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  1. #1081
    Registered User guyver79's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Philip81193 View Post
    If you don't think training and nutrition methodologies have improved in the last 30 years we have a fundamental disagreement and the discussion can't progress from here. I do agree about the increased gene pool however.
    No I don't see much of a difference.

    Everything that people do now has been implemented by bb'ers over the last 30 years.

    High volume (Arnold) low volume (mentzer) moderate volume (Haney).

    Actually Haney recommended moderate volume and frequency and a balanced diet, not too low in fat or carbs thirty years ago.

    Low carb, high carb, low fat, high fat diets have all been used and implemented at one time or another.

    IIFYM was touted by mentzer years ago.

    Wasn't untill Dorian came along that lower frequency became popular and now that mocked and gets called a 'bro' split and it's not 'optimal' for natties apparently!?

    (^^ Which is the way I prefer to train btw, I might flirt with full/upper/lower from time to time but I always go back to a 1 body part per week split)
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  2. #1082
    U mad bro??? Milone79's Avatar
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    how many natty pros out there sport 20" arms???? Frank Zane, Chris Dickerson etc. never had 20's

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  3. #1083
    Chicken Legs Brah lukamura's Avatar
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    Dude, loot at Frank Zane's structure, he was small and his biceps were flat. Well, not to mention Doug lifts CONSISTENTLY for about 15+ years? I see nothing impossible in his physique seeing how much effort he puts into his training/nutrition etc. you gotta be close minded to believe that someone of his repute claims natty publicly and takes over the counter stuff and is about 190lbs contest weight, where most people taking drugs can attain this amount of muscle doing a few cycles in a year. I really doubt it. I quite see the difference between natty muscles and drug muscle, folks on stuff have mostly the bold shoulders and that hanging lats type of a build - Doug has more of a "physique" which seems natural.

    You may also say, there was one Ronnie Coleman, so there is one Doug Miller.
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  4. #1084
    deadlifts 'n tacos AniMaLizTik's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by lukamura View Post
    Dude, loot at Frank Zane's structure, he was small and his biceps were flat. Well, not to mention Doug lifts CONSISTENTLY for about 15+ years? I see nothing impossible in his physique seeing how much effort he puts into his training/nutrition etc. you gotta be close minded to believe that someone of his repute claims natty publicly and takes over the counter stuff and is about 190lbs contest weight, where most people taking drugs can attain this amount of muscle doing a few cycles in a year. I really doubt it. I quite see the difference between natty muscles and drug muscle, folks on stuff have mostly the bold shoulders and that hanging lats type of a build - Doug has more of a "physique" which seems natural.

    You may also say, there was one Ronnie Coleman, so there is one Doug Miller.
    Youre wasting your breath. "Anyone with a physique better than mine isnt natty" is the stance of most of the kids on this board because they lift casually for a year or two, blow tons of money on supps, booze it up on the weekends and look like crap.
    ...imnoting
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  5. #1085
    U wot m8 Philip81193's Avatar
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    Agreed.
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  6. #1086
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    Originally Posted by NaturalPursuit View Post
    GOTTA GET THIS THREAD ROLLIN AGAIN!!!

    LMFAO. ur not natural. ur pathetic. 5 foot 8. 218 pounds. just look at u. absoultely pathetic how low you can be to make some chump change in the supplement/fitness industry. just like scumbags who breed dogs in puppy mills and sell puppies just ot make some money without caring about the consequences.


    im all for natural bodybuilding, but people like you in this thread really are pathetic. natural my @$$. no way.






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  7. #1087
    Registered User guyver79's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by lukamura View Post
    Dude, loot at Frank Zane's structure, he was small and his biceps were flat. Well, not to mention Doug lifts CONSISTENTLY for about 15+ years? I see nothing impossible in his physique seeing how much effort he puts into his training/nutrition etc. you gotta be close minded to believe that someone of his repute claims natty publicly and takes over the counter stuff and is about 190lbs contest weight, where most people taking drugs can attain this amount of muscle doing a few cycles in a year. I really doubt it. I quite see the difference between natty muscles and drug muscle, folks on stuff have mostly the bold shoulders and that hanging lats type of a build - Doug has more of a "physique" which seems natural.

    You may also say, there was one Ronnie Coleman, so there is one Doug Miller.
    Like I've already said it's entirely possible in theory, Ronnie is a great example, most people don't realise how far Ronnie and Jay were ahead if the pack when they were competing, it's conceivable that there are going to be the "Ronnie's" and "Jays" in natty bb'ing.

    My only problem is people touting a dry shredded 190lbs as something that's easily achievable for a non natty when in fact that would make you one of the biggest guys onstage at a untested regional show and wouldn't of looked out of place on the Olympia stage 30 years ago.

    Again it's a shame that it gets questioned or has to get questioned, but competitive natty bb'ing is the obscure minority side of a sport that's already an obscure minority sport.

    A buddy of mine years ago had an outstanding physique, that I knew for a fact that he was 100% natty, at the same time I knew dudes way smaller and some that didn't even look like they lifted on tons of stuff, my old training partner was 240lbs, I'm only going by experience of going to shows and knowing competitors and training at a "hardcore" gym where everyone was fairly open about everything, it's quite shocking once you know how casual that side of it is.
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  8. #1088
    P.O.P Pimp Squad IronAddict1775's Avatar
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  9. #1089
    Prep Coach NaturalPursuit's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Jelet View Post
    LMFAO. ur not natural. ur pathetic. 5 foot 8. 218 pounds. just look at u. absoultely pathetic how low you can be to make some chump change in the supplement/fitness industry. just like scumbags who breed dogs in puppy mills and sell puppies just ot make some money without caring about the consequences.


    im all for natural bodybuilding, but people like you in this thread really are pathetic. natural my @$$. no way.






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    And you know me personally? Is that how you know I'm not natty?
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  10. #1090
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    Checking on this thread again and it never disappoints, the stupidity is outstanding. Some of you are like religious zealots with the lack of critical thinking.
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  11. #1091
    NGA\IFPA Pro Bodybuilder fltallpaul's Avatar
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  12. #1092
    who is john galt? nzgs's Avatar
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    Doug Miller needs to play in traffic.
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  13. #1093
    Prep Coach NaturalPursuit's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by fltallpaul View Post
    DAMN! Thanks for the post paul!
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  14. #1094
    Becoming a better person Tex24's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by NaturalPursuit View Post
    And you know me personally? Is that how you know I'm not natty?
    Dude you can't fool people who know hormones and have half a brain. Just look at you.

    Natural? Do you honestly believe yourself at this point? I really think you've lied so much about being natural that you actually believe it's true now.

    Absolutely pathetic. 100% what is wrong with this industry. Sad thing is I'm sure you sleep perfectly at night...

    edit* I'm talking about the picture posted. it's laughable and pathetic you people defend that as a natural physique. disgusting
    Last edited by Tex24; 08-30-2014 at 05:01 PM.
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  15. #1095
    Prep Coach NaturalPursuit's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Tex24 View Post
    Dude you can't fool people who know hormones and have half a brain. Just look at you.

    Natural? Do you honestly believe yourself at this point? I really think you've lied so much about being natural that you actually believe it's true now.

    Absolutely pathetic. 100% what is wrong with this industry. Sad thing is I'm sure you sleep perfectly at night...

    edit* I'm talking about the picture posted. it's laughable and pathetic you people defend that as a natural physique. disgusting
    So basically if anyone has a better physique than you, their on hormones?
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  16. #1096
    deadlifts 'n tacos AniMaLizTik's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by NaturalPursuit View Post
    So basically if anyone has a better physique than you, their on hormones?
    I'm not sure if half these dumases are trolling or just that ignorant.

    20 years of training with trial and error with decent genetics and you have a great physique.
    ...imnoting
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  17. #1097
    Prep Coach NaturalPursuit's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by AniMaLizTik View Post
    I'm not sure if half these dumases are trolling or just that ignorant.

    20 years of training with trial and error with decent genetics and you have a great physique.
    EXACTLY! Not sure if the others are srs or not
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  18. #1098
    Becoming a better person Tex24's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by NaturalPursuit View Post
    So basically if anyone has a better physique than you, their on hormones?
    Uhh no not at all. I've seen some great natural physiques. Most of the ones in this thread are NOT those physiques. You guys are posting pictures of guys on hormones. The guy you posted and I quoted about is CLEARLY on hormones. CLEARLY.

    You are absolutely clueless and ignorant if you think or say otherwise.

    What a ****ing joke you people are. Absolutely pathetic
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  19. #1099
    deadlifts 'n tacos AniMaLizTik's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Tex24 View Post
    Uhh no not at all. I've seen some great natural physiques. Most of the ones in this thread are NOT those physiques. You guys are posting pictures of guys on hormones. The guy you posted and I quoted about is CLEARLY on hormones. CLEARLY.

    You are absolutely clueless and ignorant if you think or say otherwise.

    What a ****ing joke you people are. Absolutely pathetic
    I was curious, so i took a quick glance at your forum posts. Just as i thought, EVERY single post you make is negative and cynical. With an outlook like that, it's no wonder you make sht gains and resort to bashing others. negged
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    Becoming a better person Tex24's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by AniMaLizTik View Post
    I was curious, so i took a quick glance at your forum posts. Just as i thought, EVERY single post you make is negative and cynical. With an outlook like that, it's no wonder you make sht gains and resort to bashing others. negged
    lol you think I care about green squares, I never even post on this forum anymore. You're like a 45 year old man negging someone on the internet and propagating lies about being oh so natty.

    There is a difference between being negative and cynical and REALISTIC and HONEST/TRUTHFUL.

    It's pathetic how caught up in your own lies you people are. But keep it up, keep putting unrealistic expectations of what you can achieve naturally out so kids and aspiring bodybuilders can eat up the lies and buy the newest bull**** supplements to get huge

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  21. #1101
    Prep Coach NaturalPursuit's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Tex24 View Post
    lol you think I care about green squares, I never even post on this forum anymore. You're like a 45 year old man negging someone on the internet and propagating lies about being oh so natty.

    There is a difference between being negative and cynical and REALISTIC and HONEST/TRUTHFUL.

    It's pathetic how caught up in your own lies you people are. But keep it up, keep putting unrealistic expectations of what you can achieve naturally out so kids and aspiring bodybuilders can eat up the lies and buy the newest bull**** supplements to get huge

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  22. #1102
    deadlifts 'n tacos AniMaLizTik's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Tex24 View Post
    lol you think I care about green squares, I never even post on this forum anymore. You're like a 45 year old man negging someone on the internet and propagating lies about being oh so natty.

    There is a difference between being negative and cynical and REALISTIC and HONEST/TRUTHFUL.

    It's pathetic how caught up in your own lies you people are. But keep it up, keep putting unrealistic expectations of what you can achieve naturally out so kids and aspiring bodybuilders can eat up the lies and buy the newest bull**** supplements to get huge

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  23. #1103
    Becoming a better person Tex24's Avatar
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    You people are so delusional it's laughable.

    Enjoy ruining the industry with your lies and bullsh*t, oh holier than thou "naturals"
    Last edited by Tex24; 09-01-2014 at 08:58 PM.
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  24. #1104
    NGA\IFPA Pro Bodybuilder fltallpaul's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by AniMaLizTik View Post
    u mad?
    He mad
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  25. #1105
    Chicken Legs Brah lukamura's Avatar
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    This thread is so full of drama.

    I cri evrytiem.
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  26. #1106
    Prep Coach NaturalPursuit's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by fltallpaul View Post
    He mad
    Im interesting in see some offseason posing from Paul Arms looking BIG in your recent videos!
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  27. #1107
    NGA\IFPA Pro Bodybuilder fltallpaul's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by NaturalPursuit View Post
    Im interesting in see some offseason posing from Paul Arms looking BIG in your recent videos!
    I have been adding some volume to arm training along with back. I don't think I will ever wow anyone with my arms but always working toward respectability. Thanks.
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  28. #1108
    o hai xKyle10's Avatar
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    in for more vids of doug miller. when is that last time he competed?
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  29. #1109
    Demon Fitness - Owner demonwareltd's Avatar
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    Been awhile since I have checked this thread out. Always good for the lols with people bantering back and forth. At the end of the day, worry about yourself and your own goals and stop giving two ****s about what others have or have not
    accomplished.
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  30. #1110
    U mad bro??? Milone79's Avatar
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    I'm gonna leave this right there: goodnight sweet dillusions...compare with physiques of pre-steroid era....

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