he says he is, then he will be successful, all his clients will do well, nobody will get injured, and it's all good. If he is as clueless as we suspect he is, then he will get no clients, nobody will get injured, and it's all good. Either way, all good.

Competence in others is obvious even to people who lack the skill. I don't have to know anything about basketball to be impressed by Michael Jordan, nor anything about sprinting to see that Usain Bolt has a run both fast and elegant. Likewise, most people can tell when a trainer or coach is competent or clueless. They might choose to ignore their instincts and hire them anyway, but really deep down they know - and will eventually act on that. So if our OP is clueless as he wanders aimlessly around 24 Hour Fitness trying to get clients, people will see that - and not hire him.

Don't underestimate gym-goers. They know good and bad when they see it. This is why the guy I mentioned earlier has been able to do so well - he's very very competent, and people see it instantly.

Competence in others is obvious, our own competence or lack of it is not always obvious to us. "Definitely, definitely an excellent driver." So whether the OP is competent or not, potential clients will realise it. And in any case, he's choosing a market which is small or nonexistent. He said he wouldn't take me as a client because even if I'm interested in his favoured sports, I'm too old. If you begin your career with no clients and reject the first one who asks to be your client, how successful are you going to be?

The free market will deal with him as he deserves.

[smttysmth02gt]

The trouble is that young adult male athletes never hire trainers or coaches, because they know everything already - as demonstrated by the OP's posts to this thread.

I've read this entire thread, and I failed to see any arrogance or pride from the OP. The poor guy asked a simple question and got hammered by all the "pro's" here telling him unless he had a piece of paper, he shouldn't do any training, which is hogwash. It's disappointing to see this type of attitude coming from you guys. You should be encouraging newbies to educate themselves and train to the best of their ability, and help others do the same, rather than get caught up with a technicality that literally proves nothing, other than test taking skills. It doesn't mean you have an in depth understanding of health and fitness, nor retain skills in the gym, nor the patience needed to train other people correctly.

Ultimately, I think you guys have misunderstood where OP was coming from (and took offense to the fact that he doesn't want to get certified). What I gathered is, he's a young guy looking to one day be a personal trainer but wants to ease in it for the time being on an off the record basis. Speaking as someone who does this on a regular basis, I'd have to strongly disagree with the presumption that the lack of the paperwork disqualifies any individual from any amount of success or competence.

[Mindi912]

The poor guy asked a simple question and got hammered by all the "pro's" here telling him unless he had a piece of paper, he shouldn't do any training, which is hogwash. It's disappointing to see this type of attitude coming from you guys. You should be encouraging newbies to educate themselves and train to the best of their ability, and help others do the same, rather than get caught up with a technicality that literally proves nothing, other than test taking skills. It doesn't mean you have an in depth understanding of health and fitness, nor retain skills in the gym, nor the patience needed to train other people correctly.

Why would anyone want to train with someone who doesn't have the paper to say they are qualified. No gym would hire him. Like everyone said being 19 just makes it worse.

They are encouraging him, don't know where you got they weren't. They are encouraging to get qualified, no one has said he doesn't know his **** what they are saying is that no one will see him as credible if he's not certified.

[smttysmth02gt]

Why would anyone want to train with someone who doesn't have the paper to say they are qualified. No gym would hire him. Like everyone said being 19 just makes it worse.

They are encouraging him, don't know where you got they weren't. They are encouraging to get qualified, no one has said he doesn't know his **** what they are saying is that no one will see him as credible if he's not certified.

Did you read anything I, or the OP (or anyone else) said? He's not attempting to get hired by a gym. Please read my first post. Obviously, the liability alone from doing this professionally would necessitate the certification. The folks in this thread have harped on the piece of paper being a necessity in order to do ANY training at all, which is nonsense. There's nothing wrong with an educated and skilled person (non-certified) working gigs part time (whether it be working on cars, painting houses, or unclogging toilets). Nobody's arguing the risk involved with liabilities and legalities (injuries, lawsuits, etc.). My gripe is the equation of certification = knowledge/skill/talent. That's false.

[Lopez27]

Kyle, I will respond tonight when I have more time.
Smtty, I couldn't have said it better myself.

Why would anyone want to train with someone who doesn't have the paper to say they are qualified. No gym would hire him. Like everyone said being 19 just makes it worse.

They are encouraging him, don't know where you got they weren't. They are encouraging to get qualified, no one has said he doesn't know his **** what they are saying is that no one will see him as credible if he's not certified.

Why? Because they see my accomplishments and want to have that same success. After talking with me and a few trial sessions they see that I know my stuff and I can get them to where they want to be. I know that no gym would hire me, I do not want to work for a gym. Like I've said many times, I'm not forcing anyone to work with me, hell I won't even market myself! I will take on the few people I know want to work with me now, and once their friends begin to see their results they will start referring them to me and thats how it will work.

I do not care if I am seen as credible or not by your standards. I can let my work and results speak for themselves and I know I won't have trouble finding clients.

[Mindi912]

Did you read anything I, or the OP (or anyone else) said? He's not attempting to get hired by a gym. Please read my first post. Obviously, the liability alone from doing this professionally would necessitate the certification. The folks in this thread have harped on the piece of paper being a necessity in order to do ANY training at all, which is nonsense. There's nothing wrong with an educated and skilled person (non-certified) working gigs part time (whether it be working on cars, painting houses, or unclogging toilets). Nobody's arguing the risk involved with liabilities and legalities (injuries, lawsuits, etc.). My gripe is the equation of certification = knowledge/skill/talent. That's false.

Sorry disagree! wouldn't hire him without the paper, especially if he were independent!

If anything happened and his client was injured either a) they wouldn't have a leg to stand on because they hired him without making sure he was qualified for the task

or

b) he get himself sued to hell and back because he mislead his clients by not telling them he wasn't qualified.

He couldn't get insurance to start with.

All that side sorry I still can't see him getting any clients even if he was the best because without the little bit of paper he's not qualified and I want as hell to make sure I hire someone who has that bit of paper to confirm they have the knowledge! It's simple really - paper = qualified to do job
no paper = not qualified to do the job

[smttysmth02gt]

Sorry disagree! wouldn't hire him without the paper, especially if he were independent!

If anything happened and his client was injured either a) they wouldn't have a leg to stand on because they hired him without making sure he was qualified for the task

or

b) he get himself sued to hell and back because he mislead his clients by not telling them he wasn't qualified.

He couldn't get insurance to start with.

All that side sorry I still can't see him getting any clients even if he was the best because without the little bit of paper he's not qualified and I want as hell to make sure I hire someone who has that bit of paper to confirm they have the knowledge! It's simple really - paper = qualified to do job
no paper = not qualified to do the job

Perhaps things are a bit different because of your location? I honestly don't know. From a professional stance there's no argument that one should be certified. Once again, under the table/off the record work is done every day by people who are "not qualified" by your standards in various industries.

This vehement stance that the certification = knowledge/skill/talent (qualification) is laughable. I don't think OP ever said he'd neglect to tell them he isn't certified (Hence the very topic of this thread---personal trainer WITHOUT being certified). Btw...I have clients myself as a side job, so this "nobody will hire you without the hand of God ordained piece of paper" crap is hilarious. Your colleagues have already pointed out he COULD be insured, but it would cost more without certification. You are literally saying that Joe Blow can't replace a part on your car without a piece of paper saying he is "qualified". It's complete nonsense.

You seem like you've got some more reading to do in this thread since you haven't done a very good job of keeping up.

BTW...I really don't think whether you would hire him or not was ever worthy of mention. Even if I had an opinion of whether or not I'd hire him, it would still be irrelevant, as neither of us would ever be potential clients.

[jeffsmith2]

I've read this entire thread, and I failed to see any arrogance or pride from the OP. The poor guy asked a simple question and got hammered by all the "pro's" here telling him unless he had a piece of paper, he shouldn't do any training, which is hogwash. It's disappointing to see this type of attitude coming from you guys. You should be encouraging newbies to educate themselves and train to the best of their ability, and help others do the same, rather than get caught up with a technicality that literally proves nothing, other than test taking skills. It doesn't mean you have an in depth understanding of health and fitness, nor retain skills in the gym, nor the patience needed to train other people correctly.

Ultimately, I think you guys have misunderstood where OP was coming from (and took offense to the fact that he doesn't want to get certified). What I gathered is, he's a young guy looking to one day be a personal trainer but wants to ease in it for the time being on an off the record basis. Speaking as someone who does this on a regular basis, I'd have to strongly disagree with the presumption that the lack of the paperwork disqualifies any individual from any amount of success or competence.

And one of his "clients" drops a weight on themselves and sues him. He's ruined for the rest of his life. Do you not understand how insurance works? You don't train people without insurance. If you don't get certified you can't get insurance. Nobody is saying you can't have all the knowledge in the world but unless you're certified you shouldn't train people.

Any trainer who would tell others to train without insurance is an embarassment.

[smttysmth02gt]

And one of his "clients" drops a weight on themselves and sues him. He's ruined for the rest of his life. Do you not understand how insurance works? You don't train people without insurance. If you don't get certified you can't get insurance. Nobody is saying you can't have all the knowledge in the world but unless you're certified you shouldn't train people.

Any trainer who would tell others to train without insurance is an embarassment.

Think about what you just said.......

[carl.c]

Smtty Lopez: You guys have convinced me. It was silly of me to think this was a real profession where people should have a basic skill level.

[Azrairc]

OP just go out and train w/o a cert, come back in 3 months and tell us how great its going. You have already decided the answer of your question was "yes" before you even asked it. No reasoning is helping them change your opinion so find out for yourself.

[KyleAaron]

I've read this entire thread, and I failed to see any arrogance or pride from the OP.

You don't see it because you share it, thinking that certifications are worthless, that experience is not necessary, and that training people who are paying under the table in a facility he's not working in is okay.

The poor guy asked a simple question and got hammered by all the "pro's" here telling him unless he had a piece of paper, he shouldn't do any training, which is hogwash.

I didn't say he shouldn't train anyone. I said he wouldn't get insured to train people, no gym would employ him, and since he also lacks experience, people wouldn't sign up to become clients with him. As well, I said that his target market - young adult males who are athletes - is a very very small market, practically non-existent - because like him, they think they know everything already.

So it doesn't really matter whether he should or shouldn't train people - he won't be training anyone, or at least not many people and not for long. It's like if I wanted to be a bus driver but refused to get my bus license and thought my experience driving cars was enough to make me a brilliant bus driver. Should I drive buses? Maybe, maybe not - either way, nobody is going to hire me to drive their bus anyway. The shoulds and shouldn'ts just don't come into it.

It's disappointing to see this type of attitude coming from you guys. You should be encouraging newbies to educate themselves

What part of "get a certificate" does not read like "educate yourself" to you?

Are all certificates good? Of course not, especially in the USA. Are they better than no education at all? Absolutely. He's not going to come out of a course knowing less than he does now.

It doesn't mean you have an in depth understanding of health and fitness, nor retain skills in the gym, nor the patience needed to train other people correctly.

It does demonstrate some work ethic and patience. If you're too lazy to do a weekend course for a few hundred bucks, are you really going to be incredibly hard-studying when you're paying nothing and will get no piece of paper for it? The guy who can't be bothered looking through a manual is going to spend hours pouring over exrx.net taking notes? You think?

I'd have to strongly disagree with the presumption that the lack of the paperwork disqualifies any individual from any amount of success or competence.

I disagree with it, too. Like I said, one of the best S&C coaches I know is totally unqualified. But he's got experience, and he really does work hard studying training techniques and so on. But he's 47, not 19 - he's had time to get experience.

Qualifications, experience. You can get away with just one of the two. The two together work best, complementing each-other. But if you've got neither, you'll be in trouble. Especially if you try to train people at someone else's gym and paying under the table, focusing on a market niche that isn't actually part of the market.

Again, I've got no problem with him trying. Trying and failing embarrassingly is part of growing up, teaches you a lot. And if he succeeds, good for him.

In short: yes, you can call yourself a PT without any certifications or experience. But no-one will hire you, so you'll be a PT in name only. Enjoy the name.

[jeffsmith2]

Think about what you just said.......

What I see is you encouraging someone to go train people without a certification and insurance. This makes all personal trainers look bad and cheapens the professions as whole. It is also terrible advice as this 19 year old headstrong individual could get someone hurt or be taken advantage of by a client and be financially ruined for a very long time.

Simply awful advice you're giving him that could ruin his life.

[chrisarnett]

I started 25 years ago when there were not certification programs that I knew of. Then in the late 80's or early 90's they began to pop out of the woodworks.

Because I also taught Aerobic Dance and they jumped on that whole cert thing as a money maker (I.D.E.A now called A.C.E), I got my cert through them.

[jmar4eva]

Kyle, I will respond tonight when I have more time.
Smtty, I couldn't have said it better myself.



Why? Because they see my accomplishments and want to have that same success. After talking with me and a few trial sessions they see that I know my stuff and I can get them to where they want to be. I know that no gym would hire me, I do not want to work for a gym. Like I've said many times, I'm not forcing anyone to work with me, hell I won't even market myself! I will take on the few people I know want to work with me now, and once their friends begin to see their results they will start referring them to me and thats how it will work.

I do not care if I am seen as credible or not by your standards. I can let my work and results speak for themselves and I know I won't have trouble finding clients.

im an athlete, at the college level, and i would not want to work with you lol.. i would not want to work with someone with no ***** or degrees younger than me who just did what i did to get his knowledge (serf the internet), because as far as what i train for(vert jump and speed) i know theres alot of wrong **** on the internet and it took me a long time to figure out and test for myself what really works

[WoofieNugget]

Kyle is bang on about this one. One of the things about this industry is that turnover is very high simply because people think it is a fun, easy, glamorous profession, get into it and then realize they actually have to work hard, get no results for their clients (or worse hurt somebody) and leave. I've been in it for over a decade and seen it time and again.

Of course you can train people without a cert, and in my opinion that is one of the problems with the PT industry. Any yahoo can take a weekend course and suddenly be considered qualified to care for someone's health and safety while they hold massive amounts of weight or do movements that they are totally not ready to do simply because the trainer thinks it is cool and fun or that they will sell more sessions because they are seen as "hardcore".

Just last week we hired a girl who has a degree from a very respected university here in Canada. She's smart, but she has never even coached anyone on how to do a bench press - I had to teach her. Experience in my opinion counts more than any piece of paper when it comes to teaching people, but you should have a balance of both. Do you have the results over time where you can show you have helped people, plus a desire to keep learning and honing your craft through education? This is what I look for in a trainer when I'm hiring them, not just one or the other.

[theguitarman128]

That would be their choice. They can judge by my own accomplishments and what they see from their trial sessions. Then decide if they would like to keep going. I already have guys who want to work with me which is why I even thought of this in the first place.



I rejected book knowledge because I haven't became certifed? Lol. There is this marvelous thing called the internet, and if you seek the knowledge it has the ability to teach you far more than what your basic certification program ever will. Everything anyone will ever need to know can be researched, studied, and learned on the internet.

I have played football for 6 years, wrestling for 3, boxed for 2, and mma for 2. Through high school I have made myself far more bigger, stronger, faster, and more athletic through lifting weights solely. Like I've said before people do not have to hire me if they don't want to, their choice.

I would not work with you, I only work with high school and college athletes.

Ha your set up for failure all the way around. Btw, sounds like you have a pretty narrow target audience. How many high school kids and college students do you think have money to pay a personal trainer, and if they do would want to work with an uncertified 19 year old? Now let's suppose the parents have money and for some reason they're not asking and questions and just pay you. You have to know they're going to sue you and your going to lose. You may have some book smarts I'm not sure, but it's obvious you have either no life experience or you've neglected to learn from it. Whatever the case may be you had your mind made up before you asked the original question so theres no point anyway, because like the majority of teens you think you know more than you do and you want a quick fix.

[jeffsmith2]

I rejected book knowledge because I haven't became certifed? Lol. There is this marvelous thing called the internet, and if you seek the knowledge it has the ability to teach you far more than what your basic certification program ever will. Everything anyone will ever need to know can be researched, studied, and learned on the internet.

Just stop. If you think you can be a good PT by just reading broscience on the internet(re: 95% of the garbage out there) then you have no business training.

Listen, if you want to train people simply get a basic certification. You can probably get even a real bad one for 200 dollars or so. You probably won't learn much but it will allow you to get insurance. Let's say insurance is a couple hundred dollars per year for the most basic. That's a 400-500 dollar startup that might even be able to write-off some on your taxes. Most certifications will lead you to some form of discounted insurance with a company they work with.

Even if you get a client who you think is great and a good person you never know if God-forbid they will try and sue you if they get hurt. Is the potential of possibly getting sued and losing, which you will if you have no insurance, worth whatever small amount of money you will make through part-time training? I'm telling you this to protect you from possibly ruining your life by getting sued by some client looking for a payday. It is not worth mortgaging your future. Perhaps contact gyms in your area. Some gyms offer PT training through their own organizations.

You have to approach training from the standpoint of being a business. You're an independent contractor and you need your business practices to be just as solid as your training practices.

[MattLong17]

This is a ridiculous thread, imo.

[Lopez27]

This is why I distinguished between "book knowledge" and "experience."

A certificate shows that you at least have the knowledge required to get the certificate. This may not be much, but it's more than most people have. One of the best S&C coaches I know has no certificates, didn't even finish high school. But he's experienced. He's 47 or so, has years of lifting and injuries behind him, and never stops learning. And his clients get results, winning PL comps and setting records.

-----And not much knowledge is required to get a certificate.

At 19 with no certificate a person has neither book knowledge nor experience. "I played high school football." That's nice, I played rugby and boxed for a few years in the Army back in the 1990s, doesn't make me a rugby or boxing coach. Doing it and coaching it are different things.

-----Strong assumption.

It's true that there are a lot of free resources for people to educate themselves. However, there are a few issues with that. One is that there's so much bullsht around, how is the learner to distinguish truth from bollocks? This is where the base of experience or formalised learning helps.

-----Read and learn from the best of the best don't just read thing from random authors.

The other is that self-taught people in any field tend to have odd gaps in their knowledge. Something they didn't study because they didn't know it was important.

For example, knowledge of the personal training or strength and conditioning marketplace. The OP wants to work with young adult male athletes. The trouble is that young adult male athletes never hire trainers or coaches, because they know everything already - as demonstrated by the OP's posts to this thread. This is why most sports coaching positions are voluntary and unpaid. A 15-21 year old footballer simply will not pay money to learn how to get stronger or kick a football better.

-----Very false.

The exception is if the trainer or coach is a hero of some kind. A bro from the Misc would pay for Arnold Squashenegger to train him, or for Zyzz to spot him on bench. But he'll never hire Coach Joe Blow however competent he is.

With some book knowledge or experience of training and coaching people, you get to know this about the market. Self-taught you wouldn't know it. It doesn't occur to the OP, "hey, if I refuse to pay for education because I think I know it all already, why will other young guys pay for me to educate them?"

-----I never said this. And like I said, finding clients is the LEAST of my worries.

These little gaps in learning are what formalised education is for. Certainly most certificates are not very good. But even the worst teacher is a better teacher than yourself. Big gaps. At gyms I've worked at we've had people show up with fake certificates. We've figured it out after ten minutes of job interview.

Others are worried about the OP and the consequences of his foolishness. I'm not. I believe in the free market. If he's as brilliant and experienced as he says he is, then he will be successful, all his clients will do well, nobody will get injured, and it's all good. If he is as clueless as we suspect he is, then he will get no clients, nobody will get injured, and it's all good. Either way, all good.

-----I agree.

Competence in others is obvious even to people who lack the skill. I don't have to know anything about basketball to be impressed by Michael Jordan, nor anything about sprinting to see that Usain Bolt has a run both fast and elegant. Likewise, most people can tell when a trainer or coach is competent or clueless. They might choose to ignore their instincts and hire them anyway, but really deep down they know - and will eventually act on that. So if our OP is clueless as he wanders aimlessly around 24 Hour Fitness trying to get clients, people will see that - and not hire him.

-----I agree.

Don't underestimate gym-goers. They know good and bad when they see it. This is why the guy I mentioned earlier has been able to do so well - he's very very competent, and people see it instantly.

-----I agree once again.

Competence in others is obvious, our own competence or lack of it is not always obvious to us. "Definitely, definitely an excellent driver." So whether the OP is competent or not, potential clients will realise it. And in any case, he's choosing a market which is small or nonexistent. He said he wouldn't take me as a client because even if I'm interested in his favoured sports, I'm too old. If you begin your career with no clients and reject the first one who asks to be your client, how successful are you going to be?

-----Agreed. I wouldn't begin my career with no clients and you are not the first to ask me.

The free market will deal with him as he deserves.

Sorry disagree! wouldn't hire him without the paper, especially if he were independent!

-----I do not care if YOU would hire me or not, like I've said before I'm not worried about finding clients.

If anything happened and his client was injured either a) they wouldn't have a leg to stand on because they hired him without making sure he was qualified for the task

-----Who says I'm not qualified for the task?

or

b) he get himself sued to hell and back because he mislead his clients by not telling them he wasn't qualified.

-----I am qualified, however I do plan on telling them I am not certified.

He couldn't get insurance to start with.

-----Was unaware insurance was required before. This is why I'm probably not going to do it.

All that side sorry I still can't see him getting any clients even if he was the best because without the little bit of paper he's not qualified and I want as hell to make sure I hire someone who has that bit of paper to confirm they have the knowledge! It's simple really - paper = qualified to do job
no paper = not qualified to do the job

-----I find your logic rather amusing, once again I'm not worried about clients.

And one of his "clients" drops a weight on themselves and sues him. He's ruined for the rest of his life. Do you not understand how insurance works? You don't train people without insurance. If you don't get certified you can't get insurance. Nobody is saying you can't have all the knowledge in the world but unless you're certified you shouldn't train people.

-----Yeah I did not know about insurance before.

Any trainer who would tell others to train without insurance is an embarassment.

Smtty Lopez: You guys have convinced me. It was silly of me to think this was a real profession where people should have a basic skill level.

-----You sound stupid. Just because someone isn't certified that doesn't mean that they don't possess a basic skill level.

OP just go out and train w/o a cert, come back in 3 months and tell us how great its going. You have already decided the answer of your question was "yes" before you even asked it. No reasoning is helping them change your opinion so find out for yourself.

-----Wish I could but I can't uninsured. And no I did not decide the answer was yes because the answer is no, unless you want to potentially be sued.

You don't see it because you share it, thinking that certifications are worthless, that experience is not necessary, and that training people who are paying under the table in a facility he's not working in is okay.

-----Once again equating a certificate with experience.

I didn't say he shouldn't train anyone. I said he wouldn't get insured to train people, no gym would employ him, and since he also lacks experience, people wouldn't sign up to become clients with him. As well, I said that his target market - young adult males who are athletes - is a very very small market, practically non-existent - because like him, they think they know everything already.

-----Where do you get the idea that I lack experience? And for the 23456789 time, finding clients is the LEAST of my worries.

So it doesn't really matter whether he should or shouldn't train people - he won't be training anyone, or at least not many people and not for long. It's like if I wanted to be a bus driver but refused to get my bus license and thought my experience driving cars was enough to make me a brilliant bus driver. Should I drive buses? Maybe, maybe not - either way, nobody is going to hire me to drive their bus anyway. The shoulds and shouldn'ts just don't come into it.


What part of "get a certificate" does not read like "educate yourself" to you?

Are all certificates good? Of course not, especially in the USA. Are they better than no education at all? Absolutely. He's not going to come out of a course knowing less than he does now.

-----I agree however I just don't see the education learned through the certification showing me anything that I do not already know or as necessary.


It does demonstrate some work ethic and patience. If you're too lazy to do a weekend course for a few hundred bucks, are you really going to be incredibly hard-studying when you're paying nothing and will get no piece of paper for it? The guy who can't be bothered looking through a manual is going to spend hours pouring over exrx.net taking notes? You think?

-----Not to lazy just don't feel it's worth the trouble if I could legally train people without it. P.s. I spend an average of 2-3 hours daily reading and learning about athletic training, from real coaches.


I disagree with it, too. Like I said, one of the best S&C coaches I know is totally unqualified. But he's got experience, and he really does work hard studying training techniques and so on. But he's 47, not 19 - he's had time to get experience.

-----I'm not going to train world class champions bro.

Qualifications, experience. You can get away with just one of the two. The two together work best, complementing each-other. But if you've got neither, you'll be in trouble. Especially if you try to train people at someone else's gym and paying under the table, focusing on a market niche that isn't actually part of the market.

-----I have experience. I've been to where the people I want to train want to go, and I've done what the people I want to train want to do.

Again, I've got no problem with him trying. Trying and failing embarrassingly is part of growing up, teaches you a lot. And if he succeeds, good for him.

In short: yes, you can call yourself a PT without any certifications or experience. But no-one will hire you, so you'll be a PT in name only. Enjoy the name.

-----LEAST of my worries.

Comments made.

[Lopez27]

What I see is you encouraging someone to go train people without a certification and insurance. This makes all personal trainers look bad and cheapens the professions as whole. It is also terrible advice as this 19 year old headstrong individual could get someone hurt or be taken advantage of by a client and be financially ruined for a very long time.

-----Seeing all these personal trainers with multiple certifications telling me I should do higher reps with lighter weights if I want to "tone", not squat because it's bad for the knees, do 20 sets of arm isolation exercises and work only one muscle group per day is what I think looks bad and cheapens the profession.

Simply awful advice you're giving him that could ruin his life.

im an athlete, at the college level, and i would not want to work with you lol.. i would not want to work with someone with no ***** or degrees younger than me who just did what i did to get his knowledge (serf the internet), because as far as what i train for(vert jump and speed) i know theres alot of wrong **** on the internet and it took me a long time to figure out and test for myself what really works

-----I don't care.

Kyle is bang on about this one. One of the things about this industry is that turnover is very high simply because people think it is a fun, easy, glamorous profession, get into it and then realize they actually have to work hard, get no results for their clients (or worse hurt somebody) and leave. I've been in it for over a decade and seen it time and again.

-----I will get results no doubt in my mind.

Of course you can train people without a cert, and in my opinion that is one of the problems with the PT industry. Any yahoo can take a weekend course and suddenly be considered qualified to care for someone's health and safety while they hold massive amounts of weight or do movements that they are totally not ready to do simply because the trainer thinks it is cool and fun or that they will sell more sessions because they are seen as "hardcore".

Just last week we hired a girl who has a degree from a very respected university here in Canada. She's smart, but she has never even coached anyone on how to do a bench press - I had to teach her. Experience in my opinion counts more than any piece of paper when it comes to teaching people, but you should have a balance of both. Do you have the results over time where you can show you have helped people, plus a desire to keep learning and honing your craft through education? This is what I look for in a trainer when I'm hiring them, not just one or the other.

-----Yes I do.

Ha your set up for failure all the way around. Btw, sounds like you have a pretty narrow target audience. How many high school kids and college students do you think have money to pay a personal trainer, and if they do would want to work with an uncertified 19 year old? Now let's suppose the parents have money and for some reason they're not asking and questions and just pay you. You have to know they're going to sue you and your going to lose. You may have some book smarts I'm not sure, but it's obvious you have either no life experience or you've neglected to learn from it. Whatever the case may be you had your mind made up before you asked the original question so theres no point anyway, because like the majority of teens you think you know more than you do and you want a quick fix.

-----Not worried about clients.

Just stop. If you think you can be a good PT by just reading broscience on the internet(re: 95% of the garbage out there) then you have no business training.

-----I do not read broscience from the internet.

Listen, if you want to train people simply get a basic certification. You can probably get even a real bad one for 200 dollars or so. You probably won't learn much but it will allow you to get insurance. Let's say insurance is a couple hundred dollars per year for the most basic. That's a 400-500 dollar startup that might even be able to write-off some on your taxes. Most certifications will lead you to some form of discounted insurance with a company they work with.

-----I would, but like like I said I wouldn't be training many people and it just wouldn't be worth it to pay so much.

Even if you get a client who you think is great and a good person you never know if God-forbid they will try and sue you if they get hurt. Is the potential of possibly getting sued and losing, which you will if you have no insurance, worth whatever small amount of money you will make through part-time training? I'm telling you this to protect you from possibly ruining your life by getting sued by some client looking for a payday. It is not worth mortgaging your future. Perhaps contact gyms in your area. Some gyms offer PT training through their own organizations.

-----Answered above.

You have to approach training from the standpoint of being a business. You're an independent contractor and you need your business practices to be just as solid as your training practices.

Comments made.

[KyleAaron]

Odd and confusing way to respond.

I would like to hear of your success or failure over the next 12 months or so, however I think it most likely you will fail and just slink off without a word, this is the most common result of such situations.

Anyhow, I'm confident that the free market will treat you as you deserve. Some of the others posting here must be fcking communists or something.

[Lopez27]

Odd and confusing way to respond.

I would like to hear of your success or failure over the next 12 months or so, however I think it most likely you will fail and just slink off without a word, this is the most common result of such situations.

Anyhow, I'm confident that the free market will treat you as you deserve. Some of the others posting here must be fcking communists or something.

How is it odd and confusing?

I probably will not do it as I was unaware of the need for insurance before it just never went through my mind. Not worth paying a few hundred for a cert and a few hundred for insurance yearly for me.

[AtomicVeggie]

OP, no offense dude, but you're going about this the completely wrong way, and you will fail if you don't take the proper steps. Also, why isn't getting clients a concern of yours? Isn't that the point of personal training in the first place? You may have confidence in yourself, but why should others? You have nothing to back it up. If you're a 19 year old with no cert or degree calling yourself a strength trainer for athletes and you try to sign me up, I'm going to laugh at you.

[racejunkie]

racejunkie, be fair, most of us (including me) wouldn't know what to do with them, either. Difference is, we know it Knowing the limits of your knowledge is important for all sorts of reasons.

Better examples would be,

35yo grossly obese desk worker wants to lose weight, what will you start him with, and how progress him over the next however long he's with you? Given a healthy diet and working with you, how long will it take for him to reach a healthy bodyweight?

33yo underweight office worker with flat back and extraordinarily tight hamstrings and restricted dorsiflexion wants to be better at triathlons, but refuses to eat a lot, what will you do with him?

20 yo healthy bodyweight physiotherapy student has had subacromial space shaved to help with supraspinatus impingement, both shoulders, and has patellar maltracking leading to chrondomalacia, wants to get stronger for triathlons, do what?

54yo property developer with a healthy bodyweight and no health issues wants to have improved yachting performance.

49yo educator, healthy bodyweight woman, low-grade MS, wants to combat her MS and "be fabulous fifty."

Just five clients I've had, off the top of my head. That's the sort of person you get as a client. No major issues, but some minor issues you have to figure out how to work with or around. Not one of them is able to perform below parallel barbell squats in their first session. So...?

Really? I'm surprised you don't get more clients like I mentioned due to the cost of Medicare replacement co-pay costs and co pay costs from private insurance. Serious. A family member was the stent guy who had to pay $30 a session for cardiac rehab and, of course they want you to go 3 days a week for at least 4 weeks. He was cleared by the cardiologist after a few visits to see a personal trainer. Cardiac rehab is mainly just walking on the treadmill or cycling. That's it. The PT used the same intensity as cardiac rehab, but made it more interesting by mixing things up a bit with weights and balance training along with the cardio.

[Lopez27]

OP, no offense dude, but you're going about this the completely wrong way, and you will fail if you don't take the proper steps. Also, why isn't getting clients a concern of yours? Isn't that the point of personal training in the first place? You may have confidence in yourself, but why should others? You have nothing to back it up. If you're a 19 year old with no cert or degree calling yourself a strength trainer for athletes and you try to sign me up, I'm going to laugh at you.

Because I already have people who want me to train them and I know that people will be interested in my services once word gets around. I have my own results, experience, and knowledge to back it up. Never said I would try to sign you up bro...